A few questions for those who believe that UFO's are manned by interstellar fairing aliens.

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist

1. Many people have claimed that UFO's can accelerate 90 degrees relative to their position and other maneuvers that contradict the underlying physical principles of current propulsion technology. What many scientists have concluded is that such aerial maneuvering can create gravitational forces so great (hundreds of times that of Earth) and would flatten any living creature like a pancake. Your take on this?

I know they are capable of these sudden direction changes at fantastic speeds because I saw one do it with my own two eyes, with friends and others I didn't know. Hella show. What we saw was not earth technology and yet, it was technology. Under intelligent control and with purpose. I'll describe it more if any one is interested tomorrow, as it's late here and I'm out.

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist

1. Many people have claimed that UFO's can accelerate 90 degrees relative to their position and other maneuvers that contradict the underlying physical principles of current propulsion technology. What many scientists have concluded is that such aerial maneuvering can create gravitational forces so great (hundreds of times that of Earth) and would flatten any living creature like a pancake. Your take on this?

Hmmm my Theory !

Simple

Some kind of Anti Gravity within the Craft!!

as Carol Sagan might as well theorized!

Something like this around the !!!!!!!!!! 2:56 Mark of this Clip!!!!!!! below
as she unstraps her self from the Chair !! from seeing her Locket/Compass floating around!!

Contact Scene


Could I be Right ! ? in this Theory! I would think it may be possible

that's if Man can create a Anti Gravity Field or a Machine messing with time
not saying a time machine but bending it manipulating it with in the Craft , Space Ship, UFO Etc..

well that's my Conjuncture..

Why do UFOs need headlights? Surly they don't navigate by sight, even our military jets don't navigate by looking out the windshield. Sure looking outside supplements flying modern jets but in complete darkness looking outside is nearly useless, how do Navy pilots land on small aircraft carriers, by gut judgements on how far the lights on the ship are from them?

reply to post by dilly1

I still believe we'll see they travel, move about and appear and disappear in ways neither of us can express in words...certainly not by Hummer.

Lets leave it at a quote from your favorite movie: Forest Gump. "Stupid is as stupid does".

I will not entertain any more nonsense from you. Although it was entertaining.

Peace

Originally posted by MathematicalPhysicist
1. Many people have claimed that UFO's can accelerate 90 degrees relative to their position and other maneuvers that contradict the underlying physical principles of current propulsion technology. What many scientists have concluded is that such aerial maneuvering can create gravitational forces so great (hundreds of times that of Earth) and would flatten any living creature like a pancake. Your take on this?
2. To cross the vast distances of the stars, it is known without a doubt that any engine that is used would need to be extremely vast and thus requires a huge star ship. Most UFO reportings are of objects from as small as 3 m across to a one mile. Such machinery is not capable of achieving the high speeds required to cover the astronomical distances in a feasibly short time, and any advanced civilization capable of travelling to the stars would not waste such high amounts of energy or a long time to just spy on humans. Your take on this?
3. An alien civilization capable of travelling to the stars has most likely mastered the physics of optics, and have cloaking technology at their disposal. Not only that, but they have also most likely mastered nanotechnology and the many other scientific areas that we have yet to even begin to slightly understand. In practice, would it not be feasible to have unmanned, cloaked aircraft that are very small but sufficient enough to serve the purpose of spying on humans?

I'll come up with more questions as the thread progresses.

I take you do perceive and realise that your points above and yes scientific facts/realities are from a reality of what science currently understands at the present time and may not apply to all or any extraterrestrial intelligences that are highly advanced and way ahead of us in possible new physics;

**Breaking** VLT May Have Proven That Our Laws Of Physics Are Wrong - The Universe Is Not Equal!

"the VLT (Very Large Telescope) in Chile has found that may prove our science based knowledge of laws and physics in the universe is completely and utterly incorrect and the so called experts in these matters may have to issue apologies for trying to ridicule the people who disagreed with them".

Defying Einstein's equivalence principle, which states that the laws of physics are the same everywhere, researchers have found new evidence that supports the idea that we live in an area of the universe that is "just right" for our existence". Taking data from the Very Large Telescope (VLT) in Chile Webb has observed that alpha varies in space rather than time. The VLT data suggests that, elsewhere in the universe, the value of alpha is very slightly bigger than on Earth; Laws of physics are not the same everywhere;

source links and links for further pontifications
sify.com...

en.wikipedia.org...

www.eso.org...

www.cosmosmagazine.com...

