Did the Holocaust Really Happen?

the sick thing is once the last few people who were actually there and saw the camps and the atrocities are gone from old age these denying bastards will actually be able to make people believe it never did happen.

To forget or deny it happened is a huge travesty to the people who had to go thru it, and to those people i apologize for what we have become.

and once it is forgotten then it is likley to happen again.

Originally posted by Gixxer

...

and once it is forgotten then it is likley to happen again.

I am sorry to say, and I hope I am wrong, but i suspect it will happen again.

Mass murder is the one aspect of mankind that we can not seem to eliminate. There is always an excuse; and it's always "different" than the last time... until a generation or so later, when you realize just how stupidly our fellow man has behaved.

While it is common and somewhat troubling that the word "holocaust" has been meme'd into meaning only one thing, our collective history is full of holocausts... the WWII version was not even the most egregious example... heinous though it was.

It isn't enough to "remember." We need to understand it. Institutionalized hatred is mankind's most evil enterprise.... sad that we accept it by degrees.

My grandmother grew up in a castle, along the rhine i believe, during all this, her familily had something to do with Dachau. She refuses to talk about it though and i dont blame her nor will i push her to talk about it. But i still cant really say wether it really happened or not, sure seems like it did, but who am i, im just regular guy...


Peace

Originally posted by PutAQuarterIn

edit on 18-7-2012 by PutAQuarterIn because: nevermind OP..needs a less sensational title. the title alone was highly insulting

I think you are too easily insulted if the thread title, a rhetorical question, is offensive to you.

I wish there was a down vote button!! How the hell do you post in a thread without reading the OP?

OP BELEIVES THE HOLOCAUST HAPPENED!!! HE JUST HAS A SENSATIONAL TITLE!!

Everyone that posted here that yes, it did happen, including the mod, should be put on a list of people who don't read threads, and have a strike against them. ATS should start kicking people off who post without reading the OP say after 5-10 strikes.

This thread and ATS's purpose is to have a discussion, which is always two sided. If you aren't here to have a discussion and you post without reading then you bring the whole community down and show the sub-par intelligence that has lately been bringing ruining this site

To the OP, thanks for your well researched and provocative thread. I learned something new and appreciate your time and research.

Originally posted by illuminnaughty
reply to post by jrmcleod

 

Yes I agree with you. Theose people in the photos look like they starved to death. The americans bombed all day and we brits bombed all night. Every road railway port and any other transport system was bombed. So no food or supplys could get to the camps. In a time of war I would feed my own troops first, rather than any one who was a traitor or who had declared war on my country. Thats why they were in the jail/camp. Just like in the USA. Who rounded up all the japonese and put them in camps.

that is an excellent point- not to negate the suffering and death of anyone in WW2, be they German, Jew, Russian, British whatever, but say the US suffered a massive attack and foodlines, supplies etc were disrupted- would the Japanese camp prisoners have been fed ahead of US soldiers, civilians etc?

No is the answer, and the footage would have been of dead emaciated Japanese.............

Originally posted by jrmcleod
reply to post by SkullAndBeats235

 

I'm NOT denying that the Holocaust never occurred but posting a couple of images without any source really doesn't do it for ATS members.

What i will say on the matter is that 90% of all those dead people look like they starved to death...

Did the holocaust happen? I don't know, i have seen documentaries on it and to be honest i can't seem to make up my mind totally...and to be honest it serves NO purpose for me to make up my mind, it is in the past...and there it shall remain!

The reason it matters is that the Neo-Nazi's and Hitler supporters are trying to rewrite history, even though some victims and many who got the story from family members who were victims are still alive. I got a first hand account from a German Lady, now dead, who told me the story of the war from her eyes as a German Citizen. German Citizens were virtual prisoners in their own country. She was used as sex slave by an SS Officer (at age 13) and as she told me how the people of her town made US Flags to wave to welcome the US Troops as Hero's to the German Citizens, the look in her eyes answered any questions I may have had. Yes, the German people welcomed the troops that took down Hitler, they were victims also.

