Is Lucifer our Friend?

Originally posted by Deetermined

Originally posted by Oannes
Lucifer does translate as Lux :light, and Ferre: to carry. The bringer of Light. Lets also keep in mind that Lucifer (En.ki) told the truth in the Garden of Eden. Yahweh (En.lil) was the liar.

Lucifer lost his title of being the bringer of light when he was kicked out of heaven.

Yes, he did lie, because Adam and Eve did indeed die a human death. He was never talking about a spiritual death.

See my lost above. He never was the "bringer" of light. He was the "bearer" of light, or the reflection of the true light, the light of the world. Lucifer is a terrible Latin rendering of the Hebrew to Greek of "Heylel" which means crescent moon. The moon bears the light of the sun, or reflects it to the world.

reply to post by Deetermined


Lucifer lost his title as bringer of light when he he attempted to become the equal of his creator. And obviously no jealous god (for his name is Jealous) would want anyone being anywhere close to equal to him.

Why do you think we ritually debase ourselves in his eyes every Sunday? He loves sheeple!

*sigh*


*tap tap*

Is this thing on?

reply to post by NOTurTypical

But back it up to verse 1. The context is ALL those who came to the sheep via illegitimate means. Not as in ALL sheppards/teachers before Him. He sent the prophets to the sheep.

I think there might be some confusion.

Yes, John 10:1 states that anyone trying to get to God through anyone but Jesus was a thief and a robber.

In verse 7, Jesus makes it very clear that He is the door.

It is my opinion that verse 8 is stating that anyone else who has proclaimed to be the door or proclaims that anyone other than Jesus is/was the door, would also be a thief and a robber.

John 10:1

10 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.

John 10:7-8

7 Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep.

8 All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


*taps Typical's head*

Is this thing on? Testing, testing...

In all seriousness, we're having a very legitimate discussion. Please don't derail it by suggesting that you're the only one who is right.

reply to post by Deetermined


Let's put a stop to all this "Jesus is the only way" nonsense now.

Jesus's name literally means "God is the way." The Bible states that God is love.

Therefore, when they say Jesus is the way to heaven, they are really saying, "Love is the way to heaven."

People just like a fleshly figurehead to kowtow to. It makes it feel that much more real to them. But in all truth, LOVE IS THE KEY. Get it now?

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by Deetermined

 

Let's put a stop to all this "Jesus is the only way" nonsense now.

Jesus's name literally means "God is the way." The Bible states that God is love.

Therefore, when they say Jesus is the way to heaven, they are really saying, "Love is the way to heaven."

People just like a fleshly figurehead to kowtow to. It makes it feel that much more real to them. But in all truth, LOVE IS THE KEY. Get it now?

I thought it meant savior or God saves ... savior... where do you get "God is the way" where did you get this from anyways...

ah i got trolled

Christ is the doorway based on his teachings which are fairly universal. Jesus taught almost the same lessons as prophets before him. I believe that anything but the "doorway" are teachings that don't tell humanity that the Spirit of God is within

From what I know, it was near the beginning of perfect creation from which Lucifer simply disagreed with the way things were carried out. He disagreed with the selfless unconditional nature of God and wanted independence and felt the universe selfishly belonged to him and whoever joined his rebellion. He revoked the selfless creative nature of God and believed that individuals should be in complete control over the material universe in a selfish manner. He believed love and goodness are conditional, based on if he feels you deserve it. egotism gets you nowhere.

God and his angels are unselfishly and unconditionally loving. Since they knew he likely wouldn't change his mind they wanted to give lucifer a chance to realize his mistake by letting him be an adversary of the universe to different life forms under various names (think of the "trickster" God)

Lucifer tries to fool individuals into joining his failed rebellion which orientates the individual towards service to self and selfishness which is always self destructive regardless and this is what Lucifer fails to realize in the darkness of his ego on these lower planes.

Can you see how The snake in the garden of Eden was lucifer? He fools you into thinking that liberation, protection, and freedom are his gifts but they always come with a price. Once man learned from the tree of good and evil , so man also learned life and death and now people are stuck reincarnating and forgetting what is really going on. Death was the price they paid for liberation, and so called freedom. trickery at its finest.

this is a cosmic battle that goes beyond Christianity, Judaism and religion. dont believe anything you read that misconstrues lucifer as your helpful adversary or friend of humanity. You think lucifer and higher entities aren't allowed to lie to you or something? or that they aren't more evolved and clever then most human beings?

Lucifer is beyond clever, look all around you at the world. It's true to a certain extent that since the garden of eden that lucifer was allowed to be an adversary to help humanity come back to God, to give him a satisfactory imaginary position of power so that he wouldn't wreck too much havoc.

To this day there are the individuals who are "luciferians" who believe in this, who are part of influencial institutions and organizations in order to continue this adversary - game for humanity. they are part of the modern day rebellion of lucifer and the people of this planet are their victims to trick into embracing their ideologies.

The media is perhaps the most blatant tool to the trained eye , promoting selfish materialism , lustful selfish desire , and overall superficial meaningless garbage. Hollywood has always been the hotbed of satanism (anton lavey), luciferianism and God knows what else. I highly suspect California is going to slip into the ocean for the sake of humanity.

Theres much to be said about this topic, but i'd be here forever. Just remember that the luciferian spirit is trickery at the highest levels and lies. Anything that positively promotes lucifer does not go into detail about the historical influence of lucierian faction in humanity (the 1%) throughout history. If they did, people would demand the blood of the elites.

