Light creates gravity. Here's how.

Originally posted by andersensrm
reply to post by smithjustinb

 

No I don't get what your saying, I don't see how it creates gravity, gravity is only created by mass. Light is affected by gravity though.

While true that gravity is directly related to mass, there is nothing offering proof that mass creates gravity, nor is there any logical explanation of how that would work except to come up with the idea that mass bends spacetime. If that were true, then how come in gravitational lensing the light curves outwards and not inwards to the most "expanded area of spacetime"? i.e. towards the gravitational strong-point.

There are two forces we have to admit we don't understand according to the current physics model of our universe. Those forces are gravity and magnetism. By finding the relationship between the two, we can come to fully understand them. My theory offers a visual and logical connection of such a relationship.

Gravity is directly related to mass because the more mass you have, the bigger magnet you have. Light accelerating the quantum electrical field causes a change in the magnetic environment which results in a quantum-electrical connection between us and our larger body.

Now we might possibly, for the first time understand the relationship between magnetism and gravity

Originally posted by mbkennel

Originally posted by coyote66
If photons do not have mass, why does light bend when passing near a star? (observed at an eclipse)

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Why is it necessary for photons to have mass in order for their paths to be bent?

Honestly, I'm astonished at the fervent Acceptance of Ignorance on this thread. Does not anybody know any physics at all?

Here's a hint. There was this german guy called Albert. He figured it all out.

In a nutshell:

*) light does not have mass, but it does have momentum and and energy density and hence a pressure
*) this means that light (electromagnetic fields) does indeed work as a source(=cause) of gravitation along with mass. In practical terms, this effect is very small and cannot be measured on Earth, but has some effect on the cosmology of the universe.
*) gravitation affects the geometry of space time which affects all laws of physics and their observations.
*) there is a specific quantitative theory which has been upheld by experiments and observations for almost a century
*) quantum mechanics is not necessary in the above.

See "Einstein-Maxwell equations" here: en.wikipedia.org...
The stress-energy tensor is the thing which "causes" gravity. There is a part for electromagnetic fields which you add to that of matter.

In the following, the tensor is composed exclusively from electric and magnetic fields (no particles), which means that electromagnetic waves (light) contributes.

en.wikipedia.org...

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Thanks for helping me out with this one.

reply to post by GobbledokTChipeater


It's not gravity, but mass acting on space, which bends space, that bent space is what satellites are "stuck" in due to the effects of gravity (i.e. bent space)... gravity is short hand for that effect... but... it's a bit more complex...

This picture will help illustrate what I mean...

Originally posted by xacto

Originally posted by 1ncegreat
I'm sorry but that is flawed thinking that has been disproved by the fact that when its night time you and everything else don't just float up and away.

You think the Sun is the only source of electromagnetic material?

You do know that every electron and proton and neutron emit and absorb photons (light) right? In fact, the exact mechanics are still largely unknown. It could be that photons orbit electrons rather than being "absorbed", and as for the nucleic particles, who knows, maybe photons are constantly absorbed and never emitted from the nucleus? Strong nuclear force needs something strong to power it eh?

Thanks for adding to my visual interpretation of my theory. Light, being lighter and more positively charged than the electron inevitably orbits the electron when it comes into contact with it. This is brilliant.

Originally posted by captainnotsoobvious
reply to post by GobbledokTChipeater

 

It's not gravity, but gravity acting on space, which bends space, that bent space is what satellites are "stuck" in due to the effects of gravity...

This picture will help illustrate what I mean...

Actually this picture doesn't illustrate the supposed gravitational effect on space very well. The representation of space in this picutre only shows what happens to 2d space. The picture would not look the same in 3d space.

reply to post by smithjustinb


It's obviously just an illustration to help people visualise a concept. The first clue shoulda been the floating head and torso of Einstein in the corner.

If you want accurate descriptions, start here:

chongonation.com...

Originally posted by Haxsaw
hmmm, I'm no physicist, and I know others in this thread have borught it up, but if light created gravity then if you isolated a space/room and all that is in it from all light sources for a substantial amount of time, do you think gravity would cease to exist in this space/room(or be less powerful)?

This would be a good experiment. The vacuumed container would have to be huge and completely devoid of all wavelengths of electromagnetic radiation including radio waves. It would have to be tested in space.

Also if light can travel in all directions at the same speed then wouldnt "gravity" cancelling itself out?

No.

More:

NASA Announces Results of Epic Space-Time Experiment

science.nasa.gov...

