The Reason Some Americans Hate Immigrants...it's not because they are "illegal"

Originally posted by kosmicjack
reply to post by OutKast Searcher

 

Look our minimum wage is due to the hard fought battle of blue-collar workers and the unions that represent them. It should not disappear like a fart in wind (hat-tip Shawshank) because workers from more desperate nations come in and subvert our system of supply and demand.

I have said from my first week on ATS and I say today - the only one who benefits from illegal workers is Corporate America. They work for crap and spend at least some of their paycheck here (usually Wal Mart) before leaving or wiring the money. In the mean time, they drive down wages, suck local state and federal resources, cripple our health and education system and bring in third world diseases and social issues.

It's not fearful, racist or jealous to call bull on that.

edit on 6/18/2012 by kosmicjack because: (no reason given)

Our nation has always been built on immigrants coming here for a better life.

Why should we change that now?

reply to post by stanguilles7


I've answered this over and over...employers who hire "illegals" should be come down on hard. And then we should make it very easy for people to come in legally or with a work permit so employers can legally hire them for at least minimum wage.

I don't support for the current system to continue where "illegals" are taken advantage of for greedy Americans to profit off of...but I refuse to place the blame on people just looking for a better life like people on this forum want to do.

reply to post by jjf3rd77

You're the one that thinks going 1 MPH over the speed limit is a crime. But sure cops do give out tickets for that all the time. For most cops its 5 MPH unless they are really hurting for speeding tickets

Ummm...The law is the law right???

Why should we forgive those evil speeders for breaking the law....they are just like rapist.

It's not a law. It's basic capitalism and Economics.They steal money from America since they are here illegal and most likely under fake IDS then illegally wire that money to their real families than that is called stealing or money laundering take your pick!

Wrong again...there is nothing in "capitalism" or "Economics" that says you must spend all your money in the nation you make the money...you are just making things up now.

It's not "stealing"...it's using your money how ever the hell you want to use your money.

But I guess we should stop those people who are vacationing in other countries and spending our American money there...damn bastards...stealing our money.

Lets put it into real simple terms, which will fly over liberals heads as always.... Employer pays you 10 dollars an hr as a citizen and offers 7 dollars to the illegal alien this is what happens afterwards.... 2 dollars is taken for your income tax, 1 dollar for you property tax/rent, 1 dollar for car insurance, 1 dollar for health insurance and lets say 3 or 4 dollars for food and necessities..... So after all that money put into the system you are left with about 2 dollars of that 10......

Now the illegal was paid 3 dollars less than you but are not bound to our system or laws, they don't have income tax, property tax, car insurance or health insurance.... Sure they may have to pay lets say 1 dollar out of that on sales tax and that's all we'll see.......

So in all actuality they are actually making more than the american citizen you are bringing home 2 dollars after paying into the system and they are bringing in 6 even if you are making 3 dollars more..... That is how the system works and why people are getting ticked off...... Oh yeah some of that money out of you check is going to the people making more than you feeding off the system, nevermind that though....

reply to post by MRuss

I see you didn't take my challenge. In fact, you ignored my entire post because just like any good liberal, you can't back up your "theories" with proof.

Sorry...didn't know I had a time limit.


But you can't prove what you are trying to prove...if all Americans were the hardest workers in the world..."illegals" wouldn't have a chance getting a job.

Sorry.

Originally posted by My_Reality
reply to post by OutKast Searcher

 

What a load of nonsense. You must think it is OK that illegals bring down wages and take jobs away from legal citizens. It's not. Another thing, I don't care that they risk their life to get here ILLEGALLY. I don't care about their families. If these illegal immigrants truly cared about their families they would stay with them and try to change the country that they are from. They don't do that. In essence, they are cowards.

You are right. There is a difference between two types of people. One group is legal....the other group is not.

Another thing...what does this have to do with US Political Madness? All I see is a rant targeted towards legal residents that you consider lazy with nothing of substance behind it. The politics of this post is simply mind-blowing!!!

I think it is perfectly fine for "illegals" to look for a better life in the land of opportunity.

I think that if you have a problem with American citiznes paying "illegals" lower wages that you should write your congressman and ask them to pass a law to come down hard on American citizens who exploit "illegals".

And if you don't think the immigration issue is US Political Madness....

Originally posted by Zaphod58
reply to post by groingrinder

 

I always hear about how illegals can't get benefits because they don't have an SS number. I worked with a girl who I found out later was illegal, and she bragged one day that she and her friends could get a new SS number any time they wanted, and if they got caught they'd just get a new one.

The number has to match up to an account that has money paid into it. An empty account cannot be withdrawn from. You cannot get a newly minted SS number and start claims on it.

reply to post by RSF77

From what you've told me before you support your so called "social safety nets" (i.e. free money, remember that stupid little convo we had? no?). Money is usually what people WORK for in capitalism. When you give it to them for nothing, they tend to do nothing.

