The Messiah destroys the Edomites and Moabites in his return.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by BO XIAN

 

very well... how about this one about Israel being wiped out


Son of man, the house of Israel is to me become dross: all they are brass, and tin, and iron, and lead, in the midst of the furnace; they are even the dross of silver. As they gather silver, and brass, and iron, and lead, and tin, into the midst of the furnace, to blow the fire upon it, to melt it; so will I gather you in mine anger and in my fury, and I will leave you there, and melt you. Yea, I will gather you, and blow upon you in the fire of my wrath, and ye shall be melted in the midst therof. As silver is melted in the midst of the furnace, so shall ye be melted in the midst thereof; and ye shall know that I the LORD have poured out my fury upon you.
- Ezekiel 22:19-22

That happened when Rome destroyed Jerusalem and the temple burned in 70 A.D. and what jews hadn't been killed were taken into captivity to europe. The nation of Israel melted away from all history except in the memories of the jews and christians who escaped and told the story to their decendents. Israel, was destroyed and renamed Syriac Palestina by Hadrian Caesar afte rhe plowed under the temple mount in 135. A.D. When this happened the Israelites knew that had made God mad and that he turned his back on them.

reply to post by BO XIAN

Anyone who claims that God's EVERLASTING PROMISES to the children of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob are now canceled is dangerously close to, if not over the line of blaspheming against God Almighty by claiming He lied.
That implies that Christ's promises may not be reliable to His Church--also a blasphemous thing to imply, on the part of the Replacementarians.

No, it is just recognizing truths in the Bible that most people conveniently ignore.
The Old Covenant was ended by God at the request of the Israelites when they demanded to have God through Samuel appoint for them a king. God relented and made a replacement covenant to where if the kings acted properly and the people lived accordingly, they would prosper, but if the opposite turned out to be the case, then they would all be swept away. From that point on it became a renewable contract where God could opt out at any time.
The promises of Jesus are sure because he is the guarantor, meaning he is the king and he does do good and it is only up to us to follow his commands.

reply to post by BO XIAN

BTW, claiming that God replaced the children of Israel with the Christian Church is horrifically disparaging to God Almighty and His Everlasting Promises to the children of Jacob.

This is the fundamental premise of Christianity that the church is the new Israel.
If you think not, you have no business claiming to be Christian, and why on earth would you want to, seeing how Christianity has no status in your opinion.

Of course Jesus fulfilled the Old Testament. That says NOTHING about trashing God's promises to the children of Jacob.

This statement contradicts everything else you have said up to this point.

The idiology chose the label.

I had never heard this term in my life until I came on this forum and ran into dispensationalists saying I was promoting replacement theory. Up to that point I had no reason to believe it was anything but normal Christianity. To me you all are completely insane as far as your religion goes and maybe as individuals too, by the evidence I see on this forum.

. . . e.g. Romans 11 and Hebrews . . .

Maybe you should read that yourself. To me what this says is that the church takes the place of the status quo so that salvation can go out to the greater world, so that "Israel" encompasses enough of it to where every former member of the Israel of old (who my be detached himself from his roots) can be saved within the re-formed and re-constituted Israel.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

So what you are telling us is that by your definition, and your definition alone, that you believe Jesus merely went to some allegorical, metaphysical plane, and that Jesus just dissipated somewhere?

I don't know where you got that from. The passage says he was taken up by a cloud and then they saw the cloud get further and further away, so that shows what the means of transportation was that the men in white were referring to.
There is only this one verse that can be used by some people to indicate a return of Jesus (in this chapter). My point is that if you use the alternative use of the word, to mean, to go, instead of, to come, then you can translate the entire verse, meaning using all the words and not just dropping the ones that do't fit.
It is the context which determines whether the word means come, or go, so it looks like you have to change the context to mean come, while if it means go, the original context matches.

. . . you are proposing is a pagan view of Jesus . . .

