Mom calls 911 to help manage autitictic teen/ cops kill him

To protect and to serve... themselves!

Sorry for one liner but sometimes...

Okay, this is both scary and sad. The number of people finding ways to make this right is just terrible. Was the cop "within policy" as they might put it? Yes, I'm sure he was and right within the lines of training as the book says.

Was what he did RIGHT? Oh hell no. There is no excuse for this. Now the average cop ain't Batman but they have a few tools for a teenager with an edged weapon that requires closing distance to do something with. The armor EVERY cop wears these days (and never did as a universal thing when I was growing up) gives them even more margin.

However, lets see....., He has a taser. Always a favorite among cops these days...why not this one? Was he just sick of screwing with this kid since there was apparently a history of problems? He has Mace. Police version of it...and that crap is no joke as many can attest to. Autism isn't PCP. The kid would have dropped like a sack of potatoes if he's anything like my autistic son...and he'd be alive today.

Failing all that..... They need to be capable of FIGHTING. That used to be a given and a part of the job. I can't recall how many times my father came come with various little injuries, as a cop. It was simply the way it was and shootings weren't the norm and taken as a routine occurrence. One of his major career "events" was shooting a damn dog that had already attacked several people and was running loose. It bothered him personally but literally put his own status in question. Shootings USED TO BE taken very very seriously.

Finally...Just what are they given a baton for?? Is it JUST to beat the living crap out of defenseless homeless guys in places like Fullerton..or MIGHT the training for their "tactical baton" include little uses like assisting while disarming someone? Could be....if this jerk had absorbed his training.

In the end though....A kid is dead. An autistic kid who probably died never even fully understanding why it happened. Cops today wonder why the community is pissed at them? I wonder why this cop isn't facing formal charges. I'd say the questions are linked. Very much so.

Originally posted by samkent
reply to post by smyleegrl

 

Call an ambulance where they can sedate him. Yes, that means getting in arm's reach and that carries risk, but I would think five or six cops could unarm him using little more than a net or pepper spray.

Are you kidding me? A net? Since when do the police have anything to do with a net?
"Here sarg you take this end and we will circle him a couple of times" Get real!

And ambulance drivers are not bouncers. They are not there or even trained to deal with violent people. That is the job of the police.

People on here are assuming that the officer had a taser on his belt. Not every officer carries one.
Plus as far as I know police are trained 'Shoot to kill" not wound him a bit.
Imagine the law suits. "You didn't have to shoot his knee. You could have shot his calf."

And no it's not trainning to run the other direction if you don't want to shoot the person. That could lead to a law suit as well.
Picture this. The officer backs off and the kid turns on a neighbor and injures or kills him. Can you say millions?

It's not the officers fault the kid did not respond to orders. That loose chimpanzee didn't respond to orders a year ago either. Neither the kid or the chimp could understand the consequences. Too bad!

To those who feel the police are just a bunch of jack boot thugs, why don't you become one? Be one of the good ones. Then you can try to talk sense into some crack head. Or wrestle with a weapon yelding autistic kid. We bury good cops every year.

Okay maybe these trigger happy cops are indeed just following protocol. Then it's this increasing pattern of the "shoot first, ask questions later" mindset, that concerns me.

Maybe cops should carry nets.

Maybe ambulance drivers should work out and get some training in dealing with violent people.

EVERY officer should carry a taser.

And only "shooting to kill" is the act of a brainwashed, inhumane, poor excuse for a human being.

Police often have to deal with situations involving schizophrenics, drug users, drunks or people who are just "out of their mind" angry (being that it IS a big part of their freakin JOB) Many whom have not even committed a crime. If "protocol" calls for the use of deadly force as an only option in this situation, then the protocol is cowardly!

An average guy with a little knowledge in self-defense and take down tactics could have taken him down. Oh, and god forbid that the officer gets a little scratch in the process. Oh, nooo. Because then, an INNOCENT KID wouldnt have to lose HIS LIFE

A normal human being, armed with a gun with no kind of police training, put in the exact situation as the officer, would have achieved much better results. Because your average citizen gives much more value to a human life

Honestly, if I was in the same situation and i truly feared for my life, worst case scenario, I would have shot him in his leg(s). No doubt. End of situation, we all go home and live to see another day. And i'm not even trained to deal with such situations. Its not a part of my JOB nor do I get PAID.. "to protect and serve"

These cops only "protect and serve" themselves, and each other. While they maim, kill and harass the people who pay their salary.. the people who their supposed to be working for.


btw. Does anyone know if this officer was given the specifics of the situation by the 911 operator? If not, IMO, she/he is part to blame.

Originally posted by Muckster
To protect and to serve... themselves!

Damn, didnt know that had been said already

The public is expected to do everything possible before using lethal force in self-defense - back up, run away, using non-lethal means at your disposal.
Why don't cops have to follow the same rules?
Are they not capable of going backwards?
Sad stuff right here.

How foolish was that officer Drunk, having a gun doesn't mean to always fire. An narco test must be conducted of that officer. Its totally disturbing.
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Originally posted by newcovenant

"My son suffers from seizures and they just murdered him," Camberdella said of her 18-year-old son, Michael Camberdella. "They just killed him."