Now... stay with me here. As a democrat you support this and you have told me so yourself, now you come on here with another post crying about how Americans aren't working, while you support giving them money for NOT WORKING.

Yes...I suppot a social safety net...not a "free ride"...big difference.

reply to post by OutKast Searcher


Thank you so much from the bottom of my heart. Just knowing people like you are out their supporting REAL people who just want a chance at life. Let me tell you a little story about myself and my family, if you care to read. When my father was just 18 he had to drop out of the Universidad de Morelia, in Mexico because my grandfather had contracted lung cancer, to find work to help his parents pay for hospital bills. Unable to make meet ends, my father and his older brother decided to come to America LAND OF THE FREE. Yes, illegally. My father tried 3 times, each time getting apprehended along side my uncle. The last time, the border patrol caught my uncle, but not my father, him only being 19 years old, not knowing the way to Los Angeles from Michoacan, Mexico he decided from memory to try and make it, alone. He got lost for 2 days in the Arizona Desert, until another illegal came across my father and helped him make his way. It took my father 15 years to gain citizenship. My father has NEVER committed ANY crimes beside being illegal, he worked hard in the fields with my mother who is legal. My father has helped a number of homeless Americans because he knows what it feels like to be alone with no money, to have no one help you in your hour of need. When I was 15 he got a very good job working as a City Employee.Years went by, and every year he would take us on a mini vacation to Mexico, thru Arizona to Nogales, while making a pit stop in Arizona, my father was beaten up by 5 white men, the gas station manager, came out with a rifle and shot one who was holding a pistol to my fathers face. Yes, in front of his family, me, my younger sister, my baby brother and my mother, yelling obscenities at us for being mexican. The manager (He was American) shot the man who had the pistol (shot him in the shoulder by the way) and they picked up their friend who was "going to come back and kill us" all got in their pick up truck and left. My father refused medical services and didn't want to include the police since he just wanted to go home to mexico. I do not even know that managers name, but I will never forget his face, or his actions, or the words he said to my father. "We are all alike, we are here to feed our families and be happy, do not let them bring you down, as long as your a hardworking man, you do not commit crimes against our country, you are one of us"

People, you have to open your eyes, Most people do not have YEARS to wait in line to get a green card. My grandfather lived for a few more years (5) because of the money my parents were sending back. My mother never applied for Cash Aid, WIC, or any government agency. Some of us are FORCED TO COME here to help our family. While we have a few bad apples, so do you. We need a better system of having immigrants be legal and not risk them crossing the border illegally, costing our system money and other forms of help we can be using on american people. We come here to be good people and work hard, not to drop our "anchor babies" and leech off your government. It hurts so much that some american's will not give us the time of day because some of us are illegal, we are all drug mules, suck your tax money and so forth. The story I write is true, I made nothing up. I never had fancy cell phones, or any good materialistic objects because I know how hard my parents worked to put food on the table. We are not ALL criminals, we are good people with morals, respect and love for your country.

reply to post by OutKast Searcher


What's the difference?

There is no realistic difference, it's the same thing. You are paying low income people to live so they don't complain, loot, steal and riot for a living. Instead of giving them a job, it's cheaper to find labor in another countries citizens than it is to employ an American (I personally consider that treason). Your "social safety net" is a recipe for disaster.

Meanwhile, the rest of us with some sense are suffering for it. That isn't a functional society and it will come crashing down sooner or later when the goods run out. It's simply human nature to take something for nothing if you can, regardless of the big picture.

It's a social ponzi scheme.

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher
reply to post by kennylee

 

Entering illegally is a misdemeanor as you stated, the first time it is done. If it is repeated, it becomes a felony.

Nope..sorry...just because a blogger says so it doesn't mean it is true.

Penalties can go up for repeat offenses...but it still isn't a "felony".

Here, let me educate you on what a misdemeanor is verses a felony.

Misdemeanors are more serious than infractions, but less serious than felonies. Misdemeanors typically result in a heavier fine than what someone would pay if they committed an infraction; or if sentenced to jail, for a term that is less than a year.

Notice that a misdemeanor is a year or less in jail?? Now for the felony..

Felonies are the most serious types of crimes, and each state has different punishments for these offenses. A standard definition of a felony is any crime punishable by more than one year in prison.

resources.lawinfo.com...
Notice that a felony is a year or more in jail
This source is not a blog, but Im sure you will have some excuse. Now for what 8 U.S.C. § 1325 : US Code - Section 1325: Improper entry by alien says.

