Is Anyone Still Taking OWS Seriously?

reply to post by OutKast Searcher


Apparently these OWS supporters don't understand how business works. Sure, you can shut the port down. But the businesses won't lose any money. How do I know? Because there is a little thing called insurance that any savvy business person would buy. It covers lost productivity. I had it when I owned my restaurant. It pays you your average daily receipts in the event you lose productivity for any reason. So the business files a claim due to the ports being shut down. They get paid for lost productivity, but the workers get nothing. So who is truly losing out on this? Way to go OWS! Actually making the 1% richer by doing this! Guess we know who you truly support!

If you actually do a little research, you'll find out that 99% (no pun intended) of the truckers and longshoremen support this protest because they are LEGALLY PROHIBITED FROM STRIKING, have # wages, have to buy their own trucks and fuel too. They've been fighting Goldman Sachs, SSA and EGT over this for years.

Do.

Resseeeeearch before spouting at the mouth.

Originally posted by zanysami
If you actually do a little research, you'll find out that 99% (no pun intended) of the truckers and longshoremen support this protest because they are LEGALLY PROHIBITED FROM STRIKING, have # wages, have to buy their own trucks and fuel too. They've been fighting Goldman Sachs, SSA and EGT over this for years.

Do.

Resseeeeearch before spouting at the mouth.

Well since you apparently have already researched this...why not just provide the source that says 99% of the port workers support this.

Please don't come back and tell me to go on a wild goose chase looking for it, you made the claim...you back it up.

I'll be waiting.

Occupy is still in full steam here in SLC, but the focus is away from protesting and towards some organized political action. We had a glimpse into what "cooperation" with the Mayor and Police Chief did for us and we are dealing with things in a more organized, organic, non official avenue. Meetings are biweekly and we are organizing some pretty exciting things in the community. The voting and meeting structure are still 90-10 consensus and we have divided the area into geographic communities. We have been canvassing the city and are taking a neighborhood approach, asking people what they need in each neighborhood and supporting them to get results. Our focus changed and we are not asking groups to join us, but are offering our support to existing activist groups under their banners and we are driving forward as a collective.

Soooo, when you see PETA, LGBT protests, Tea Party, Gun Rights Activists, Oath Keepers, Ron Paul people protesting you are seeing us in the masses at those events supporting people against a tyrannical government. When you see the “rioting”, those are the anarchist work groups just doing their best to draw attention away from the “real work” of consensus-community building.

We have offered services to homeowners facing foreclosure and eviction and we have a waiting list of nearly three dozen homes that have contracted with us for occupation against the sheriff and the banks. We have begun protesting individuals and specific geographic locations. We are organizing voting districts and campaigns to put Occupy party members on city counsels and state positions. We are organizing and supporting local businesses and protesting national chains and corporate giants like Walmart, Monsanto and The Banksters.

We are saving seeds and organizing community gardening projects for spring. We are also looking into collective property with communal kitchens. Defensible communities….

We are studying and networking on alternative energy and waste processing systems…

We are studying and organizing health and public safety systems and enlisting professionals sympathetic to our course to teach and train our ranks.

IMPORTANT….we are NOT arming for violence, but we are preparing for autonomy through sustainable living practices and education. We are creating neighborhood tribal counsels and regional structures that will help support communities and neighborhoods in the vent of a bank run or food shortages.

We have sent liaisons to neighboring states and back east to make sure we are on the same page come spring. Run out of steam….more like building a strong, steady boil for a release when the weather breaks….

The processes are very refined and we are able to make decisions quickly and accurately. Pounding our heads against the stone wall wasn’t working here, so we are going totally grass roots.

We are getting very good at sniffing out the agents in the ranks as well and some of us are focusing on that aspect so we can get some internal control and get rid of the spies in these groups. We have been focusing on feeding and housing the needy this season, its getting very cold here in UT and we are actively supporting shelters and soup kitchens. We have a growing, albeit silent, presence in Gallivan Plaza. We are self policing and are managing to keep the criminal element at bay in this camp.

You need to understand that this country, the world for that matter, is heading for something that it has never seen before… something that will absolutely destroy the present paradigm of society, trade and economy. We are prepping for this and have established a network of counsels that communicate rapidly and efficiently. We have a supply chain. We have a unified agenda. This is a model for self organizing collectives that will, we believe, be the only way to survive with any degree of safety and cohesion when TPTB trip the switch in the spring.