"The cop got out of the car and just started shooting six times," she said. "(My son) had no weapons, he had no nothing." Sheriff Ric Bradshaw told Parker shortly after noon what 911 callers told dispatchers, that the teen was armed with a hammer and hedge clippers. "He was nervous because he's afraid of police and he suffers from depression and he's, he's autistic," she said. "My son is autistic. He has significant brain damage."

Notice it says here the callers said he had a hammer and garden clippers. The mother seems to dispute that he was holding any kind of weapon when police arrived, although she was traumatized and hospitalized immediately afterward and investigation is still underway.

Mom says teen son shot dead was autistic

Sheriff says using a taser was not an option

I noticed a similar story from February 'Cops kill an autistic teen in his own basement, armed with a butter knife.' Tells me Police need some additional and special training dealing with autistic people, disabled, impaired and handicapped people who are in obvious distress and may even appear threatening.

There must be non lethal options for controlling folks in these situations.
People should really say "enough is enough."
This is not a dog we are talking about now.

This was on the local news. In this story says multiple calls to 911 were made because the boy was acting out in a troublesome way due to his medical condition entirely and was not actually any kind of threat to the officer.

In our local television news, we are told the mother herself called the local Police to help her control her autistic son who had become uncontrollable and she told the 911 operator he had the hedge clippers and a hammer. That's why she called police, hoping they could help her get him under control

The first thing the officer did on arrival was shoot and kill him.
The police chief says that when the officer saw him coming in his direction with the hammer and shears he shot him. Odd because that is what they were called to the scene about.

I wonder if cops will begin to shoot and kill epileptics having seizures, fearing a possible danger to themselves? They may get kicked in the face or injured in the thrashing about? Is there a greater danger seeking the Heimlich Maneuver from a police officer if you can't speak and appear ODD? Might it be better to stand down and risk your chances choking to death? That's a sad commentary on the Police today.

edit on 5-10-2012 by newcovenant because: (no reason given)

Haven't these police departments heard yet of Crisis Intervention Teams that are specially trained to deal with the Developmentally Disabled and with other high stress situations such as this? National Association for the Mentally Ill IE:NAMI has been even helping to even fund Crisis Intervention Training for these CIT's across this entire nation. When I lived in Columbia Missouri was on the ground floor of helping to push that City's Police Department into forming a CIT Unit and today that CIT Unit is doing a fine job and more and more officers are being trained. OMG what a tragedy. My prayers go out to the family and friends of this young man.

I wonder why, as the Sheriff said, using a taser wasn't an option?

Am I the only one who recalls in the late nineties when these things were first introduced, the flurry of press interest in the policing tool of the future, designed to save lives? The taser was touted as a line of defense for the officer, a non-lethal alternative to the use of lethal force.

I guess some police officers would just rather to use their lethal option, some people just enjoy killing.

reply to post by newcovenant


Aren't these 'police' supposedly trained professionals? Aren't they supposed to remain calm and collected in the most dangerous of situations?

This officer should be suspended immediately, badge removed and an independent inquiry launched. If it turns out he failed in his duty to handle the situation with a cool head, then he should be charged with murder and jailed if found guilty by his peers.

That's how this system is supposed to work.

Firstly I would like to point out that I'm a "cop." I have been a Police Officer for 11 years and have had many experiences. I have worked as a patrol Officer, on a traffic enforcement unit, was deputized by the US Marshals and assigned to an ATF Task Force where I worked 3 1/2 years of full time undercover, and am now assigned as a Detective and am on our Special Emergency Responce Team. With that being said, I have learned that the general citizen cannot do our job. The typical individual even though making it through the academy will only remain in law enforcement for about 2 years if not less. The ones that do make it through go through some time where they are jaded towards the public they serve becuase of the things that officer sees every day. I'm sure most people have thoughts of what they would do in one of these situations or day dream about what they would do in the event of a crime hapenning right in front of them. The truth of the matter is from my experience, very few people actually stand up when someone is commiting a crime. Although rarely I have seen individuals confront criminals, most people call law enforcement. So I would like to present the idea that you might not have what it takes to do our job. Everyone screams why didn't they taze him, or shoot him in the legs...really? Maybe the guy isn't issued a tazer and shooting him in an extremity on purpouse would be intentional maming which may be better than death but doesn't gaurantee that the individual will not continue forward and attack you. Gardening clippers and a hammer most definately constitutes an armed individual. I have had instances where I should have shot people and didn't. Am I glad I didn't pull the trigger....yes absolutely!!!!! On the other hand I have to always tell myself what if the guy wouldn't have dropped the gun or knife or baseball bat, or metal tiiki torch that was still lit, or etc etc etc. Would I have used deadly force if that armed individual continued to be a threat to mt life or a anothers, yes without any hesitation at all. So back to the incident that all of this cop bashing is around. A man with a hammer and gardening clippers comes at a Police officer. If he didn't comply to commands to drop the weapon this is a deadly force situation. I dare say that those of you who haven't had an experience like this before, as most Police Officers have, you would shoot much quicker than us who deal with this sort of thing on a regular basis. Mental handicap or not a threat is a threat. You can what if this situation all day but in the end. The media will stretch the story which ever way they want, and until you have access to discovery for the incident through the court system you will not know the true story. I suggest every one of you go to your local department and request to do a ride along. Don't just do one do multiple's. I can guarantee it will change your outlook on Law Enforcement. Also before its said again I do agree there are dirty cops but realistically they are few and far between and most of those who serve and protect really love what they do and would never do anything to jeapordize their career. Flame on

reply to post by CosmicCitizen

The cop should have retreated to his car (if out) and called for special backup.

