ATS It's all or Nothing!

Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by Aeons

 

Awesome

You've been around ATS as long as I have let me ask you this?

Because of ATS and the various forums, have any of your opinions or views changed over the years on something you may have at one time never thought in a million years that you would change your view on it?

edit on 22-1-2012 by SLAYER69 because: clariifcations

I'm not sure that I have many things I would be 100% sure I'd never change my mind on.

This is one of the reasons I find it very personally amusing that people online (and some in person) tend to experience me as a person with unwavering concrete convictions. The only conviction I'm pretty sure is consistent is that I would vastly prefer to do the best I can with what I have available.

But yes. I have changed my mind on some things, sometimes to accept things that my primary overwhelming desire is to reject completely.

Mainly though, like everyone I have a few totally crazy ideas. I like the people who are willing to challenge me on them.

Originally posted by Whateva69
I know it sounds silly, and some of my posts are a bit dizzy and ditzy but that's just who i am, so ill try to rethink before i post from now on, though its really hard, i always forget what im going to say, so its tricky to rethink something when ive forgotten what it is.

I hear ya.

For me when I worry too much about what I'm about to write it usually comes out wrong. On the flip side, if I just post how I feel without worrying about how it may be perceived it is usually well received.

Originally posted by 1littlewolf
I can honestly say ATS has made me a better person, and it was only by chance which I even found this website.

Honestly..

I feel the same way. Some may feel differently but I agree with this sentiment.

I've finally found a group of people who share many of the strange and weird interests which I have, but who can critique them intelligently and in turn take them to levels which I haven't even considered.

Agreed.

Even though some members I'll disagree with doesn't mean I don't respect their opinions even when it conflicts with mine. It makes me reexamine my views and stance sometimes. Often. In the endeavor to win a debate I'll often learn something new while researching the topic I'm in a discussion/debate etc.

The caliber of people here motivates me to want to be a better person (having to young kids now also works wonders on ones maturity levels

) And if nothing else, I've definitely learnt to type a lot faster.

I agree, the caliber of most of the members [On any side of a debate] seems to be very high. I've learned a fair amount sometimes from just reading. Which by the way I do a lot more of than contributing.

I do have a few patience issues with seemingly stupid posts. But if I can hold my tounge (or keyboard....?) it often turns out that either myself or the other poster somehow just misunderstood each other and in turn we both walk away knowing a little more.

Or not.

Some people will never agree on some issues. I'm trying to no longer take such outcomes as hard as I once did.

It can be hard though cos I really used to enjoy a bit of a verbal showdown with someone who disagreed with me, though I've also noticed though that you look a lot less stupid if you've remained civil with a guy who's just proved you wrong

Agreed.

Great thread Slayer

Thank you

PEACE

Originally posted by IceHappy

For me its is sometimes hard to be objective when reading a post as we all have our pet peeves and ideals. Gut reaction is a human trait! The reason I come to ATS is for information. Since I am an American outside of America the need for information is great! That is to hear the news and enjoy many sides of the argument that our members come up with.

I hear ya.
The large amount of varying opinions is one of my most liked aspects of ATS and it's members contributions. I don't always agree with the majority but do appreciate their participation.

What I find disappointing however is so many of our members are willing to attack the poster than to debate the idea which the poster tried to bring up. These attacks come in "you cannot spell!" to "Your Grammer shows your educational skills." The results are that post was derailed and the defense and counter attack begins. Many ATS posters here go for the gut and defense rather than to think outside the box and try and look at all ramifications of the information on offer. I am seeking the truth and to do that one must read everyones point of view and weigh up the evidence which is why it is so important that people back up their opinions with links that support their idea is wider than their imagination.

Sadly there are apparently quite a few here at ATS who have the all or nothing mindset and for some reason IMHO cannot for the life of them see a middle ground or truly understand the meaning of the Term Compromise. We see this on many forums, Religion, Politics, Foreign policy etc etc etc.


" If you don't support X then you support a corrupt and evil Y "

Meanwhile, the original poster had admitted they agree with the majority of what X has to say but was being critical of X's stance on a certain issue.