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist


Well the best way to answer your question about how the "aliens" break "our laws" of enertial forces and gravity would be that our modern science experience is about 100-200 years old (im being VERY generous in the time here). If they are in fact aliens, and they have the techniology to travel long distances in space or bend space time, that would lead me to believe that its taken them hundreds and thousands of years to reach a point where they could think up, study, test such theories and build such craft to do so. But back to the fact that you are basing your questions off OUR laws or what we know, which could maybe fill a thimble compared to beings that can bend space time. Im sure if they have figured out how to do those things figuring out how to not disturb gravity is most likely childs play. We are so close minded as a people (not all of us), no one just sits and thinks of certain posibilities. If you are a man of science, then you know that anything is possible. Especially as far as the possibilities of life beyond our planet. The number of solar systems and the size of the universe is proof of that. So if you dont think that there is even the slightest possibility that we ARE being visited (not to say we 100% are) then sir/madam you need to open your mind and realize what we know may not be the end all be all of science. And to be clear im not saying aliens ARE visiting us, just saying its possible and if they are they probably know more about.....EVERYTHING than we do.

Originally posted by MathematicalPhysicist
1. Many people have claimed that UFO's can accelerate 90 degrees relative to their position and other maneuvers that contradict the underlying physical principles of current propulsion technology. What many scientists have concluded is that such aerial maneuvering can create gravitational forces so great (hundreds of times that of Earth) and would flatten any living creature like a pancake. Your take on this?
2. To cross the vast distances of the stars, it is known without a doubt that any engine that is used would need to be extremely vast and thus requires a huge star ship. Most UFO reportings are of objects from as small as 3 m across to a one mile. Such machinery is not capable of achieving the high speeds required to cover the astronomical distances in a feasibly short time, and any advanced civilization capable of travelling to the stars would not waste such high amounts of energy or a long time to just spy on humans. Your take on this?
3. An alien civilization capable of travelling to the stars has most likely mastered the physics of optics, and have cloaking technology at their disposal. Not only that, but they have also most likely mastered nanotechnology and the many other scientific areas that we have yet to even begin to slightly understand. In practice, would it not be feasible to have unmanned, cloaked aircraft that are very small but sufficient enough to serve the purpose of spying on humans?

I'll come up with more questions as the thread progresses.

1: the craft's antigravity properties create it's own gravity and the objects inside are not subject to inertial forces relative to how the craft is moving

2:they don't always commute, some are already here, have been for hundreds of thousands of years, perhaps longer. As far as passing the speed of light, don't think our limited understanding of physics applies to species much much older and advanced than ours. Their millions of years of advanced knowledge has had plenty of time to figure it out.

3: sure they have cloaked probes, drones, spy craft, why not? There are probably other things that they have that even if they explained what it's purpose is we wouldn't understand. Sort of like trying to explain why you stare at your computer to your dog. The dog can see the computer but hasn't the mental capacity to even begin to understand.

All you need to do is apply your logic in #3 to #"s 1 and 2. But nonetheless, I think its more likely the wildly manuevering objects are 'unmanned' probes.

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist


1) Learn something man... do u know what is anti-gravity? doesn't look like. With a anti-gravitational field around the "pilot" of the space ship, he feels no acceleration neither g-forces. So they are able to do those turns at any speed.

2) Ok, u little criticizer who doesn't search for info... travelling large distances is by 2 ways mainly: (1) to wrap space, which give to the spaceship extreme speeds (a project NASA is trying) or (2) by controlled wormholes, which is easily seen when "alien" spaceships appear from nowhere. Now, for the size of the ships, did u know that around the sun there are ships huge as some planets? Use some logic, the ones we see on earth are small cause they have a mother-ship "not far away".

3) Well, yes they have cloaking (that's why the mother-ships are mainly seen during solar flares, cause these surround those ships, showing their shape and size), and yes they use small things, the 1 to 3 meter diameter unmanned flying objects. Yes that is yet small for an advanced civilisation cause it has to include in it anti-gravitational systems, electronics, receptors, navigation, "fuel", etc. They use those to spy us, most are cloaked (but still visible in other spectrum) but some few fail to, there is always a possibility on malfunction because of storms or electrostatics on our planet. While the big ones some see are another story, for example: abductions and visitors (they visit us like we visit a zoo...)

