Palestine Exists 2.0

Good thread corruption, and your welcome. I would also add this thread that I made to this and make it a giant reference everyone can refer back to:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Click here for more information.

reply to post by gravitational

Is it because the statements given by Arabs and “PALESTINIANS” that there isn't and never was a people called Palestinians, and a Palestinian state or kingdom never existed, preventing you from continuing your childish little hateful cr*p you keep spreading around ATS ?

The only people that are hateful, are those opposing Palestine it seems. There is Alonzo730, Chr0naut, SavedOne and you, posting hateful comments towards a people, a country and other posters on ATS. If you do not like their research, perhaps do some of your own that is not based on the hateful mindset with which you've produced your posts so far in this thread.

To the OP: Thanks for that. The picture of the Palestinian passport says a lot to me.

Of course, that is exactly why this second thread was started - there are many statements by Arab leaders explicitly denying that a Palestinian nation exists, but that instead it is merely a convenient fiction to hang a propaganda narrative on.

The real motivations for the Arab/Israeli conflict, ie jihad would be unacceptable to Western audiences, nor would the real motivations of leftist animosity towards Israel be acceptable - hence the leftist/Islamicists find common ground in promoting the 'propaganda of the big lie'

S+F

To be fair, you can make the argument than ANY of the people who have historical ties to this region deserve to be there. What we refer to today as Palestinian people are the Palestinian Arabs living in 'Palestine' just as Palestinian Jews once lived there. Palestina dates back to the 5th c. BC and the inhabitants were primarily descendents of Canaanites, Hebrews, Philistines, and later Arabs, and on and on, too many to list.

Palestine existed, by that name, as a state, throughout the middle ages - even as it's rulers changed from Seleucids to Ottomans to Egyptians - it was still recognized as "Palestine". The inhabitants of Palestine were Arabs and Jews.

BTW OP, a good image is the one from the Wiki page, a map from 1759 clearly stating Palestine


After the UN mandated the DIVISION of Palestine into an ARAB and a JEWISH state, one side accepted the partition (the Jews) and the other side did not accept it. The Jewish state (Israel) has been carving territory out of the Arab territory ever since. YES, Israel won the brief civil war that erupted in protest of the UN partitioning of Palestine, and yes Israel took territory from Palestinian Arabs as did Jordan and Syria. But what's happening there now is nothing short of genocide as they continue to rob Palestinian Arabs for there homes and land at gunpoint.

The argument that always crops up in these discussions is that Jews are descended from the Ancient Israelite and have a historical claim to this land is false, because before there were Ancient Israelites there were Canaanites- dating back to the neolithic - and Palestinian Arabs (as with Palestinian Jews) are as much descended from them as modern Jews.

To sum up:
Palestine existed throughout history as a land. It's borders have changed over time, as any land's would. Rulers and conqueror's came and went. Palestine (by that name) existed on a map until it was carved in half by the UN creating an equal Palestinian state of Arabs and an Israel state of Jews. Therefore the Palestinian people DO exist, even if they are being driven into ghettos or turned into refugees in their own land.

reply to post by SavedOne

Well of course Palestine exists. So does Europe. But Europe is not a country, and neither is Palestine. Never has been.

But Europeans ARE A PEOPLE. Do you understand that? Do we look at Europeans and tell them "you're just an invented people"? That would make it okay to eradicate them from their land and take their homes?

Even going by the UN partitioning in 1948, they defined PALESTINE as a STATE along with ISRAEL as a state. Zionists in Israel have made it abundantly clear they will not stop until they've eradicated every sign of Palestine and the Palestinian Arabs.

Here's another map for you;



The caption reads:

Byzantine mosaic depiction of a corner of ancient Palestine, VIth century AD. Water bodies are prominent, while land routes are entirely omitted, reflecting a preference in means of transportation. The river is Jordan. The city in the center is Jericho. East is on top. Jerusalem is bottom right, lavishly illustrated and commented. Other ancient cultures with less textual-scriptural emphasis produced maps with entirely pictographic and glyphic features.

There's a whole slew of ancient maps here:
Murray Hudson - Maps of Middle East (Palestine, Holy Land)

reply to post by JohhnyBGood

there are many statements by Arab leaders explicitly denying that a Palestinian nation exists, but that instead it is merely a convenient fiction to hang a propaganda narrative on.

Would those be the same leaders that have been put in position by America and Israel?

I wonder why they would deny such a thing...

I also wonder why their people are revolting and these "leaders" turn out to be nothing more than foreign policy puppets for the US and thus via proxy, Israel.

Your argument holds no water. Unless you can show that these "leaders" properly represent(ed) their people. Which you can't because revolutions have broken out.