You are just making this all up. If you had actually read the verses, you would see that it says Jesus was taken up in a cloud. I did not think I had to go over that and hold your hand through it, sorry I mistook your level of competence to follow along.

edit on 16-1-2012 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

Jim Dewey, please remember your posts. I did not make that up, you did. So now, I will go back through every post you ever made and show your your own progression into falsehood. When YOU inserted the punctuation, YOU changed the meaning to fit YOUR viewpoint and YOU admitted it.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000


Perhaps it depends on what is meant by turning His back on them.

He certainly committed to disciplining them for rejecting Christ and for their foresaking Him and their idolatries.
.

Originally posted by Unvarnished
reply to post by lonewolf19792000

 

This is the problem with organized religion, it pretty much institutes so much hate and violence towards so many people that it is pathetic. So many people throughout history have mercilessly been killed because of clashing beliefs. I am not saying there is no God, but I cannot picture a being that pretty much causes so much hate and enmity between human beings. I do believe there is a Supreme Being, but it is sad how many people die everyday because of clashing faiths.

I was about to rip you a new one until I reread what you had written and saw the word "organized" religion. So, I'mma have to agree with you.

I was going to reply, "My religion doesn't teach hate at all."

Matthew 5:43-48

43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’
44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,
45 that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous.
46 If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that?
47 And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that?
48 Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.

Amen

Wolfie, I'm currently on video 13 of 15. I have a buttload of other Missler videos to watch as well. This guy is as credible as they come (background outside of theology) and he knows his Bible inside and out.

reply to post by BO XIAN

Of course, after the Great Tribulation, He will reign from the New Jerusalem in a more OBVIOUSLY OVERT manner, manifestation, PRESENCE.

However, He reigns at God's right hand, NOW.

How is it that Jesus could reign some other way, I mean you seem to imply that this is an inferior position, as if at some future time, Jesus will reign independently, where he is on training wheels now?
Are you saying Jesus is going to be on TV after some future point? Is that the overt part you are talking about, Jesus TV? So instead of just working through the spirit, Jesus can talk to us on cable and that is an improvement?
I think we are the New Jerusalem, the church, which is the bride and we are not waiting around for the bridegroom, and parables like that were talking about the people who did not have the sense of God to properly keep watch when he came, it is not about people waiting for him to show up now because we already know who he is and can already have a relationship with him.
I don't think there is an "after the tribulation", if by that you mean a future tribulation.
Revelation 7:14
Then he said to me, “These are the ones who have come out of the great tribulation.

This whole chapter seems detached from the rest of Revelation and it names the twelve tribes and numbers them, 144,000. These could be the ones killed in the Roman-Jewish wars, the number of people in Judea who believed in Jesus and were killed. I realize there is a myth that the Christians fled but that is not at all realistic and as far as I know has no evidence to support it as being factual.

reply to post by OldCorp


Thats what i noticed about Missler, he knows the word. I honestly didn't know about the prophecy in Isaiah 63 because i didn't think about it until i saw that video and went back and reread it for myself and then read Revelation for confirmation.

Here's an intersting site i dug up:

www.biblefortoday.org...

reply to post by jmdewey60

No, it is just recognizing truths in the Bible that most people conveniently ignore.

That's Unmitigated Nonsense.

Asserting that God canceled

HIS EVERLASTING PROMISES to the children of Jacob is the FURTHEST THING FROM

THE TRUTH.

Thankfully, most folks are likely to understand the relatively straight-foreward language below and see quite clearly and emphatically what God was saying:

Jeremiah 31:35-36

The Message (MSG)

If This Ordered Cosmos Ever Fell to Pieces

35God's Message, from the God who lights up the day with sun and
brightens the night with moon and stars,
Who whips the ocean into a billowy froth,
whose name is God-of-the-Angel-Armies:

36"If this ordered cosmos ever fell to pieces,
fell into chaos before me"—God's Decree—
"Then and only then might Israel fall apart
and disappear as a nation before me."