... Next Time, before saying something like this, inform yourself

Ah just another person claiming the old "to far to travel between stars". You know what? how the heck would our scientests know hmm? we arguably made it to our very own moon even if we did land on the moon a couple times it is to early to call out "to far to travel between stars" You don't know there planet could be much different what if there was a fule that went 50 light years a second possible? yes. unlikley can't say because we don't know anything "supposedly" all those sighting must leade up to something.

Originally posted by Illustronic
Why do UFOs need headlights? Surly they don't navigate by sight, even our military jets don't navigate by looking out the windshield. Sure looking outside supplements flying modern jets but in complete darkness looking outside is nearly useless, how do Navy pilots land on small aircraft carriers, by gut judgements on how far the lights on the ship are from them?

I suppose the light might be a byproduct of something else - like heat coming from a jet engine.

Or maybe the light is designed to attract attention - like a duck call

Or maybe the light is just a flashlight for looking at the ground when they are flying low. There's no reason they can't use low technology methods when those are the most practical and economical. Also there is no reason UFO's need to use the best technology available. Maybe they are cheap drones and aliens don't care much if they are sighted or even if they crash.

1. As you alluded to in 3., they're likely unmanned ships that dock with larger (manned?) stations. So no harm done, irrespective of what extremes of manoeuvrability are attained.

2. Size wouldn't matter for an advanced propulsion system that does not rely on copious amounts of combustible fuel. Which aliens capable on interstellar travel would surely have harnessed.

3. They do tend to be hidden, for most part. It's just that on occasions they seem to emerge from their dissembled state. This could be due to malfunction, unanticipated terrestrial interference with their cloaking systems, such systems needing to shut down in order to allow for other monitoring capabilities to function, a deliberate ploy to send a message of some sort, 'alien error'...

I myself saw an odd, shiny, sliver object in the sky not so long ago. I would have thought nothing of it had a radio talk-back caller not SMS'd the station I was listening, that moment, alerting them to a "UFO" over the area which I was (as a result of the notification) prompted to look up in the direction of! *cues Twilight Zone theme *

Garbage thread is garbage.

Well, I shouldn't say that. People who've addressed the OP's questions in good faith have taught me something. Thank you for that information.

But seriously, from the OP's standpoint, UFO believers are ridiculous because interstellar ships would need to be massive, given our current model so its impossible. UFO believers believe that because interstellar ships would need to be massive, which is one of the myriad reasons why we can't do it, they must have developed an alternative.

This is irreconcilable and has nothing to do with physics. So, coming in with the "I have science on my side" stance is arrogant and abrasive. On one hand, you have people who say "you must not have seen what you think you saw, 'cause our model of the universe doesn't support it." and on the other you have "yeah, I know that, but I know I saw that too, so either I'm insane, or what I know isn't complete."

I don't think the UFO phenomenon would be eradicated if everyone got an A in elementary physics, even if the OP feels it should be so. Point is, we don't know if we live in an infinite universe, or if there are an infinite number of universes in their own space and time....theoretical physicists agree on that. If we live in an infinite universe, then it is a certainty that aliens exist, and if it were possible to develop interstellar travel, it is certain that some civilization found their way to us, since in an infinite universe, and infinite number of civilizations currently have space travel. Same holds true for the infinite universe thing. If neither are infinite, then the probability goes sharply down.

Point is, we don't understand near enough to say that UFO's could be aliens, or that they couldn't. We can look at each account and determine what is the most likely explanation, but large scale speculation about the possibility of aliens is largely worthless.

Unless you're trying to pick a fight. Then it's very useful.

I have had my share of seeing strange things and UFO's. They have the ability to stay stationary silently. They also have the ability to travel almost instantly place to place so fast that they leave a contrail behind them. They move and wobble like motion. While moving fast forward they dip slightly forward creating a gravity field in front and behind them that pushes them forward like a propulsion. So in my opinion and theory they are phasing in and out of frequency's and are dimensional. Why fight through the impossible and impractical, when you can go around it like a detour? If you think about it for a moment that solves all the the problems. It's like being inside a large building with multiple room of doors. You bypass all of them by going out the window and walking the outside of the box.