3) attempts to enter or obtains entry to the United States by a willfully false or misleading representation or the willful concealment of a material fact, shall, for the first commission of any such offense, be fined under title 18 or imprisoned not more than 6 months, or both, and, for a subsequent commission of any such offense, be fined under title 18, or imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both.

codes.lp.findlaw.com...
Do you see where it says for the first commission of the offense is 6 months? Thats the definition of a misdemeanor. Now notice where it says for subsequent commission of the offense, or in layman terms, If the offense is repeated... Imprisoned for no more than two years, which means that it is a felony.

And these links are good links and nothing you can deny, although with you, I realize even when someone shows you and proves to you that you are wrong, you still think you are right. At least thats what I get from reading every post in this thread.

riggs2099 at 2012-06-18" target='_blank' class='tabOff'/>

This is all I have to say about Americans and the immigrant issue.

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

Your reply is the perfect example of what I'm talking about.

Instead of focusing on the hard working immigrants...you bring up violent criminals and drug runners as if they are the norm.

There are violent criminals and drug dealers in every subgroup of society...but you and others try to associate that with immigrants to paint a negative picture of them...so that when anyone sees or thinks "immigrant"...they think "criminal" or "drug runner".

lol there are a lot of "hardworking" immigrants that moonlight as drug dealers etc. And seeing as they are in the country illegally, the very minute they enter the country they are a criminal lol...good first impression is it not?

The point is for most Hispanics men between 16-30, selling drugs and gang related activity is easily accessible, and most get their start as drug runners for the cartels.

believe it or not I'm part Hispanic with Hispanic relatives... and I probably have a better understanding than you on this matter. and yes I as well as my father are here legally.

I believe all of the United States of America is made from immigrants. The only difference is that we are in the 4th or 5th generation of the children of the first immigrants. So why this hatred? For the immigrants the U.S. is the only place where they can have a better future for their family. Would you liked to be kicked out of a place where it's the only place to have better future for your loved ones? Don't think so. Just make a law that if you make one offense your deported and there should be no problem. They will even fight in any war against those that want the US destroyed, just for their children to have a better future.

Originally posted by marsoto
I believe all of the United States of America is made from immigrants. The only difference is that we are in the 4th or 5th generation of the children of the first immigrants. So why this hatred? For the immigrants the U.S. is the only place where they can have a better future for their family. Would you liked to be kicked out of a place where it's the only place to have better future for your loved ones? Don't think so. Just make a law that if you make one offense your deported and there should be no problem. They will even fight in any war against those that want the US destroyed, just for their children to have a better future.

Well, if they come here legally, work legally, and stop sucking our government dry, then by all means let them come.

Originally posted by kerazeesicko

riggs2099 at 2012-06-18" target='_blank' class='tabOff'/>

This is all I have to say about Americans and the immigrant issue.

edit on 18-6-2012 by kerazeesicko because: (no reason given)

Nice picture but where's the guy standing behind the native american? Oh thats right, they rubbed them out of history so there are no fingers to point......

reply to post by OutKast Searcher


Or maybe it could be that those immigrants come here and undercut our wages, our standard of lving, and our culture. Did you ever think that maybe having a bunch of people willing to work for 1/3 the rate because they're sending all the money they make out of the country anyway to somewhere where it's cheaper to live is a less than zero sum game?

Did you stop to think that maybe some people notice this less than zero sum game and get extraordinarily frustrated? Did you ever stop to think that this less than zero sum game has REAL CONSEQUENCES for peoples lives and livelihoods?

NO YOU DIDN'T

As usual with your posts it's all about blaming the victim.


And for the record I support a sane and balanced LEGAL immigration policy. I also welcome anyone that comes to America looking to become an AMERICAN. What I do not support in any way shape or form is those that come to this country and SPIT ON EVERYTHING WE BELIEVE IN while reaping the benefits of the society they so REVILE.

reply to post by jheated5


Not to mention that the United States of America didn't exist when the first colonies here were established. Not that would really matter for someone who looks at this from a perspective of racism, culturalism, nationalism or whatever you want to call that form of hate.

The people that fled to the US weren't looking for jobs, they were looking for freedom for their very lives. Some of them anyways, I suppose a lot of them were just along for the ride as well for whatever reason.

reply to post by marsoto


None of this is new, Americans have always blamed the immigrants legal or illegal. First the Irish and Chinese now its the Latinos. They stamp their feet and pout about them, but ultimately won't put the feet of those truly responsible aka the employers hiring them responsible. They don't want to admit that the failure of the middle class is their own fault for decades of shopping big box stores, buying American produced foreign cars and prostituting themselves like Chinese labor with free ride "Right to work" laws which is really the right to work for less.

Originally posted by KeliOnyx
reply to post by marsoto

 

but ultimately won't put the feet of those truly responsible aka the employers hiring them responsible.

Its the job of the government to enforce the laws and penalize companys who hire illegals. To bad nothing the government ever does is to benefit its citizens and always has its roots in greed.