Jeremiah 31:35-36

Amplified Bible (AMP)

35Thus says the Lord, Who gives the sun for a light by day and the fixed order of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, Who stirs up the sea's roaring billows or stills the waves when they roar--the Lord of hosts is His name:

36If these ordinances [of fixed order] depart from before Me, says the Lord, then the posterity of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before Me throughout the ages.

Jeremiah 31:35-36

New International Version (©1984)
This is what the LORD says, he who appoints the sun to shine by day, who decrees the moon and stars to shine by night, who stirs up the sea so that its waves roar--the LORD Almighty is his name:

New International Version (©1984)
"Only if these decrees vanish from my sight," declares the LORD, "will the descendants of Israel ever cease to be a nation before me."

New Living Translation (©2007)
It is the LORD who provides the sun to light the day and the moon and stars to light the night, and who stirs the sea into roaring waves. His name is the LORD of Heaven's Armies, and this is what he says:

New Living Translation (©2007)
"I am as likely to reject my people Israel as I am to abolish the laws of nature!"

Of course . . . THE TRUTH, as usual, as Scripture says, is for those with eyes to see and ears to hear.

The Old Covenant was ended by God at the request of the Israelites when they demanded to have God through Samuel appoint for them a king.

PLEASE--SHOW US THE SCRIPTURE that comes even remotely close to clearly stating such a hideous heresy. And NOT from the Replacementarians mangled and contorted Bible either, please.

God relented and made a replacement covenant to where if the kings acted properly and the people lived accordingly, they would prosper, but if the opposite turned out to be the case, then they would all be swept away. From that point on it became a renewable contract where God could opt out at any time.

What an UNBiblical pile of farce!

There's not a single Scripture supporting such an off the wall assertion.

The promises of Jesus are sure because he is the guarantor, meaning he is the king and he does do good and it is only up to us to follow his commands.

Uhhhhhhhhhhhh . . . The EVERLASTING PROMISES OF THE FATHER ARE TRUE AND DEPENDABLE TO ISRAEL AND ALL CREATION

BECAUSE

GOD CANNOT LIE.

THE EVERLASTING PROMISES OF THE LORD JESUS, THE CHRIST, CREATOR GOD; KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS ARE TRUE AND DEPENDABLE

BECAUSE

GOD CANNOT LIE.

reply to post by jmdewey60


BX: BTW, claiming that God replaced the children of Israel with the Christian Church is horrifically disparaging to God Almighty and His Everlasting Promises to the children of Jacob.

This is the fundamental premise of Christianity that the church is the new Israel.

I'm UTTERLY incredulous at such an UNBiblical assertion claiming to be 'Christian.'

The fundamental premise of Christianity is that Salvation is by the Grace of God through the Blood of Jesus The Christ for those who choose to receive His said Salvation by faith in Him.

If you think not, you have no business claiming to be Christian, and why on earth would you want to, seeing how Christianity has no status in your opinion.

Yet again putting UTTERLY INACCURATE; UTTERLY FALSE; UTTERLY UNTRUE; UTTER NONSENSICAL assertions in my fingers. Fascinating.

BX: Of course Jesus fulfilled the Old Testament. That says NOTHING about trashing God's promises to the children of Jacob.

This statement contradicts everything else you have said up to this point.

Uhhhhhhhh NO! NOT AT ALL! Sheesh.
I wasn't aware English could be so challenging on such issues.

HINT:

Fulfilling the Old Testament in terms of Salvation through THE MESSIAH vs through slaughtered sheep is wholesale DIFFERENT than claiming rather blasphemously that

GOD'S EVERLASTING PROMISES ARE NOT DEPENDABLE..

BX: The idiology chose the label.

I had never heard this term in my life until I came on this forum and ran into dispensationalists saying I was promoting replacement theory.

Uhhhhhhhh I don't recall saying anywhere that I was responsible for how well read you are or aren't.

Up to that point I had no reason to believe it was anything but normal Christianity.

Welllllll, at least you sort of got the part right about it

BEING "anything but normal Christianity."

