ATS: We Have Failed!

reply to post by ofhumandescent


I don't think you understand. I'm not talking about homeless people. I'm talking about the annoying hipsters who populate my area and criticize corporate companies while wearing 100$ Gucci scarves, pay 10$ for a cup of coffee from starbuck then decide not to shower because it's "natural" and it's the hip thing to do. Almost all of my family has been in the military and it's despicable when our veterans get a raw deal.

But when these "dirty hippies" show up and protest because they have entitlement issues that's when I call them dirty hippies.

reply to post by 0zzymand0s

Above them are the political class, who are put into power by corporate money.

Only when "The People" fail to cast their votes with knowledge and forethought. In the United States, We The People actually do own and control the government. It is sad that most Americans have abdicated.

Corporations do not enter the voting booth. Americans do that, but vote blindly. The Tea Party placed their own candidates into office. The system works. Join the Tea Party.

It could be that all of the complaining that OWS is doing is because of the policies of the folks THEY put into office.

Vote smart for real change.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by sheepslayer247

 

Just like everything else regarding OWS. No taking ANY responsibility for their own actions or in this case inaction including the fizzle at the end.

Lack of Leadership

Lack of a cohesive Agenda

Lack of a clear unified message

Lack of Real Content

Union participation.

Communist Agenda....

I could go on but what would be the point?

So please, let's again [as always] lay blame elsewhere...

I've said quite a few times to Fall back, Regroup and come out swinging in the Spring with a Clear message and an established leadership who will articulate the groups clear agenda. Also, Many of us have been saying all along.

Take it to Washington and End the FED ----> Case in Point!

You didnt heard? WE ARE GOING TO TAKE TO WASHINGTON, YOU DOOF

Originally posted by sam_inc

You didnt heard? WE ARE GOING TO TAKE TO WASHINGTON, YOU DOOF

Can't you READ?

Check the date of my thread. That was written long before OWS woke up and realized they were barking up the wrong tree!

Doof indeed...

while I agree with most of what you say. It's not over. it will not end until things change. ill be the last one out there protesting if I have to.

reply to post by LifeIsPeculiar


The "peoples" vote means nothing unless

1) We use traceable paper ballots

2) We eliminate all soft money and corporate political contributions

In the meantime, a vote for anyone is a vote to continue funneling money up the pyramid, while accepting stricter control from the top. All other issues are meaningless divide-and-conquer strategies for perpetuating the top down system of consolidation and control by an international elite which controls the very idea of money and power.

Occupy was only a catalyst and drastic change is inevitable. It appears the crooks on wall-street are untouchable with citizens going so far as to support them. Their grasp on wallstreet's teet will losen in due time.

Yeah, as far as ATS goes, from what I've only personally seen, it's a pretty big fail. Very little of actually getting at the truth and facts and an awful lot of ignorant poop-slinging. But poop-slinging seems to be the rising trend all over the web and maybe the world these days. They who sling faster and harder believe they're winning and so fling faster and harder. No matter what the truth is. No matter what the facts are.

Vilify those who disagree with you no matter what. I don't really even know what's going on but these people show some characteristics of things I hate or am not supposed to support and are not exactly like me so I'm going to flap my jaws or wear out my fingers because I can.

This tit-for-tat method of politics and communication, where you can pretty much predict word-for-word by person depending on which MSM or blog they follow like a sick religion, is getting very, very old. And it's making me vomit and/or tune out more and more often too.

And maybe tuning out is exactly the right thing to do at this point. Because we sure aren't getting anywhere.

As for OWS itself? Perhaps some people are missing the point of what a catalyst is. And maybe even expecting immediate results. Do you believe that all the achievements and progress of the past happened overnight and weren't fraught with stumbling blocks, roadblocks, and even some deaths and bloodshed? Do you believe real change happened overnight (or even within the span of a few months)? No, of course not. This is no different. This isn't over or failed by a long shot. In fact, it's just beginning.

I know this is cliche but it applies to everything. It ain't over til it's over. The only way that we can be dominated completely is to allow it to occur and I for one will never give up. Even if this initial round is not won, then that only means we come up with another tactic. Just think, it only takes a small pebble to ruin a car windshield. To begin with that small rock only chipped the glass, but given time that crack will spread until it breaks the windshield.
Persistence is the key to our success. Just don't give in.

reply to post by sheepslayer247


i agree to an extent..that the people at OWS are the ones stepping away fom their computers and trying to make the change everyone says we need...and yes..theres a whole tonne of idiots still at their keyboards slating them saying they are a pest...the same idiots who scream bloody murder at our leaders and corporations and want them gone just as much.

