The 800 Pound Gorilla Everyone Ignores

Originally posted by uSNUUZuLUUz

Originally posted by hawkiye
I'll just get right to the point. Can someone please tell me why I should vote in elections that cant be verified?


And then of course we have those who claim if we do not endorse an unverifiable system by participating in it we don't have a right to complain. Are you mad? WE have every right to complain when our fellow human beings think they can vote theft plunder and even murder onus and our families through an unverifiable system much less through a verifiable system...

edit on 26-8-2012 by hawkiye because: (no reason given)

BEST SOLUTION::

Are you ready for the Best solution. Please lawmakers, enact the following. PUBLIC ONLINE VOTING and PUBLIC results.

#1 : Have a website per state, to allow for online voting (to as not to overwhelm one website accross the country)

#2: Have people go through an "account setup". Where it verifies your address, your ability to vote (if registered), and what county, etc. It will ask for your social security numer, yet the USER name will be their "Driver's License Number" or an alternate number given by the state voting website. Reason for Driver's licence number or alternate # (as opposed to say a social security number), is so that you can see everyone's vote listed by that #. But of course, you won't know who specifically that person is next to that #. Unless, you get a court warrant, and then you can see the name next to each number. So overall, anyone can verify the results per county, and per state, on the website and see the breakdown. And if anyone wants to claim FOUL, then can go through the courts, and get the specific name.

#3: This will encourage more voting. Why in the 21st century, are we still going to the polls and physically punching a ballot, or pressing a button? In no way, make the online voting, mandatory. But at least make it an option. That way, people from out of town, can still vote. The elderly can still vote, the disabled can still vote, etc. There is no reason to force people out of their homes to go stand in a long line, to get into a small booth. Online voting (securely) will help that effort. Expect to see a large turnout.

#4: Of course make it Secure. make it so that you can only vote 1 time. If you go and view your public results, by your number, that only you know, and if you see an error, you will be able to contact the administrator, and file for FRAUD.

#5: Public is the key. I as a citizen should be able to view each states results, and VIEW MY OWN RESULTS. It is so frustrating, that on the digital ballots, i don't even get a paper receipt. Say I pressed the wrong button, at least the paper receipt would show, ooops I made a mistake. The online system, would eliminate all of that error.

#6: Quick results. If done online, results can be processed quickly and efficiently. No waiting for hours to see results. As you can probably see the tally live as it unfolds. It will make you feel better for voting a certain way, if when you vote you see the # increase by 1 vote. YOUR VOTE. LIVE. And to be fair, you can start the online process 1 week early, to allow for any error or any FOUL claims, etc.

--------------------------



BUMP

This is what needs to be done to Finally Fix the Current Corrupt Voting Process in America.

As A Nation, Can We Finally Let this Year of " 2012 " be The Last Year of Voting Corruption and Scandal !

As Mentioned Above by " uSNUUZuLUUz " and In my prior post, We Already Know How To Fix This Voting Count Problem!

Whatever Computer Methods the States Decide to Use - These Voting Scam Problems Can Be Fixed -

Originally posted by chrisb9

Originally posted by uSNUUZuLUUz

Originally posted by hawkiye
I'll just get right to the point. Can someone please tell me why I should vote in elections that cant be verified?


And then of course we have those who claim if we do not endorse an unverifiable system by participating in it we don't have a right to complain. Are you mad? WE have every right to complain when our fellow human beings think they can vote theft plunder and even murder onus and our families through an unverifiable system much less through a verifiable system...

edit on 26-8-2012 by hawkiye because: (no reason given)

BEST SOLUTION::

Are you ready for the Best solution. Please lawmakers, enact the following. PUBLIC ONLINE VOTING and PUBLIC results.