Replacementarian theology is from the pit. The very idea that ALMIGHTY GOD'S EVERLASTING PROMISES TO ISRAEL COULD POSSIBLY BE CANCELED BY ANYONE OR ANYTHING

IT WELL BEYOND ABSURDLY PREPOSTEROUS as well as GROSSLY UNBIBLICAL.

To me you all are completely insane as far as your religion goes and maybe as individuals too, by the evidence I see on this forum.

Why THANK YOU for such an uncivil and grossly insulting assertion. I appreciate the addition to my Heavenly account.

BX: . . . e.g. Romans 11 and Hebrews . . .

Maybe you should read that yourself. To me what this says is that the church takes the place of the status quo so that salvation can go out to the greater world, so that "Israel" encompasses enough of it to where every former member of the Israel of old (who my be detached himself from his roots) can be saved within the re-formed and re-constituted Israel.

What a mangled pile of UNBIBLICAL pseudo-theology. There's not a single verse in all of the Bible that says anything of the kind.

And there's dozens of verses that say the opposite.

reply to post by BO XIAN

The Dispensational perspective has been traced all the way back to the New Testament era.

I'm having a problem finding any documentation on this.
Would you please be so kind as to provide some sort of evidence to show that this is a true statement by you that I just quoted?

reply to post by BO XIAN

God will thrash Moab and Edom because of His priority for the seed of Jacob and because Moab and Edom did not respect them but were merciless toward them.

It seems to me that Replacementarians* taking a similar stance toward the children of Jacob are begging for a harsh response from God Almighty as well . . . particularly when they imply that God Almighty lied about HIS EVERLASTING PROMISES to Abraham and Abraham's seed through Jacob.

*[I'm willing to CONSIDER using a different label. It would need to be AS ACCURATE and DESCRIPTIVE as "Replacementarians," however.]

Don't worry about offending me with labels, if that is what you think describes me then you should use it.
I think anyone who practices bigotry to the point of committing genocide are going to be subject to the judgment of God but I don't see these old myths having any relevance in today's world and should be left in the dust bin of history unless it is looked at as a relic of the ignorance people lived in ages gone past.
That old "god" as you call him is gone, along with the old Israel and we have a new YHWH, a new I Am, the new Name of God, Jesus. When the curtain was torn in the temple that marked the end of the era of that old desert spirit that Moses met at Sinai.

reply to post by jmdewey60

Posting multiple translations doesn't really add weight to it,

I can certainly see the obvious--that it has no influence on some folks toward increasing their understanding of the true facts of Scripture.

and do you actually think that I would only read one version of a verse, to start with, which seems to be your assumption you are working off of, that I somehow just missed the import of a specific word.

No. I don't think I'd put it that way. It appears that you missed great HUGE CHUNKS of BASIC SCRIPTURE--far more than a few specific words here and there.

And what is this other thing in this post? An excerpt from a blog? Is this person you are quoting, God, where he can read the mind of a president of a foreign country, one he has never met?

I have no earthly idea what you are talking about.

And so you really think Iran is the one who will destroy Syria?

Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhh where on earth did you fantasize that from my words?

That is really weird to me, meaning it makes no sense and makes me wonder about your grasp on reality

THANKS THANKS! I appreciate that you are questioning my sanity again. Such insults strike me as a gift.

and why it is you fall under the spell of religious zealots.

I have no idea what alternate reality on what planet or in what dimension you may be blathering about there.

How is it that your version of religious fanaticism is somehow ok, while someone else's fanaticism is evil and needs to be wiped out?

I'm puzzled that anyone would need to call basic, fairly obvious and straight-foreward Biblical understanding is now labeled "religious fanaticism."

And, I don't know what you are referring to about "someone else's fanaticism."

If you think that fanatical Muslim worship of the demonic moon god, allah is wonderful . . . perhaps I misunderstood that you claimed to be a Christian.


