The Messiah destroys the Edomites and Moabites in his return.

Originally posted by jmdewey60

Originally posted by WarminIndy
So, what, according to you is left unfulfilled?

The return of Jesus Christ.

Originally posted by WarminIndy

Originally posted by jmdewey60

Originally posted by WarminIndy
So, what, according to you is left unfulfilled?

The return of Jesus Christ.

He did.
Jesus died.
Jesus was placed in a tomb.
Jesus rose from the dead and was seen by Mary, who he told that he had not yet gone to his father.
He also appeared to others in Jerusalem with the same sort of story.
Subsequently he did go and then returned to appear to his disciples in Galilee.
He made it known to them that he had gone to the Father and had returned with the promise of the spirit which he had told them he would get to give them.
Then Jesus gave them this power and authority as delegated to them, from God, by Jesus.

Originally posted by jmdewey60

Originally posted by WarminIndy

Originally posted by jmdewey60

Originally posted by WarminIndy
So, what, according to you is left unfulfilled?

The return of Jesus Christ.

He did.
Jesus died.
Jesus was placed in a tomb.
Jesus rose from the dead and was seen by Mary, who he told that he had not yet gone to his father.
He also appeared to others in Jerusalem with the same sort of story.
Subsequently he did go and then returned to appear to his disciples in Galilee.
He made it known to them that he had gone to the Father and had returned with the promise of the spirit which he had told them he would get to give them.
Then Jesus gave them this power and authority as delegated to them, from God, by Jesus.

Acts1:9And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. 10And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; 11Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. 12Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.

Did this same Jesus come back in like manner?

reply to post by WarminIndy

Did this same Jesus come back in like manner?

Here is that verse with my punctuation added for clarity, which is a straight, word-for-word-translation from the Greek:

Ye men of Galilee, who you have stood looking up to (going into heaven), this very Jesus, who was taken up into heaven, away from you, into heaven, in this way, will go (in that manner that you saw him go) into heaven.

The word normally translated in this verse to say, come, can mean, come, or, go, depending on the context.
What these "men in white" are telling them is that in the way they saw Jesus going into the sky, that heaven, in the same way you saw him going away from you, he is going to the other heaven.
This same mode of transportation you witnessed taking him up in the sky, that will keep on pushing him along until there is no higher heaven to go to.

Originally posted by jmdewey60reply to post by BO XIAN

 

Damascus was conquered by the Assyrians and later the Babylonians, then the Greeks and then it was battled over by the warring Greek factions up until the Romans took it, so there were plenty of opportunities to have wreckage and ruin in that city.

---

Isaiah 17:1

KJV:
An oracle concerning Damascus:

“See, Damascus will no longer be a city
but will become a heap of ruins.

New International Version (©1984)
An oracle concerning Damascus: "See, Damascus will no longer be a city but will become a heap of ruins.

New Living Translation (©2007)
This message came to me concerning Damascus: "Look, the city of Damascus will disappear! It will become a heap of ruins.

English Standard Version (©2001)
An oracle concerning Damascus. Behold, Damascus will cease to be a city and will become a heap of ruins.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
The oracle concerning Damascus. "Behold, Damascus is about to be removed from being a city And will become a fallen ruin.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
The burden of Damascus. Behold, Damascus is taken away from being a city, and it shall be a ruinous heap.

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
This is the divine revelation about Damascus. "Damascus will no longer be a city. It will become a pile of rubble.

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
The burden concerning Damascus. Behold, Damascus is taken away from being a city, and it shall be a ruinous heap.

American King James Version
The burden of Damascus. Behold, Damascus is taken away from being a city, and it shall be a ruinous heap.

American Standard Version
The burden of Damascus. Behold, Damascus is taken away from being a city, and it shall be a ruinous heap.

Douay-Rheims Bible
THE burden of Damascus. Behold Damascus shall cease to be a city, and shall be as a ruinous heap of stones.

Darby Bible Translation
The burden of Damascus. Behold, Damascus is taken away from being a city, and it shall be a ruinous heap.

English Revised Version
The burden of Damascus. Behold, Damascus is taken away from being a city, and it shall be a ruinous heap.

Webster's Bible Translation
The burden of Damascus. Behold, Damascus is taken away from being a city, and it shall be a ruinous heap.