#1 : Have a website per state, to allow for online voting (to as not to overwhelm one website accross the country)

#2: Have people go through an "account setup". Where it verifies your address, your ability to vote (if registered), and what county, etc. It will ask for your social security numer, yet the USER name will be their "Driver's License Number" or an alternate number given by the state voting website. Reason for Driver's licence number or alternate # (as opposed to say a social security number), is so that you can see everyone's vote listed by that #. But of course, you won't know who specifically that person is next to that #. Unless, you get a court warrant, and then you can see the name next to each number. So overall, anyone can verify the results per county, and per state, on the website and see the breakdown. And if anyone wants to claim FOUL, then can go through the courts, and get the specific name.

#3: This will encourage more voting. Why in the 21st century, are we still going to the polls and physically punching a ballot, or pressing a button? In no way, make the online voting, mandatory. But at least make it an option. That way, people from out of town, can still vote. The elderly can still vote, the disabled can still vote, etc. There is no reason to force people out of their homes to go stand in a long line, to get into a small booth. Online voting (securely) will help that effort. Expect to see a large turnout.

#4: Of course make it Secure. make it so that you can only vote 1 time. If you go and view your public results, by your number, that only you know, and if you see an error, you will be able to contact the administrator, and file for FRAUD.

#5: Public is the key. I as a citizen should be able to view each states results, and VIEW MY OWN RESULTS. It is so frustrating, that on the digital ballots, i don't even get a paper receipt. Say I pressed the wrong button, at least the paper receipt would show, ooops I made a mistake. The online system, would eliminate all of that error.

#6: Quick results. If done online, results can be processed quickly and efficiently. No waiting for hours to see results. As you can probably see the tally live as it unfolds. It will make you feel better for voting a certain way, if when you vote you see the # increase by 1 vote. YOUR VOTE. LIVE. And to be fair, you can start the online process 1 week early, to allow for any error or any FOUL claims, etc.

--------------------------



BUMP

This is what needs to be done to Finally Fix the Current Corrupt Voting Process in America.

As A Nation, Can We Finally Let this Year of " 2012 " be The Last Year of Voting Corruption and Scandal !

As Mentioned Above by " uSNUUZuLUUz " and In my prior post, We Already Know How To Fix This Voting Count Problem!

Whatever Computer Methods the States Decide to Use - These Voting Scam Problems Can Be Fixed -

All this? Just to vote for the CEO of the USCorp?
i dont think you understand the Country you live in.

reply to post by Rockpuck


This is shockin yet in no way a surprise. It dosent matter if it happened with one or with every name on that list. A vote being counted fasly is still cheating weather its enough to change the outcome or not. America is supposed to be the leader of the free world, the example to all other nations. There is no excuse for even just one wrongly counted vote. Counting is something we learn in kindergarden. Its not that hard to do.
The fact that your name was on no list clearly seems that a third party vote isnt counted at all. I recall a few years ago a guy on here claiming he receved a call from an automated census(didnt actualy count for the vote but still) that asks who you plan to vote for. The classic press one for dem two for rep and three for indipendant. And ofcourse an option to have your name removed from the calling list. He says he cpressed three and the machine told him he was removed from the list as if he selected that. Seems even the census board dont want to count third party voters. That just stuck with me.

Originally posted by chrisb9

Originally posted by uSNUUZuLUUz

Originally posted by hawkiye
I'll just get right to the point. Can someone please tell me why I should vote in elections that cant be verified?


And then of course we have those who claim if we do not endorse an unverifiable system by participating in it we don't have a right to complain. Are you mad? WE have every right to complain when our fellow human beings think they can vote theft plunder and even murder onus and our families through an unverifiable system much less through a verifiable system...

edit on 26-8-2012 by hawkiye because: (no reason given)

BEST SOLUTION::

Are you ready for the Best solution. Please lawmakers, enact the following. PUBLIC ONLINE VOTING and PUBLIC results.

#1 : Have a website per state, to allow for online voting (to as not to overwhelm one website accross the country)

#2: Have people go through an "account setup". Where it verifies your address, your ability to vote (if registered), and what county, etc. It will ask for your social security numer, yet the USER name will be their "Driver's License Number" or an alternate number given by the state voting website. Reason for Driver's licence number or alternate # (as opposed to say a social security number), is so that you can see everyone's vote listed by that #. But of course, you won't know who specifically that person is next to that #. Unless, you get a court warrant, and then you can see the name next to each number. So overall, anyone can verify the results per county, and per state, on the website and see the breakdown. And if anyone wants to claim FOUL, then can go through the courts, and get the specific name.

