Is God Satan? Could everything we know about the Abrahamic faiths be backwards?

reply to post by starsyren

What type of person glorifies "God" by crashing an airplane full of innocent passengers into a building full of office workers? God or Satan? The answer could not be more obvious. The True God would never accept a "gift" of psychotic violence; he would never make martyrs of mass murderers, he would never welcome killers bathed in the blood of innocents to paradise.

If you are using 9/11 to make your case....
God is not contained within any religion. There are people who do all kinds of things deluded that God wanted them to do it... and then there are other people who point out these incidents and make their own conclusions.

Originally posted by Grifter42
The very wikipedia link you posted but apparently didn't read. Beyond that, there are sources with the wikipedia article that are accurate if you doubt the reliability of the article itself.

I did read the Wikipedia article.

Do you have evidence The Cathars existed?

Well, I'd ask one, but they're all long dead. Do you have any evidence the black plague occurred? I mean, you have history books, and records, and documentaries, but do you have any REAL evidence the black plague existed? It's a historical event. It happened. Just because there's no one alive from the 11th or 12th century to ask doesn't mean it didn't happen.

The most important thing you need to realize is that RELIGION GOD

There is a huge difference between having faith, being spiritual, believing in a god - and "belonging to a church"...respective thinking that a church's teachings, actions and doctrines are always the same as what a true belief is actually about.

In my opinion, you do not need a religion (let alone a church) to believe in God and have a faith.
In my opinion, today's churches and religions are more ABOMINATIONS of the actual teachings, they often lead away from being a good human just focusing on superficial, non important things and NOT focusing on the really important issues.

Atrocities, murder etc. have always been and are STILL conducted because people belong to a certain religion or church - this does not mean that "God" itself is satanic....rather, that the teachings and how today's churches work are "satanic" (if we want to use that word.)

Short: Don't blame god for what people do in the name of religion.

That fact that crazy humans do crazy things "in the name of God", Allah etc. does not mean God is evil..it just shows that those RELIGIONS are crazy/#ed up.

Well, if man is crazy and genocidal, and man was made in God's image...

reply to post by Grifter42


It may seem like an exaggeration but at least one book claims they may have never even existed. Most likely they did exist but what are your sources beyond that?

Though the Cathar ritual of Provence still exists what does it say?

Quite a few more books claim Jesus and God don't exist than claim that the Cathars don't. Now, if we're going to debate the theology of mythological beings, that's quite alright, but to deny the existence of the Cathars and their mass execution by the catholics would be like denying the holodomor, or the holocaust. Let me guess. You're a catholic?

Originally posted by Grifter42
Quite a few more books claim Jesus and God don't exist than claim that the Cathars don't. Now, if we're going to debate the theology of mythological beings, that's quite alright, but to deny the existence of the Cathars and their mass execution by the catholics would be like denying the holodomor, or the holocaust. Let me guess. You're a catholic?

Of course more books make other claims, the Cathars are not widely discussed so it isnt like people would write many books about them.

No, I am not a Catholic or any other Religion.

Well i asked you a few times what you are using for sources, are you going to divulge this information?

Where are your sources that say the Cathars didn't exist? I can't find anything about their alleged nonexistence. You want my sources? Wikipedia. The Cathars are rather old and obscure, I can't see any reason they'd have to have any bias or what-not in regards to them. What's so mythical about the Cathars? They were pretty much Gnostics with some minor differences. Of course, in religion, minor differences are enough to cause wars, murders, and burnings at the stake, but still, close enough for horse shoes and hand grenades.

Where are your sources that say the Cathars didn't exist? I can't find anything about their alleged nonexistence. You want my sources? Wikipedia. The Cathars are rather old and obscure, I can't see any reason they'd have to have any bias or what-not in regards to them. What's so mythical about the Cathars? They were pretty much Gnostics with some minor differences. Of course, in religion, minor differences are enough to cause wars, murders, and burnings at the stake, but still, close enough for horse shoes and hand grenades.

I use Wikipedia all the time but in matters such as this I dont take anything at face value.

I have to tell you much of what i read prefaces with phrases like "supposedly" or "may have been" and that is the credible stuff.

Can you name five prominent Cathars?

reply to post by starsyren


You are on the correct path, with Mainstream Christianity replacing older religions, and about Yeshua being an observant Jew.

I do not grasp how you come to the conclusion that this represents ALL Abrahamic faiths, or how YHWH is really ha-Satan..

That is not logical at all.

Originally posted by starsyren


Thanks for your post! When you mentioned bible scholars, I automatically though of my History of Xianity class in college (I'm a History major by-the-way). Even after studying the bible as we did, I STILL don't understand how anyone can look at that book and see the "infallible word of God". Anyone who still believes that crap has obviously brainlessly swallowed whatever load was offered them, and will surely have a rude awakening in the end!

You can't prove it isn't, just as I can't prove it is.

So why not live and let live?

reply to post by Malcher


I visited the shrine.

I posted a link to a picture of a shrine where they were burned to death, the last massacre.img.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by hypattia
The Cathars believed much the same thing. They were massacred in the 14th century by the Catholic Church.
Below is a link to a picture of a shrine where they were burned to death, in the South of France.img.abovetopsecret.com...

Do you have any info on that stone?

OP-"Christ at no time said he was creating a new religion. He was at all times an observant Jew, faithful to the Demiurge Yahweh, and if "God" was a Jew then presumably everyone who believes in him ought to be a Jew too."