Originally posted by InfoKartel
reply to post by JohhnyBGood

 

there are many statements by Arab leaders explicitly denying that a Palestinian nation exists, but that instead it is merely a convenient fiction to hang a propaganda narrative on.

Would those be the same leaders that have been put in position by America and Israel?

I wonder why they would deny such a thing...

I also wonder why their people are revolting and these "leaders" turn out to be nothing more than foreign policy puppets for the US and thus via proxy, Israel.

Your argument holds no water. Unless you can show that these "leaders" properly represent(ed) their people. Which you can't because revolutions have broken out.

In 1974, the late Syrian President, Hafez al-Assad, declared: "It would be fitting for us to mention to the responsible Israeli authorities that we view Palestine not just as an inseparable part of the Arab nation, but as a part of Southern Syria."

In 1987, he reiterated himself at a conference in Amman, "A country named 'Palestine' has never existed." Jordanian King Hussein responded, "The appearance of the national Palestinian persona serves as a response to Israel's claim that Palestine is Jewish."

Arafat who in 1970, with candid simplicity, told the reporter Arianna Palazzi: "The question of borders doesn't interest us... From the Arab standpoint, we mustn't talk about borders. Palestine is nothing but a drop in an enormous ocean. Our nation is the Arabic nation that stretches from the Atlantic Ocean to the Red Sea and beyond it..... The P.L.O. is fighting Israel in the name of Pan-Arabism. What you call "Jordan" is nothing more than Palestine."

israelagainstterror.blogspot.com...

You can understand why corruption started a new thread when his lies were exposed - there is no defense against these statements and there are more equally damning at the site.

Pre 1948 Israel what was it?

Does this mean people of Republic of Ireland can now just say Northern Ireland is not its own country and never has been or it does not exist ? this is a really bad road to go down am glad someone on ATS has made a stand against this ignorant information well done OP

reply to post by shambles84


The statements made by Arab leaders are telling you exactly what 'the Palestinian people' were invented for - a propaganda trick.

Why are you ignoring them? - do you think they didn't know the truth? or perhaps you just can't handle the unpalatable truth, that you have been lied to, misled, decieved and used as a useful idiot.

reply to post by JohhnyBGood


Are you saying Leena from Palesteena during the 1920's is also a propaganda trick? How about the maps depicting ancient Palestine that were printed in the 1800's and before?

reply to post by Corruption Exposed


Those maps are completely meaningless, Palestine was a backwater region of the Ottoman empire - big deal if they showed it on a map!

Why don't you try and address all those statements by Arab leaders who are bluntly saying "THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS THE PALESTINIAN PEOPLE"

I have an idea.
You know the old scenario when a kid repeatedly asks for something and the parent cuts them off with a quick "shhh".
I think it's time to apply a similar technique only adapt it for worldly affairs.
The next time ANYONE even mentions an outward act of aggression, we murder them and publish their names like it's a police blotter.
Simple as that...
Any stories surface today of some war mongering leader threatening to retaliate if they are struck? Well guess what? It hasn't happened yet so shut your hateful troublemaking mouth and report to your killing chamber to be publicly made an example of. Any stories of wiping a group of people off a map? Report to your killing appointment please.
Goes for ANYONE who speaks of violence... Starting now.
Ready.... GO

Originally posted by Namaste1001
It is my understanding that the Palestinians can trace their roots all the way back to the Canaanites that lived on that land millennia ago.

Newt is making himself sound more like a Zionist stooge every time he opens his mouth.

And it's probably how he will win the elections.

reply to post by JohhnyBGood


Palestine is indeed REAL they even have there own flag and its only because of America that the U.N is not going to accept its statehood , the US being capable of pressuring countries, Israel being able to pressure world leaders, and because of the hypocrisy of Western politics .
So to deny That Palestine or its people do not exist is just ignorance and as a member of ATS i will deny ignorance.
If were going to be a bit nit picky what gives the right for Americans to exist .in fact i here by claim that America does not exist and will now be known as the land of the NATIVE INDIANS who are the right full owners of this land .

If you want to go deeper into the decendents I would not be so proud to be in the same line and the same generational patterns has emerged and will continue untill one is no more and that is not just a Biblical or Jewish view but also an Islamic view in that their god will wipe out all Jews which is the opposite of the Bible foretells although it fortells this type of endtime enemy.

The Bible states that there will be remants of these Canaanite or Anakim's left because they were not wiped out completely and they will rise at some level to rebel against God's plan for the Jews in the Bible.

Caanites and Anakim's are brutal line of people who can not be helped or at least be saved by God spiritually, they will always rebel against the Jews.

