ALL MEMBERS READ:Increased Scrutiny for Aliens & UFO Forum

I know that now that I know that the forum will be moderated more I will stop by there more often. I was usually discouraged by the constant belittling and bickering, so I never even go there anymore. I mean I wouldn't even click on a thread.

I figured that in order for me to see a UFO without the arguing, is if one came to my house and spoke to me.

I cant lie, I didn't think it was such a big deal for someone to make a mistake, and those (no names named) know it all's would come running... balloons, lights, planes, it was like they just kept refreshing the page, and never giving anyone else a chance for input.

It also didn't help that some members (I hate to admit it) are considered "Sy-Fi-UFo-Pantetary-Military Craft-Chinese Lantern-Secret Military Aircraft" know it all's, and everyone else would get right on that bandwagon.

I understand that claims made on this forum suggestion other beings coming from other planets, and revealing themselves, but seriously.... calm down, it could be worse, maybe if people weren't looking to debunk UFO's so much, they can see some of the other silliness that happens in the world.

Peace, NRE.

reply to post by BIGPoJo

reply to post by Tahnya86



I totally understand why feverishness debunkers insult people so much. It is because you are challenging their world view. They believe that we are in fact alone. Sure, some of them will make the claim that there is no evidence but the fact is you are challenging their world view.

I think that the believers as the debunkers call them actually do believe alien beings are visiting us. Some of them believe they have contact with said beings. They are tired of being ridiculed and called a liar, hoaxer, or kook. I too understand why they can be so hateful to debunkers.

Then you have the other types of people. The people between the two ends of the spectrum. I am this type of person and I personally find it irritating being labeled either a debunker or a believer because I am neither. I don't see the alien subject as a religion, I see it as a scientific frontier. I find it highly improbable that we have been visited but I also find it highly probable that life exists elsewhere in the universe. Life is too invasive just to exist on this small mote of dust we call Earth.

I fall into that middle spectrum also. I am very critical in what I accept as proof, so it takes a lot to convince me. But I can be convinced -- just have a believable case to present, please.

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by tothetenthpower

 

This includes insults, condescending remarks, ridicule, the infamous “ This has been posted a million times, use the search feature” complaints.

While insults, condescending remarks, and ridicule seem to occur with equal frequency from both "sides" of the fence (The infamous snappy comment in regard to skeptics, "Don't worry, it's only Venus reflecting off swamp gas..."), I hope this doesn't mean that it is unacceptable to point out that a given topic has been repeatedly discussed. I hope this doesn't mean that such a topic must be rehashed in a new thread. I hope this doesn't mean it becomes necessary to repeat the research already done (on both "sides'). I hope this doesn't mean it becomes necessary to repeat the same arguments (for and against) simply because new members don't want to review the ground already covered.

edit on 11/18/2011 by Phage because: (no reason given)

Seems like you hope that all the above posts up to and including the moderators original post were virtual and erasable. Not trying to be "prickish", but if you see a post that doesn't fit your idea of something you want to get involved with, then don't get into it. Meanwhile folks who want to get involved can.

Again, no offense intended, but I suspect that you did't read all the posts down to the point where you posted, or you may have seen that way around your issues, as well as some others. Again , if I have misspoken or inferred something other than the truth, I do apologize. Just going on my limited ability to make sense of what I read here.

There are some great points here. Interesting that when folks tend to sit down and point out issues without pointing blame, a lot more can get done.


Kind of like me. I believe there is life out there, elsewhere, alien if you will... Are these aliens coming to Earth? Don't know. Is there anything else that could be causing the UFO phenomena? Sure is.

The government has secret data, and material, as well as dead aliens, or perhaps live survivor aliens. Maybe so, maybe not. It's possible (even though most people consider it unlikely) that the US Government does, in fact, not have any "hard core" evidence. And regardless of what anyone posts nay-saying my observations, and you may feel very seriously that I'm messed up, we won't know until all the evidence is in.

See, I know this topic has been discussed and "re-cussed" a thousand times before, but if a "newbie" should see it, and respond, well.... We might get a new, and very interesting discussion. We don't always know which direction they will take... (Not even the old time UFO information MASTERS (8,000 original posts are more...).

reply to post by sigung86

You are mistaken. I read all the posts before mine and I spoke about a single issue, not "issues". You, like others, missed the point entirely. However the mod (the OP) whom I was replying to did not miss the point and did respond to it.

So yes, you can certainly still link another thread that's got hte same information and alert staff of duplicates so they may be closed, those rules do not change.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

There is no need for repetition of the same topics in new threads.

