Church of England warning on gay marriage

reply to post by boymonkey74


Oh and the message is Love each other....

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

They just want to get married

Well they should have the right to be miserable like the rest of us, I suppose.

reply to post by DBCooper71


Sure they should! And they should also have the right to be as blissful as I am in my marriage (which had nothing to do with a church or clergy of any kind).

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


My husband and I were married by a clerk in the county courthouse.
We did not feel married because a preacher did not marry us in a
church.We had a civil ceremony in march and a wedding in june.I do
hit my hubby up for our anniversaries on both dates.
Getting married in a courthouse is legal in the eyes of the state.Getting
married in a church,in my opinion, is being legal in the eyes of G-d.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


i see your point.

thanks for the clarification.

-subfab

reply to post by mamabeth

Originally posted by mamabeth
Getting married in a courthouse is legal in the eyes of the state.Getting
married in a church,in my opinion, is being legal in the eyes of G-d.

I agree completely! I was married in the woods without clergy and our 20th anniversary is days away! I feel so completely married and joined with my husband. That should be a choice for everyone. There are plenty of churches that will marry gay people, too. So they will be married in the eyes of god, as well.

reply to post by subfab


No problem.

reply to post by boymonkey74


I don't debate or contemplate on whether God is right or wrong, Im a soldier, I shut up and march. If God says homosexual sex is an abomination, okay then it's an abomination. But its also no different than any other sins to me. No different than lying, fornication, stealing whatever, we all are sinners. My problem with it is forcing a religious affiliated Institution to sanction it against their beliefs and practices. Kinda like forcing Muslims to eat pork. If a religion is opposed to something they should have just as much right to live in rejection as the other has to live in support. Call me crazy but I feel one person's rights end where another person's rights begin. And loving someone doesnt mean you agree to anything and everything they do or say. It means to support them, offer them things when they are in need etc. Christ hung out with sinners but He didnt join them in their sins and debaucheries. He simply met them where they were. There are PLENTY of liberal churches out there who accept gays, there is no need to force a church to accept something they feel is wrong and do not want to participate in. It is England afterall, so in the end we can't force our free exercise clause on them, but it would be nice if they enjoyed the same liberty.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Thing is God didn't say it did he...men wrote that book 2000 years ago when men were backward and wanted something to help control the masses.
If Jesus came back now he would rip that book up.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


So where is the liberty for the gay people who believe in Christ? you go on that we in the UK have no liberty by doing this but I think it is the opposite we are trying to give people the freedom to do what they want in their own religion. It's just about equality people want to be treated fairly by church and goverment.
Also I say shame on any Religion who will not accept people for who they are.

I agree with the idea about separating church and state. Legal marriage would be one thing and church marriage would be another.

reply to post by cloudyday


Best post in the thread
Seems to me he suffers from homophobia and just uses Christianity as an excuse.

Heck it says many silly things in the bible (shellfish eating,beating women,working on a sunday and you should be put to death) so tell me Notyour do you just pick and choose which ones to follow or do you follow them all?

reply to post by cloudyday


Darn it you changed your post so I will quote you

Notyour said " don't debate or contemplate on whether God is right or wrong, Im a soldier, I shut up and march. If God says homosexual sex is an abomination, okay then it's an abomination"

I recall people at Nuremberg saying the exact same thing...

Originally posted by boymonkey74
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Thing is God didn't say it did he...men wrote that book 2000 years ago when men were backward and wanted something to help control the masses.
If Jesus came back now he would rip that book up.

Yes, here we go again, the "nuclear option". Yea hath God really said? The condemnation of homosexual sex also appears in Revelation. But who cares? Jesus died for the gay person just as much as he did for the thief. Different sins, but the same Hell. One sin isnt more "bad" than another.

Originally posted by boymonkey74
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

So where is the liberty for the gay people who believe in Christ? you go on that we in the UK have no liberty by doing this but I think it is the opposite we are trying to give people the freedom to do what they want in their own religion. It's just about equality people want to be treated fairly by church and goverment.
Also I say shame on any Religion who will not accept people for who they are.

Same place as for the thief or liar who believes in Christ. They can believe in Christ, but don't expect the church to sanction their lies or stealing. I tend to question the salvation of folks who claim Christ yet their lives dont change whatsoever. I think those folks actually bought fire insurance. And how is it "liberty" to force a church or clergy member to participate in something he is morally opposed to on religious grounds???? That would be the exact OPPOSITE of religious liberty.