BTW the warrior in me loves your old avatar the human side of me like your new one as you (from a straight man) are a good looking man. You are definitely a Thinker and always look forward to what you have to say...

Pls put me on your U2U postings...

No problem.

Thanks for the compliment and I change my Avatars depending on my moods.
I've received a few requests for the U2U notification.

Will do

Originally posted by Aeons

This is one of the reasons I find it very personally amusing that people online (and some in person) tend to experience me as a person with unwavering concrete convictions. The only conviction I'm pretty sure is consistent is that I would vastly prefer to do the best I can with what I have available.

I may be off here but this got me thinking. The last sentence about. Can we be handicapped by the sources of information that we have available to us?

But yes. I have changed my mind on some things, sometimes to accept things that my primary overwhelming desire is to reject completely.

Same here.
I am now more willing to attempt to look at things differently but don't always do

I'll have to work on that further

Mainly though, like everyone I have a few totally crazy ideas

Have you read some of my Lost and Ancient civilization threads?

Many feel they are "Way out there and crazy"

Originally posted by SLAYER69

So I guess the premise of this thread appears to be lost on some

edit on 22-1-2012 by SLAYER69 because: (no reason given)

I could have sworn that it was someone else that started this thread, or else I would not have posted the comment I did. Anyway, moving along.. it's good to see that you realize and take ownership of your bias. The best mind-frame to be in before posting is to realize what we know is indisputable fact, and what we don't know.

Example:

We know the mainstream media and government has been proven to manipulate and sometimes outright lie to the public. We know this is fact through documented cases. Was 9/11 an inside job? We don't know this is 100% factual. So we look at the things we do know about the situation, there was insider trading, the explanation of how WTC 7 collapsed according to the 9/11 commission report is impossible, the speed of the WTC collapse defies the laws of physics being able to fall at nearly the same speed as a quarter coin in free-fall dropped from the same height as the WTC.

I cannot say for fact how each sequence of 9/11 being an inside job occurred, and you cannot say for fact that 9/11 wasn't an inside job. When either side completely dismisses the alternative view point it kills informed discussion and promotes ignorance. Especially when neither side has indisputable proof.

Originally posted by Drezden
I could have sworn that it was someone else that started this thread, or else I would not have posted the comment I did. Anyway, moving along..

No you were right the first time.

I think that shows how an "Avatar" can influence ones opinion of the poster. That probably speaks volumes. I wonder how many do this instead of actually reading the content of the post as it is intended instead of judging the post based on their preconceptions of said poster.

Eh?

I cannot say for fact how each sequence of 9/11 being an inside job occurred, and you cannot say for fact that 9/11 wasn't an inside job. When either side completely dismisses the alternative view point it kills informed discussion and promotes ignorance. Especially when neither side has indisputable proof.

Then how should this be handled? What goes through your mind while dealing with this type of discussion [Thread Topic "9/11" is not an issue in this example]

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Many ATS members cant be
independent critical thinkers.

Think about global politics for a second.
I'll wait...


I see this on a daily basis here at ATS. Take your favorite geopolitical arena and any given relevant recent headline. Which side are you on? Do you have a side? Do you favor one side over the other? Could you separate yourself from your preconceptions enough to discuss the situation in a fair, balanced and unbiased manner? Could you be wrong? Can you concede certain facts even when and if they fly in the face or your perceived Paradigm? Do I make assumptions about other posters?

Those are some questions I ask myself before I jump into a topic.
[I'm not always successful]

Are you?

edit on 22-1-2012 by SLAYER69 because: (no reason given)

Amen brother, but I can't say what I think if you know what I mean.

I am very cautious and have never really felt comfortable completely opening up on the forum,

reply to post by 1littlewolf

I can honestly say ATS has made me a better person,

I think forums in general made me a worse person,

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
Amen brother, but I can't say what I think if you know what I mean.

I am very cautious and have never really felt comfortable completely opening up on the forum,

Nothing wrong with anonymity.
I too don't reveal too much. This is a "Conspiracy" site after all.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/179aab7cc79f.gif[/atsimg]

reply to post by v1rtu0s0

Originally posted by Drezden
When either side completely dismisses the alternative view point it kills informed discussion and promotes ignorance. Especially when neither side has indisputable proof.