Long-time observer here, but this thread is the first I've felt truly compelled to comment on.

Some of you may know my handle from other forums. I'm no newcomer to the UFO debate. I've visited the ATS site for years, but I have to admit, until now, I've never wanted to step in and trade punches.

Because to those of us watchers, the outsiders who read and ponder but stay silent, too many of the ATS threads seem more like brawls than civil discussions, especially in the Aliens/UFO section.

But why is that? It's because the topic we're discussing -- the likelihood that non-terrestrials are observing our planet, and some of us personally -- is a world-changing topic. There are so many vested interests here that it has to be accepted that if there are Watchers observing us from somewhere Out There, as many believers will insist, then we would have to expect our government to not only keep tabs on these chats, but would also do their best to interrupt such civil discussions.

We've all seen the threads that discuss the further likelihood that ATS is continually permeated by the NSA, the Pentagon and perhaps a dozen other agencies. Hell, if I were in their shoes, I'd have paid assets here, too.

Originally posted by BIGPoJo
reply to post by Tahnya86
I don't see the alien subject as a religion, I see it as a scientific frontier.

But see, it's not a scientific frontier. Not anymore. It's a battleground, and we have to accept that.

Maybe the majority of us would like to believeit's a scientific frontier, and worthy of a dispassionate, objective debate. But that'll never happen, not as long as the US government maintains that "There are no such things as flying saucers," while simultaneously keeping technology from those same non-terrestrial sources as much of a secret as they can.

I'm in a very exclusive group: I've not only discussed secret UFO projects with government officials, but I've also been fortunate to have witnessed an actual UFO (with two other witnesses) and also been face-to-face with a group of Men in Black in the requisite black Caddy (again, with other witnesses). So, no one has much traction when they try and convince me that these events are simply people's imaginations.

But what I've been able to hold onto is my scientific skepticism: I'm the first one to look for the best answer, the most reasonable possibility, the overlooked scientific reality that many "quick to believe" observers fail to reach for. But I am far from a skeptic: I've gone toe-to-toe with those that the OP described, those with closed minds, or the more evil variety, those that are present simply to disrupt and prohibit a civil discussion of the subject. I do welcome the more discerning eye of an educated mind and always will, since there are more hoaxes these days than ever before. But too many hard-nosed, "my way or the highway" deniers have spoiled the word "skeptic" for those who, at heart, simply remain unconvinced.

I also applaud the ATS mods for taking this stance. I believe they, too, have seen the rise in recent years of two distinct groups of disruptors: the childish "Ur an igit, ufoes ain't real" chuckleheads, and the more sinister disinfo agents whose skills and talents are for more subtle, and who are smart enough to work both sides of the issue.

As much as I support healthy open skepticism -- and I don't mean closed-minded deniers -- still I believe every poster here must accept a very painful truth: we are in a war, people, a war to deny Their presence, to deny Their influence in our world's events, to deny They are in cahoots with our government(s). To think that we will be able to hold the posters here to the same level of civility that we would use in a discussion with our friends is to close our eyes to the reality of the position that ATS occupies.

These are the front lines in a war that is being fought for the future of our very world. And until real Disclosure occurs, there will continually be infiltrators here, paid agents, motivated rabble rousers. I encourage the ATS mods to try and ride herd on them. In fact, I cheer their bravery in policing these forums.

And if they do succeed in keeping the more obvious troublemakers at bay, they may convince many of us outsiders to come in and add our voices to the growing chorus.

/Rant mode off/

TS

I totally agreed, but it is too late.
Many important members have flown away from ATS in the last two years...

Internos
Mikesingh
Zorgon
easynow
mcrom901
karl12

and many other....

The lack of Justin (Jkrog08), R.I.P., friend, is tremendous...

I didn't even know there was a UFO forum here.

If I am to understand this right, your saying that you do not want De-bunkers posting in the forum?

Since I don't believe in UFO's, thanks for the heads up on what to avoid here.

Hope your Increased Scrutiny works out for you.

Cheers.

reply to post by lnfidel

Debunk yes
Denigrate no

I hope this will stop the "Picture or it did not happen " Posts , they were pissing me off big time !
Intelligent debunking is great , but rudeness I see has stopped me posting and replying many times .
thank you for stepping up to try and stamp it out

reply to post by wmd_2008


please download jaime maussan international ufo congress 2005-2010 (he didnt attend 2007) however he attended x-conference 2007. the xcon link is here www.youtube.com...

the others you will need to find on the web, people may not be seeding unfortunately. having seen loads of videos, i firmly believe there is alot going on in areas like mexico, and some parts of the u.s. but you often need cameras because they are up so high in altitude. there are alot more videos out there but the ones posted above are the best in my opinion, mexico is a hot spot for ufo activity.