#3: This will encourage more voting. Why in the 21st century, are we still going to the polls and physically punching a ballot, or pressing a button? In no way, make the online voting, mandatory. But at least make it an option. That way, people from out of town, can still vote. The elderly can still vote, the disabled can still vote, etc. There is no reason to force people out of their homes to go stand in a long line, to get into a small booth. Online voting (securely) will help that effort. Expect to see a large turnout.

#4: Of course make it Secure. make it so that you can only vote 1 time. If you go and view your public results, by your number, that only you know, and if you see an error, you will be able to contact the administrator, and file for FRAUD.

#5: Public is the key. I as a citizen should be able to view each states results, and VIEW MY OWN RESULTS. It is so frustrating, that on the digital ballots, i don't even get a paper receipt. Say I pressed the wrong button, at least the paper receipt would show, ooops I made a mistake. The online system, would eliminate all of that error.

#6: Quick results. If done online, results can be processed quickly and efficiently. No waiting for hours to see results. As you can probably see the tally live as it unfolds. It will make you feel better for voting a certain way, if when you vote you see the # increase by 1 vote. YOUR VOTE. LIVE. And to be fair, you can start the online process 1 week early, to allow for any error or any FOUL claims, etc.

--------------------------



BUMP

This is what needs to be done to Finally Fix the Current Corrupt Voting Process in America.

As A Nation, Can We Finally Let this Year of " 2012 " be The Last Year of Voting Corruption and Scandal !

As Mentioned Above by " uSNUUZuLUUz " and In my prior post, We Already Know How To Fix This Voting Count Problem!

Whatever Computer Methods the States Decide to Use - These Voting Scam Problems Can Be Fixed -

exactly... At least if it is Public and Transparent, and you can go and view your VOTE, then you can be assured that the count is accurate..

I know there are many other factors to the american political/voting system, but at least if you are going to have a vote.. make it TRANSPARENT, and visible to everyone. That way everyone can back check, and feel confident in whose elected. Not right now, with the current system, you press a button and you are done, and walk away. Who knows what the machine actually counts, who knows what the software does with the data (rounding?), who knows what happens when it gets sent around the country??? any one of those steps their could be corruption, and there is NO way to verify any of it. Go try and verify your vote, after the elections, and see if they can tell you who you voted for. You CAN't.

let's force the system to go PUBLIC and ONLINE!

reply to post by uSNUUZuLUUz


y all dont understand.

there has to be a wet ink signature from you to vote. thats how they want it. they/you are bound by Universal Commercial Code by your voluntary sign. Every signature is worth money.

there will never be computerization for this reason only.

To computerize it would eliminate the signatory binding and cancel the point of why elections were established----

to get you to sign on with a de-facto company imitating a Country.

Originally posted by rainbowbear
reply to post by uSNUUZuLUUz

 

y all dont understand.

there has to be a wet ink signature from you to vote. thats how they want it. they/you are bound by Universal Commercial Code by your voluntary sign. Every signature is worth money.

there will never be computerization for this reason only.

To computerize it would eliminate the signatory binding and cancel the point of why elections were established----

to get you to sign on with a de-facto company imitating a Country.

edit on 28-8-2012 by rainbowbear because: (no reason given)

Have you not been in a new voting booth before?? It is all done by computer. There is no ink signature anymore. All you do is show your ID, take a credit card thingy, put it in the machine. Then all you do is press the touch screen, and select your votes. Afterwards, you click "confirm" and then take the card out to the people working at the voting poll.. No paper involved. NO ink signature. Been that way for about 6 years here in Northern Virginia.

