Town Vows to Defend Nativity “Until Hell Freezes Over”

The good folks of Henderson County, Texas have decided to draw a line in the sand...and stand and fight for their right to continue to erect a nativity scene on the lawn of their courthouse - as they have done for 35 years.

The Wisconsin-based atheist organization (the Freedom From Religion Foundation) sent a letter to the county explaining that a local resident had complained and they wanted the Nativity removed. “It sends a message of intimidation and exclusion to non-Christians and non-believers this time of year”

I think the county commissioner just about sums this up for me...

Henderson County Commissioner Joe Hall called the attack “stupid” and said he’s going to do whatever it takes to stop the atheists.

radio.foxnews.com...

Here here Joe!

Atheists and believers of other faiths need to relax and enjoy the holidays. If you don't want to say "Merry Christmas", say "Happy Holidays".

If you don't subscribe to the stories of the birth of Christ at this time of year...kick back and have fun with Santa Claus, Christmas lights, the exchange of gifts with loved ones, the upcoming New Year...

Stop trying to take all of the enjoyment out of (or damper the special joy Christians feel during) the Christmas Season.

Keep your humbug attitudes to yourselves. Nobody is forcing you to enjoy this time of year - but stop trying to force other people to not enjoy it.

reply to by mobiusmale

The good folks of Henderson County, Texas have decided to draw a line in the sand...and stand and fight for their right to continue to erect a nativity scene on the lawn of their courthouse - as they have done for 35 years.

If it were on privately owned land(s) this would be a non-issue. But since it's on a land paid for by the taxpayers (which includes Theists and Atheists), it has become such.

Seperation of Church and State...

reply to post by mobiusmale


The same could be said when Christians want to put bans on various things like computer games and movies that they deem to be wrong for whatever reason, or various other instances where Christians want to get rid of activities/things that others enjoy.

Should we just say to them "Chill out mate, if you can't get into the spirit please don't ruin it for the rest of us"?

Here's a good one - Israel can shut the hell up about the Gaza strip. They just don't seem to be "getting into the spirit" of it.

Works both ways mate. Can't have everything your own way.

Had the Xmas tree up around Black Friday, got presents under the tree, I get it, but this is a non issue.

No one cares about Holidays when it comes down to what really matters, why aren't the towns defending outrageous tax rates instead of religious beliefs that only affect a select few? Nonsense issue IMHO.

Why don't they open it up for everyone? Let everyone put their own religious crap up on the lawn, they can keep a little square of grass untouched and say it is out of respect of the atheist.

Or how about this, have all the christians camp in tents in front of it, crap all over the grass and destroy it. Then claim it is all protected under peaceful protest?
If OWS can do it for 3 months im sure Christians should be allowed to do it until new years.

reply to post by PrimalRed


I am with you. Since this is a free country and ALL religions are entitled to the same perks, why cant they put up all types of religious symbols?

Until then aren't they the ones being persecuted and not the other way around?

Originally posted by JibbyJedi
Had the Xmas tree up around Black Friday, got presents under the tree, I get it, but this is a non issue.

No one cares about Holidays when it comes down to what really matters, why aren't the towns defending outrageous tax rates instead of religious beliefs that only affect a select few? Nonsense issue IMHO.

edit on 9-12-2011 by JibbyJedi because: (no reason given)

You know over the last 3 years or so I have seen a story just like this on the news every year about a town that gets mad because they can't put a religion symbol on public land. I have no idea why such huge attention is given to such non-essential things, and not what really needs to be fixed.

America needs to come to the realization that Christianity is not the only religion in the world. This country was NOT founded on it. This country was founded on brave men who wanted to get away from religion persecution. To be free to worship what ever god they see fit. And have a nation that's leaders did not involve their own religious beliefs or ways of thinking on taxpayers that may not believe the same thing.

I'm sorry but if I am paying taxes for land that is publicly owned. I see no reason to have ANY religious symbolism on it.