I've had some face to face confrontations with these sick people who are trying to convince people that Hitler was a saint and the Holocaust is not true. They were all both hard core Anti-Semites who want the Jews dead and hard core Racists who belonged to both the Freemen in Montana and the Aryan Nation. All belonged to both groups. They are serious about this and brainwash their children to carry on their plans.

The quickest way to repeat history is to forget history or to rewrite it to hide atrocities like this.

This was way deeper than the Jews. Part of being a Nazi is believing that all less than perfect people should be eliminated (killed) and all children born less than perfect should be killed. You should really deny ignorance by learning this history, so you can't be mislead by evil people and yes Neo-Nazis are genuine evil. If they start hanging out here I know I won't stay and I imagine most members will feel the same.
____________________________________
NOTE:
Springer if your reading, thank you for your thread and attention.

double post. check the one below.

Oh boy, I thought we were done with these threads...

Down goes another one. People, Hitler was a very sick man, he needed euthanasia and even decided to administer it himself. There is no question what happened before, during, or after. Well, maybe after, but still, the war happened and for very legitimate reasons. The evidence is overwhelming, and if you don't like it, don't push it on the family and friends of those who live on with the memories. To deny the terror and atrocities of that time is to spit in the face of those who lost their lives. Have some respect, please.

Peace to all descendents of the victims of WW2. The cost of that vicious fight was a very dear one. Millions of lives, to be exact. Millions of beautiful, innocent souls. Hitler deserved every bit of what he got. He paid for it with the blood and ashes of innocent people, and that's a fact.

reply to post by SubAce


Just like everything else I never experienced first hand, there's no way to really "KNOW" whether or not it happened. Did some awful things happen? It would definitely appear that way. Did they happen exactly as the media says they did? Does anything ever happen exactly the way the media says they do?

Let me ask you this question, do you look at the population of Germany today and can you sincerely connect them with the cultural heritage of Germany?

I can't ... the fact of the matter, that if you look at today's Germany ... it's like looking at ancient ruins, of an ancient culture.

So the answer is, definately yes ... there most certainly has been some racial disaster there.

After saying that, I stop and wonder ... and I don't think it's as simple as it's given out to be.

Originally posted by Maxmars
While it is common and somewhat troubling that the word "holocaust" has been meme'd into meaning only one thing, our collective history is full of holocausts... the WWII version was not even the most egregious example... heinous though it was.

It isn't enough to "remember." We need to understand it. Institutionalized hatred is mankind's most evil enterprise.... sad that we accept it by degrees.

If you ask me, it never stopped, it merely migrates from place to place. Look to Rwanda, Darfur...before that Cambodia. The killing never stops, we just stopped counting.

reply to post by SubAce


In answer to your original question:

Yes, it did.

Originally posted by gaurdian2012
I am truly in shock that this thread has not generated any BS anti semetic ramblings. let me jump in and fix that, the holocaust did happen just not only to Jews the Blacks and native Indians also had there versions of a holocaust and now the middle east Muslims face a similar holocaust. you need to rephrase the title of this thread not Did the Holocaust Really Happen? but Is the holocaust still happening?

All I get from that is you are so filled with hate that you cannot even stay on topic. You have to make it about you and what you want to talk about. Sad actually.

What is even sadder of course is how just like the Nazi's, most Muslims are slaughtered by the radical Islamist, who account for most of the deaths in their own land. Then on top of that while conducting their own Holocaust they try and say the Holocaust never happened. Even sadder. The body count from Muslim on Muslim killing must be staggering in proportions over the centuries. Hardly a day goes by we don't read about a radical Islamist killing a group of innocent Muslims. It's particularly troubling when like the Germans they start killing their own people.

reply to post by AfterInfinity




try reading his post, he is not denying the holocaust....................

reply to post by Nephlim


Because the OP wrote the perfect piece of knee jerk bait. And look how many knee jerkers he caught.

