What Will Shortly Take Place

Originally posted by GBP/JPY
reply to post by SubAce

 

hey, nice thread, man.....about death in your post up there two spaces or so....do you think it's possible we all awake from sleeping....and then get a chance for hell?......the believers will not really be judged , and when "all knees will bow" could that act allow all to be saved from hell?....I've been working on that a while.....

Greetings GBP/JPY.

Firstly the Bible teaches that all mankind when they die go to the common grave, or Hades, also translated hell. Hell is not a literal place, rather it is the condition of being dead. It is not a place of fiery torment. You are correct in stating that man is as if asleep in hell, because they don't exist, and can't think or feel or anything else, just like when you are in a deep sleep.

You need not question me on what I personally think about hell or what will happen to those in it. For Revelation itself tells us:


(Revelation 20:13) . . .And the sea gave up those dead in it, and death and Ha′des gave up those dead in them, and they were judged individually according to their deeds.


During the thousand year reign Jesus Christ will empty Hades (also translated hell) and bring all those sleeping in it back to life. Then, after the thousand years, and all those resting in sleep right now in death have been taught the truth and allowed to go through the final test hell itself is thrown into the lake of fire:


(Revelation 20:14) . . .And death and Ha′des were hurled into the lake of fire. This means the second death, the lake of fire.

Now how can death and hell be thrown into the lake of fire, if it were a literal place. The scripture itself tells us that the "lake of fire" is symbolic of the second death. The first death there is a resurrection from, the second death is final, eternal destruction. Those who go to the second death will be dead forever without a chance of living again.

So in what since is death and hell thrown into the lake of fire? In that death will be done away with:


(1 Corinthians 15:26) . . .As the last enemy, death is to be brought to nothing.

At that time no one alive will ever have to die again, for death will be no more, it will have been done away with in the symbolic "lake of fire" which refers to utter destruction. Jesus will undo death and get rid of it forevermore!

The Bible is flawed in many ways, but relating to this specific topic, your whole idea is wrong for 2 reasons...

One, Satan this and Satan that blahh blahh blahh... Satan (who doesn't exist) is guilty of NOTHING, unless you count that nifty little snake in Eden... *Man* is the perpurtrator of EVERYTHING.

Stop blaming some ficticious creation, and accept Men have flaws, and a certain group of those men have took it upon them selves to rape the Earth and human kind.

Seconding, no prothecy will come true, if you decide to take action to change the course of likely events. That's the beauty of this universe, and maybe the multiverse.. Nothing is set in stone, nothing is decided, and nothing is fate that you can't change.

We are FREE to change direction, and FREE because of that fellow you call Satan (hypothetically).

I don't bash the Bible and believers for the fun of it, but no matter what way I look at standardised religion it is PURELY destructive, and I'm sick of it.

Your belief in the Bible has led you astray from reality, as with many others, here you are preaching about the end times, instead of writing letters of complaint to your government, or writing letters of support to whistleblowers.

Because most you Bible and church folk think a prayer will solves your problems, where us who are *intune* with reality take action. How many actions have been ceased in the stead of prayer? Too many.

I'm also a firm believer in thoughts manifesting them selves into reality, so can you, and others of your sort PLEASE stop thinking the end is nigh and a Bible apocolypse is going to happen. If enough of you think it, it might as well just happen.

So STOP! Take a step back, and swallow the reality of the world we live in. Take responsibilty for your own actions, with out blaming some unseen hand, whether it be God or the Devil

youve taken on quite a task here sub ace, you must be baptized i take it?

it troubles me you did not answer that one mans question about blood transfusions though

Sometimes people assume that Jehovah’s Witnesses refuse all medical treatment or that they simply do not value life. Nothing could be further from the truth. Jehovah’s Witnesses seek the best medical care available to them and their family members. However, they seek nonblood medical management. Why?
Their stand is based on a fundamental law that God gave to mankind. Just after the Flood of Noah’s day, God gave Noah and his family permission to eat the flesh of animals. God imposed this one restriction: They were not to consume blood. (Genesis 9:3, 4) All humans of all races descended from Noah, so this law is binding on all of mankind. It was never rescinded. Over eight centuries later, God reaffirmed that law to the nation of Israel, explaining that blood is sacred, representing the soul, or life itself. (Leviticus 17:14) Over 1,500 years later, the Christian apostles commanded all Christians to “keep abstaining . . . from blood.”—Acts 15:29.
To Jehovah’s Witnesses, it is clearly impossible to abstain from blood while taking it into the body in a transfusion. They therefore insist on alternative treatments. That Scriptural stand often results in an even higher standard of medical care. No doubt that is why many people who are not Jehovah’s Witnesses also request bloodless medical treatment.