The model is sound. You can come to us for structure when society wobbles and dies in the spring. Understand that we are your neighbors and we are organizing a neighborhood near you into a survival clan.

Many of us are tired of yelling ourselves silly and we have decided that the time is growing late. We, at this point, realize that most folks aren’t really getting the message and we have decided to start prepping to meet the events that will surely come this spring. We are getting ready and we really don’t have time or resources to continue to convince the “non believers” that they should get ready themselves. I wish we could, but we really can’t anymore.

Small scale protests will continue as a reminder that we are still here. Remember, the 60s era movement took almost five years to garnish enough support to radically change public policy. We are still in the planning stages and have managed to take the best of what worked then and leave out the elements that were counterproductive, like the orgies, drugs and violence. It’s working folks. You don’t have to believe this, but know that structure is in place when all else fails and know that you won’t have to navigate the chaos alone. When TPTB raid personal savings, checking, hedge funds, bonds, stock accounts and every other safety net you have worked your entire life for, remember we have been organizing for cohesion and community. There is a place for your voice here.

As you can see, we present a problem for TPTB and we will be declared terrorists by the end of the month, no doubt  Keep in mind that leadership is by consensus and we still do not have a solid leadership structure, BY DESIGN. Leadership can be co-opted and leaders can be captured and interrogated. The ambiguous, voluntary, consensus model also allows us to easily see who the agent provocateurs are.

Ambiguity of leadership and declared goals are very effective organizational strategies. Our goals remain broad and each individual agenda is handled by work groups interested in organizing and executing that particular plan. There is no “one message” just a great deal of compartmentalization to cover each aspect of a working, growing community. A great deal of detailed, planned compartmentalization. It is almost to the level of intuitive hive mind in a way…things get done quickly and efficiently with little ego based aggression.

It’s a beautiful thing being collectively run by some very beautiful, intelligent, passionate people. The future looks bright here.

Ait, back to the planning…

reply to post by PapaKrok


Well, I was with you until you touted support for PETA.

I don't support them or the terrorist group green peace. Any group that seeks to limit the rights of any individual should NEVER be supported!

A lot of the same points I made are already talked about on here. Whereas there are still a FEW ATS members who truly still support their cause. I think it's true. Once the crackdowns began, then the media had less and less to report on. If OWS was really so strong they would continue protests in the light of police crackdowns. Why aren't they? It's because they are mostly wimpy college kids who don't want to get a bruise on their body and then complain about getting pepper sprayed to the media after they refused to listen to the police. As was reported there were hundreds of thousands of protesters at the height of the movement, how was it possible that relatively small police forces without using guns forced them all away?? they complained about pepper spray and police brutality??

Yes, the parks they in were occupied illegally, because they didn't state when they would leave, they thought it was their home, and the parks are owned by the city! Not the public! Even homeless people are asked to leave public parks and public areas if they are causing a disturbance or if someone feels uncomfortable around them.

If they truly wanted revolution why are they going back into their houses which were sold to them by the company Fannie and Freddie Mac? Why are they getting heat from Kenmore, Sears, and Honeywell? Why are they sitting in their basements made from Home Depot? Playing on their iPhones made from Apple? That's where they all went, you know! These were all evil companies right? So, why did they surrender so easily?

Originally posted by haarvik
reply to post by OutKast Searcher

 

Apparently these OWS supporters don't understand how business works. Sure, you can shut the port down. But the businesses won't lose any money. How do I know? Because there is a little thing called insurance that any savvy business person would buy. It covers lost productivity. I had it when I owned my restaurant. It pays you your average daily receipts in the event you lose productivity for any reason. So the business files a claim due to the ports being shut down. They get paid for lost productivity, but the workers get nothing. So who is truly losing out on this? Way to go OWS! Actually making the 1% richer by doing this! Guess we know who you truly support!

