Did Carl Sagan know something?

Wow, until reading comments here, I never thought anyone out there thought men in black was a documentary.
Crop cires are so debunked I will not even bother providing a link, accept to a company making them:
www.circlemakers.org...

As one poster told us, and I amazed nobody read it, Carl Sagan didnt know anything, mr Frank Drake did.
That man is where to focus on!

Back in 1999 when I saw UFOs first hand including a close up sighting of a metallic flying disk, I was also reading all of Carl Sagan's books as well. Just a funny coincidence.

Carl Sagan has been the most crucial and important figure in 'awakening me' to the vast universe of knowledge and information, and giving me a scientific grounding but also at the same time, a creative perspective and the tools to determine things out for myself without having to rely exclusively on other humans to create my understandings of my surroundings.

Sagan was actually the primary person who would have served as a 'xeno-diplomat' if you will, in the event that we made official contact with alien life forms. He was easily one of the smartest and best informed people, he worked on Blue Book and criticized the project on many occasions.

One interesting point is that he believed Blue Book was just a public display intended to quell the public's interest in the subject and made various suggestions and points that there must have been 'another project' with better resources deeper within the military hierarchy that was taking a more serious approach to the subject. Examples he gave were about the bogus explanations given for various UFO sighting events, which did not make sense or explain the sighting to any reasonable extent.

I am highly convinced that Sagan was involved in various 'secret' projects and had knowledge far beyond that of accepted science, and he gave many clues to this throughout his wonderful books on various occasions. This should be obvious to anyone who has done their homework.

I would have to say that Sagan was the most influential person in my life in opening me up to thinking rationally and scientifically about things. My secondary influence was a few years later, and it was Michio Kaku, the person who has taken Sagan's place.

I highly suggest people read all of Sagan (and also Kaku's) books and writings.
Especially check out these books:

All links are to Amazon.com -
Sagan:
The Dragons of Eden: Speculations on the Evolution of Human Intelligence

Shadows of Forgotten Ancestors

Pale Blue Dot: A Vision of the Human Future in Space

The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark

Cosmos

Broca's Brain

And by Kaku:
Visions: How Science Will Revolutionize the 21st Century

Everyone must read all of these particular works I have linked, although these authors have written many other works I want to emphasize these particular works.

Please note that although Demon-Haunted World is a guide to determining what is fact from fake, and although he dismissed most crop-circles as hoaxes, we have to remember no one is perfect and everyone can make mistakes. Also there could have been a reason he was 'put up to debunking them in particular', by powers we may not know about or see.

Sagan and Kaku have taught me one very important skill, and that is to QUESTION EVERYTHING and to remain open to ALL POSSIBILITIES even if it seems improbable. The Truth can indeed be stranger than fiction. Don't take anything as gospel but take things into consideration and open your mind to what could exist behind the veil that clouds our vision.

Very good thread topic OP, I am very happy with what you have accomplished here!

NEW YORK CNN Astronomer Carl Edward Sagan, a gifted storyteller who extolled and explored the grandeur and mystery of the universe in lectures, books and an acclaimed TV series, died Friday after a twoyear battle with bone marrow disease. He was 62.

Sagan died of pneumonia at the Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center in Seattle, where he had a bonemarrow transplant in April 1995, a center spokeswoman said. The center had identified his disease as myelodysplasia, a form of anemia also known as preleukemia syndrome.

articles.cnn.com...:US


What I don't understand is this, we send out messages (we meaning the gov) looking for something, but if someone says they may have heard or saw a reply......the same gov says they are nuts. Makes me think someone is trying to tell us something and tptb are not happy about it. like someone said previously.....they seem to be contacting the public, not the gov where the secret could be kept.

In Pale Blue Dot, Sagan clearly pointed out that there have been many radio signals received by SETI that are anomalous and worth looking into deeper.

And although some 'crop-circle formations' have been debunked, many of them have not been successfully or properly debunked. You must remain open to alternative possibilities or you are closed minded and thus incapable of finding the truth whatever it may turn out to be.

There are many anomalous crop formations, and there are many formations which can be shown to be man-made.

Just because mankind can create flying objects does NOT mean that 'all flying objects are man-made'. This applies to all other subjects as well.

People who assume they know everything and dismiss contrary evidence are fools.

I think it is rather strange that the DNA length and the population are the same numbers. Since 4billion is incorrect, I am assuming that the number 4.29 billion wasn't our DNA length. If you consider our progenitors, who were not the greys but pretty much look like us, would their genome total 4.29billion base pairs?

reply to post by VoidHawk


lol very interesting but I mean this is so far fetched its practically absurd.

Originally posted by theBigToe
reply to post by VoidHawk

 

lol very interesting but I mean this is so far fetched its practically absurd.

This is the perfect example of closed mindedness to the vast plethora of alternative possibilities and the failure of logic and rationality.

A one line dismissal with little to no substance, no reasoning as to "why", no explanations of what specifically is absurd, etc.

Forgive me for dismissing such fallacious points of view and criticizing them heavily.

Just because something is far-fetched does not imply automatically that it is absurd. Only logical inconsistency can reveal absurdity.

reply to post by VoidHawk


The genome is an organism’s complete set of DNA. Genomes vary widely in size: the smallest known genome for a free-living organism (a bacterium) contains about 600,000 DNA base pairs, while human and mouse genomes have some 3 billion. Except for mature red blood cells, all human cells contain a complete genome.


www.ornl.gov...

reply to post by muzzleflash


Im anything but closed minded. I believe in extraterrestrials.