World English Bible
The burden of Damascus: "Behold, Damascus is taken away from being a city, and it will be a ruinous heap.

Young's Literal Translation
The burden of Damascus. Lo, Damascus is taken away from being a city, And it hath been a heap -- a ruin.

You seem to be resisting the clear indication that Damascus CEASES to be a city at all. Has NOT happened,

YET.

saiah 25:2 You have made the city a heap of rubble, the fortified town a ruin, the foreigners' stronghold a city no more; it will never be rebuilt.

www.fivedoves.com...

To Ahmadinejad's way of thinking, if somebody has to be martyred to the Mahdi's cause, why not Syria? Twenty-five hundred odd years ago, the Hebrew prophet Isaiah prophesied of the destruction of Damascus. This prophecy is made more fascinating by the fact it remains unfulfilled in history.

Damascus is the oldest continually inhabited city on earth. Although conquered many times, its status as an economic and cultural center of antiquity preserved it intact to this day.

But Isaiah predicted Damascus would one day face utter destruction: "Behold, Damascus is about to be removed from being a city and it will become a fallen ruin," he writes in Isaiah 17:1.

The prophet also predicts Damascus' destruction will come at a time when "the glory of Jacob" had begun to fade (verse 4), at a time when Israel is in great peril of being "shaken like an olive tree," leaving only a few "on the topmost bough."

Isaiah prophesies that, when Damascus' destruction comes, there will be "an uproar of many peoples" and "the rumbling of nations" but that they will flee at God's rebuke.

It seems clear from recent events that Syria is preparing chemical and biological weapons, and possibly some form of nuclear weapon for use in some future war against Israel. Syria and Iran have been outfitting Hezbollah with the latest in offensive weaponry since the war of June 2006.

Israel is unlikely to sit back and wait for a first-use chemical or gas attack from Damascus. Neither is it likely to wait until Ahmadinejad can use Syria to flank them in the event of conflict with Iran.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by BO XIAN

 

Deut 13:16:

New International Version (©1984)
Gather all the plunder of the town into the middle of the public square and completely burn the town and all its plunder as a whole burnt offering to the LORD your God. It is to remain a ruin forever, never to be rebuilt.

New Living Translation (©2007)
Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the open square and burn it. Burn the entire town as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt.

English Standard Version (©2001)
You shall gather all its spoil into the midst of its open square and burn the city and all its spoil with fire, as a whole burnt offering to the LORD your God. It shall be a heap forever. It shall not be built again.

Isaiah 60:12:

New International Version (©1984)
For the nation or kingdom that will not serve you will perish; it will be utterly ruined.

New Living Translation (©2007)
For the nations that refuse to serve you will be destroyed.

English Standard Version (©2001)
For the nation and kingdom that will not serve you shall perish; those nations shall be utterly laid waste.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
"For the nation and the kingdom which will not serve you will perish, And the nations will be utterly ruined.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
For the nation and kingdom that will not serve thee shall perish; yea, those nations shall be utterly wasted.

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
Nations and kingdoms that do not serve you will be destroyed. The nations will certainly be ruined.

King James 2000 Bible (©2003)
For the nation and kingdom that will not serve you shall perish; yea, those nations shall be utterly wasted.

Genesis 27:29 May nations serve you and peoples bow down to you. Be lord over your brothers, and may the sons of your mother bow down to you. May those who curse you be cursed and those who bless you be blessed."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Isaiah 14:2 Nations will take them and bring them to their own place. And the house of Israel will possess the nations as menservants and maidservants in the LORD's land. They will make captives of their captors and rule over their oppressors.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jeremiah 12:17 But if any nation does not listen, I will completely uproot and destroy it," declares the LORD.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Daniel 2:44 "In the time of those kings, the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed, nor will it be left to another people. It will crush all those kingdoms and bring them to an end, but it will itself endure forever.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Daniel 7:18 But the saints of the Most High will receive the kingdom and will possess it forever--yes, for ever and ever.'
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Daniel 7:27 Then the sovereignty, power and greatness of the kingdoms under the whole heaven will be handed over to the saints, the people of the Most High. His kingdom will be an everlasting kingdom, and all rulers will worship and obey him.'
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Zechariah 14:17 If any of the peoples of the earth do not go up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD Almighty, they will have no rain.