So if they can do that all electronically, then might as well go to the next level and do it ONLINE. There are many other ways of verifying who you are, rather than a signature.

reply to post by uSNUUZuLUUz


ya, i know. youve signed for a drivers license as ID? do you have to have a SS number? do you need to be registered with signature in the County you reside?

or not?

very doubtful that you have not given them a wet ink at sometime, to vote.

all these acts relinquish your sovereignty and bind you to the Corp.

dude thats crazy that you still have faith in a program that only needs an "ID" and a CREDIT CARD?

no, out in the West, were too smart to use computers to vote, apparently. now the paper trail is part of your Visa bill--LOL!

Do you think if nobody at all voted (wouldn't that be cool if everybody abstained for one election?) that we would still be fed some type of decisive election result with a candidate still being put into office?

Originally posted by TheCaucasianAmerican
reply to post by newcovenant

 

Haha wow you just compared voting to a law. I have voted. And all it was is a waste of gas and time.

You have the right to not vote. But its the law to wear a seatbelt. You know? Click it or ticket?

I am a free American to do whatever the heck I want and all you want is a dictatorship.

You are not the american.

It is called a democracy not a dictatorship and voting is a privilege. If you don't vote you probably will in time end up with a dictatorship. If you think it is a waste of time then don't vote. None is forcing you to vote and for the record I've been an American longer than you have been anything.

reply to post by jeantherapy


do you know the real statistics of how many people actually do vote?

how do you know its not already like this?

Answer;

you are a smart human with rational capabilities and you know the truth but you work hard to not believe what you know.

just an observation.

Originally posted by BennyTheBlade
reply to post by newcovenant

 

lmao i dont deserve to live here? First off i didnt choose to live here. I was born here. If the only way one deserves to live here is by being a blind fool im glad i dont. The system is a scam to the fullest extent. Its a joke. Its a failed system. The economy is proof the gov is a failed system. Voting does nothing to change that failed system, only further it along. If wanting clear proof that the voting is fair makes me unamerican that heck with it, im not proud to be american anyway. I cnat see why everyone wouldnt want to know for sure its fair. Thats just idiotic. Secondly, no offence? Thats pretty offencive so im sure it was intended. Be a man and say your being offencive. You sir are an ignorant waste of my time and i want nothing to do with your childish comments. Just because i demand the system be proven fair you think you deserve more than i do. I pitty the fool. Get over yourself already. Thank you come again.. Oh and ps, you failed to explain your logic. That link you posted doent offer any reason why it should be law. If anything thats more reason i should have the right to choose if i care enough.

edit on 27-8-2012 by BennyTheBlade because: wanted a proper explanation of a past question.

It's a great system and among the best in the world. Why do you think we still have people trying to get into the country and very few trying to get out of America? It is just a shame people in ignorance due to an incomplete education or perhaps simple childish immaturity think it was easy or free. People fought and died to give American people the right to vote in free and fair elections. You can demand all you want, you can cry and stomp your feet but no body is going to do your homework and prove the system is fair to you or anyone else. That is up to you to study history a little and realize what you've got here and appreciate it or move out of the country if you think some other country does it better. Political Science 101. Simple. No need to chastise me, or call me ignorant since I know more about the election process than you seem to. There is no need to accuse me being a waste of time just because it irks you I am a patriotic American who is glad for and accepts the responsibility to vote. You admittedly, are not and do not.

With what has been happening in the past elections like the 2000 election in florida, it is more clear then ever before that our votes only count to the oil companies who turn a profit from it! The truth is unless one votes on an absentee ballot they have no real chance on being counted! Less and less control flows from out of our hands and into the hands of TPTB! Today we now have the EVM (electronic voting machines) where our votes can so easily be switched with a couple of key punches! Is it any wonder why so few of us end up voting! Then there are the choices we are given to choose from! It's never a choice for the best candidate but always for the lesser of two evils! Which candidate will hurt us the least! I believe today more then ever it's painfully obvious that the bulk of these candidates platforms are basically the same even though they pretend to be different!
For instance. My sister believes that a Mitt Romney will do more harm to the middleclass then a Barrak Obama but the truth is they have the same mandate. They serve the same master, Corporate America! even though Obama is a bigger liar, the truth is that if he gets reelected he will still cut SSI, raise taxes, give the wealthy more tax cuts and help to destroy more jobs here in America! While allowing more illegals entry into this country!
If he does'nt do all this in his first year of office i will admit there are more differences between the candidates then i was willing to admit! We will never change this country through elections but only through boycotting, nonparticipation and outright decention on the verge of revolution! Cause God help us if the road to change never comes!