Originally posted by GR1ill3d
reply to by mobiusmale

 

The good folks of Henderson County, Texas have decided to draw a line in the sand...and stand and fight for their right to continue to erect a nativity scene on the lawn of their courthouse - as they have done for 35 years.

If it were on privately owned land(s) this would be a non-issue. But since it's on a land paid for by the taxpayers (which includes Theists and Atheists), it has become such.

Seperation of Church and State...

You see, this is where the fringe religion-haters go a little offside.

James Madison [of Virginia] said he apprehended the meaning of the words to be, that "Congress should not establish a religion, and enforce the legal observation of it by law."

Thomas Jefferson wrote...

...legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof", thus building a wall of separation between Church & State.

I fail to see how erecting a nativity scene in celebration of a traditional American holiday in any way constitutes the County establishing a law that requires people to observe the Christian-related aspects of the holiday period...nor does it prevent anyone from exercising their non-Christian beliefs.

So...I don't believe your argument holds water.

reply to post by PrimalRed


Poor form mate, way to bring OWS into a debate that has nothing to do with OWS. You just wanted to have a dig.

How else apart from crappy blinking lights do you get people in the mood to spend all their money?

Originally posted by mobiusmale
nor does it prevent anyone from exercising their non-Christian beliefs.

But that is EXACTLY what is happening. The Christians are questioning the right of the atheists to practice what they believe. What the hell gives them that right, considering they are so up in arms about perceived persecution of themselves?

reply to post by mobiusmale


I really do not care one way or the other but I would really like for some of you to explain to me why my taxes should go to your religion in this country of America where we have freedom of religion as you just pointed out. Forcing my to pay for you God does not sound that free to me. Please explain.

I have to admit that I do not see an issue here.. my home town turns into a mini Jerusalem around Easter, each part of the city is used to hold the passion play made up of thousands.. most Christian sects join together for the fun..

Those who not want to play with them go off and play somewhere else.. be it pea tossing, or running with the pantomime animals

Originally posted by Kryties
reply to post by mobiusmale

 

The same could be said when Christians want to put bans on various things like computer games and movies that they deem to be wrong for whatever reason, or various other instances where Christians want to get rid of activities/things that others enjoy.

Should we just say to them "Chill out mate, if you can't get into the spirit please don't ruin it for the rest of us"?

Absolutely. If these activities are not breaking any laws, then they should be told to chill out, and not to try to impose their religion-centric worldview on others. They can ask (like the Atheists in this case), but we don't have to listen.

reply to post by GR1ill3d

I'm sorry but if I am paying taxes for land that is publicly owned.

There's your local battle. I'm with you there, when we can take that obligatory unfair taxation back, on land we bought and "own", then we can talk about others' problems.

Originally posted by Kryties
reply to post by PrimalRed

 

Poor form mate, way to bring OWS into a debate that has nothing to do with OWS. You just wanted to have a dig.

But its true...
If people are allowed to erect crappy wood structures and defecate in front of the court house for 3 months there should not be a reason why a bunch of people can't "peacefully protest" those who wish the nativity scene to be gone until the end of December.

I am an atheist, but as long as it is not payed for by public money and we can erect our shrine to flying spaghetti monster (pasta be upon him), I am OK with it.

We are a democratic republic, NOT a theocracy. I hear so much crap on this message board about how the Muslims suck because they live in a theocracy and can't separate their religion from their government. But then those same people, the uber Christians, just want everyone to "lighten up" about what looks, from the perspective of athiests, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, and all other denominations, like a Christian theocracy.

Practice what you preach. Put up Nativity scenes all over your front lawns if you like. But stop trying to bring religion into the public sphere. I repeat: we are NOT a theocracy!

I fail to see how erecting a nativity scene in celebration of a traditional American holiday in any way constitutes the County establishing a law that requires people to observe the Christian-related aspects of the holiday period...nor does it prevent anyone from exercising their non-Christian beliefs. So...I don't believe your argument holds water.

Baby Jesus says hello.

If Christmas was a still a fully pagan holiday and had nothing to do with the nativity scene. This story wouldn't even get a second glance.