Deny ignorance, indeed! How do they do it when they ignored the entire opening post? LOL

Originally posted by Blaine91555
What is even sadder of course is how just like the Nazi's, most Muslims are slaughtered by the radical Islamist, who account for most of the deaths in their own land. Then on top of that while conducting their own Holocaust they try and say the Holocaust never happened. Even sadder. The body count from Muslim on Muslim killing must be staggering in proportions over the centuries. Hardly a day goes by we don't read about a radical Islamist killing a group of innocent Muslims. It's particularly troubling when like the Germans they start killing their own people.

This raises an interesting point actually. When it came to the Germans murdering the ethnic Poles, there was no dilemma. The Wehrmacht rolled in, and behind them went the squads of Einsatzgruppen, rounding up every male over the age of 14 and slaughtering them. No questions asked, no cries of conscience. Later when women and children were included, alcohol was necessary to get them in the 'mood', but apart from that, still very little qualms. Relatively speaking.

The German Jews though, despite having suffered social and economic persecution from the very beginning of the Nazi regime, came to very little harm prior to the decision made at Wannsee. That is why most of them didn't flee when they had the opportunity to do so, they thought that the trouble would pass, and apart from living in ever cramped conditions, they were still relatively free to move around and assist each other. The Germans, or rather Nazis had never intended to kill these people, they had hoped to get rid of them by legitimate means, and when those options became closed to them, and the Jews, unable to work and therefore pay for food, began to suffer, it was only then discussed whether they should kill them. And, when that decision was made, it was understood that because these people were like them, in every way but faith, that it would be hard for the men assigned the task. Every effort was therefore put into killing them as 'cleanly' as possible, and various methods were tried and tested before Zyklon-B was decided as being the most 'humane' method.

It is, it seems, very easy to commit genocide when the people that you are killing look different, and when there is a barrier of language between perpetrator and victim, so much harder when the only invisible differences exist.

What is interesting about the current situation with the Muslims and the Jihadists, is that most often, especially if one looks at the ethnic cleansing that took place in the Balkans in the early to mid 1990s, was that the majority of those 'Muslims' were brought in from elsewhere, many had served in Afghanistan for example. And, similarly, the other side used mercenaries too. The killing was not really driven by internal rivalries, so much as it was propelled by outsiders paid to create mayhem that appeared to be racially motivated.

Not sure if this has been covered already, but here is a Bishop that have studied this extensively saying there is no proof of any Gas Chambers, and why it was impossible.

reply to post by NeoVain


I covered this in the other thread that got closed down, but will happily reiterate. Jean Luc Pressac is the only qualified person to have studied the gas chambers extensively. The gas chambers themselves were levelled to the ground as the Allies approached, and all that remains of them are fragments of rubble. The gas chambers as they are now at Auschwitz are reconstructions.

Jean Luc Pressac's study can be read here...

www.holocaust-history.org...

reply to post by Biliverdin


Thanks and interesting reply. You seem to be very studied in history and I look forward to seeing any threads you post.

As I go through the news every day it never fails to amaze me as I read about a bomb being set by one Muslim to kill other Muslims over differences in how they view their religion. Or I should say sickens me.

Over the last couple of years I've gotten to know some of the refugees from the Sudan who were brought here by CCS to Anchorage. They are such wonderful friendly people I have trouble equating them with what they are fleeing from. Clearly the Muslim people are wonderful folks and it is a real mystery to me how they spawn the radicals in their culture. There is in my opinion a lot in common with how the Nazi's were able to do as they did in plain sight and not be stopped by the Germans themselves.

I'm not sure I understand the psychology behind people who turn a blind eye towards or defend the indefensible based on shared culture. We are very strange animals who's actions often make little sense.

I sometimes wonder if there is a genetic trigger that creates a group of irrational haters in our species as a form of population control.