I find many topics riddled with opinionated "facts",that in the real world,don't hold legitimacy.



When that happens,the person who "thinks" he/she is right,will use even more opinions,to legitimize his/her stance.Sometimes using facts that have no real bearing to the original questions,and should never have made it into a discussion,only to justify their original thesis.

I also find alot of editing of posts,clearly after someone has proved a poster wrong.

If you are bringing to a discussion,certain questions,and answer them using Facts and Logic,and poster then decides to change said questions,after realizing a flaw or mistake in their own reasoning,I find that as being Highly disingenuous.

We all make mistakes,and owning up to them,is clearly "being the bigger man or woman" in my book.

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
Amen brother, but I can't say what I think if you know what I mean.

I am very cautious and have never really felt comfortable completely opening up on the forum,

Nothing wrong with anonymity.

I too don't reveal too much. This is a "Conspiracy" site after all.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/179aab7cc79f.gif[/atsimg]

Facebook is the place to be,if you want to reveal information.

I talk about my children,my heritage,me being an American,because I am proud of that.
As far as my address,my phone number,etc.............
That wont happen,unless I decide that its beneficial to my life,and my family.
At least thats how I feel about it.........

reply to post by sonnny1




Sick minds think alike

I follow a golden rule
Speak honestly about what you have learned.
Be sincere in what you say so others may learn.
Listen to others and learn to learn.

If you can't do that then dont post at all. At that point they aren't listening. They are preaching. No one is learning.

If I see a little "info squad" laying down the rule of the law, I read as much as I can swallow starting from the OP to whatever post warranted a single and concise throwing in of my 2 cents.
After that I just leave.

Always laugh when I am here. This place makes me crack up sometimes. lol

It's funny the things people say here. I have never seen such elegant and perfectly articulated insanity neatly placed in the form of text.

If not just for the glimpse of the most cynical arguments for ludicrous points of view, I am here for the brilliant and artful masterpieces of twisted and confounded lies and misconceptions. Deliberate in many cases, others it's a knee jerk reaction.

Then there are the rays of light. The sanity that keeps you coming back for more.

reply to post by casenately


I appreciate your Candor and honesty
Thank you for taking the time to reply.

Originally posted by sonnny1

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
Amen brother, but I can't say what I think if you know what I mean.

I am very cautious and have never really felt comfortable completely opening up on the forum,

Nothing wrong with anonymity.

I too don't reveal too much. This is a "Conspiracy" site after all.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/179aab7cc79f.gif[/atsimg]

Facebook is the place to be,if you want to reveal information.

I talk about my children,my heritage,me being an American,because I am proud of that.
As far as my address,my phone number,etc.............
That wont happen,unless I decide that its beneficial to my life,and my family.
At least thats how I feel about it.........

I don't say anything there either.

I was speaking more along the lines of deep religious/spiritual and political opinions,

reply to post by Stormdancer777


I understand actually.

Im vocal on many subjects,some not so vocal.

I love deep threads,that make you think.

On religion?
I try to stay out of it. Seems every time I speak my peace,someone tends to go highly religious,or hard core atheist....on me......

I stated I felt bad for the Pope once,you should have heard the comments...........

reply to post by SLAYER69

Do you favor one side over the other?

Most assuredly! That’s human nature (especially for some…esprit de corps)

Could you separate yourself from your preconceptions enough to discuss the situation in a fair, balanced and
unbiased manner?

Absolutely…if you don’t then you stop learning. Sometimes I swing from one side to another on an issue based on what I’ve just learned. Critical thinking…get it or become irrelevant!

Could you be wrong?

Unfortunately YES! But it’s a rare occurrence (IMO)

Can you concede certain facts even when and if they fly in the face or your perceived Paradigm?

I won’t name ATS names but I’ve been forced to concede facts from time to time; it wasn’t pleasant but it happens (if you’re honest).

Do I make assumptions about other posters?

Never!!

I'm glad I'm not the only one who has been thinking this. I have been trying to bring to light that many of the members on here are allowing themselves to led around just as much as those who only follow the MSM. Unfortunately, I just generally get hounded for asking the questions that I do.