BX: You seem to be resisting the clear indication that Damascus CEASES to be a city at all. Has NOT happened, YET.

You did not answer my earlier question of what you thought about what the meaning of this statement is. Let's say for sake of argument, that God or someone comes in person to earth and makes the world into a garden of Eden. Now in this new Edenic world, there is a big fence around the whole Damascus area with signs reading, "Keep Out ! Prophetically Eternally Accursed Area!!" ?

That's certainly possible.

I don't know HOW Almighty God plans to handle that issue.

I just know that HIS WORD IS LITERALLY TRUE. And, that folks who have contended that His Word is not literally true have been PROVEN WRONG many hundreds, if not thousands, of times.

I'm certainly convinced that as long as it's possible to say where Damascus geographically was, that said plot of land would not be inhabited again.

If said plot of land ends up at the bottom of the sea or subducted under a techtonic plate . . . then, of course, it would be a moot issue.

Taking Scripture at face value doesn't mean one has to be off the wall irrational about it.

.
.

reply to post by BO XIAN

It is a counterfeit pseudo-'Christianity' that pretends to REPLACE the children of Jacob with the Christian Church in God's eyes. There's not a shred of Scripture to support that.

It is the Gentile Church that is GRAFTED INTO the SEED OF ABRAHAM, ISAAC AND JACOB as Paul makes clear in Romans and Hebrews.

He exhorts fairly sternly against being haughty and looking down on the seed of Jacob.

There's only umpteen verses affirming God's promises to the children of Jacob and not a single one saying GOD CANCELED HIS EVERLASTING PROMISES to the seed of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

You are not quoting verse here but saying a lot of made-up philosophy but writing it in a way to make your own words appear to have authority. What do you call that? I call it making yourself out to be God.

Paul talking to the gentiles explains how this promise comes to them, which is through Jesus:
Gal3:16 The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. The Scripture does not say "and to seeds," meaning many people, but "and to your seed," meaning one person, who is Christ.

The promise was expanded to the whole world:
RO 4:13 It was not through law that Abraham and his offspring received the promise that he would be heir of the world, but through the righteousness that comes by faith.

The promise made to Abraham is expanded to include everyone who has faith like Abraham.
RO 4:16 Therefore, the promise comes by faith, so that it may be by grace and may be guaranteed to all Abraham's offspring--not only to those who are of the law but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham. He is the father of us all. 17 As it is written: "I have made you a father of many nations." He is our father in the sight of God, in whom he believed--the God who gives life to the dead and calls things that are not as though they were.

reply to post by BO XIAN

31:35 The Lord has made a promise to Israel.
He promises it as the one who fixed the sun to give light by day
and the moon and stars to give light by night.
He promises it as the one who stirs up the sea so that its waves roll.
He promises it as the one who is known as the Lord who rules over all.
31:36 The Lord affirms, “The descendants of Israel will not
cease forever to be a nation in my sight.
That could only happen if the fixed ordering of the heavenly lights
were to cease to operate before me.”

This is probably what Jesus was addressing in Mathew 24, where the disciples would have been astonished when Jesus said not one stone would be left upon another, because here was this oracle in Jeremiah about how the city would be rebuilt and the temple. It goes on to say, for the age, at least in the Greek version but apparently the age ended and so does this oracle.

reply to post by BO XIAN

as we have seen Israel return to the Holy Land and become a Nation again in a day precisely as predicted in Scripture. Now, the rest of the END TIMES SCRIPTURES are continuing to unfold precisley literally.

That is an assertion often made but it is empty.
It is just so many words that people are supposed to accept as fact, so as to not be labeled an anti-Semite.
Just like the claim that six million Jews were killed by the NAZI's in WWII.
It's not real, it is just an incantation to the demon god for magical powers from hell.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by BO XIAN

 

The Dispensational perspective has been traced all the way back to the New Testament era.

I'm having a problem finding any documentation on this.

Sure:

@ @ @ @ @


www.freerepublic.com...

