Exposing the evils of Wicca Witchcraft!

Originally posted by Akragon

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by Akragon
You might notice that Jesus answered any question that anyone asked him... even hard questions like what will happen at the end of the world...

What Jesus?

There is not one shred of actual fact/evidence that "mythical biblical Jesus" ever existed.

Do you believe that really matters?

Regardless of he existed, who ever it was that the authors wrote about knew what he was talking about

What.. how can you say this?
By this statement, I could also say that JK Rowling knows what she is talking about in harry potter.

He doesn't exist does he?

*Facepalm* I just started a new religon ._.

Originally posted by darkredfish

Originally posted by Akragon

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by Akragon
You might notice that Jesus answered any question that anyone asked him... even hard questions like what will happen at the end of the world...

What Jesus?

There is not one shred of actual fact/evidence that "mythical biblical Jesus" ever existed.

Do you believe that really matters?

Regardless of he existed, who ever it was that the authors wrote about knew what he was talking about

What.. how can you say this?
By this statement, I could also say that JK Rowling knows what she is talking about in harry potter.

He doesn't exist does he?

*Facepalm* I just started a new religon ._.

You misunderstand...

His lessons are truth that can't be denied... Lessons on how we should treat each other in our lives, not just a story...

It doesn't matter if he existed, what we have from whoever it came from are lessons for life

reply to post by Akragon


Well so are the Grimm tales, The Quran, The book of Mormon, books of scientology, and about 10,000,000 childrens inspirational books.

Should we worship Judy B June (or was it blue?) now?

Originally posted by darkredfish
reply to post by Akragon

 

Well so are the Grimm tales, The Quran, The book of Mormon, books of scientology, and about 10,000,000 childrens inspirational books.

Should we worship Judy B June (or was it blue?) now?

You should worship whoever you please...

It doesn't matter to me in the least... i know nothing of any of those books, aside from a bit of scientology...

Im just telling you what i know of this book...

Take it as you will...

reply to post by nixie_nox


We all get a little heated at times, do we not? I think I can speak for the other Wiccans who have been haunting this thread all day on All Hallows, instead of dancing in the Moonlight about a fire in the forest, and being one with the Divine.
Our simple ways will never fall by the wayside, as long as Free Spirits roam, there will be Pagan Folk. We are not better than any, nor are we worse, in fact, I see every living soul as a perfect equal to myself.

For those of us who roam the Spirit World, between the dimensions, it is difficult for us to see down here into the mundane world, and see what is going on.

I believe the time has come for those interested parties for one of us to define what a Wiccan is, and what a Wiccan is not. I think what Margot Adler said pretty much says it all on what Wicca is:

"We are not evil. We don't harm or seduce people. We are not dangerous. We are ordinary people like you. We have families, jobs, hopes, and dreams. We are not a cult. This religion is not a joke. We are not what you think we are from looking at T.V. We are real. We laugh, we cry. We are serious. We have a sense of humor. You don't have to be afraid of us. We don't want to convert you. And please don't try to convert us. Just give us the same right we give you--to live in peace. We are much more similar to you than you think."

We should educate people that 'Witch' is not evil but ancient and positive. The first time I called myself a 'Witch' was the most magical moment of my life." Margot Adler
Drawing Down the Moon: Witches, Druids, Goddess-Worshippers, and Other Pagans in America

The main points to be made here are:

Witchcraft or Wicca is not a cult. We do not proclaim ourselves to be spokespersons for the divine or try to get others to follow us as their leaders.

We do not worship Devil/Satan/Pan nor do we consort with Demons.
Satan is a Christian creation and they can keep him. We do not need a created being who is author of ultimate evil. We do not need eternal
hellfire/damnation to scare us into doing the right things in life, and being in service to others. We choose to do the right thing and love our brothers and sisters because it IS the right thing, and it feels really good to do it!

We do not sacrifice animals or humans because that would violate our basic tenant of "Harm None." Anyone who does perform blood sacrifice, and claims to be a Wiccan or a Witch is lying. Blood is a very powerful thing, and is like a nuke when it comes to Real Magick, which I will get to in a minute.

We have no need to control the life force of another, worship anyone or thing to achieve mystical or supernatural powers. Our energy comes from within, our personal relationship with the Divine and Nature. The Force is available to, and used be everyone, in some way or another. When two or three like minds come together, and pray, chant, or cast, it is the power of human will that does the Magick. Here is 3D life there is a period of waiting, and we do not always get what we want, but sometimes we do get what we need.

To be a Wiccan one must be willing to do three things:
To will.
To Dare.
To keep silent.
Of course all is in accordance with Nature, and the Stars, and time of Moon, and these things always have bearing on our human will.