BUT

OWS isnt the way to make change...peaceful protests are not the way

take a look...the world carries on the banks and businesses carry on

as long as people keep gathering in their thousands to hold signs and chant catchphrases the government will continue to ignore them.

change wont happen untill we force it to...i dont see it happening peacefully

Originally posted by sam_inc

Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by sheepslayer247

 

Just like everything else regarding OWS. No taking ANY responsibility for their own actions or in this case inaction including the fizzle at the end.

Lack of Leadership

Lack of a cohesive Agenda

Lack of a clear unified message

Lack of Real Content

Union participation.

Communist Agenda....

I could go on but what would be the point?

So please, let's again [as always] lay blame elsewhere...

I've said quite a few times to Fall back, Regroup and come out swinging in the Spring with a Clear message and an established leadership who will articulate the groups clear agenda. Also, Many of us have been saying all along.

Take it to Washington and End the FED ----> Case in Point!

You didnt heard? WE ARE GOING TO TAKE TO WASHINGTON, YOU DOOF

Are you referring to the March to DC? That march is crumbling into nothing.

3 marchers have simply disappeared, 2 went to new york & got arrested, & the remaining are splitting into factions.

This was two hours ago

Marchers are sleep-deprived, struggling w/internal divisions. Temps are in the 30s, it's bitter cold. 76 miles (4 days) to D.C.

www.washingtonpost.com...

Originally posted by sheepslayer247
That's right ATS.....we have failed!

What you mean "we" paleface?

Do you mean to tell me defacating on police cars and in alleys, raping women in tents, chasing little kids going to school, blocking traffic, preventing small businesses from opening, proclaiming your student loans should be free "Just because I'm ME!" and pretending to speak for 99% of the population, when most of them are at work not interested in indulging in two-year old tantrums failed?

Good.

Originally posted by argentus

 

I still believe that there is an element within many of the Occupy locations that is almost pure anger without focus. Occupy Wall Street was chosen (I believe) as a symbolic location -- the 1% don't live there or even show up there, and they aren't inconvenienced an iota by blocking traffic or anything else. There appears to me to be a facet of Occupy that wants to strike back at the thumb of oppression that has bent their backs, but it manifests as hardship for the very people they hope to welcome as brothers and sisters. The MSM, of course, LOVES to focus on this fringe that seems to me to be pure, frustrated rage. I'm not saying that the rage isn't justified, only suggesting that the manner in which it is acted out is often misplaced.

The very fact that Occupy is in the conversation and exchange of ideals and even the so-called "news" is evidence to me of the importance of the movement, because it is causing people around the globe to talk and debate. Even those exchanges that become heated and defensive have worth. I think we might look back upon this time much much later and see this era as the genesis of postive change. That is my fervent hope.

Crazy time we live in.

I feel like the general message being sent by occupy is something that the vast general majority agrees with, maybe not exactly 99%, but at least a large number of people whose circumstances are more unfortunate than others for whatever reason. Also, many people may see it as a method of invoking drastic, but necessary changes in our government and its laws, others might want a more democratic method of selecting presidents. There is a plethora of reasons to support the occupy movement, though not everyone believes it will succeed and for some there is a "my way or the highway" mentality where one particular concept or subject about OWS constitutes the whole thing as trash in their minds.

It is incredibly interesting to watch our society try to grasp a hold on to an idea that has obviously been brewing in peoples minds for a while, to watch people who were before docile now spring to life with vigor and care for the future. There are steps that need to be taken and locked door at the top of those steps, I wouldn't count on the American people walking back down the steps and going back to sleep, there is always another way out whatever it might be.

I think the ideas and motivation behind OWS have existed for a long time in this country and probably all throughout our history, it is just now taking shape in our generation. Not everyone is just going to lay down and quietly submit to an increasingly tight leash, people know whats up and there is a line drawn at a certain point, its just a matter of when that is.

Originally posted by ~Lucidity

Yeah, as far as ATS goes, from what I've only personally seen, it's a pretty big fail. Very little of actually getting at the truth and facts and an awful lot of ignorant poop-slinging. But poop-slinging seems to be the rising trend all over the web and maybe the world these days. They who sling faster and harder believe they're winning and so fling faster and harder. No matter what the truth is. No matter what the facts are.