From that, a very simple explanation:

Time and space, according to Einstein's theories of relativity, are woven together, forming a four-dimensional fabric called "space-time." The mass of Earth dimples this fabric, much like a heavy person sitting in the middle of a trampoline. Gravity, says Einstein, is simply the motion of objects following the curvaceous lines of the dimple.

Originally posted by GobbledokTChipeater
Gravity is directly related to mass/density.

There are 100% working formulas to calculate gravity on different sperical bodies in space, and they use mass and the radius of the body (density, basically) to calculate the gravity. See here.

It doesn't matter. The math could still be right even though it supports a wrong idea. For example, I could say 1+1=2, and say, "Yes we have 2! It must be right." When in actuality, you never had 1 and 1, you really had 4 halves.

Gravity varies with the mass and the size of the body. The light falling on the body has no consequence in the current working equation.

True, but why does mass vary? Is it because spacetime is actually bending, or is it because light causes the particles to accelerate causing a quantum-magnetic/gravitational effect. If spacetime was really bending, then why wouldn't you experience time differently in space than you do on Earth?

Originally posted by Swing80s
This is really uncanny as I I thought the same thing the other day. If you think about it we all have equations for gravity but nobody can explain how it works. If something with a high gravity can bend light, doesn't that mean that light is inolved somehow?

What's more is we already define light as electromagnetic energy. So why wouldn't the positive charge of light have an effect on the negative charge of a proton?

I don't believe the ones who doubt me can accurately explain how light can reflect without slowing down. Unless they tell me that electrons carry light so that it can maintain its speed.

reply to post by smithjustinb


your idea about light reflection is an interesting one. are you basically saying that photons are "slingshot" around nuclei by "attaching" to orbiting electrons?

is the mechanism of "attachment" magnetism?

also: how exactly does a "toward earth" travelling photon create gravity? i might have some interesting ideas for you..when it comes to this.

please keep in the back of your mind that ALL particles are different expressions of photons, i.e. the paper i linked earlier.

Originally posted by metalshredmetal
reply to post by smithjustinb

 

your idea about light reflection is an interesting one. are you basically saying that photons are "slingshot" around nuclei by "attaching" to orbiting electrons?

is the mechanism of "attachment" magnetism?

More than likely.

also: how exactly does a "toward earth" travelling photon create gravity? i might have some interesting ideas for you..when it comes to this.

Hypothetically speaking, the photon attaches to the electron via magnetism which causes the electron to accelerate on its downward trajectory. This is the essence of the pull of gravity. When the electron (in orbit around the proton and neutron) begins its upward trajectory, the light breaks free from its hold on the electron (or the electrons hold on the photon). At that point, there is no cumulative energy relationship between the proton and the atom and thus there is no upward push, only a downward pull.

Many people are quick to chastise the OP for his idea, but I definitely support such thinking outside of the lines. While the logic had holes, it was a pretty neat idea. Keep it up

Originally posted by Matteroni
Many people are quick to chastise the OP for his idea, but I definitely support such thinking outside of the lines. While the logic had holes, it was a pretty neat idea. Keep it up

Thank you for that, but there are no logic holes. There were some who presented a supposed logical hole, but I was able to logically explain in the replies that followed how their hole was not a hole at all.

dude!!

what else

Originally posted by ReptilianPoker
what else

What is consciousness?

Can this knowledge be used to influence your gravitational field with your mind and levitate or travel interstellar distances?

Have you ever felt what some people describe as "The holy spirit"? I have, and whether or not it is truly "holy" is irrelevant to the feeling I felt in the context of this discussion. Anyway, if you have not felt it, it feels like your whole body becomes charged with a very pleasurable feeling. The feeling is accompanied by a certain sense of weightlessness. So perhaps the feeling you are feeling is actually the harmonious resonance between the electrons in your body and electrons surrounding your body so that your body becomes free of gravity's hold on you.

reply to post by smithjustinb


Light does create gravity. mass is energy, and compress it enough and it will bend space time.

However, gravity as a reaction is not caused by light.


But realize, that because light can be used to create the force of gravity, it is the easiest way to create a warp drive. lol.

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by smithjustinb

 

Light does create gravity. mass is energy, and compress it enough and it will bend space time.

However, gravity as a reaction is not caused by light.


But realize, that because light can be used to create the force of gravity, it is the easiest way to create a warp drive. lol.

So in other words, light is proven to create gravity, but misinterpreted as to what extent it does.

reply to post by smithjustinb


yes.

If you made a crosshair of lasers powerful enough, the intersection point would have a gravitational pull.