Gene Kranz's Remarkable Self Incriminating Gaffe, The Storied Ship, " Fraudulent Apollo 13 "

reply to post by nake13

Interesting information there Decisively,however,it still does not (to me anyway) provide the "smoking gun",personally,the one aspect of the 13 mission that I found odd was the lack of television coverage of that particular mission,I can't believe that the public were so "used to moon shots" that 13 was just another routine bore fest!

They did not transmit television signals after the accident to conserve power. If it was "faked," they would have filmed a gripping tale of survival in progressive TV episodes, wouldn't they?

Relax there naked13, so much more to come

reply to post by nake13


You've just seen/read a bit, tip of the spaceberg as I like to say. I'll show you a half dozen videos of Kranz and Lovell yapping this, that, and the other thing. You'll also need to go through the other EECOM tapes. The next EECOM flight officer up was Clint Black who worked the next 8 hours. As time goes on, you'll begin to get a feel for when it was or was not determined that there might have been an "explosion", or that oxygen was actually leaking from a tank.

That is a good exercise to go through. Can you tell naked13 from listening to the EECOM tape and by way of reading the VOICE TRANSCRIPT if it had been determined by the time Leibergot went off duty that there was O2 leaking, or that an O2 tank exploded, or that the LM as a lifeboat was needed ? See if you can figure out when it was that the flight officers became aware of the "explosion" if they ever so became aware during the actual days of the Apollo 13 flight. See if you can determine when the flight officers were able to tell that O2 was leaking, that it was O2 that was venting by way of reading the Voice transcript and listening to Leibergot's EECOM tape.

This is sort of where the money is, for openers anyway. There is a lot to it.

For example , did you know that Edgar Mitchell claimed he was in the MOCR, just like John Young claimed he was in the MOCR, when the tank blew ? Did you know Edgar Mitchell claimed that within MINUTES, he was aware it was a "LM as lifeboat " situation ? Well if you did not, you know now, and I'll present a nice reference from the Stu Roosa Biography, a Mitchell quote to support that, a direct Mitchell quote/claim.

So of course these astronauts were not in the MOCR, it is night time for God's sake, fairly late as a matter of fact, and everything was cruising along hunky dory, AND SY LEIBERGOT HAS THAT NICE PICTURE TO SHOW THE MOCR WAS EMPTY, no one there but them flight officers, NO JONH YOUNG, NO EDGAR MITCHELL.

The most compelling evidence in a way is the scientific evidence as regards aluminum. This, even given Kranz's and Lovell's nutty testimonies as regards all of this.

Consider this, the Cortright Commission claims that in addition to 1.1 pounds of Teflon burning in O2 tank two, and so probably being responsible for the "combustion" that lead to the tank's blowing, an undisclosed amount of aluminum may also have burned as well and so contributed to the energy release that lead to the damage/disaster.

Why don't you start on your own before I get there naked13 ? I am bound to be working on Kranz here for a week or two. Even before I get started on it, posting references, why not look at the Cortright Commission documents yourself, including the scientific appendix on the experiments they purportedly ran in support of their conclusions ? Can you find any experimental support for their claim about aluminum ? What kind it was ? HOW MUCH ALUMINUM BURNED AND WHY THIS MUCH ? WAS IT HOT ENOUGH TO IGNITE ALUMINUM IN THAT TANK ? WHY/HOW DID THEY DRAW SUCH A CONCLUSION.

You will fined the Cortright Report to be a sham, and with it, all of Apollo. By all means , do not take my word for it. check the facts for yourself, independent of my references and my presentation/approach to the problem.

There are several other "anomalies" I can point out, but for now, I think I would like to focus on these, for it represents a great effort, each subject; Kranz's shuck and jive and fake crying, Aaron's poppycock story about diagnosing a non-instrumentation problem from home, Young's claim he was there when the tank blew, Mitchell's claim he was there and knew it was a "LM as lifeboat situation" minutes in, Cortright claims so bogus with respect to the quantity of Teflon burning, the quantity of aluminum alleged/ or not alleged to have burned, and the reason Teflon and aluminum were inculpated given the circumstances.

All bull. Fasten your seat belt, you are in for the ride of your life.

reply to post by decisively

All bull. Fasten your seat belt, you are in for the ride of your life.

I'm pretty sure we've already done all this on another thread. Why can't you keep track of your own posts?