Each local action is planned locally and supported generally by the general assemblies of each participating city. There is no central government, just supporting clans under a unified banner. We may not agree with what Occupy is doing in LA, but we do support their autonomy and their judgment as to what is an appropriate course of action in their region and cimmunities. I was a trucker for years...I see their point. The ports are not American owned or run, they are, essentially, foreign states on the borders of the US. Don't believe me? Try and get into one and see what happens...

was it ever taken seriously??? I mean.. outside of the first week when no one knew what was going on... now the message is clear (they just want to loiter)

I dont even think some of the protestors are taking it seriously anymore.

reply to post by Domo1


Here is an interesting opinion in today's (Seattle Times) editorial section:

seattletimes.nwsource.com...

reply to post by caladonea


Kudos to you for linking to this.

For the most part it echos what a lot of us on this board have voiced. Guess now all the OWS supporters will go after the paper for telling it like it is.

This movement will not ever run out of steam, we may be withdrawn a bit now but with the most recent action of occupying shipping ports tells me that this movement has not ran out of steam. We are merely regrouping for the next major action as for revolutionary change to take effect you just don't announce your plans to the world because if you've ever seen a James Bond flick and that is when the villian leaks their entire plan instead of just killing Bon they always wind up losing and getting dead.

Originally posted by caladonea
reply to post by Domo1

 

Here is an interesting opinion in today's (Seattle Times) editorial section:

seattletimes.nwsource.com...

That is a great article. And this is the criticism I have had for OWS all along...I said at the very beginning...become political, or die.

It appears they choose to die. They want "change"...but are against working within the political system...they still don't have any logical reasoning how exactly that is going to work. I guess they think that they stand in the street, hold a sign, say they aren't going to become political, a lot say they aren't going to even vote...and then the expect politicians to listen to them and do exactly what they are demandng

These are the most important lines in the article IMO.

The original message was lost. The subject at hand, evidently, was proper policing techniques.
...
Briefly, it looked like the left had created its very own version of a tea party, a force that would seize control of the national attention and force intransigent Republican legislators to explain themselves and force real banking reform into existence. But that result appears increasingly unlikely. By the time Republican members of the federal deficit-reduction supercommittee killed any hope of a grand deal because they were unwilling to seriously consider a minor increase on the tax-rate for millionaires, the protesters didn't even appear to notice. The day after that deal died, the Occupy movement should have physically blocked all congressmen from entering the Capitol, but they were busy fighting with the police.

OWS's refusal to become political or pick a side is what has killed them and made them irrelevant to everyone except themselves.

reply to post by caladonea


That article is so wrong it's not even funny!

THE OFFICIAL STANCE OF THE #OOCUPYEVERYTHING - OCCUPY TOGETHER - #OCCUPYWALLSTREET MOVEMENTS AND ALL ASSOCIATED MARCHES & OCCUPATIONS THROUGHOUT THE PLANET CURRENTLY :

This group wants absolutely nothing to do with the corrupt 2 party oligarchy as both have been bought and paid by the banks, The Federal Reserve and Wall Street and does not need nor require money from 1%'rs and to say anything otherwise is a major dis service to this group and movement as a whole as we see people like Soros as being apart of the problem and does not endorse millionaires or billionaires. No corporate dollars are welcomed and if one were to attempt to finance this movement it would be rejected and returned with a note saying "No sale!"!

To believe anything else means you are being seriously deceived and tricked and said source should not be trusted or taken seriously and if it does not come from the aforementioned it is not to be taken as the official stance. No General Assembly in any group throughout the planet will amend this ever!

STRONG EMPHASIS UPON THE FOLLOWING AND CANNOT BE EXPRESSED ENOUGH :
Unless it comes from Occupy Together, Occupy Everything, #Occupy Wall Street, NYC General Assembly or any of the countless official "Occupy" family of sites it does not speak for this movement and the movement will not endorse any site outside of our family of sites. Adbusters does not speak for us, Tides does not speak for us, no union speaks for us, The American Socialist Party does not speak for us, The Communist Party does not speak for us, Nancy Pelosi, Obama, Biden, The Democratic National Committee, The Republican Nation Committee, The Tea Party, Libertarian movement or any other political party or figurehead does not speak for us and neither do they represent us! neither does any group that has decided to join us under their own free will and volition but even those groups and our partner firms do not speak for us! We speak for ourselves!