The Early Church Fathers and the Foundations of Dispensationalism

Larry V. Crutchfield

Professor of Early Christian History & Culture
Columbia Evangelical Seminary, Longview, WA

Part I—Setting the Stage: The Participants and

Theological Principles in the Debate

The Issue

. . .

The terminus a quo of the patristic period is generally fixed with the close of the apostolic age, while the terminus ad quem is set for the Latin church at the death of either Gregory the Great in ad 604 or Isidore of Seville in 636, and for the Greek church at the death of John of Damascus, c.749. This study is limited to the period of church history prior to the Council of Nicea (ad 325), commonly known as the ante-Nicene age. Included here are the writings of the fathers who were contemporary with and in some cases instructed by the apostles, and the church leaders who were in turn the disciples and pedagogical benefactors of those fathers.[6] In other words, our focus will be upon the early church leaders who may be regarded as belonging to what Ryrie calls “the first and purest centuries”[7] of church history.

Church leaders of the first century have traditionally been designated “apostolic fathers.”[8] In this group we find: Clement (flourished c.90-100), bishop of Rome; Ignatius (died c.98/117), bishop of Antioch; Polycarp (c.70-155/160), bishop of Smyrna; Papias (c.60-c.130/155), bishop of Hierapolis; The Didache (composed before the end of the first century AD); the Epistle of Barnabas (comp. c.70/117-138); and Hermas’ The Shepherd (comp. apparently in two parts, c.96/140-150). These fathers, along with Justin Martyr and Irenaeus, are especially significant for a study of this nature because of their proximity to the apostles and their teachings, notably the Apostle John, author of the Apocalypse.


Among the influential Christian leaders of the second century we may include the apologist[9] Justin Martyr (c.100-165); the polemicists Irenaeus (120-202), bishop of Lyons, and his disciple Hippolytus (d. c.236), anti-pope bishop in Rome; and from the African school, Tertullian (150-225), apologist, moralist, and theologian. Though they bring little to the discussion, for the sake of completeness and because they are listed as second century millenarians by Peters,[10] we add: Pothinus (c.87-177), Irenaeus’ predecessor as bishop of churches in Lyon and Vienne (in modern France); Melito (d. c.190), apologist and bishop of Sardis; Hegesippus (second century), church historian; and Apollinaris (c.175), apologist and bishop of Hierapolis.
. . .

# # # # # # # # #

www.endtimes.org...

The History of Dispensationalism

While the opponents of Dispensationalism will point out that as a system of theology it is relatively new, it is notable that there is evidence from the early church writers that there was clearly an understanding that God dealt with His people differently in progressive dispensations, and that Israel wasn't seen as replaced by the Church. A small reference to some of these writings is found in 'The Moody Handbook of Theology" by Paul Ennis. He mentions the following Christians as being in the history of the development of Dispensationalism.

• Justin Martyr (A.D. 110-165)
• Iranaeus (A.D. 130-200)
• Clement of Alexandria (A.D. 150-220)
• Augustine (A.D. 354-430)
. . .

Some Dispensational writers
• Pierre Poiret (1646-1719)
• John Edwards (1637-1716)
• Isaac Watts (1674-1748)
• John Nelson Darby (1800-1882)
• C.I. Scofield (1843-1921)
• Lewis Sperry Chafer
• Charles Ryrie
• Dwight Pentecost
• John Walvoord

The Replacementarian perspective, historically, is a throw back to the heresies of the Roman church & the Vatican.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by BO XIAN

 

31:35 The Lord has made a promise to Israel.
He promises it as the one who fixed the sun to give light by day
and the moon and stars to give light by night.
He promises it as the one who stirs up the sea so that its waves roll.
He promises it as the one who is known as the Lord who rules over all.
31:36 The Lord affirms, “The descendants of Israel will not
cease forever to be a nation in my sight.
That could only happen if the fixed ordering of the heavenly lights
were to cease to operate before me.”