Edit to add: Here you go:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by decisively

posting references, why not look at the Cortright Commission documents yourself, including the scientific appendix on the experiments they purportedly ran in support of their conclusions ? Can you find any experimental support for their claim about aluminum ? What kind it was ? HOW MUCH ALUMINUM BURNED AND WHY THIS MUCH ? WAS IT HOT ENOUGH TO IGNITE ALUMINUM IN THAT TANK ? WHY/HOW DID THEY DRAW SUCH A CONCLUSION.

already been answered by Aloysius the Gaul on the first page

the full commission report is available here

the report does NOT say that 1.1lbs of Teflon burned.

It says that 1.1lbs of Teflon was available as fuel as part of the O2 tank (Table 4.1 Materials Available within Oxygen tank), along with .8 lbs Al, 2.2 lbs stainless steel, and 1.7 lbs inconel alloys.

A detailed list of the makeup of every component inside the tank (motors, fans, sensors) etc is given in Appendix D, pages 49-58.

so the amount of aluminium is given, as is its location. However it was not necessary for it to burn in order to cause the rupture - the amount of teflon there was perfectly adequate to cause that - on page 4.38 it says that this amount of teflon was "more than sufficient" to acount for the recorded temperature and pressure changes, and that the time frame for them (relatively slow increases taking over 1 minute) weer consistent with the burning of teflon.

Appendix F is "Special tests and analysis" and includes analysis of the energy requirements for ignition and combustion of teflon, and a master list of all tests and analysis performed.

Wherever you got the idea that 1.1 lbs of teflon represents some sort of mystery is unknown - but that source is just plain wrong.

i guess you just like ignoring anyone that speaks against you.. nice way of denying ignorance

decisively, I haven't had a chance to listen to the Apollo 13 EECOM tapes yet. It's on my to-do list. Does your team have the current capacity to summarize the Kranz/EECOM narrative in a 3-5 minute youtube video?

In this Hollywood version, do you find any narrative problems?

Click here for more information.

Originally posted by DJW001
reply to post by SayonaraJupiter

 

Does your team have the current capacity to summarize the Kranz/EECOM narrative in a 3-5 minute youtube video?

His team seems to have lost his internet privileges. Finish up your homework so you can come out and play, Teddy!

DJW, you are way off topic. Why don't you show us that you are an experienced contributor to ATS. Please be an example for our newer members and make EVERY POST COUNT.

I'm going to follow my own advice now and post some pics of these Apollo 13 perps, first Gene Kranz.

Gerald Griffen (on the left)

Glynn Lunney.

Finally, Chris Kraft.

reply to post by SayonaraJupiter

I guess I lost something in the translation. What does posting pictures of Apollo 13 astronauts have anything to do with showing them to be fraudulent, or as "perps" as you and decisively have come to call them?

reply to post by SayonaraJupiter

With GENUINE Swimmers Like This, Who Needs The Ridiculous 7th Grade Middle School Pretense Of The American Apollo Astronauts ?

SayonaraJupiter, of course there are major major problems with this silly presentation

Big picture wise, Kranz never said, never commented out loud to his Mission Control Staff, that he doubted "the problem" had an instrumentational basis. Indeed, Flight Director Kranz was alleged to have been dependent on Leibergot and the EECOM support staff to begin the difficult process of making such a determination. That comment of Ed Harris' there at the end of your clip;

"These guys talking about bangs and shimmies up there, doesn't sound like instrumentation to me. "

is of course completely absurd, complete nonsense.

It will be no problem for us to put together a little something on the EECOM tapes. The project is actually sort of in the works already. That said, I believe it makes infinite sense to first provide additional links to the Clint Black tapes that follow the Leibergot reels . I would very much like to simply allow others to listen to EECOMs Leibergot and Black WORK, and in so doing, allow the curious to decide for themselves when a determination was made, if one ever was made, with respect to the timing of O2 leak awareness. What was the chronology of O2 tank leak and O2 tank explosion awareness ? When were these things discovered/recognized/confirmed ?

I am otherwise occupied this week as you'll hear soon enough SayonaraJupiter. Think Omaha, think swimming, and you shall "find me".

plus.google.com...

I am on "assignment" of another sort, a non-Apollonian sort, for this week. Here in Omaha with old friends, and making new ones. Though some may find it surprising, my passion for swimming is not altogether un-Apollo-related, as I shall share with the group here over the next few weeks, perhaps months.