Here's a question i pose: how many of you......watch TV?

Why do i ask? Well, simply because besides it's brainwashing efx....i believe television is the medium, the door if you will, to the demonic world; The "spirit" world. Keep in mind, Satan is called the "prince of the power of the air" in Ephesians 2:2. He is called the "ruler of this world" in John 12:31. These titles, and many more attributed to Satan throughout Scripture, signify his capabilities.

The greatest deception, in the history of mankind, was turning Satan into a cartoon character. I say: "Devil"; You think: pitch fork and pointy tail. I say: "Hell"; You think: ______________ I BET YOU.....we both have the same IMAGE of the Devil and Hell. Am i right?

I wonder what people, back in the day, thought of when Jesus mentioned them? What was the image they had?

Originally posted by SpittinTruth
Here's a question i pose: how many of you......watch TV?

Why do i ask? Well, simply because besides it's brainwashing efx....i believe television is the medium, the door if you will, to the demonic world; The "spirit" world. Keep in mind, Satan is called the "prince of the power of the air" in Ephesians 2:2. He is called the "ruler of this world" in John 12:31. These titles, and many more attributed to Satan throughout Scripture, signify his capabilities.

The greatest deception, in the history of mankind, was turning Satan into a cartoon character. I say: "Devil"; You think: pitch fork and pointy tail. I say: "Hell"; You think: ______________ I BET YOU.....we both have the same IMAGE of the Devil and Hell. Am i right?

I wonder what people, back in the day, thought of when Jesus mentioned them? What was the image they had?

It's possible people back then didn't fully understand who Satan the Devil was. He wasn't really fully revealed until Jesus came to earth and revealed his works and explained him in greater detail than was done in the Hebrew Scriptures.

Originally posted by kilodelta
youve taken on quite a task here sub ace, you must be baptized i take it?

it troubles me you did not answer that one mans question about blood transfusions though

Sometimes people assume that Jehovah’s Witnesses refuse all medical treatment or that they simply do not value life. Nothing could be further from the truth. Jehovah’s Witnesses seek the best medical care available to them and their family members. However, they seek nonblood medical management. Why?
Their stand is based on a fundamental law that God gave to mankind. Just after the Flood of Noah’s day, God gave Noah and his family permission to eat the flesh of animals. God imposed this one restriction: They were not to consume blood. (Genesis 9:3, 4) All humans of all races descended from Noah, so this law is binding on all of mankind. It was never rescinded. Over eight centuries later, God reaffirmed that law to the nation of Israel, explaining that blood is sacred, representing the soul, or life itself. (Leviticus 17:14) Over 1,500 years later, the Christian apostles commanded all Christians to “keep abstaining . . . from blood.”—Acts 15:29.
To Jehovah’s Witnesses, it is clearly impossible to abstain from blood while taking it into the body in a transfusion. They therefore insist on alternative treatments. That Scriptural stand often results in an even higher standard of medical care. No doubt that is why many people who are not Jehovah’s Witnesses also request bloodless medical treatment.

You are correct people are quite mistaken. And thank you for taking the time to write this. I've learned that when I post a subject, opposers inevitably try to get the thread off track with their ad homin attacks, so I've learned to ignore them. I've written replies about these questions before and mentioned that. Also I told him if he was serious about an answer to IM me. He didn't, so it really showed where his heart was, he didn't really want an answer or he would have IM'd me and I would have been happy to explain the truth to him about the matter.

reply to post by SubAce

true Christians being delivered up to be persecuted and killed, being objects of hatred by all mankind, false prophets arising, a cooling of the love of people because of an increase of lawlessness, and a special preaching of the good news as a witness in all the earth, then the end comes.

We aren't quite there yet.

How can we trust the bible since Satan is ruler over the earth. So many governments/rulers have "edited" the bible to suit their needs and aid in control of the sheeple. King James is a prime example....and what happened to the book of Enoch?

reply to post by Sinny


You are quite deluded if you think that human governments are going to fix things. Thank you for taking the time to express your feelings on the matter. But really, you are living in fantasy world if you really think that human institutions or governments are going to make things better. Eventually even you will have to see the wise counsel of the Psalmist when he wrote under divine inspiration:


(Psalm 146:3) . . .Do not put YOUR trust in nobles, Nor in the son of earthling man, to whom no salvation belongs.

And the wise prophet Jeremiah:


(Jeremiah 10:23) I well know, O Jehovah, that to earthling man his way does not belong. It does not belong to man who is walking even to direct his step.