Just one thing, could mods check the facts before jumping on a contributors back.

I've never had an issue with a mod until recently, my posts are normally 100% on topic, polite and if I do make a mistake I will instantly own up and apologise if its shown to me. I rarely post pure humour unless its on topic and its never crude.

Sadly in one group I replied to a person (the very next post) who had joked about something personal, obviously something he felt was ok to say in the group, I replied on topic and ended with an OBVIOUS clean throw away joke. Next thing I'm fined stars etc and get a manners and decorum marker. I replied to the mod explaining this perfectly, showing 100% it wasn't a personal attack which is what the mod said and I got a reply saying his decision stood, I replied back and again just got the same sort of PM back.

Now I appreciate the mods work 1000%, I've been a mod on certain groups (not ATS) over the years and its a tough and not fun job but I can say I checked every argument I responded to.

Why does it annoy me?

Because I'm NOT that sort of person to make an attack on anyone in a deliberate nasty little way.

Yes I agree on all the things pointed out in this thread and welcome them, I especially want to see and end to the "its swamp gas" single liners, it was funny 20yrs ago, not now. It come comes under the old, if you have nothing worthwhile to add then say nothing banner. I've also seen so many people with utter arrogance towards 'newbs', its the last thing we need and we also do not need cliques forming.

So mods, please enjoy your job, you have 100% our support but please don't be robots.

reply to post by tothetenthpower

Very well put.
Thank you.
I really hope this makes a difference.

reply to post by Phage


Phage, your signature rocks. I love it.
Go Twain.

Nice

reply to post by tothetenthpower


My thoughts exactly. In a way, we're mimicking how society ostracizes people for being different. People come here to avoid scrutiny for their unique ideas, but just get the same treatment here anyway.

ATS motto is "deny ignorance", yet the second an alien thread comes up, there are already people ready to put down the thread without even considering its contents.

What ends up happening is that people become SCARED to speak out and share their ideas. They get attached to their forum identity, not wanting to gain a bad reputation and lose credibility for being the guy with ridiculous/crazy ideas. It's the very thing happening in our society now. People fear speaking out against the U.S. government for fear of being labeled a terrorist/commie/socialist/anti-semite/etc.

So why do we, here at ATS, harbor the same type of attitude towards each other?

People are entitled to their opinions and can choose to agree/disagree with a topic. However, people should voice their opinions in a way that is civil and mindful of the supporting evidence the topic presents.

I find replies here on ATS difficult to follow, so I normally ignore them. So it's not really too much of a problem. A skeptic is as bad as a believer. For the skeptic there is no indisputable proof, for the believer there is no need for proof.
Anybody that's posted a few times in blogs knows that the internet is full of rude cowards hiding behind pseudonyms. People with the self esteem so tiny, that they need to be anonymously offensive. Such people are easy to detect and even easier to avoid.

just thought i would say by way of feedback, that i dont post on this forum much anymore becuz of the numerous rude and overly aggressive comments i kept getting to threads i started. one was about a ufo sighting i had. now i just come here to read mainly; or if i do post, i don't read the responses because it only gets me upset or angry to read rude responses...

reply to post by Phage


Phage, with all due respect, it is not up to you (or any other member) to decide what can be reopened or not.
If some folks want to do a all new research for a topic discussed 6 months ago, let them do it.
If you feel that it pollutes your ATS experience, there is a report function and moderators will make the call.
Fresh looks on old stories are, I hope, always welcome.

And nobody forces you to read them either.

Originally posted by Arken
I totally agreed, but it is too late.
Many important members have flown away from ATS in the last two years...

Internos
Mikesingh
Zorgon
easynow
mcrom901
karl12

and many other....

The lack of Justin (Jkrog08), R.I.P., friend, is tremendous...

Well zorgon still lurks and you know why mike left just after he was shown that his so called moon towers were actually shadows because he was looking at the picture the wrong way round! To be fair he did say he was wrong but he did leave soon after.

Then as you know I am a sceptic but I really mean this somewhere out there other life exists I do believe that, does it visit here I dont think so, I have seen to many videos at airports at night and of obvious out of focus lights, if you use a video camera yourself YOU can recognise all these things!

Also believers dont help themselves when threads are posted with titles such as BEST ever video/picture when they are not and have been shown before or when they post the youtube idiot videos.

I want to see proof, I would love to see proof and IF I saw something on here I thought was the real deal I would back it to the hilt!!!