The Driver vs. Bicyclist Fight is Way More Violent in England

reply to post by ANOK


I'm for equal rights, nobody should have more rights.

reply to post by andersensrm


I think sometimes the party that is more likely to get hurt needs more rights to stay safe.

Originally posted by andersensrm
reply to post by ANOK

 

I want to see all the evidence that biking on the sidewalk is so dangerous. I'd argue that it isn't. I've done it many a times, and no one ever got even close to being hurt. Its absolutely ridiculous. You have every right to get on your bike and ride on the road, but if there is a shoulder thats where you should be, you shouldn't be in the middle of the lane, blocking drivers because you want to show how you have rights on the road as well.

Come live where I do.

You have obvioulsy never rode a bike much in the city. Riding in the gutter is ridiculous. The law allows full use of the lane for a reason.

Again the problem is you, and your impatience and sense of superiority. Why should a cyclist ride in the gutter because you want to go by, who are you? You think your car makes you more important? It's not like you didn't understand when you decided to purchase and use a car, that there would be other road user, like cyclists, also. Cyclists have been using the roads for years, long before you decided to put your ass on a car seat and start demanding other road user get out of your way. "Hey Lance, andersensrm just got a car, we gotta ride on the sidewalk now."

Like I said, it's all about the attitude of the operator of motorized vehicles, and the false sense of superiority it gives them. Give people a break, you'll get there. Cyclists are not purposely getting in your way in an attempt to take your freedom away. Give people a crappy attitude, and you'll get that in return.

Originally posted by andersensrm
reply to post by ANOK

 

I'm for equal rights, nobody should have more rights.

But you just told us all how you think you should have more rights because you drive a car.

Hilarious.

Our rights will never be equal while you're in a vehicle, and I'm on my feet. I have a right to be protected from your privilege of driving a motorized vehicle. I am the one who is going to be injured, and in pain, long after your insurance has paid for the immediate hospital bills, which BTW your taxes have been paying for the last 4 years and will continue to for the rest of my life, and you have forgotten about the whole thing (and probably laugh about it with 'friends').

reply to post by PhoenixOD


I could be wrong but i dont see an intersection or traffic lights where the bus is stopped..

This leads me to believe that the cyclists has stopped in the middle of the lane, which appears to be only a single at that point, and he has done it on purpose. Seems to be more to this than the cyclists riding in the middle of the lane.

Looks to me the cyclists may have been annoyed at the bus maybe for nearly hitting him early so he decides to stop traffic and than this happens. Pity bus driver took it a step too far.

reply to post by ANOK


I've ridden a bike in S.F. on the sidewalk no problems. There was plenty of room on the shoulder of the road, that I didn't have to block anyone. When there are trails available I use them. You say I have the superiority, when you have the same thing. You want cars to stop for you, so you never have to stop and look where your going. I ride my bike to work once a week, I don't need to be in the road. I ride the trail a lot, and it is the same width as a sidewalk, and I ride past about 75-100 people with no problems. And people on bikes, do like to slow me down, just because Im in a car. There is clearly a shoulder, and they refuse to move over to it, first hand experience here. Its not like the shoulder was covered in gravel or anything, it was just as clear as the road itself. There are plenty of places you can move to, where people don't drive cars, if there that big of a problem you could always move

Originally posted by andersensrm
reply to post by ANOK

 

I've ridden a bike in S.F. on the sidewalk no problems.

Bro I was a bike messenger in San Francisco, eight to ten hours a day 5 days a week. You can't tell me you can ride a bike on the sidewalk safely in the city.

I've been a pedestrian here for 14 years, so you can't tell me bikes are safe on side walks. It is seriously frowned upon, you just don't notice the dirty looks as you fly by. It might seem fine to you on the bike, but it's not safe for pedestrians. We have enough to deal with.

www.sfbike.org...

Sidewalks Are For Walking, San Francisco Bicycle Coalition



(haha I've know the guy in the leather jacket for years, I think he was born a bike messenger)

I guess you didn't get one of the flyers?

It goes back to it being the drivers of motorized vehicles that are the root of the problem. That and the way cities infrastructures are designed around motorized vehicles and anyone else an afterthought. It's just another negative effect of a profit driven economy.

Originally posted by andersensrm
reply to post by ANOK

 

I want to see all the evidence that biking on the sidewalk is so dangerous. I'd argue that it isn't. I've done it many a times, and no one ever got even close to being hurt. Its absolutely ridiculous. You have every right to get on your bike and ride on the road, but if there is a shoulder thats where you should be, you shouldn't be in the middle of the lane, blocking drivers because you want to show how you have rights on the road as well.

If you were riding a bicycle on the sideWALK where I was WALKING, that would annoy me. I would probably clothesline you.

So, yeah, it would be dangerous for you.

reply to post by ANOK


Okay..... you showed a video with a bunch of people riding their bike on the sidewalk no problem. If the bikers are going too fast and end up hurting someone, thats on the biker, maybe you should be for bikers riding slower on the sidewalk. I'm all for riding your bike on the road, as long as your not riding in the middle of the lane blocking the cars. If you have to get around an obstacle I get it, but I've been behind riders countless times, who could have moved over a couple of inches and still ride fine, and let everybody past. When your on a two lane road with no shoulder, and you see a row of cars behind you starting with 2 cars growing to a stretch of 25-50 all being blocked because you can't pull over for 30 seconds? I mean c'mon dude, get realistic, its not all about, well cars should just wait. It takes effort from the rider and pedestrians as well. Its not like, yea just ride wherever, and walk wherever cause you have the right of way. You have to yield to cars in some cases, just as cars have to yield to you. When someone makes wide sweeping generalized statements that all car drivers are a certain way, they're just being foolish. Same if its being directed towards bikers. But if you think bikes can ride in the middle of the road, when there is clearly room on the side to let people past, then i don't know what to say, other than there's no point in further discussing anything with you as you have an unrealistic world view.

reply to post by CaptChaos


Fine do it, I don't care, as long as I'm not hurting you, slowing down and yielding to you, there's no problem. You clothesline me for no reason, other than you want to police everyone based on your belief that you may get hurt, go for it, I will literally fight you to the death.