* * * * * * * * *

Preterists, REPLACEMENTARIANS et al who cast such events in the past seem to have a very very funny

DICTIONARY as well as a very funny history and a very UNBiblical eschatology.

reply to post by BO XIAN


very well... how about this one about Israel being wiped out


Son of man, the house of Israel is to me become dross: all they are brass, and tin, and iron, and lead, in the midst of the furnace; they are even the dross of silver. As they gather silver, and brass, and iron, and lead, and tin, into the midst of the furnace, to blow the fire upon it, to melt it; so will I gather you in mine anger and in my fury, and I will leave you there, and melt you. Yea, I will gather you, and blow upon you in the fire of my wrath, and ye shall be melted in the midst therof. As silver is melted in the midst of the furnace, so shall ye be melted in the midst thereof; and ye shall know that I the LORD have poured out my fury upon you.
- Ezekiel 22:19-22

reply to post by BO XIAN
Posting multiple translations doesn't really add weight to it, and do you actually think that I would only read one version of a verse, to start with, which seems to be your assumption you are working off of, that I somehow just missed the import of a specific word.
And what is this other thing in this post? An excerpt from a blog? Is this person you are quoting, God, where he can read the mind of a president of a foreign country, one he has never met?
And so you really think Iran is the one who will destroy Syria? That is really weird to me, meaning it makes no sense and makes me wonder about your grasp on reality and why it is you fall under the spell of religious zealots. How is it that your version of religious fanaticism is somehow ok, while someone else's fanaticism is evil and needs to be wiped out?

You seem to be resisting the clear indication that Damascus CEASES to be a city at all. Has NOT happened, YET.

You did not answer my earlier question of what you thought about what the meaning of this statement is. Let's say for sake of argument, that God or someone comes in person to earth and makes the world into a garden of Eden. Now in this new Edenic world, there is a big fence around the whole Damascus area with signs reading, "Keep Out ! Prophetically Eternally Accursed Area!!" ?
Again, if your answer is, no, then you are forced to conclude this prophecy is not to be taken literally.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

Did this same Jesus come back in like manner?

Here is that verse with my punctuation added for clarity, which is a straight, word-for-word-translation from the Greek:

Ye men of Galilee, who you have stood looking up to (going into heaven), this very Jesus, who was taken up into heaven, away from you, into heaven, in this way, will go (in that manner that you saw him go) into heaven.

The word normally translated in this verse to say, come, can mean, come, or, go, depending on the context.
What these "men in white" are telling them is that in the way they saw Jesus going into the sky, that heaven, in the same way you saw him going away from you, he is going to the other heaven.
This same mode of transportation you witnessed taking him up in the sky, that will keep on pushing him along until there is no higher heaven to go to.

Why would you add punctuation that did not exist in the verse? So what you are telling us is that by your definition, and your definition alone, that you believe Jesus merely went to some allegorical, metaphysical plane, and that Jesus just dissipated somewhere?

Really, is that what you are telling us? I need to have so clarification here because apparently I have been wrong all these years because I never had your own personal definition. What you are telling me is that Jesus went in some mode of transportation that merely kept pushing him into some higher plane of existence? Are you telling me that you are defining this in metaphysical terms?

So by your definition, all the scriptures are mere metaphysical ideas and there is no literal meaning to any of the Bible? So what if I told you that Jesus never existed, nothing in the Bible existed and therefore faith is nothing more than a gnostic concept? Is that really what you are saying, because it sounds like you are.

Jesus went away literally and is coming back literally. That is something you will have to grasp to understand if you wish to call yourself a believer in Jesus Christ. I can take any concept of any religion or secular idea and turn it into metaphysical definition, and convince myself that I now understand it all according to my own addition of punctuation marks. What would make me right? How can I verify that what I know is correct?

I will say this to you, and no offense, but what you are proposing is a pagan view of Jesus and now can insert any name in place of Jesus. You can insert Heimdallr in the place of Jesus and still be correct in your own view. You can insert Vishnu in place of Jesus and still be correct in your view. Why did you not just tell us in the first place that you were not only a Preterist, but that you were also a pagan? That would have ended a lot of confusion.