For openers, we have no need for pretend heroes that make up pretend stories about things they did not do. Why ? Well, because when we have Becca Mann swimming "for us", she is marvelous enough, just as she is. She's best, matter-0-fact, just exactly precisely as she is. Becca is marvelous in a way Neil Armstrong could never hope to be.

Truth be told, I am as patriotic as they come.

I live for these days SayonaraJupiter. This is as good as life gets, as good as America gets. I'll be here with pen and camera for a week. Nevertheless, I will do my best over the next several days to provide at least a bit of detail/analysis regarding the Apollo 13 VOICE TRANSCRIPT, and Kranz's book, FAILURE IS NOT AN OPTION. I believe just a smidgeon will go a long way toward helping you sort through some of this Apollo 13 related NASA VOMIT, a favorite subject of mine and my friends as you may have gathered already.

When I get home to S.F. next week, I'll see if I can get the tape thing up for you in a timely fashion.

Best, GO USA !!!!

reply to post by decisively

I am otherwise occupied this week as you'll hear soon enough SayonaraJupiter. Think Omaha, think swimming, and you shall "find me".

plus.google.com...

I am on "assignment" of another sort, a non-Apollonian sort, for this week. Here in Omaha with old friends, and making new ones. Though some may find it surprising, my passion for swimming is not altogether un-Apollo-related, as I shall share with the group here over the next few weeks, perhaps months.

For openers, we have no need for pretend heroes that make up pretend stories about things they did not do. Why ? Well, because when we have Becca Mann swimming "for us", she is marvelous enough, just as she is. She's best, matter-0-fact, just exactly precisely as she is. Becca is marvelous in a way Neil Armstrong could never hope to be.

Do you consider this schoolboy fantasy to be "on topic," Sayonara? Does it make your case seem more credible? Decisively said exactly nothing in his long winded post. He is reveling in his fraudulence.

They heard a bang. Oxygen tank is a good contender for the thing that went bang.

End of story.

Decisively is a tweaker. For sure.

Oh my, Oh my

reply to post by mrwiffler


Your boy Kranz is in big trouble here Mr. Wiffler. This, because he said maybe they should use the LM before anyone even knew there was a problem.

I am off to watch some genuine "heroes". I shall help you see the light tonight upon my return. I would suggest you premedicate yourself, perhaps xanax, a handful. It ain't gonna be easy for a "patriot" like yourself to read.

reply to post by decisively


Um, when something goes bang on yer ship, it's probably a good idea to look for a life boat. Simple as that.

You're just tweaking your little head off. Give it a rest and you might work out what's actually happening.

Originally posted by Gibborium
reply to post by SayonaraJupiter

 

I guess I lost something in the translation. What does posting pictures of Apollo 13 astronauts have anything to do with showing them to be fraudulent, or as "perps" as you and decisively have come to call them?

I didn't post pictures of Apollo 13 astronauts.

I posted pictures of Gene Kranz, Gerald Griffen, Glynn Lunney and Christopher Kraft. I also posted a video clip from the 1995 Hollywood version of fake Apollo history.

C'mon Gibby. I was doing was a favor for decisively by posting pics of the perps in the Apollo 13 drama. The guys on the ground are just as important as the guys in the capsule, aren't they?

Many times these guys at mission control are left out of the Apollo narratives. I'm posting pics for readers of the thread who may not know who these guys are, the roles they played and what they looked like in 1970. I do this for the sake of the New Apollo Narrative and so readers will be familiar with the players. That's all. Really.

reply to post by decisively

...and in so doing, allow the curious to decide for themselves ...

Yes. That is always what we want. For everyone.

Originally posted by DJW001
reply to post by nake13

 

Interesting information there Decisively,however,it still does not (to me anyway) provide the "smoking gun",personally,the one aspect of the 13 mission that I found odd was the lack of television coverage of that particular mission,I can't believe that the public were so "used to moon shots" that 13 was just another routine bore fest!

They did not transmit television signals after the accident to conserve power. If it was "faked," they would have filmed a gripping tale of survival in progressive TV episodes, wouldn't they?

How much power does that TV camera draw? Not much. They had the radios running at the time all you need to do is put your low power tv signal on the private radio loop that was already powered up.