Originally posted by boymonkey74
reply to post by cloudyday

 

Best post in the thread

Seems to me he suffers from homophobia and just uses Christianity as an excuse.

Heck it says many silly things in the bible (shellfish eating,beating women,working on a sunday and you should be put to death) so tell me Notyour do you just pick and choose which ones to follow or do you follow them all?

Resorting to personal attacks now? Just because I have a different opinion? How tolerant of you.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


No you choose to believe that passage in the bible and I assume you do not believe that anyone working on a sunday should be killed so I can only assume you pick your beliefs from the bible to suit who you are and anyone who believes that being Gay is an "abomination" because it says so in the bible is just a homophobe.
Or tell me why do you pick one thing out of the bible and believe/agree with it and not another part?

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by DBCooper71

 

Originally posted by DBCooper71
...why would gay people want to get married in church when the church doesn't want them there.

They don't. They just want to get married. By the state. The church thinks they "own" marriage and they don't.

There are churches in England who want to marry gay people - - but it is against the law.

I don't think they are even allowed to have fake weddings - - - Gay Ceremonies.

Originally posted by boymonkey74
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

No you choose to believe that passage in the bible and I assume you do not believe that anyone working on a Sunday should be killed so I can only assume you pick your beliefs from the bible to suit who you are and anyone who believes that being Gay is an "abomination" because it says so in the bible is just a homophobe.
Or tell me why do you pick one thing out of the bible and believe/agree with it and not another part?]

Absolutely! The bible was written by man - - and interpreted by man.

People choose what they want to believe. There are interpretations of the bible by people familiar with the culture at the time that make far more sense - - - then today's hate chosen interpretations.

Here's a nice article I just found (the excerpt I posted is the end of the article):

God May Hate My Underwear, But Does He Hate Me?

Follow one writer’s investigation into whether the Bible says God hates him for being gay.

BY David Stalling - June 12 2012

Since so many people enjoy adding their own twist to the story, here’s mine: I’d like to think that when Paul reached the Pearly Gates, God looked at him and said, “Paul, I appreciate everything you’ve done for me, so please don’t take this the wrong way. But that whole 'Romans 1:24-27' thing; What the hell were you thinking? Did you listen to anything my son said?”

I do like what Paul wrote in Romans 9:20: “But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, ‘Why have you made me like this?’”

I used to hate what the molder molded of me — if there is indeed a molder. But not anymore. Now I prefer to believe what I read in Song of Solomon 8:7: “Many waters cannot quench love, neither can floods drown it.”

 Certainly ignorance and crazy interpretations of a book won’t quench nor drown love, even if that love is the love of a man for a man, or the love of a woman for a woman.
Sorry for all the redundancies in the use of the word love, it’s something I picked up while reading the Bible.
www.advocate.com...

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
I don't debate or contemplate on whether God is right or wrong, Im a soldier, I shut up and march. If God says homosexual sex is an abomination, okay then it's an abomination.
...

Would you agree that God's orders should accord with our own conscience? In other words if God's orders seem wrong, then maybe we ought to look suspiciously at those orders to make sure they came from God? Paul seems to imply that God's laws are written in the hearts of all people, so we shouldn't require a Bible or a Church to know right from wrong. If the Bible and Church disagree with our hearts, then what does that say?

14 (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law. 15 They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.)

Romans 2:14-15 NIV

Originally posted by boymonkey74
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

No you choose to believe that passage in the bible and I assume you do not believe that anyone working on a sunday should be killed so I can only assume you pick your beliefs from the bible to suit who you are and anyone who believes that being Gay is an "abomination" because it says so in the bible is just a homophobe.
Or tell me why do you pick one thing out of the bible and believe/agree with it and not another part?

edit on 12-6-2012 by boymonkey74 because: (no reason given)

Ad hominem/poisoning the well. The moral law never was abandoned or changed. The cereminial law was fulfilled in Christ, but what was forbidden as a perversion in the OT the same is still forbidden. What does Romans say about homosexual sex? It's a demonic spirit, thousands of people have been delivered from it when they reent and ask Christ to cleanse them. Often moving on to happy, healthy marriages.