The power of the individual is within, for it's the living spirit of God which dwells within. That is exactly which the luciferians would want you to deny and to accept the outside power of lucifer instead. That is victory against "God" for lucifer in this rebellion.

Can you see how the luciferians have control over this world, almost all religions and worldly powers give you this false belief that "God" and "power" is outside the individual when they are tricking you into forgetting that the living spirit of God is within. I'll leave it at that for now.

Originally posted by SpearMint
What if everything you just mentioned didn't exist and were merely creations of men?

LOL.

What if we made a "re-boot' of the Bible, and this time Moses is played as a thief?

Sure, there are the Gospels of Judas, and we've got some other texts that show Lucifer in a more "I'm on man's side" kind of light. But in the end, we are debating the fevered imaginations of a group that made it all up.

The only difference between Christianity and the Greek Mythologies or Norse Gods is that they've got the donations and PR today and the other myths lost. You might as well be debating if Loki was actually the good guy.

Sounds like fun -- and least for a Hollywood blockbuster movie.

reply to post by robhines


He's just as much a friend as the Easter Bunny, Santa Clause, Jesus and every other mythological character.

Originally posted by FeatherofMaat
reply to post by robhines

 

He's just as much a friend as the Easter Bunny, Santa Clause, Jesus and every other mythological character.

yeah i remember all the crusades and people dieing in the name of the easter bunny and santa claus.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

*taps Typical's head*

Is this thing on? Testing, testing...

In all seriousness, we're having a very legitimate discussion. Please don't derail it by suggesting that you're the only one who is right.

It's your guy's Hebrew fail not mine.

reply to post by VitriolAndAngst


Yea anything from Judas should be taken as truth................................................................ not

Originally posted by votan

Originally posted by FeatherofMaat
reply to post by robhines

 

He's just as much a friend as the Easter Bunny, Santa Clause, Jesus and every other mythological character.

yeah i remember all the crusades and people dieing in the name of the easter bunny and santa claus.

My son almost got in a fight at school over Smokey the Bear! The stupid guy in the costume was not very good, and one of the other kids said Smokey the Bear isn't real, and my son got mad and said, "Just because that is a stupid guy in a costume does not mean Smokey the Bear isn't real!" They apparently got in a pushing match and had to be separated by the teacher. They're only 5, but apparently religious folks behave similarly sometimes.

Originally posted by P-M-H
reply to post by VitriolAndAngst

 

Yea anything from Judas should be taken as truth................................................................ not

But "Judas" earlier we were talking about Christ's half brother Judas. Jude is the nickname for Judah/Judas.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

*taps Typical's head*

Is this thing on? Testing, testing...

In all seriousness, we're having a very legitimate discussion. Please don't derail it by suggesting that you're the only one who is right.

Evangelical Fundamentals are the quickest to anger and first to deny and assume they are the only ones to have something everybody else SHOULD HAVE.....

Originally posted by rebellender

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

*taps Typical's head*

Is this thing on? Testing, testing...

In all seriousness, we're having a very legitimate discussion. Please don't derail it by suggesting that you're the only one who is right.

Evangelical Fundamentals are the quickest to anger and first to deny and assume they are the only ones to have something everybody else SHOULD HAVE.....

What makes you think I'm angry? And skeptics complain about the mistranslations in the Bible so I'm pointing one out from the 5th century Latin. "Lucifer" is a Latin rendering of his name from Isaiah which in the original text is "Heylel" which means "crescent moon". Moons cannot produce any light whatsoever, they can only reflect light from another source. Heylel also means crescent moon in Arabic, another Semitic language. Lucifer doesn't mean "light bringer" it means " light BEARER". He formerly bore or reflected the Light of the world, or the Sun. Christ is the Morning Star. Moons are not stars.

Believe what you want but "Lucifer" is a horrible translation of "Heylel" from the Hebrew to the Greek to Latin.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Incidentally, Lucifer and Satan have roots in different cultures, and have different meanings. Which means that somewhere along the way, Lucifer was transplanted into Satan's culture, or vice versa. Lucifer and Satan have nothing to do with each other; they were stylized as the same people when Christianity melted down the pagan faiths in order to construct its own as we know it.

reply to post by AfterInfinity

Let's put a stop to all this "Jesus is the only way" nonsense now.

Sorry, I didn't mean to offend you, but if someone wants to point out that Christianity is a copycat pagan religion, I think I should at least be able to counter it in Jesus' defense. And yes, I believe he addressed "all that ever came before" him in the verses I posted.

Hey, if you want to point out that some other deity claimed to be God's only son, was capable of creating the universe and all human life on it, as well as offered up themselves as a sacrifice in order to provide an eternal afterlife for humans, I'm all ears. In fact, if that's the case, I want to be the first one to know about it! Thanks!

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by Deetermined

 

Let's put a stop to all this "Jesus is the only way" nonsense now.

Jesus's name literally means "God is the way." The Bible states that God is love.

Therefore, when they say Jesus is the way to heaven, they are really saying, "Love is the way to heaven."

People just like a fleshly figurehead to kowtow to. It makes it feel that much more real to them. But in all truth, LOVE IS THE KEY. Get it now?

From the standpoint of above. Many have come to worship Jesus, when they should be worshiping Father. Even he spoke on praying and asking of Father.