I just find it hard to believe everything I read on internet forums. He made a very good case for why he believes what he does, but it just seems really far fetched and unlikely. I didnt say he was wrong. I just said its so far fetched its practically absurd. Glad to see you attack me for it though. Thanks for that.

reply to post by muzzleflash



Keep looking up, errr sorry, keep looking down at the corn fields.
That where the alien action is at!
Right.

Originally posted by JohanD
As one poster told us, and I amazed nobody read it, Carl Sagan didnt know anything, mr Frank Drake did.
That man is where to focus on!

Sure Drake knew a lot of things, but so did Sagan.

Forgive me for not taking you seriously, especially considering you made an ATS account to make this one post.

Deflection and distraction tactics are not going to work here. Don't focus on Carl Sagan? I beg to differ!

reply to post by muzzleflash


And being that things are considered far fetched it usually implies that people are making big leaps on assumptions.

Originally posted by theBigToe
reply to post by muzzleflash

 

Im anything but closed minded. I believe in extraterrestrials.

I just find it hard to believe everything I read on internet forums. He made a very good case for why he believes what he does, but it just seems really far fetched and unlikely. I didnt say he was wrong. I just said its so far fetched its practically absurd. Glad to see you attack me for it though. Thanks for that.

Believe believe believe.

Belief is little more than faith. It's assumptions based on absence of evidence.
However an absence of evidence is not automatically an evidence of absence.

I prefer to KNOW things for sure.

Without knowing, I will remain open to alternative possibilities and refrain from dismissing them entirely based purely on "personal beliefs".

reply to post by BBalazs



there is no way some of the more "complex" weaved patterns could have been made by man. There is just too much going on inside the plants, underneath the formations, and before, during, and immediately after to claim all are hoaxes. You are silly for even trying to imply it. Some of the geometry is very complex and some of the formations are meant to be considered in a 3D context. Although the linky you provide is pretty interesting...I have read countless books, by experts, who are trying to figure this all out...

They all hint to the same thing, albeit in different ways...but they all feel the complex formations are a message...a dialog between us and them. Although its been pretty one-sided up until recently.

I understand that for some(not directed at you specifically, I don't know you) this is a religious issue or whatever and all I can tell you is...that's okay with me, but facts are facts and the truth is sometimes things are just more complex than the average person can stand to bare. But to claim hoax across the board on anything as amazing and intellectual as the crop formations is childish and an exercise in naivety, which by its very definition is ignorant and incredulous to the fullest extent imaginable.

I'm sorry, but unless you've been living under a rock for the last 8 to 12 years...we are crawling toward a soft disclosure of the true nature of the Universe and ALL ITS LIFE!

Food for though below...

God himself, I would think, would find it pretty arrogant of us to truly believe we are the best he can do in such a vast place as his kingdom, his heavens. You Bible thumpers mean to tell me than we live in this whole big ginormous place...all by ourselves. AND we are relegated to this sinking ship of a planet...That's no God of mine! I will tell you that!

Originally posted by BBalazs
Wow, until reading comments here, I never thought anyone out there thought men in black was a documentary.
Crop cires are so debunked I will not even bother providing a link, accept to a company making them:
www.circlemakers.org...

Hello BBalazs,

I just wanted to re-post your link because apparently everyone on this page missed it!!!
Great site if people want to understand the reality of crop circle construction: why, who and HOW!

Thanks for the link,73's,
Tom

reply to post by muzzleflash


Ummm, you believe in aliens too. If youre telling me you have direct evidence of an alien species existing then I would call you a liar because that would be you implying you know something that no Human can possibly know at this point with what technology we have available to us. Can you answer what would any government gain from covering up direct contact with an alien species?

You think aliens on Jupiter are contacting Humans on Earth. Forgive me for being arrogant and ignorant when I remain skeptical.

Originally posted by BBalazs
reply to post by muzzleflash

 

Keep looking up, errr sorry, keep looking down at the corn fields.
That where the alien action is at!
Right.

I have seen a metallic flying saucer with my own eyes, therefore I know as a fact that something strange is going on here at Earth. I don't expect you to "believe" me, you have to see it yourself to KNOW it's real. But I do not have the luxury of dismissing such topics as I have witnessed the absolute proof of their existence.

Therefore it is only logical to remain open to many possible sources of explanation until ultimate evidence can prove all cases conclusively.

Keep dismissing things you 'don't like personally'. That is the perfect example of willful ignorance.

reply to post by tomdham

I think i will send them a link to this message board, they will enjoy this.
It has pretty much been unofficially confirmed they were behind the message, but dont tell anyone here.

reply to post by VoidHawk


11000
10000
11010
XXXXX
-----
75010
i.e. 7 atoms of hydrogen, 5 atoms of carbon, 0 atoms of nitrogen, 1 atom of oxygen, and 0 atoms of phosphorus.
[edit]Double helix

11
11
11
11
11
01
11
11
01
11
01
11
10
11
11
01
X
1111111111110111 1111101101011110 (binary)
= 4,294,441,823 (decimal)

DNA double helix (the vertical bar represents the number of nucleotides, but the value depicted is around 4.3 billion when in fact there are about 3.2 billion base pairs in the human genome).
[edit]Humanity

X011011
111111
X0111 110111
111011
111111
110000
1110 (binary) = 14 (decimal)
000011 111111 110111 111011 111111 110110 (binary)
= 4,292,853,750 (decimal)


://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arecibo_message


This is some more info on the message.