You have just told every pagan out there to insert name of deity they choose, and they would be correct. By your own added punctuation to change the meaning, you are the same as Mohammed and every pagan out there because you change the meaning to suit your own interpretation while disregarding the literal truth of the scripture. OK, so you are a pagan, why didn't you just tell us that in the first place?

BTW, there are pagans on here that have been more theologically and intellectually honest. At least they don't misrepresent what they believe. They might not believe in Jesus as literal, but none of them have changed any punctuation of the Bible to suit their viewpoints. They should be commended for their honesty.

reply to post by BO XIAN

Preterists, REPLACEMENTARIANS et al who cast such events in the past seem to have a very very funny

DICTIONARY as well as a very funny history and a very UNBiblical eschatology.

It's called Christianity, that Jesus is the fulfillment of the Old Testament.

It is your cult, dispensationalists, who are the aberration and create disparaging names for people who believe in Christianity as it stood for so many centuries from the time of the Apostles, while you elevate people who are outright frauds as prophets that remove Christ and substitute your counterfeit version, denying the sovereignty of the Lord, in favor of another future Messiah. Jesus is king over the Earth and until you accept that, you are of ant-christ, those who refuse to believe the Messiah has come in the flesh, meaning the historical Jesus, and not your fantasy messiah you are still waiting for.
My advice for you is to take the next step and just get it over with and convert to Judaism since you have already discarded the real substance of Christianity.

reply to post by WarminIndy

Why would you add punctuation that did not exist in the verse?

If you compare the Greek version with the translation, meaning the ordinary printed Bible versions commercially available at your local book store, you notice they do not translate the verse word for word and leave a bunch of words out in order to make it seem like it says something that in my opinion it does not. There was no punctuation in the original writings, as it came from the pens of the New Testament writers. I believe with this punctuation as added by me you can read the verse with all the words included, to where it makes sense.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

Why would you add punctuation that did not exist in the verse?

If you compare the Greek version with the translation, meaning the ordinary printed Bible versions commercially available at your local book store, you notice they do not translate the verse word for word and leave a bunch of words out in order to make it seem like it says something that in my opinion it does not. There was no punctuation in the original writings, as it came from the pens of the New Testament writers. I believe with this punctuation as added by me you can read the verse with all the words included, to where it makes sense.

You added the punctuation to define the meaning for your own viewpoint. It only makes sense to you and so you must go through the entire Bible to change every verse to fit your viewpoint.

Because you changed the punctuation to make a different meaning, I will ask this, what gives you the authority to do so? And can you not see that by your changing of it, you are creating a new religion and one that is based solely on your interpretation?

So when are you going to print your own version of the Bible? Are you going to call it the Authorized Dewey Version? Then in several hundred years, when people read it and compare it to other Bibles, they will say "wait a minute, why is this punctuation here?" and argue about the meanings. We can't do that because we have no authorization to change one jot or one tittle or leave out one verse or change any verse of the Bible.

Before changing it though, maybe you should ask within yourself if what you are reading is what it really means, and not interjecting your viewpoints into it.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by BO XIAN

 

Preterists, REPLACEMENTARIANS et al who cast such events in the past seem to have a very very funny

DICTIONARY as well as a very funny history and a very UNBiblical eschatology.

It's called Christianity, that Jesus is the fulfillment of the Old Testament.

It is your cult, dispensationalists, who are the aberration and create disparaging names for people who believe in Christianity as it stood for so many centuries from the time of the Apostles, while you elevate people who are outright frauds as prophets that remove Christ and substitute your counterfeit version, denying the sovereignty of the Lord, in favor of another future Messiah. Jesus is king over the Earth and until you accept that, you are of ant-christ, those who refuse to believe the Messiah has come in the flesh, meaning the historical Jesus, and not your fantasy messiah you are still waiting for.
My advice for you is to take the next step and just get it over with and convert to Judaism since you have already discarded the real substance of Christianity.

edit on 16-1-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

You are the one who added a punctuation mark to change a meaning of a verse so it fits your view. Isn't that a little dishonest?

reply to post by sk0rpi0n

very well... how about this one about Israel being wiped out

That verse talks about

ISRAEL BEING !REFINED!

NOT obliterated.

God declares that as long as there are sun, moon and stars, His EVERLASTING PROMISES to the children of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob will endure and be operative.