This is probably what Jesus was addressing in Mathew 24, where the disciples would have been astonished when Jesus said not one stone would be left upon another, because here was this oracle in Jeremiah about how the city would be rebuilt and the temple. It goes on to say, for the age, at least in the Greek version but apparently the age ended and so does this oracle.

So often . . . your posts seem to come from a different planet and a different language and to have not the faintest connection with The Bible.

This is one of such posts.

Rationalizing away GOD'S EMPHATIC ASSERTION

THAT

AS LONG AS THE SUN, MOON AND STARS EXIST

HIS EVERLASTING PROMISES TO THE BLOOD CHILDREN OF ABRAHAM, ISAAC AND JACOB

REMAIN FULLY IN FORCE

is sooooooooooooommmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmme cheek!

It boggles my mind that anyone could rationalize away such clear and EMPHATIC SCRIPTURES.

Incredible.

I don't think God could have made THE TRUTH about HIS PRIORITY FOR ISRAEL

any plainer or stronger.

reply to post by jmdewey60


Given that you trash God's CLEAR AND EMPHATIC Jeremiah 31:35 EVERLASTING PROMISES to Israel . . .

I'm skeptical that we have enough common vocabulary to have a meaningful dialogue.

You seem to even think that you do God a service with such horrific UNBiblical assertions.

In my experience, there's not much remedy for such . . . nonsense.

Holy Spirit has to break through to such a perspective . . . and I don't often see Him drag out a sufficiently tough carbide bit up to the task of boring a hole and pouring it in enough for some edifying Holy Spirit born enlightenment on that score to actually register on the mental processes concerned.

If I decide to try and respond to that post, I will. Mostly, it seems to be an exercise in utter futility.

The truth is not the least bit tarnished.

Yet, understanding remains grossly lacking.

At some point, we Dispensationalists cannot help that. There has to first be eyes to see and ears to hear before even Holy Spirit will facilitate understanding. There has to be AT LEAST A DESIRE to see and understand HOLY SPIRIT'S TRUTH.

reply to post by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by BO XIAN

 

very well... how about this one about Israel being wiped out


Son of man, the house of Israel is to me become dross: all they are brass, and tin, and iron, and lead, in the midst of the furnace; they are even the dross of silver. As they gather silver, and brass, and iron, and lead, and tin, into the midst of the furnace, to blow the fire upon it, to melt it; so will I gather you in mine anger and in my fury, and I will leave you there, and melt you. Yea, I will gather you, and blow upon you in the fire of my wrath, and ye shall be melted in the midst therof. As silver is melted in the midst of the furnace, so shall ye be melted in the midst thereof; and ye shall know that I the LORD have poured out my fury upon you.
- Ezekiel 22:19-22

That happened when Rome destroyed Jerusalem and the temple burned in 70 A.D. and what jews hadn't been killed were taken into captivity to europe. The nation of Israel melted away from all history except in the memories of the jews and christians who escaped and told the story to their decendents. Israel, was destroyed and renamed Syriac Palestina by Hadrian Caesar afte rhe plowed under the temple mount in 135. A.D. When this happened the Israelites knew that had made God mad and that he turned his back on them.

Like I said earlier, on a different thread...

If its a verse that suggests the destruction of an "enemy", such as muslim countries.... its supposed to take place in our coming future. (eg- this thread)

If its a verse that suggests the destruction of Israel, who they are infatuated with, they say it "already happened" in the past.

Given the flexibility when it comes to inerpreting these "prophecies", Ez 22 can ALSO refer to Israel being destroyed again in OUR future. Most of the people in this whole "bible prophecy interpreting" business are christians.... and they have a soft spot for the modern day state of Israel. i.e - Israel will win ALL its wars

IMO, the bible can also be interpreted by non-muslims, such as myself, to conclude that it endorses the arrival of Islam. (I've already made a detailed thread about it, and I'm surprised you did'nt participate in it)

Even if you disagree with my findings, theres no reason why YOUR interpretation of the bible more valid than MINE.