That's why you need bike lanes, luckely my country made those everywhere, so bikers aren't as hated as much. And hate for something is often a general thought, passing over to one another basicly. Or love in that matter, like when your dad ownes a certain brand of car, his son most often will love that brand aswell.

In this case, just some who lost his temper (bad day) and if there where bike lanes, then the biker wasn't in danger of someone loosing his control.

Two comments:

1) I race bikes and I live in a town. In order to train I have to ride through town to get to most of my best training areas. I ride way to fast to be safe on a public sidewalk and no I am not some sort of pro, but even when I am doing recovery rides I am doing at least 17mph. I also have parts of town without sidewalks.

2) Bike lanes are awful. They cause more accidents because drivers feel they do not have to be aware of cyclists using them. They don't bother to move over and often clip cyclists, they don't look behind them before they turn and they don't think about the possibility of the cyclist needing to get across traffic to turn left.

reply to post by PhoenixOD

Been going on a long time. More hidden video. . . www.youtube.com...

reply to post by backwherewestarted


Bike lanes more afwfull? looks like the car drivers just hate bikers then, so they love to drive over bike lanes? Seen some movies about biker accidents on liveleak, it's amazing how much bikers are hated in the US. I sure would think twice driving a bike over there..

You can't say riding a bike on the sidewalk is safe...

Accident reports for 2010 from the SFPD’s Traffic Company show 19 bicycle/pedestrian accidents in San Francisco, and 19 as of August of this year. The figures do not include unreported accidents. The city saw two bicycle fatalities in 2010, and two so far this year, according to Dangerfield.

In response to cyclists who say it is okay for them to ride on the sidewalk if they do it safely, Ra compared riding a bike on the sidewalk to driving in bike lanes.

“If you can [cycle on the sidewalk] safely, then I can drive a car in the bike lane if I do it safely.”

missionlocal.org...

If it wasn't illegal and everyone was doing it the statistics would increase. We want no statistics. Don't just do something because you can get away with it, be responsible.

As someone with a lead foot when I drive and who rode well over a thousand miles last year across several states here in the U.S., I think lots of people don't understand just how hard it is to cycle in an urban environment.

If you ride on sidewalks, they're uneven and chipped away, with pedestrians all around who you don't want to hit, cars coming out of lots, and it is often illegal.

If you ride on roads, every car that can zoom past you wants to murder you for going slow because you can't go as fast as they can. If you ride on the shoulder, you'll get splashed with debris and have to watch for opening car doors, even in bike lanes. If you ride in the lanes, properly, it gets even worse in how you're treated. And another thing here: Many of the red and green lights are set off by sensors based on the weight of the vehicle at the light, so as a cyclist, the act of doing what I'm legally supposed to do leads to unending red lights.

That's why cyclists ride crazy. I do 90% of my riding on rail trails for that reason, and stick to bike routes where possible, thinking you'd have to be insane to ride as a courier. But I ended up having to ride through downtown DC at rush hour (after travelling there with a pack full of stuff as I was on a long trip from Pittsburgh), and I rode crazy because 1) vehicles wouldn't give you a chance otherwise and 2) frankly, it seemed safer since motorists expected it.

If roads had better shoulders or bike lanes, that'd be a good step. Not every road, but at least a few main thoroughfares. I think then if cyclists walked a few of the dangerous stretches, and if people weren't always in a psychotic hurry, it would be fine.

But for as much as cyclists sometimes do dumb things, the cause of most accidents on the road is some combination of the inattentiveness or aggression of drivers.

As for the bus driver who ran over the cyclist, I don't know what it is called in England, but here in the States it looked like at least aggravated assault if he saw the guy.

Originally posted by andersensrm
Okay..... you showed a video with a bunch of people riding their bike on the sidewalk no problem. If the bikers are going too fast and end up hurting someone, thats on the biker, maybe you should be for bikers riding slower on the sidewalk.

C'mon man they shouldn't use the sidewalk at all. Did you look at the other links, like the Bicycle coalition, sidewalks are for walking?

I'm all for riding your bike on the road, as long as your not riding in the middle of the lane blocking the cars.

Again it's back to you and your feelings of superiority because you're in a car. How many more times, Cyclists are allowed full use of the lane in San Francisco, if you don't like that law then take it up with the city, not cyclists obeying the law.

reply to post by Ixtab

If cyclists paid road tax and had insurance I could accept there presence on the road, but they have neither so should not in anyway be allowed on the road.

So you would say the same thing about pedestrians? They have the right away no matter what. Hit me I know someone getting their ass beat then I'm getting paid cuz you'll have a lawsuit on you. Same thing goes for cyclists.

Imply the same rules for pedestrians and bikes when public roads are used.

This bike rider and bus driver were both in the wrong.
Problem is, when a vehicle is obstructing traffic, they can be identified immediately.
Pedestrians and bikes not so much.

Ignorance is often displayed on all sides.

What to do?

Originally posted by andersensrm
reply to post by ANOK

 

I'm for equal rights, nobody should have more rights.

Roads dont work with equal rights because it is about saftey. You are more vunrable on a bike than in a car..