Originally posted by The Great Day
How can we trust the bible since Satan is ruler over the earth. So many governments/rulers have "edited" the bible to suit their needs and aid in control of the sheeple. King James is a prime example....and what happened to the book of Enoch?

The Bible has stood the test of time. For example most manuscripts used to translate much of the Hebrew Scriptures, such as Isaiah used to date back to around the 13th Century of our Common Era. But in about the mid half of the 20th century the Dead Sea scrolls were uncovered, with extant scrolls of the Holy Scriptures, one of Isaiah almost completely intact that dated to about the third century B. C. E. that is a thousand years earlier.

Were* there differences that many claim? Many changes and errors? No, while there were a few grammatical and spelling differences the substance was not changed one iota. There were no changes. So we have solid proof that the holy scriptures have been faithfully preserved over thousands of years down to our day.

It may be Satan's world, but he cannot undo God's word. It is a light admist the darkness. And we are the light bearers that shine as illuminators in a bedarkened world:

(Philippians 2:15) . . .that YOU may come to be blameless and innocent, children of God without a blemish in among a crooked and twisted generation, among whom YOU are shining as illuminators in the world.

reply to post by SubAce

(2 Peter 3:5, 6) . . .For, according to their wish, this fact escapes their notice, that there were heavens from of old and an earth standing compactly out of water and in the midst of water by the word of God; 6 and by those [means] the world of that time suffered destruction when it was deluged with water.

The heavens and earth of old, in Noah's days, were destroyed in a deluge. Now how was the heavens destroyed in water?

Yes, you realize that the heavens refer to the governmental authorities, and the earth represent the masses of wicked mankind. You realize that is what this verse is saying, so why do you think the very next verse means anything different? The heavens and earth today are reserved for destruction not by water this time but by fire. That is, the political system of things and the wicked masses of mankind will be destroyed at Armageddon. That the literal earth is not being referred to is quite obvious.

I think we need to go back to Genesis, Chapter 1 to determine what's what:

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.

7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.

9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.

10 And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.

So, no, I have no idea where you consider it obvious that government authority means heaven and earth means wicked mankind.

Originally posted by Deetermined
reply to post by SubAce

 

(2 Peter 3:5, 6) . . .For, according to their wish, this fact escapes their notice, that there were heavens from of old and an earth standing compactly out of water and in the midst of water by the word of God; 6 and by those [means] the world of that time suffered destruction when it was deluged with water.

The heavens and earth of old, in Noah's days, were destroyed in a deluge. Now how was the heavens destroyed in water?

Yes, you realize that the heavens refer to the governmental authorities, and the earth represent the masses of wicked mankind. You realize that is what this verse is saying, so why do you think the very next verse means anything different? The heavens and earth today are reserved for destruction not by water this time but by fire. That is, the political system of things and the wicked masses of mankind will be destroyed at Armageddon. That the literal earth is not being referred to is quite obvious.

I think we need to go back to Genesis, Chapter 1 to determine what's what:

1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.

7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.

9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.

10 And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.

So, no, I have no idea where you consider it obvious that government authority means heaven and earth means wicked mankind.

Actually there was a post that explained this very thing in further detail. Here it is:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Cheers.

How long righteous mankind will live on earth:

(Psalm 37:29) The righteous themselves will possess the earth, And they will reside forever upon it.


Also what the Bible really teaches about how long the literal earth will survive:

New International Version (©1984)
He set the earth on its foundations; it can never be moved.
New Living Translation (©2007)
You placed the world on its foundation so it would never be moved.

English Standard Version (©2001)
He set the earth on its foundations, so that it should never be moved.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
He established the earth upon its foundations, So that it will not totter forever and ever.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed for ever.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English (©2010)
He has prepared Earth upon its foundations that it will not move for an eternity of eternities.

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
You set the earth on its foundations so that it can never be shaken.

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed forever.

American King James Version
Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed for ever.

American Standard Version
Who laid the foundations of the earth, That it should not be moved for ever.

Douay-Rheims Bible
Who hast founded the earth upon its own bases: it shall not be moved for ever and ever.

Darby Bible Translation
He laid the earth upon its foundations: it shall not be removed for ever.

English Revised Version
Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be moved for ever.

Webster's Bible Translation
Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed for ever.

World English Bible
He laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be moved forever.

Young's Literal Translation
He hath founded earth on its bases, It is not moved to the age and for ever.


Scripture referring to the repatriation of the Jews back to Jerusalem from their bondage to Babylon (symbolic fulfillment of a new heavens and earth):

If this helps, I dug up these versions at bible.cc real quick (Isaiah 65:17):

New International Version (©1984)
"Behold, I will create new heavens and a new earth. The former things will not be remembered, nor will they come to mind.
New Living Translation (©2007)
"Look! I am creating new heavens and a new earth, and no one will even think about the old ones anymore.