In 1954 it was well recognized by those in positions of authority that it was only a matter of time, only a few decades, before the general public would be able to grasp and upset the cradle of power, for the very elements of the new silent-weapon technology were as accessible for a public utopia as they were for providing a private utopia.

this is what Elections are for.
silent weapons for quiet wars--Summary

So when you voters are willing to step up and have true responsibility in what your Country does, instead of hiring some bureaucrat, maybe we will be free.

reply to post by rainbowbear

The number of friends and acquaintances I've had tell me they voted and my observations of people gathered at polling places lead me to believe people are voting. ???

reply to post by jeantherapy


yes, but thats a small example of your statement.
what about the Country as a whole?

HOW do we know the facts about who votes for whom and how many.

It is possible that hardly anyone votes for a President, isnt it? You could go to vote and write in Micky Mouse.

we still get bush, or obama, or romney.

once this is a known number, it should be easy to see, that the amount of people voting isnt even enough to prove that the results were true. Like you mentioned in your post.

reply to post by newcovenant


people try to get in the country and dont want to leave it because just like you they are so quick to beleive the lies. Simple as that. You keep saying its a great system and its free and fair but you nor anyone else can offer any reasoon why thats true. You dont have to do my homework, i already have and my answers say its not fair. You dont want to do it because you cant find the proof that its fair. Prolly because your using your american text books full of propaganda. What makes me unpatriotic? Because im not proud to be american? Well i got news for you, america has become something it was never intended to be, i beleive in what the real partiotic americans first stood for and thats not what america has become. So your a bit confused. Once again i will say, anyone that doesnt see why there is no reason the election should be done in such a way that its proven fair is just a blind follower. Power always leads to corruption. Always. Americas gov is just better at hiding that corruption.

reply to post by jeantherapy


one important thing you over look. The fine folks running for office still get to vote too and surly they will cast a vote for themselfs. And congress will vote and so will the senate. And wifes and family of canidates will too. It will never be zero votes. Could be justa handful but thats all it takes.

Originally posted by BennyTheBlade
reply to post by newcovenant

 

people try to get in the country and dont want to leave it because just like you they are so quick to beleive the lies. Simple as that. You keep saying its a great system and its free and fair but you nor anyone else can offer any reasoon why thats true. You dont have to do my homework, i already have and my answers say its not fair. You dont want to do it because you cant find the proof that its fair. Prolly because your using your american text books full of propaganda. What makes me unpatriotic? Because im not proud to be american? Well i got news for you, america has become something it was never intended to be, i beleive in what the real partiotic americans first stood for and thats not what america has become. So your a bit confused. Once again i will say, anyone that doesnt see why there is no reason the election should be done in such a way that its proven fair is just a blind follower. Power always leads to corruption. Always. Americas gov is just better at hiding that corruption.

The problem with "Patriotism" is that it triggers an emotional response instead of one of logic and reason. It literally disconnects your brain and keeps you from thinking with a whole brain.

Patriotism is not love of freedom or truth or Country, but a pep rally for the State.

you need it like a hole in the head

reply to post by rainbowbear


We don't know the facts about the voting that is precisely why I have never and probably will never vote.

Originally posted by BennyTheBlade
reply to post by jeantherapy

 

one important thing you over look. The fine folks running for office still get to vote too and surly they will cast a vote for themselfs. And congress will vote and so will the senate. And wifes and family of canidates will too. It will never be zero votes. Could be justa handful but thats all it takes.

Of course, but if the figures were accurately reported back to us then we could see if only a thousand people in the whole country voted; wouldn't that send some shockwaves?