Vilify those who disagree with you no matter what. I don't really even know what's going on but these people show some characteristics of things I hate or am not supposed to support and are not exactly like me so I'm going to flap my jaws or wear out my fingers because I can.

Uhmmm….you should know better than most that this is a forum to debate, and slinging mud is par for the course. The truth is in there for the reader to find (of course not in every post).

As far as OWS, the big movement is dead. The fanatical core is still alive and well and will pop up to cause trouble from time to time. But these people have always been around…nothing new.

Nobody is really missing the point about OWS. It’s just that the country doesn’t support socialism, friend. Free college? Socialized medicine? Demonizing capitalism! Come on!

If OWS would drop all the nonsense and demonize the correct villains they’d be a huge force right now because the country knows there is rampant corruption. Unfortunately they won’t drop the socialist, anti-capitalist BS so their support is waning…..fast.

reply to post by sheepslayer247


I dont think it was a total fail. but it was setup to fail from the getgo. It did get word out. (to some) But the message got so messed up and lost. maybe go about it the right way? Not saying i know what the right way is. But face it holding a sign or writing a letter to your congressman and even voting dont do jack squat But maybe make you feel better in pretending that you made a difference. Your going to have to go about things a lot smarter then before to get change in.

P.S. Don't think the way it was originally setup to make change. Look into the new laws and ways to make change happen

Originally posted by sheepslayer247
reply to post by Skippy1138

 

And my point was why weren't more of us out there helping them use the right methods?

Because they are for the most part, "kids". They wouldn't listen, they already thought they had all the "answers", and didn't need that sort of "help" from an old fart like me.

So I walked away, and left them to their "r3volution".

Met the same sort of thing on line. They didn't need our ideas - they preferred to try to assimilate us, make us conform to theirs. Had a trite counter for every suggestion brought up, or ignored it altogether, perhaps because they thought it didn't fit their collectivist agenda.

Fact is, what works, works, and what don't don't, and they elected to run with what don't, against advice.

Originally posted by JibbyJedi
reply to post by beezzer

 

But OWS gets poo-poo'd and it's time to throw in the towel? If that's the case, then maybe myself and others who didn't throw in with this movement were right.

What are you waiting for with this movement? What do you expect to be new and different after the 2 month mark? They are doing the same thing they did in the 1st week and getting the same results.

It's not about one extreme or the other, throwing in the towel and quitting is a bad idea with a large group like this "ready to go"... key word, "go"... go to Dick Cheney's house, G. Dubya's, the CEOs responsible in their respected corporations that helped this recession/depression come into being.

Sitting around parks gets a big

from me.

Going after the criminals, arresting them, having trials for them...

, I'm all on board for that, sign me up.

Usually I agree with your way of thinking. However, this time I feel that if it were millions of people in the parks and on the streets instead of hundreds or thousands, then we could accomplish any change we desired.

reply to post by sheepslayer247


it is unfortunate that the OWS movement seems to have been sidelined. However, I would like to point out that whatever idiot started this didnt think things through as the winter season is quickly approaching.

But, worry not, I have a feeling these protests will be back once it warms up, and right when we need, at the start of the election cycle. Im about 99% positive we will be seeing some mass protests leading up to the presidential election.

reply to post by charles1952


Sure. Especially now that we find out that the tea party groups imploded with greed, were backed by corporate interests and their candidates have become as addicted to pork and bailouts and easy money as the rest of them.

The tea party didn't quit, it was mostly a ruse to begin with, and one that was fairly quickly exposed for what it really was - a clever front for Republicans wanting to get out from under the stigma of Bush.

OWS isn't perfect by any means, but I'll throw in with them in a heartbeat before I joing the smoking remnants of the tea party.

reply to post by seabag


What I was referring to...the types of posts flourishing on ATS about OWS...isn't exactly leading to debate in my mind. Not even close. Maybe I tuned out too soon, but what I've seen is pretty narrowly focused a-ha! gotcha! type bologna.

As for OWS itself, again, a snowball rolling downhill doesn't just pick up snow as it gains size and strength and intensity. It picks up grass, rocks, dirt...all of which have found something in COMMON with the snow and become a formidable force.