Church of England warning on gay marriage

www.bbc.co.uk...


The Church of England has warned that proposals to legalise gay marriage could undermine its status.

While the home office have said they will not be forced to conduct gay marriages the church says it may be taken to the EU court and will have to conduct them.

Heck it's 2012 the world has moved on and if the church accepts gay people who want to get married I think there will be less homophobia around which can only be good
So come on CoE be a forerunner in religion and let gay people get married

reply to post by boymonkey74


You know there are less and lesser people getting married these days . you would think the church would be WAY past all this s**t and do whats right...church of england doing the work

reply to post by boymonkey74


That's interesting. They said the same thing here. But no one is forcing churches to marry anyone.

The church has nothing to fear, they're just using that as a reason to keep marriage equality from happening.

To be clear, I don't know about the laws in the UK or the status of the church and separation of church and state in the UK, like we (supposedly) have here... I'll have to do some more reading to see if they actually have a point.

OK, I have read more and it's virtually the same as it is here. It's fear-mongering by the church, in order to scare people into thinking the gays are taking over the church! Silly people... :shk:

This is so silly.
If certain churches don't want to marry gays, then they have the choice not to.
But there are a lot of churches that will, and there are a lot of gays that go to church and are religious.

Religion needs to be separated from politics. Period. There is no place for the former meshed into the latter. A majority should not have the right to choose and decide for a minority.

Ah yes, the Church of England, an organisation established solely to interfere with the 'sanctity of marriage'.

For those unaware, the Church of England was founded because Henry VIII wanted a divorce, which wasn't allowed by the Catholic church. Undeterred, he established a new church, which allows divorce.

So, considering the origin of the C of E, it's a bit rich to be preaching about sanctity of marriage!

They have also said that they will stop conducting marriages on behalf of the state if Gay Marriage is "legalised"

The Government’s plan to introduce same-sex marriage is one of the most serious threats to the Church of England in its 500-year history, senior clergy claim.

www.independent.co.uk...


Civil Partnerships and ceremonies have been cool here for years, this is just the final thing to change.... and it's about time.

For a conservative government to do it is pretty crazy but good on them. (It would be like the Republicans doing it in the US)

reply to post by boymonkey74


people can be married by the state. churches should be limited to cerimonial marriages.

the problem is churches have the same authority as the state when it comes to being legally married. take that away from the churches and the problem is solved.

separate the chruch and state.

-subfab

reply to post by blupblup


So they are trying to blackmail the Government? heck let them try and Iam sure the government would just say 1) fair do's you can not have people wed in your church (bankrupt within a year, 2) Just make them pay tax until they let gay people get married.
I really hope I see the day when every church has been turned into a weatherspoons

reply to post by fiflad


Great info on the CoE! Thanks!

reply to post by blupblup

Originally posted by blupblup
They have also said that they will stop conducting marriages on behalf of the state if Gay Marriage is "legalised"

Let them stop! It won't hurt anyone but themselves and their parishioners.

reply to post by subfab

Originally posted by subfab
the problem is churches have the same authority as the state when it comes to being legally married.

No they don't. At least not here in the states. A minister can perform the ceremony, but the couple still have to obtain a marriage license from the state and have legal witnesses at the ceremony sign the papers. A church wedding always includes the state contract. Marriage is done by the state. The CEREMONY can be done in a church or the woods or the beach, but the marriage is only legal if the state is involved.

It's ok for gay men and women to be priests, they just can't perform gay marriges, niiiiiiiice.

oops! DP

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


then why do they (pastors) say:

by the power vested in my by the state of (name of state) i now pronounce you man and wife.

it's because they are acting as agents for the state in conducting the marriage. they still need the same forms as a justice of the peace. only they do it under the roof of their religion instead of city hall.

-subfab

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
reply to post by fiflad

 

Originally posted by blupblup
They have also said that they will stop conducting marriages on behalf of the state if Gay Marriage is "legalised"

Let them stop! It won't hurt anyone but themselves and their parishioners.

Well that's the last they need.... numbers have been declining the last few years, rapidly.

So yeah.... let 'em

I'm not religious, so I dont care that much about this subject, but one thing that puzzles me is that why would gay people want to get married in church when the church doesn't want them there. Surely they would want to be married by people who welcome and accept them, and not because they're forced to by law.

Originally posted by boymonkey74
www.bbc.co.uk...


The Church of England has warned that proposals to legalise gay marriage could undermine its status.

While the home office have said they will not be forced to conduct gay marriages the church says it may be taken to the EU court and will have to conduct them.

Heck it's 2012 the world has moved on and if the church accepts gay people who want to get married I think there will be less homophobia around which can only be good

So come on CoE be a forerunner in religion and let gay people get married

Hey since it's 2012 can we also force the Muslims to eat pork? I mean fair is fair in the "spirit of 2012" and all.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


No just force them to accept gay people just like how so called Christians should be doing...
This isn't a subject of Islam read the title it's to do with the CoE, If the CoE started getting in with the times instead of being behind them maybe they will start to do well and the other backward thinking religions may follow suit.

reply to post by subfab

Originally posted by subfab
then why do they (pastors) say:

by the power vested in my by the state of (name of state) i now pronounce you man and wife.

Because the state has certain people that they allow to perform marriage ceremonies. Pastors are one of them. The court clerk is another. A person has to have permission from the state to perform the ceremony. But the couple has to go to the state and get the marriage license and then take it with them to the church.

Churches do NOT have the same power as the state. A church cannot grant a marriage license.

reply to post by DBCooper71

Originally posted by DBCooper71
...why would gay people want to get married in church when the church doesn't want them there.

They don't. They just want to get married. By the state. The church thinks they "own" marriage and they don't.

Originally posted by boymonkey74
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

No just force them to accept gay people just like how so called Christians should be doing...
This isn't a subject of Islam read the title it's to do with the CoE, If the CoE started getting in with the times instead of being behind them maybe they will start to do well and the other backward thinking religions may follow suit.

"Getting in with the times"? My Bible says God doesnt change. What He found destestable a thousand years ago He finds detestable today. Last time I chacked He was God and we were fallen humanity with a propensity for rebellion and perversion. And I don't care what the thread title says, I'm proposing an "argumentum ad absurdum" based upon a statement you made in the OP. It's 2012 like you say, so do we all get to vote it's high time to force the Muslims to eat pork which is completely against their religion? Tell me? Yes or no?

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Eating pork or not eating pork is up to each individual, I know moderate Muslims who love a bacon butty.
The topic is not about that it is about the word marriage, the CoE are trying to capitalize on it.
What is wrong with two people who happen to be the same sex who are Christians who love each other wanting a church wedding? is that so wrong?
Just because a 2000 year old book written by man (not God) says it is wrong doesn't mean in this day and age it is wrong, It isn't and anyone who follows the Bible by the letter has got the message wrong.
Things change and if the old time Religions don't change with the times they will vanish into the history books just like worshiping the old norse gods has.