Certainly satan and the fallen angels and the globalist oligarchy will TRY HARD to obliterate them in the coming Tribulation period.

They will fail.

The evil doers will be the ones obliterated.

There's some evidence that even all evidence of the evil doer's EVER HAVING EXISTED will also be erased off the planet.

Their existence will be as a fog in Phoenix at noon in July.

reply to post by jmdewey60

It's called Christianity, that Jesus is the fulfillment of the Old Testament.

Anyone who claims that God's EVERLASTING PROMISES to the children of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob are now canceled

is dangerously close to, if not over the line of blaspheming against God Almighty by claiming He lied.

That implies that Christ's promises may not be reliable to His Church--also a blasphemous thing to imply, on the part of the Replacementarians.

BTW, claiming that God replaced the children of Israel with the Christian Church is horrifically disparaging to God Almighty and His Everlasting Promises to the children of Jacob.

Of course Jesus fulfilled the Old Testament. That says NOTHING about trashing God's promises to the children of Jacob.

It is your cult,

Who's disparaging?

dispensationalists, who are the aberration

Ahhhhh more disparaging.

and create disparaging names for people who believe in Christianity as it stood for so many centuries from the time of the Apostles,

NOT AT ALL.

What else would you call a group or an idiology that purports to REPLACE the children of Jacob--CONTRARY TO SCRIPTURE . . . e.g. Romans 11 and Hebrews . . . with the Church of Christ? The idiology chose the label.

while you elevate people who are outright frauds as prophets that remove Christ and substitute your counterfeit version, denying the sovereignty of the Lord, in favor of another future Messiah.

That sound like a lot of Untrue, UnBiblical, irrational blather, to me.

Jesus the Christ who came in the flesh; died on the cross for the sins of mankind; and rose from the dead Is the Messiah from before the foundation of the world. He reigned, reigns and will reign in Triumph and all Glory. NOTHING can alter that.

Jesus is king over the Earth and until you accept that,

Uhhhhhhh hello?

Trying to put your words in my fingers?

CLASSIC FAIL.

All authentic Christians Praise Jesus as King Kings and Lord of Lords over ALL CREATION, ALL MULTIVERSES . . . not just planet earth. Pretending otherwise is a CLASSIC FAIL.

Of course, after the Great Tribulation, He will reign from the New Jerusalem in a more OBVIOUSLY OVERT manner, manifestation, PRESENCE.

However, He reigns at God's right hand, NOW.

you are of ant-christ,

Talk about maximally disparaging. However, it's USUALLY not my style to whine about such absurd insults and allegations.

those who refuse to believe the Messiah has come in the flesh, meaning the historical Jesus, and not your fantasy messiah you are still waiting for.

Trying to INACCURATELY, put your UNTRUE-FOR-ME words into my fingers AGAIN, I see.

CLASSIC FAIL.

My advice for you is to take the next step and just get it over with and convert to Judaism since you have already discarded the real substance of Christianity.

More false allegations.

The Dispensational perspective has been traced all the way back to the New Testament era.

Denial of facts doesn't change the facts.

Fondling and flaunting ignorance doesn't spread THE TRUTHS OF SCRIPTURE.
.
.

reply to post by WarminIndy

You added the punctuation to define the meaning for your own viewpoint.

So you are God, now, to where you can read my mind?
You are making this up to suite your own belief.
I did not already think of it that way. There was a thread called, "Jesus is never returning in the flesh" and when I saw the arguments, one was that verse in Acts, and when I looked at the Greek version I saw this problem where they changed the word order and left some out and It seemed the Bible translators had rigged it to mean something which they already believed. I was just showing how it could be understood in its original word order and all its original words.

reply to post by jmdewey60


God will thrash Moab and Edom because of His priority for the seed of Jacob and because Moab and Edom did not respect them but were merciless toward them.

It seems to me that Replacementarians* taking a similar stance toward the children of Jacob are begging for a harsh response from God Almighty as well . . . particularly when they imply that God Almighty lied about HIS EVERLASTING PROMISES to Abraham and Abraham's seed through Jacob.

*[I'm willing to CONSIDER using a different label. It would need to be AS ACCURATE and DESCRIPTIVE as "Replacementarians," however.]

