Pulling the PTSD card

Originally posted by VerityPhantom
Oh so he's wussing out on his actions now eh? Soldiers are just like police officers "GOTTA PROTECT OUR OWN KIN'" I just love to see the soldiers get special treatment.

If a civilian had committed these awful crimes they would have been burned at the stake.

no this guy wont get special treatment, he will get a fair evaluation, ie every hole looked into given a fair courts martial and after due process he will be gived a very fair hanging barring nothing out of the ordinary is found. He is a soldier and a citizen, He will be given the same due process but he wont grow old on death row.

Obama will have his exit strategy and hopefully combat tours of duty can be limited to 2 tours in 4 years

reply to post by torqpoc


Thanks for posting the link's as i said i have never heard of Bin Laden's denials before today. As for your last paragraph i'm at a loss.

When did ATS become so anti-intellectual?

IMHO, he's obviously not all there. Either he is truely evil or off his rocker. This whole thing was very methodical and cold-blooded. He didn't kill himself so he obviously wants to live. He obviously doesn't like the fact that he could die or at the very least be in jail forever, so he tried to cover it up. Now he comes out with explanations of Terminator 2 teaching him about a kill shot? He's been in for a while and you mean to tell me that during that time the military didn't go over how to aim to kill? Why pull from something as juvenile as a movie? (If anything he sould have built the damn Terminator to do the job).

Also, In the military it is a common practice for higher ups to "frown" upon treatment for any number of issues. Of course, time out of the office is time out of the mission. You're not doing your job if you're not at work, which means someone else has to do it. This can cause issues at the job. Tends to make people want to just press through because they don't want to deal with the crap they will get. It's not right, but I saw it on a daily basis in the military. Even pressed through quite a few times. Just saying, sometimes it's not as easy as it appears.

reply to post by forevertruepatriot


Doesnt mean he can kill innocent people then blame it on PTSD. He murdered people while NOT at war. I know who my true enemy is.

A few clarifications.Alcohol was being sent to troops in Desert Storm by the clever use of Lavoris(Cinammon Schnapps) and a green mint mouth wash that was replaced with Creme De Menthe.We of course kept our heads and didn't get caught....scouts should never ever get caught. And unless he actually thinks troops are given active hallucenogens,I think this "Professional" person(who diligently fails to discuss his bone fides) is referring to Meddac's use of SSRI inhibitors (Usually used as treatment usually for depression,that can cause preacher's wives to shotgun their husbands for no reason) because that is a cash cow for big Pharma.
And if anyone thinks Ft. leavenworth is special treatment you very conveniently forget.The military have NO constitutional rights.UCMJ replaces that and they will do what they want to this soldier.Imagine living your life in basic training and you get the idea.

Originally posted by forevertruepatriot
Although i dont condone what this soldier did, and i dont feel he should be let off without being justly punished for his actions. I do want to express something to you. Are you a soldier? Have you served in combat? Have you ever been shot at? do you know what its like to go to bed knowing there are people hunting you, planning your death at every possible minute? have you ever witnessed a person that is as close to you as humanly possible get shot and bleed out begging for help? I doubt you can answer yes to ANY of these questions. I, on the other hand can. PTSD, while not an excuse for EVERYTHING is a real disorder that results from the above listed situations. I have known too many friends that have returned from down range that have PTSD and its not pretty. Most have not done anything like this Sgt. Did, but i know several who have enacted violence on themselves or have come close to enacting violence on other people. It screws with your mind and makes the line of whats right and wrong VERY hard to differentiate.

Oh shut up. Every soldier in the military right now knew about PTSD before they joined, and their actions as a result of PTSD are nobodies fault but their own. Just like a smoker getting cancer is their own fault.

I'm getting sick of seeing soldiers kill innocent people in Afghanistan and even on U.S. soil and blaming it on their traumatic experiences. Tired of cops beating the everloving piss out of innocent people because they had a PTSD induced red out. If you didn't want PTSD, don't join the #ing military...

PTSD is 100% the fault of the soldiers, nobody else. The company commander didn't force you to join the military... you signed that paper knowing full well you could die or be completely #ed in the head for the rest of your life.

reply to post by Adyta


AND I QUOTE "PTSD is 100% the fault of the soldiers, nobody else." Are you serious? I guess by that logic the rape victim that gets PTSD its their fault as well. You sir should put that crack pipe down and read a book on PTSD. I hope God has mercy on your soul, that is if you even have one. A wise man once said " It is better to confess ignorance than provide it." I suggest you start confessing ASAP. Ponder over that.

Soldiers are trained to kill.
There are explicit exercizes that desensitise them.
So killing is what they do. That's what wars are all about.
How do you know who will be shooting at you next?

Does it matter whether you go door to door or drop bombs on them.
How many women and children have been killed by bombs that the US or NATO dropped in the many countries they invaded?

reply to post by lokdog


Dear Lokdog,
You're welcome, and the last paragraph was in response to some other post FF made, don't worry wasn't directed at you.

T

Originally posted by ILikeStars


That picture was taken in the courtyard at the fire station on the West side of the airfields. Across the street by the PX/BX and food courts, next to the church.

We may have been there at the same time, you and I. I was there from February to July I think.