And if the kid charges someone else while the officer is retreating??
The city gets sued.
The cop gets labeled a coward on ATS.

Originally posted by samkent
reply to post by CosmicCitizen

 

The cop should have retreated to his car (if out) and called for special backup.

And if the kid charges someone else while the officer is retreating??
The city gets sued.
The cop gets labeled a coward on ATS.

I totally think the cop should have backed off rather than kill the kid too. What are the consequences of retreating? Why not play it out and see. There is always time to fire a shot and bring him down if need be but he was running around with the lawn equipment in hand all afternoon without anyone getting harmed and there were no police there. Why expect that now that that Police ARE there, some harm was going to come to someone else? I think the mother was more worried about him causing harm to himself and why she called for assistance controlling him and not assistance in killing him. There is a posse of atty's looking at this case and if there are grounds to sue the City Police force I am sure they will find them.

reply to post by killette82


All good and well but I think we should wait for an investigation into all the underlying facts in this case before we decide this officer is not responsible for an unnecessary death.

Way too early to take his side when there are so many instances of Police brutality on film and on record.

I can't even read the article. I have twin cousins who are both autistic, one more severely than the other. I always dread the day if they were ever stopped by cops what would happen. Poor kids would probably get killed in a heartbeat when all they would probably be trying to do was communicate to the authorities.

reply to post by killette82


Finally...

There's another thing that should be mentioned. When I went to my first concealed carry class years ago I learned a few very important lessons.

the first thing we covered was that an armed attacker can cover in incredible amount of distance in a very short amount of time and before you can raise and fire a weapon if he/she is highly motivate and/or mentally deficient. A well practiced and trained shooter (a lot of LEO's don't get enough range time) can draw and fire on a target in 1.5 seconds. Guess what, an attacker can cover 21 feet in about 1.5 seconds. That's why officers (and concealed carry holders) should assess the situation from a safe distance, draw before the distance is no longer safe, and act as necessary.

The other thing is that if you have your weapon drawn, finger on the trigger, and aimed at an attacker, if they are more motivated to shoot you than you are to shoot them, they will be able to raise and fire their weapon before you can pull your trigger, even if your finger is on the trigger. They demonstrated this with empty weapons. One played police officer and aimed his weapon at the one that played perp. The perp had his weapon at his side. Both were trying to win the contest. The perp's weapon went click slightly before the officers. In all likelihood there would have been two people down if there were bullets in the guns.

I wouldn't want to be a cop. It's a somewhat thankless job. They see the dark side of people almost every day. I'm glad we have them...

More than likely the poor kid ran toward the officer... but the reality is all of us are speculating. We don't know what happened and you damn sure aren't going to get the straight truth from the media

reply to post by newcovenant


I guess those new bullets they're issuing don't work on arms or legs anymore.

The only way this cops behavior could be justified at all is if the autistic teen was brandishing a actual gun at pointing it at the officer. Otherwise the officers behavior is totally uncalled for but not surprising these days. Anyone who is not violent in their behavior towards others would have dealt with this type of situation in a completely different manner. There are numerous other options available to someone of a sound mind in dealing with a situation as such. If a mother or father of a child behaving this way would have shot them, the parent(s) would most likely be tried for murder, so... IMHO - The cop should be tried and hopefully convicted of murder also!

reply to post by killette82


That's how all the police officers I come into contact with comport themselves. But that's just me... I draw the right kind to me.

But we're hearing way too often about mentally disabled CHILDREN being killed by police with firearms. This is the third or fourth in a couple of years. Number may be higher, I don't watch the news past what Anderson Cooper's ranting about (the big screen in the lunchroom at work blares CNN and we always get the same segment of the rotation on our breaks )

Some day, a parent is going to witness this kind of thing happen, go back in the house to get their shotgun, and blow that cop's head off, and then maybe their own for good measure. How do you go on living after something like that?

Originally posted by truthermantwo
If the boy was afraid of police, why did the mother call them, she should have called an ambulance or just locked him in a room somehow. Don't get me wrong im mad at the police that shot him, but i think the mother could have done something different, we need to get out of relying on the police, they're more violent sometimes, than the violent.

18 year old boys, are a lot stronger than most moms. I have a range from 11-22. With ostero arthritis, the 11 year old is stronger than me.

Originally posted by seamus
reply to post by newcovenant

 

I guess those new bullets they're issuing don't work on arms or legs anymore.

Yeah...Apparently they can still walk unless it's a headshot.