My advice for you is to take the next step and just get it over with and convert to Judaism since you have already discarded the real substance of Christianity.

It is a counterfeit pseudo-'Christianity' that pretends to REPLACE the children of Jacob with the Christian Church in God's eyes. There's not a shred of Scripture to support that.

It is the Gentile Church that is GRAFTED INTO the SEED OF ABRAHAM, ISAAC AND JACOB as Paul makes clear in Romans and Hebrews.

He exhorts fairly sternly against being haughty and looking down on the seed of Jacob.

There's only umpteen verses affirming God's promises to the children of Jacob and not a single one saying GOD CANCELED HIS EVERLASTING PROMISES to the seed of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

For example:

Genesis:

17:4 “As for me, 11 this 12 is my covenant with you: You will be the father of a multitude of nations. 17:5 No longer will your name be 13 Abram. Instead, your name will be Abraham 14 because I will make you 15 the father of a multitude of nations. 17:6 I will make you 16 extremely 17 fruitful. I will make nations of you, and kings will descend from you. 18 17:7 I will confirm 19 my covenant as a perpetual 20 covenant between me and you. It will extend to your descendants after you throughout their generations. I will be your God and the God of your descendants after you. 21 17:8 I will give the whole land of Canaan – the land where you are now residing 22 – to you and your descendants after you as a permanent 23 possession. I will be their God.”

Jeremiah 31:

31:3 In a far-off land the Lord will manifest himself to them.
He will say to them, ‘I have loved you with an everlasting love.
That is why I have continued to be faithful to you. 4
31:4 I will rebuild you, my dear children Israel, 5
so that you will once again be built up.
. . .

31:6 Yes, a time is coming
[has NOT HAPPENED fully, yet]
when watchmen 9 will call out on the mountains of Ephraim,
“Come! Let us go to Zion
to worship the Lord our God!”’”
10
31:7 Moreover, 11 the Lord says,
“Sing for joy for the descendants of Jacob.
Utter glad shouts for that foremost of the nations. 12
Make your praises heard. 13
Then say, ‘Lord, rescue your people.
Deliver those of Israel who remain alive.’ 14
31:8 Then I will reply, 15 ‘I will bring them back from the land of the north.
I will gather them in from the distant parts of the earth.
. . .
A vast throng of people will come back here.
31:9 They will come back shedding tears of contrition.
I will bring them back praying prayers of repentance. 16
I will lead them besides streams of water,
along smooth paths where they will never stumble. 17
I will do this because I am Israel’s father;
Ephraim 18 is my firstborn son.’”

31:10 Hear what the Lord has to say, O nations.
Proclaim it in the faraway lands along the sea.
Say, “The one who scattered Israel will regather them.
He will watch over his people like a shepherd watches over his flock.”
31:11 For the Lord will rescue the descendants of Jacob.
He will secure their release 19 from those who had overpowered them. 20

God's Word is TRUE. Obviously, from the Scriptures above, Almighty God is NOT a Replacementarian.

And Moab and Edom are foolish to tryst with God against Israel.

reply to post by jmdewey60


Jeremiah:

31:18 I have indeed 33 heard the people of Israel 34 say mournfully,
‘We were like a calf untrained to the yoke. 35
You disciplined us and we learned from it. 36
Let us come back to you and we will do so, 37
for you are the Lord our God.

31:19 For after we turned away from you we repented.
After we came to our senses 38 we beat our breasts in sorrow. 39
We are ashamed and humiliated
because of the disgraceful things we did previously.’

40
31:20 Indeed, the people of Israel are my dear children.
They are the children I take delight in. 41
For even though I must often rebuke them,
I still remember them with fondness.