Jeremiah 47
A Message About the Philistines

4 For the day has come
to destroy all the Philistines
and to remove all survivors
who could help Tyre and Sidon.
The LORD is about to destroy the Philistines,
the remnant from the coasts of Caphtor.
5 Gaza will shave her head in mourning;
Ashkelon will be silenced.
You remnant on the plain,
how long will you cut yourselves?
Text

The term Canaanites was given to the various groups that lived in the promised land (Gen 10:15). They are descendants of Noah through Ham. Canaan was cursed to be a slave of his brothers by Noah after the incident when Noah was drunk and lay naked (Gen 9:25). They lived in various places among the other inhabitants of the land, especially on the low land (Num 13:29).
Text

God gave Israel a warning that if they did not destroy the people in the land they would be
“pricks in your eyes and thorns in your side” (Num 33:50-56). Joshua led the people over the Jordan and destroyed many cities and peoples (Josh 12). Joshua subdued the land, but not all the people died in it (Josh 11:21-23). Josh 13:1-7 gives us a list of land still to be possessed. Joshua divided up the land and it was the task of the tribes to possess it (Josh 23:4-13). In Judges the tribes seek to drive them out. Judah and the house of Joseph has success, but others fail (Judg 1:27-36). This was because the people did not break down the altars (Judg 2:2) and served Baal (Judg 2:11ff). Judg 3:3f gives us a list of nations left in the land. Judg 3:5-6 is one of the saddest verses as the promise was not fulfilled. The land was not totally theirs. They co-habited it with the various Canaanite, Hittite, and Perizzite groups. The promise of Num 33:55-56 was fulfilled.

The type of sins the Canaanites were involved in are mentioned in the Bible. This gives us an idea of the type of life in Canaan before Israel got there. Deut 9:4-5 makes it clear the nations were involved in gross wickedness. God's judgment was pending for many years (Gen 15:14-16). Lev 18:1ff give us a list of the horrors of everyday practice in the land (Lev 18:24). Sexual sins, child sacrifice, homosexuality, and perversion with animals are listed. Deut 18:9-14 add witchcraft and the occult to the list.
Text

julianspriggs.com...

The Rephaim or Anakim - (Heb. giants)

This people were a tribe of giants descended from Anak, who lived in the land. Their height was legendary, the Moabites and Ammonites lived in a land previously occupied by the Emin, who were as great and tall as the Anakim (Deut 2:11). King Og of Bashan was the last of the remnant of the Rephaim. He slept in a bedstead of iron, nine cubits long and 4 cubits wide (Deut 3:11, Josh 12:4, 13:12). The land of Bashan was also known as the land of the Rephaim. The town of Hebron was also known as Kiriath-arba, Arba was the father of Anak (Josh 15:14, 21:11). The valley of Rephaim formed the boundary between Judah and Benjamin (Josh 15:8, 18:16), where later David fought the Philistines (2 Sam 5:18,22).

Text

If you notice today this child sacrifice is evident today in Gaza where children are taught to die or kill the Jews, this is the same pattern that was evident in this area today, the form of sacrifice is somewhat the same is Satanic and anti-god.

reply to post by alonzo730


Just because the Jews wrote a book and claimed themselves to be gods chosen people doesn't make it true... Modern israel only exists because of the Balfour declaration by the united states & britian. WWII & the holocaust were manufactured events to justify the creation of this state that shouldn't exist... Just like 9/11 was a manufactured event to justify invading the middle east. Government & organized religion = endless war. Go ahead & call me anti-Semitic.... I'm anti religion... Imagine nothing to kill or die for. Wouldn't that be something.
Rest well John Lennon.

reply to post by JohhnyBGood


It's an historical fact that farmers rarely abandon there lands if they can help it. so the people that have lived on the land called Palestine are Palestinians.

Israel is the invented country and Israelis are the invented people all you have to do is read the wandering who, the stories in the bible about the wandering Israelites is just that stories that never happened or happened to other people.

There is no archaeological evidence to back up any of it.

And after all who would believe a people that believe that it's there god given right to lie cheat and deceive anyone not of there tribe.

So to get a whole country to them selves they are going to lie there little cotton socks off.

Both the Talmud, and the Col Nidra prayer - which allows a Jew to make all contracts, promises, and his word null and void - tells a Jew that lying to the Gentile or Christian is his right, that the Gentile and the Christian are "stupid cattle". Anyone with this perspective is evil incarnate.

From this perspective anyone believing anything that a person from this tribe of psychopaths says without cast iron proof is a fool.

So anything that johhnynoGood and his tribe has to say must be assumed to be a lie untill it can be proven otherwise.