All are welcomed from all faiths, ethnic groups, political persuasions, LBGTI, animal and kid friendly as we will not discriminate, we will be friendly to all. Illicit narcotics (marijuana to meth while all scrips prescribed to a fellow protester are obviously allowed) and liquor (all forms) use are banned and will get someone expelled and turned over to law enforcement. Come as you are! Remember, there is no member of the 1% that is on this website which means we are all The 99%!

What left? We want nothing to do with the oligarchy and to believe anything else is a major disservice!

reply to post by OutKast Searcher


Refusal to pick a side? So in your moronic logic for the movement to be taken seriously we've got to get in bed with the very elements we fight and stand against? As flipping if! We will not take money from corrupt corporations who are doing the very bidding of The SCUM. We are demanding change and flat the hell out refuse to join up with the declared enemy of humanity and freedom.

The way we are structured currently bans and prohibits being corrupted by the very elements we stand against.

The SCUM own every political party and we want nothing to do with either! Hence why we took and continue to take the message directly to the public instead of taking it to bought and paid politicians.

reply to post by PapaKrok


The East Coast actions support fully the action being undertaken by shutting down shipping ports as we are starving the beast.

reply to post by TheImmaculateD1

We are demanding change and flat the hell out refuse to join up with the declared enemy of humanity and freedom.

Who are you demanding this change from?

Walk down the path of logic and see where you end up.

Originally posted by zanysami
Every single port on the west coast is about to get stormed and shut down.
Three ports already have been completely blocked.

For what purpose? What good will this do - exactly? How will this help people - exactly?
All it does is make people not get paid and turn people further against OWS - IMHO.

reply to post by TheImmaculateD1


Oh naive one!

You are not starving the beast. Apparently you didn't read my post. they have insurance against an interruption of productivity. they will file a claim when it is over and will get paid their lost money by the insurance company. They will actually make out because they will not have to pay wages out of it. Starving the beast my butt.

Originally posted by haarvik
reply to post by PapaKrok

 

Well, I was with you until you touted support for PETA.

I don't support them or the terrorist group green peace. Any group that seeks to limit the rights of any individual should NEVER be supported!

Haarvik,

Sometimes you gotta compromise. Occupy is made up of everyone from left to right on the spectrum. Its kinda unusual to see "leftist" Marxists march in support of "Right-wing" gun control issues and Libertarian candidates, but this movement is galvanizing tolerance and is finding a common voice that transcends ideology in favor of freedom and liberty as expressed in the Bill of Rights and the Constitution. Remember, division based on ideology is what allowed TPTB to gain this degree of control and has been the major contributor to EVERY country and people that have EVER been overthrown.

PETA folks are compromising here as well, toward a more moderate view based on education and information sharing. They are right in line with the corporate concerns and some of their issues are extremely relevant. Gun owners are about to feel this with Cerberus buying up all the gun and ammo manufacturers. It is best to avoid a gut reaction and actually sit down and discuss issues with those involved rather than throw the baby out with the bathwater. They are just people, like me and you. Not evil demons.

TPTB want us divided into artificial opposites and want us perpetually at war with one another so they can stay in control. If we start to dialogue intelligently and seek collective answers and solutions, we avoid their control and can gain a powerful, unified, freedom-based front that will be unstoppable.

reply to post by PapaKrok


Well, I will give you credit for one thing...you don't follow any party line, so for that I give you kudos. I have seen firsthand what PETA does, and cannot agree with anything they say or do. Now, could it be just the experience of a local chapter? Maybe, but it still sours in my mouth none the less. You are also right in taking it to the people, in working with elected officials to ensure you follow proper channels to accomplish your goal. While I do not agree with what the initial OWS movement was and stood for, I have always said I support and commend their effort to at least try to change something.

The answer to our current issues can be summed up pretty easily. All one need do is to look at how our country was run at the turn of the century. That kind of government is what we need. It needs a rewind back 100 years and that will fix our mess. I am not a christian or a believer, however I know there are others on the board who are. So in that context, I will have to say that the number of the beast that they keep referring to is actually money. Think about it. The bible states that without the mark of the beast, you will not be able to buy or sell. Without money, you cannot buy or sell. The number of the beast has been around for quite a while if you are of the biblical persuasion. We all now have the mark of the beast.