I think we missed each other I was there Aug to Dec. I know where you are talking about. I lived in the last row to the left where they were starting to build more stuff in the open space out farther.

reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL


I'm curious. How many years have you served in the military?
An answer is not required. I wouldn't believe it unless you stated,"None."

Wishing death upon someone? This kind of thread is allowed? I'm shocked and appalled. That killer is obviously messed up in the head. He couldn't have been out to just have some fun. Something snapped, crackled, popped in his noggin.

Instead of wishing him death, I wish all of those troops a speedy departure home.

Pity the dead, pity the killer, wish death upon none.

Let me answer a few things...

I expected liberalconservatism bashing but not human stupidity... it seems infectious...

Here let me remove your liberalconservatiism glasses (it is one word)


@ if this was a civilian...

it does not apply.... but lets play your game...

a civilian would have several issues to answer....

Then the lines of responsibilities would change....
how did he get the guns?... why were these people targeted....?

In the end if was a civilian, I would say ten years into a psych ward with a court review release... I doubt however he would be released for fifteen

the key word would be treatment based...

what Part of mental disease was not understood..


@if he was muslim?

What does religion have to do with it... are you a bigot?

Mental illness is my point here.... his religion would have nothing to do with it...

If he was my major concern would be having to increase the gaurds... american military Muslim killing muslim...

no offense it would also make the placement in psych ward easier not harder..... due to service record....


@his command is not responsible...

Wrong... they are 100% responsible... they ignore the spirit of the anti-PTSD rule implemented by the army...

You are completely responsible for the behavior of those under you ....

It cost me a lot of the time refusing to accept substandard... in people and equipment... I never went to the brig but my career was ruined because I do not play well with the club crowd... the officers and senior enlisted accepted things and well now there are dead children...

they simply did not do there jobs and are like rats trying to cya... I am not suggesting a witchhunt, idiots did not do there jobs... Roll there heads for the whole fleet to see....

You would be surprised how quickly the whole fleet (ground sea space and air) will mysteriously understand how things work now... thats this rule is like being in the proper uniform...

These incidents will go down to nothing... it works that way....

btw way have you served?


@9/11 comments

I said prove it, otherwise an act of war is an act of war
I know this is part of the conversation because you do have to look at the conditions that lead to the PTSD

They allowed the Taliban to attack us...

now they aide the Taliban/Al Queda
You shot at me expect me to shoot back...

Asymmetric warfare

The term is frequently used to describe what is also called "guerrilla warfare", "insurgency", "terrorism", "counterinsurgency", and "counterterrorism", essentially violent conflict between a formal military and an informal, poorly-equipped, but elusive opponent.

When one of the insurgent "snaps" and massacres civilians, we demand blood. Yet, when one of our soldiers "snaps" and massacres civilians, we make excuses. It's shameful. It would seem the average person's moral sensibility is predicated not upon higher, universal principles, but upon uniforms and flags.

EDIT: Having said that, I don't believe we should call for executions before the accused has stood trial. That's just twisted.

Click here for more information.

Originally posted by EktoPlazm
When one of the insurgent "snaps" and massacres civilians, we demand blood. Yet, when one of our soldiers "snaps" and massacres civilians, we make excuses. It's shameful. It would seem the average person's moral sensibility is predicated not upon higher, universal principles, but upon uniforms and flags.

EDIT: Having said that, I don't believe we should call for executions before the accused has stood trial. That's just twisted.

edit on 17-3-2012 by EktoPlazm because: Additional Thought

Bite your tongue, blasphemer! Insurgents do NOT "snap"! Allah guides and leads them - Allah is infallible, and makes no mistakes. The only logical conclusion is that Allah hates civilians, women, and children.

Any other conclusion is illogical, and obvious blasphemy against Allah. You have failed Insurgency 101, and must undergo remedial training before you will be allowed to blow any women and children up. Be quick about it - Allah is running out of virgins to give the incoming Shahids.

Originally posted by ripcontrol
@9/11 comments

I said prove it, otherwise an act of war is an act of war
I know this is part of the conversation because you do have to look at the conditions that lead to the PTSD

They allowed the Taliban to attack us...

now they aide the Taliban/Al Queda
You shot at me expect me to shoot back...

There's never been a shred of evidence (or even a U.S. Government accusation) to support your claim that the Taliban regime attacked the U.S. on 9/11. If you want your opinions to be taken into serious consideration, you should first educate yourself so that you don't sound like Sarah Palin when discussing historical foreign policy.

reply to post by THE_PROFESSIONAL


Those soldiers just serve their bosses living in Israel.

So , they are the most stupid people who are manipulated and started a war to serve Zionists.

To the people who think we are toys in the hands of politicians :

Oh people , we are not toys.

So , if someone serves and kills for Zionists , at least deserves to be treated the same way he treats the locals.

It is just fair. It is the same message all prophets brought to us . We are all created equally.

Originally posted by nenothtu

Originally posted by EktoPlazm
When one of the insurgent "snaps" and massacres civilians, we demand blood.

Since when?

Most of the center, left and right all would happily live in their delusions that borders and culture are excellent reasons for honouring atrocities on the poor, women and children.

Mind your business and keep walking honey. The volcano likes fresh meat.