English Standard Version (©2001)
“For behold, I create new heavens and a new earth, and the former things shall not be remembered or come into mind.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
"For behold, I create new heavens and a new earth; And the former things will not be remembered or come to mind.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
I will create a new heaven and a new earth. Past things will not be remembered. They will not come to mind.

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

American King James Version
For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

American Standard Version
For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth; and the former things shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

Douay-Rheims Bible
For behold I create new heavens, and a new earth: and the former things shall not be in remembrance, and they shell not come upon the heart.

Darby Bible Translation
For behold, I create new heavens and a new earth; and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

English Revised Version
For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former things shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

Webster's Bible Translation
For behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

World English Bible
"For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth; and the former things shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.

Young's Literal Translation
For, lo, I am creating new heavens, and a new earth, And the former things are not remembered, Nor do they ascend on the heart.

reply to post by SubAce


The Gov won't change of its own free will. Granted.

But I'm deluded for thinking we the people can't make change? You know as well as I do, change isa comeing, for better or worse, but the majority will die trying... Think last year OWS was popular? Watch it grow..and grow..and grow, as more people wake up, and more people realise their victimisation (if that's a word lol)..

Let's agree to disagree, but I think your mind set, is the mind set that got us in this predicament to start with.

this whole thing is production which outlines a 'heliofant' Eschatology

which combines a bunch of mysticism both christian, hindu, sufi into a blender with new-age

you might think that Islam is getting shortchanged...but your wrong

One has to wrap their mind around the video symbolism
you will be able then to see that the bin Laden image (with noted a CIA badge) is absent the explaination for the white symbols in his beard

you will also note the 'troops' behind bin Laden are really missiles/rockets... which incidently are not under the control of the 'Puppet Master' seen earlier with the marrionette strings held by hands dripping in blood and 'wedded' to gold/money/power/influence


you will note that the Islamic bin Laden & followers are actually led by the cestial sign of a red crescent moon/eclipse...not the PTB, puppet masters


the 'mystical Christ consciousness' is a man made amalgamation of several religious teachings, so this personage is not a world 'savior' but One who will lead the masses/multitudes to the era of the New Sun
a Sun that destroys much of the physical Earth biosphere and thence its' long history of religious indoctrination

the portrayed 'Christ Consciousness' figure with a distorted and unsymetrical heart chakra is more akin to an Anti-Christ rather than a millennnial King...and i go further to say this character that rides the river-of-death is none other than Abraxas... the ruler of both good-evil or the concept we see as duality in nature & the spirit realms...Abraxas the master of both God & Satan

Heli0fant is deceiving the viewer in plain sight ... or walking the dog as we seen in the very first scene beyond the door being opened into a gulag/internment camp created for the goats


have a nice day thinking the vid is about a spiritual ascension of the masses led by Christ/christ consciousness in every-man

reply to post by kudegras


Former JW here.

Happy to have moved on 25 years ago. Free thought is a wonderfull thing.

John 10:34 Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I said, you are gods’?

we have more control over our destiny than you know. Which Jesus himself tried to tell us. people like you wishing this destruction will bring it on, because i believe we have the power to create our own reality, and i think Jesus often tried to tell us this.

John 14:12 I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.

It's also to be noted that when Jesus prophecied about death and destruction most agree he was predicting the fall of Jerusalem, which indeed did happen. stop wishing for the worst.

People like Paul were full of opinions. his books were probably included because they fit in better with the empire's agenda for making chirstianity their religion. i stress he had a LOT of opinions.

Originally posted by Sinny
reply to post by SubAce

 

The Gov won't change of its own free will. Granted.

But I'm deluded for thinking we the people can't make change? You know as well as I do, change isa comeing, for better or worse, but the majority will die trying... Think last year OWS was popular? Watch it grow..and grow..and grow, as more people wake up, and more people realise their victimisation (if that's a word lol)..

Let's agree to disagree, but I think your mind set, is the mind set that got us in this predicament to start with.

agreed.

When will people stop taking The Bible literally?

It's a collection of moral myths and fairy tales, that's all.

reply to post by SubAce

Actually there was a post that explained this very thing in further detail. Here it is:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Cheers.

Actually, this post did absolutely NOTHING to explain how the term "heaven" represents government authority and the term "earth" represents wicked men.

Do you care to show the exact scripture that states this?

And then break it down and explain how you see it that way.

reply to post by SubAce


Do you care to explain what "I create new heavens and a new earth" means to you?

Based on your previous definition, this would mean that God will create new governmental authorities and new wicked men.