Unfortunately your post is simply based on untruths, and therefore you are led to false conclusions.
Jesus Christ came to confirm a New Covenant " "I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people." Is it so difficult to comprehend that certain people have been called to acknowledge that covenant? That God chose individuals out of this world to be His people?

No, it was not a new religion - but a confirmation of a new covenant.

Jesus was an observant Jew. That's actually a complete blasphemy. Everybody's definition of a Jew today is one who practices the religion of Judaism, but when the word first appeared in the English language in the 18th century, it simply meant Judean (someone from Judah). Jesus was the "King of the Judeans" not "King of the Jews". The fact that you "studied" the Bible and couldn't make the connection as to WHY and WHAT Jesus Christ chastised the religious leaders of His day for shows that you didn't even study the basics. Today, just as then, many of the "Jews" were practicing a religion that included so many man-made laws and traditions that had nothing to do with the worship of the Almighty God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. In fact, Jesus identified many who were of their father, the devil. Jews as the "chosen people" of God is the biggest joke going in the world today and has been foisted upon the Christian and secular world as a cancer. A malignancy that has allowed these "so called Jews" to take advantage and create a world empire of control on the backs of these "Christians" who'd rather believe a lie than the Truth. The vast majority of "Jews" will NEVER accept Jesus Christ as their Saviour because they don't worship Almighty God. In fact, you are partially right - their god is Satan. They elected to keep with their Babylonian gods to this very day.

I have absolutely no problem with you believing what you want, but it is plain to see that all of your "research" has led you no closer to the Truth. At least start with a solid foundation, not one built on sand. But then again, His Word says it all:

"The fool says in his heart, "There is no God."
"They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator--who is forever praised. "
"However, when the Son of Man comes, will he find faith on the earth?"

It really comes down to if you like poverty or wealth.

If you're poor you despise the rich, if you're rich you despise the poor.

In my mind both sides suck.

I've always thought the term "god" was not specific enough. There are many gods and obviously Satan is one of them.

Googling "evil bible quotes" is astounding. There simply is no way the god referred to is benevolent. Bloodthirsty, jealous and full of rage.

It is obvious that the main controlling method of this god is fear, not love. People should be wary of that.

I see now. Satan did a lessons learned with all of his people and the discovered that the atheism angle wasn't cutting it anymore. So they decided to take the "God is the devil" route. Veeeery interesting...but shtoo.....

Originally posted by starsyren
This is kind of a theory I've been working on for some time now. I've never been one for mainstream religion, even after being made to attend private xian schools as a child. I always felt that something was...off, about the messages they were trying to get across, even as a kid it didn't feel right. And this Jesus fellow...what the hell's going on there? This led me to research in all world religions, even occultism and witchcraft, since I was in high school.

But I've recently come across an idea. It started with a friend (a devout Pentacostal, but I don't hold that against her) who said to once that "Satan's greatest deception in this world was convincing mankind that he didn't exist. That he was no more than the Bogeyman!" Well...I can think of a Greater Deception: what if Satan not only convinced man that he was gone...but also too that he was GOD?

Controversial, I know! But that idea really stuck with me. So much so, that I started digging on it. Any information I could find, Bibles, the internet, local preachers and professors (boy did I ever piss them off!!). But it was a website that really caught my attention. Now, when I first came across this website, I was extremely skeptical, especially given its name. But I think this is more of a ruse to weed out who's willing to dig for knowledge and who's not. So regardless of whether or not this site, and the people behind it, are legit...the ideas presented here are actually pretty thought-provoking. This site contains MANY well researched, well thought out articles. But one that really grabs me is here: The Mithras Deception

Yeah...it's kinda long. But part of the conclusion sums up the idea I'm interested in really well is this:

"Christianity, in order to eliminate Mithraism, simply assimilated many of the key aspects of the rival religion: a perfect Satanic strategy. Equally, Satanic propagandists have managed to portray the Illuminati in the popular imagination as the opposite of what they actually are. However, the truth will emerge slowly but surely. One day the world will bathe in the light of Illumination and be free forever of the Satanic Abrahamic religions of Christianity, Islam and Judaism that have worked so much evil in this world.

What type of person glorifies "God" by crashing an airplane full of innocent passengers into a building full of office workers? God or Satan? The answer could not be more obvious. The True God would never accept a "gift" of psychotic violence; he would never make martyrs of mass murderers, he would never welcome killers bathed in the blood of innocents to paradise. Such people have damned themselves. But what is truly amazing is that these people believe they are doing the work of God. How did their minds become so twisted? That's how powerful and damaging Satan's propaganda is.

Christ at no time said he was creating a new religion. He was at all times an observant Jew, faithful to the Demiurge Yahweh, and if "God" was a Jew then presumably everyone who believes in him ought to be a Jew too."

--Now, I know some of you are probably at work, or otherwised pressed for time and will probably make a snap judgement on this idea based on that exerpt alone. But I encourage you, please take the time to read the entire article/essay before you start with the flaming. It's just a theory, albeit in this skeptic's mind, a pretty plausible one...and it seems plausible to me for the simple fact that it is NO secret we are being lied to. By goverments, by churches, by schools....they all do it (unwittingly or not). So, in my eyes, a theory like this...well, it just seems to fit.

What do you think ATS?

edit on 9-11-2011 by starsyren because: formatting to increase readablility

The books are made by man and therefore in my eyes no true religion. Hence a work of Satan maybe?

I am in believing the Son of God is the Sun of God
Here a nice videoclip why I think it is.


You can read it all on this site.
Son of god = Sun of God

Originally posted by DutchBigBoy

Son of god = Sun of God

Except the English language was not invented at the time. Grand Son would be really special.