31:23 The Lord God of Israel who rules over all 52 says,
“I will restore the people of Judah to their land and to their towns.
When I do, they will again say 53 of Jerusalem, 54
‘May the Lord bless you, you holy mountain,
the place where righteousness dwells.’ 55

Israel and Judah Will Be Repopulated
31:27 “Indeed, a time is coming,” 59 says the Lord, 60 “when I will cause people and animals to sprout up in the lands of Israel and Judah. 61 31:28 In the past I saw to it that they were uprooted and torn down, that they were destroyed and demolished. But now I will see to it that they are built up and firmly planted. 62 I, the Lord, affirm it!” 63

31:31 “Indeed, a time is coming,” says the Lord, 66 “when I will make a new covenant 67 with the people of Israel and Judah. 68 31:32 It will not be like the old 69 covenant that I made with their ancestors 70 when I delivered them 71 from Egypt. For they violated that covenant, even though I was like a faithful husband to them,” 72 says the Lord. 73 31:33 “But I will make a new covenant with the whole nation of Israel 74 after I plant them back in the land,” 75 says the Lord. 76 “I will 77 put my law within them 78 and write it on their hearts and minds. 79 I will be their God and they will be my people. 80

Of course, the New Covenant also will be with their True Messiah, The Lord Jesus. However, as Revelation makes clear, they will be deceived into accepting the Anti-Christ as their Messiah for 3.5 years.

WHEN the Anti-Christ sets his image up in the 3rd Temple to be worshiped AS GOD, they will realize they bet on the wrong horse and flee for the hills as they are slaughtered by the thousands.

Nevertheless, Scripture is clear that they WILL "look on Him whom they have pierced" and accept Him as their True Messiah.

That has not happened yet. It IS SCHEDULED according to THE LORD'S SCHEDULE, not man's.

Jeremiah:

31:35 The Lord has made a promise to Israel.
He promises it as the one who fixed the sun to give light by day
and the moon and stars to give light by night.
He promises it as the one who stirs up the sea so that its waves roll.
He promises it as the one who is known as the Lord who rules over all. 84
31:36 The Lord affirms, 85 “The descendants of Israel will not
cease forever to be a nation in my sight.
That could only happen if the fixed ordering of the heavenly lights
were to cease to operate before me.” 86

Moab and Edom will have to contend with ALMIGHTY GOD's fierce protective eternal attitude toward the children of Jacob.

As will Replacementarians.
.
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reply to post by WarminIndy

So what you are telling us is that by your definition, and your definition alone, that you believe Jesus merely went to some allegorical, metaphysical plane, and that Jesus just dissipated somewhere?

I don't know where you got that from. The passage says he was taken up by a cloud and then they saw the cloud get further and further away, so that shows what the means of transportation was that the men in white were referring to.
There is only this one verse that can be used by some people to indicate a return of Jesus (in this chapter). My point is that if you use the alternative use of the word, to mean, to go, instead of, to come, then you can translate the entire verse, meaning using all the words and not just dropping the ones that do't fit.
It is the context which determines whether the word means come, or go, so it looks like you have to change the context to mean come, while if it means go, the original context matches.

. . . you are proposing is a pagan view of Jesus . . .

You are just making this all up. If you had actually read the verses, you would see that it says Jesus was taken up in a cloud. I did not think I had to go over that and hold your hand through it, sorry I mistook your level of competence to follow along.

reply to post by jmdewey60


That rationalization comes across as a major 'grope grope' for any silly assertion but The Truth.

The Preterist, Replacementarian et al perspective

IS COMPELLED to mangle and contort Scriptures up one side and down the other

INSTEAD of taking God at His Word as

meaning what He said and saying what He meant.

Dispensationalists, however,

trust

that when The Lord insures by the angels that the Disciples and through them His Church knows that

HE WILL RETURN in LIKE MANNER to His departure.

Of course, folks hostile to The Bible and to God's ways have been rationalizing away literal interpretations of Scripture for many centuries.

Trouble is,

The literal interpretations of The Bible have been

CONFIRMED RELENTLESSLY for a longer period.

At the turn of the 1800's to 1900 . . . it was vogue to insist that this or that mention in the Bible of some village or leader or whatever had to be metaphoric or symbolic or fantasy or whatever OTHER THAN literal.

Trouble is, in every case, archeology relentlessly later PROVED THAT THE LITERAL INTERPRETATION OF THE BIBLE WAS ACCURATE TO THE LETTER.

God will continue to confirm His Word in this END TIMES ERA . . .

as we have seen Israel return to the Holy Land and become a Nation again in a day precisely as predicted in Scripture. Now, the rest of the END TIMES SCRIPTURES are continuing to unfold precisley literally.

As Scripture says . . .

folks will either be broken ON THE SCRIPTURE

or

crushed under the Scripture, the Rock Christ Jesus, the Living Word.