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Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by TheSubversiveOne
I will keep my answer simple here...
You say it is impossible to be aware without a body. Ever heard of ESP? The five senses are not the only ones that exist...otherwise, people would not be able to see spirits, or communicate with them.
Let me guess, you're going to argue with that now, too.
Suffice it to say that we CAN be aware without the use of our body. In fact, people have felt things happening to OTHER peoples' bodies, while their own body remained undisturbed. Additionally, I myself have witnessed a man being able to tell things without any use of his five senses. America's Got Talent has some very amazing people on it.
Perhaps you should stick to topics you are familiar with, or educated on.
Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by TheSubversiveOne
A good question, but no cigar. See, in order for your body to count, it has to be your body doing the interacting. In these cases which I mentioned, the body should never have responded...which implies that something ELSE responded, and the body simply expressed it because that's how we're used to processing it.
Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by TheSubversiveOne
Have you ever known your body to respond when someone else was touched without your knowledge? I have seen it happen. Have you ever known someone to be completely blind, and take three cards and describe what was on them? He never saw the drawings, never heard anything or was told anything about the cards after the pictures were drawn. Yet he described them. I watched it happen.
Have you ever seen a person describe another's journey on a highway, despite the fact that it took place miles away while the watcher was dozing? I have. I've seen all of these. In all of these cases, not a single sense was used. The body was virtually useless, except in anchoring them to this world. As I said, the soul is housed in the body, and with body is required to anchor the soul to this realm. The soul powers the consciousness. The five senses are not necessary for every function of the human mind. Believe it or not, the five senses are actually among the most limiting. They aid in survival, but not true sight. Not in true understanding.
And that is where we all fall short.edit on 12-7-2012 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)
The soul is the body. The mind is the body.
What on earth makes you think the physical realm is the only one? If that is your belief, then I understand your confusion. However, there are metaphysical realms where sensation is also possible...but it is not experienced with the physical flesh. It is experienced with the mind.
Then explain to me why one does not disappear when one dies. Explain to me how the body can be broken and the mind remains intact.
The mind doesn't remain in tact. Once the support functions of the body stop, everything begins to die.
Once death is achieved, decomposition comes next. The bodily energies go where ever the body is at final rest.
The soul is not housed in the body. The soul is the body. The mind is the body. The consciousness is the body. These words are used to describe the same thing, and neither of them can logically exist outside the context of the body. If you were a soul without a body, somehow alive despite the lack of organs and skin, you wouldn't be able to navigate beyond a darkened abyss of nothing.
This is why many are shocked to know that they are still alive, after the body has died.
Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by TheSubversiveOne
The mind doesn't remain in tact. Once the support functions of the body stop, everything begins to die.
Really? Do you know the Australian who could be the poster child for "f***ed"? He literally has little tiny flipper arms and little tiny flipper legs/feet. If it has been anyone with less will power, he would be bedridden and probably suicidal for the rest of his natural life.
For such a crippled body, he should be swimming and going to shows and talking to audiences and having such a blast in life. If the body is truly the mind, he should be mentally retarded. I have rarely ever seen such a spirited, intelligent, and vibrant human being. And no, you can't argue that it wouldn't LITERALLY be like that, because there is no other way for the body to be the mind. Either they are synonymous, or they aren't.
Once death is achieved, decomposition comes next. The bodily energies go where ever the body is at final rest.
Have you seen the recent articles regarding the woman who actually rose from the dead IN THE MORGUE? Someone actually borrowed it, inserting it into a thread recounting over 5 different cases, just off hand, of people rising from the dead. Officially declared dead, then coming back to life.
The fact is, no one really knows exactly what the mind is. Are you so intelligent, so educated, that you know for a fact what hundreds of very well-paid doctors and researchers worldwide do not? No one has the mind figured out. It's as much a mystery as God itself.
If you desire more proof, a more eloquently worded argument, then try this article, written by a psychologist:
Mind And Body
edit on 12-7-2012 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by HeFrippedMeOff
My "god" doesn't require praise, just like any other parent. Parents usually prefer to see their kids become grandly successful, because that means they succeeded in raising them right. That your god requires worship and praise, and gets JEALOUS when we seek to match him, is a sad, sad thing...
I firmly believe no omniscient, omnipotent being would want to be worshipped by its creations.
That's called tyranny and an egomaniac.
I will never worship nor respect such a being, regardless of whether it gave me life or not.
A father who does not care for his children is not a father at all.
You call this world taken care of? You call this species well-raised? No. This is pitiful. I know men who are not immortal, men who can only lift 150 pounds, men who are average in stature and whose blood runs red and fast when they are cut. These are mortal, weak, sinful men...and they are better fathers than your god. And your god wants my veneration, my worship? Never.
That is where I stand on the matter. I do not mean to offend, I merely wish to show you what your god is compared to the men of this earth...the men he has abandoned to the cruelties of fate and other men.
And if your book were not telling you to worship that god on pain of eternal damnation, I think you would feel the same way I do.
If your god does exist, if he does rule this world...on the day I stand face to face with him, it will not be him rejecting me. It will be me denying him.
And if you have nothing more to say, that is where I will leave it. And note: I spoke of your god. I said nothing of the living, loving essence - the CONSCIOUSNESS - that I believe in.
openly blaspheming the existence of the "I Am" who you quoted.
I currently sit somewhere in America. I am subject to the 1st amendment, which says I can blaspheme all I want. It's called "freedom of speech", and "freedom of religion". I am not stopping you from worship, I am simply questioning your deity. I do not mean to offend, I am being honest.
Brother, I'm sorry that you are unable to give thanks.
Praise and thanks are only an appropriate product of being a creation who loves and is loved. Doesn't sound like you believe true love exists?
My Father rescued me from fear of death and from your perverse sense of authority.
You must be talking about your god who doesn't care about worship or his children to teach them to be like him.
I'm sad you feel that way but you aren't talking about Jesus or my Father.
I shall not be moved.
I accepted Christ publicly when I was 11. I've been looking for him since I was 7.
Brother, don't judge yourself so. Even unto the very last day grace is offered and even past then I will hope for you. Only ask and you'll be forgiven.
Well I explained how My Father, I Am that I Am, is much more than just consciousness. So maybe next time don't project your god's flaws onto my Father's Word.
blaspheming the name of God is wrong because God says so, not because it was legislated by men.
I hope you have a wonderful and uplifting day to brother; one where our Father reveals himself to you heart.
Your precious science says so. Logic says so. Reason says so. Own up to the reality of Jesus and the faith of the martyrs already.
Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by troubleshooter
As a very wise man said, when someone asked if they had a soul: "If you didn't have a soul, why would you worry about it?"
To which we could add the words of James in the New Testament, "As a man thinketh, so he is." God is indeed thought.
Originally posted by troubleshooter
If there was no Ravenous Bugbladder Beast of Traal, why would you worry about it?
Besides the 'soul' is from the Greek psuche from which we get Psychology...
...which consists of the study of consciousness, thoughts, emotions, behaviour.
I don't worry about 'soul' or 'body' because I have one of each of those...
...it is 'spirit' that should be our main concern...
...because most people confuse 'spirit' with 'soul' (like you did)...
...most people therefore don't even know they have one...
...and if they did know they had one wouldn't know what it's for anyway.