If you phase out of the physical world you no longer are bound by the physical laws. So traveling great distances takes no energy or time or; Since you are no longer in the physical you have no inertia. So I imagine by being a more advanced civilization they have more advanced physics. They have found a way to harness greater energy from higher elements and encapsulate themselves inside some sort of a force field like structure. Kind of like an atom has a nucleus of neutrons and protons with an outside electron. It cancels out everything and they created their own space and time till they turn the field off, then they phase back in and they have traveled great distances in seconds versus 1000's of light years.

It's not about bending space and time itself to go point A to point B. That would take the power of the whole universe! It's about energy and frequency, vibrating yourself out of phase using frequency's. So once out of the box that binds us and into your own box that you created and have control over. Then you can move that box forward where you like go. In a way you are using a vehicle to travel, but just doing it a lot different and using energy different. So if you look at rockets and propellant and forcing it's way out an cone to propel yourself forward; its quite a primitive technology. Man has only begun to scratch the surface.

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist
Man, don't be so smug. We are now doing things that were thought to be impossible 100 years ago. In another 100 years we will be doing things that we now think are impossible. Our knowledge of physics is not complete and we cannot say with certainty that certain things can or cannot be done. A Intelligent species that is hundreds or thousands of years more advanced than us would be able to do things that we think are impossible. That is pure logic you can't argue with, like it or not.

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist


1) I don't know. But out of pure speculation, one could argue that what your seeing is not what is objectively happening...aka, to us they made a 90 degree turn in a split second, to them, they made a slow course adjustment that took over 2 minutes.

2) ? Why?
Fairly wild assumption really. why would you need some epic mothership? all that is needed is a replicator and some good books to read. (since on number 3 you did suggest they had advanced nanotech, I won't discuss what a replicator is...but to those whom don't know, think star trek tng's replicator

3) Drones...sure. why not. But eventually when you hit paydirt, you will want to visit the zoo verses just send in a spycam from time to time I would think. Paydirt meaning civilizations

Many people have claimed that UFO's can accelerate 90 degrees relative to their position and other maneuvers that contradict the underlying physical principles of current propulsion technology.

reply to post by MathematicalPhysicist


"Maneuvers that contradict the underlying physical principles of current propulsion technology".

And you are right,they most certainly do.But,they contradict OUR current propulsion technology.If they are able to pull off these maneuvers then they are obviously way more advanced then us.

Can it be possible that they have figured out a way around it?I mean maybe they've figured out how to make so you can't feel the effects of the g-force?

One way would be to control gravity on the inside of the craft so your body stays stationary in the middle with no effects from the g-forces or even gravity for that matter.

I think one day we will discover it.Look at how far we have come.

1. Advanced alien hardware is likely to include inertial dampening technology. This would create computer-controlled gravitational fields to cancel out the g-forces created by inertia.

2. The vast engine you describe would only be required for technology that we currently know of. Perhaps these aliens have developed technologies which are beyond our current knowledge base, such as some kind of warp engine which can distort space/time thus shortening the distance between A and B.

3. Maybe aliens don't mind being observed, or even want us to see them. We have no tech which could threaten them after all. Some or all of the craft could be unmanned drones.

Originally posted by Sunsetspawn

Originally posted by dilly1

Originally posted by Sunsetspawn
This thread is like asking a bunch of bonobos how a 767 works.

Ask us again in one million years and we might have an answer.

Bill Hicks is the man

He most certainly is. Carlin is funnier but Hicks is a prophet.

Can we start throwing feces yet?

What do you mean you want to throw feces yet?

Originally posted by WeAreAWAKE
Personally, I believe that if there are "aliens" and "UFOs" that they are dimensional and not simply from another galaxy. I try to take the position of...what single answer explains "everything". "Everything" being aliens, ancient civilizations, 2012, the Bible, GOD, etc., etc. Again...not that I believe it...but the only thing that seems to answer "everything" is that these things would have to co-exist with us (or close to us or occasionally close to us) and appear "out of the blue". Therefore...dimensional. IMHO.

Personal belief is based on ?? Nothing really

You are totally brainwashed with all the crap society has been feeding you.

Dimensional is theoretical. Not a shred of evidence.