To be a Wiccan one must strive to attain Wisdom. When I approached the Craft, I did it with love and light, and without fear in my heart.
I had been without any thought of religion for many years, having pursued a career that truly fulfilled me in every respect. My Mother was a devout Christian, church of god, services every Sunday and Sunday night, and on Wednesday night. There came a time when I admitted to my Mom that I saw ghosts, and she of course took it in the wrong way. I was taken about at the way they all felt about it. I did not ask for this, who were they to tell me it was demons?
A few months after this, I had some questions for the minister, so I attempted to ask him as we exited the church. He patted my head and said, "go home and read your Bible, son, all of your answers are in there." He didn't know me very well. I got a copy of Strong's Concordance from my uncle, and went to work on it. I took notes, made it a real research project, my first. Now I said I had a few questions at first? When I came back I had a rather long and extensive list.
So the preacher, and a deacon, and the preacher's wife and me all went into his office. I stood while they all sat, and I began. After just a few questions they stopped me. Leave, they said. Never question God, I was told. Why not?
Many years later there came a time in my life when I was hurt, and in a weakened condition, on my back.
(contd)

Originally posted by Akragon

His lessons are truth that can't be denied... Lessons on how we should treat each other in our lives, not just a story...

It doesn't matter if he existed, what we have from whoever it came from are lessons for life

The lie and being mislead to believe in a person that only exists in mythology - - - yes it matters.

And what's worse - - is how man capitalized and manipulated "followers" through religion/politics. Definitely evil in man's greed/power. Unlike Earth beliefs that are based in Nature.

Personally - - I actually believe in "Light Beings" - - and the Watchers. I believe there was "off planet benevolent beings" involved in this particular history. But that is not the subject of this thread.

If you read the following from "above" (off planet Light Beings) - - - rather from "below" human knowledge/ignorance - - - it reads differently.

"Do not cease seeking day or night, and do not let yourselves relax until you have found all the Mysteries of the Kingdom of Light, which will purify you and make you into Pure Light and lead you into the Kingdom of Light."

reply to post by Annee


right on sister, i hear ya on all that!

i can't really buy the alien thing yet, til one shows his face...

religion as a whole has done more harm then good, but there is good in that book.

Originally posted by boymonkey74

OMG just noticed that my daily cleaning of the pipes (To help against cancer)
news.bbc.co.uk...
means Iam going to Hell lol

Doesn't mean you're going to hell.It just means you will be blind by the time you get to heaven and will not be able to see all the glory and stuff up there.You'll still be able to beat that thing like it owes you money though.

Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by Annee

 

right on sister, i hear ya on all that!

i can't really buy the alien thing yet, til one shows his face...

religion as a whole has done more harm then good, but there is good in that book.

Well I have had weird experiences since birth. Not attributing them to anything in particular - - just saying.

But I did see a UFO once. Saucer shape - self illuminating with a yellowish/white glow - clear blue skies - 4:30 in the afternoon. I actually thought it was one of those big searchlights used for advertising. Then it ascended straight up until I couldn't see it anymore.

I believe

(contd)

My son would bring me books. Using the Inter-Library Loan Program I began to study religion. I know what you all must be thinking, why bother, right? Just pick one, and be like everyone else. I have a Rebel Spirit.

I began with the Buddhist religion, it had always appealed to me after reading a book, Awakening the Buddha Within: Tibetan Wisdom for the Western World

I am part Algonquin Native, so I studied the teachings of the Tribes, and found that to be very appealing too. Trouble is, the Tribes have been infiltrated and no longer publicly worship the Great Spirit, or the Spider Woman.

I ended with Christianity, the religion of my childhood. I decided to go into it from a different angle, so I researched the Grail Legends, and went on a search for the Holy Grail. I can still remember the shock when I discovered just what it was the Templar Knights were hiding. I studied the Kabbala then for 3 years, and practiced the Rituals.

THE Hebrew word Kabbal means "to receive," and its derivative, Kabbalah, signifies, "a thing received," viz, "Tradition," which, together with the written law, Moses received on Mount Sinai, and we are told in the Talmud, Rosh Hashanah, fol. 19, col. 1, i. e., "The words of the Kabbalah are just the same as the words of the law." In another part of this work we have seen that the Rabbis declare the Kabbalah to be above the law. Basically the Kabbalah is a Jewish doctrine or system of theology. It describes or re-tells the importance of humanity's role in God's universe and how an individual is the unfolding of God unto fullness. The human is depicted by an inverted tree, designed to relate concepts of how the world came into being.

The theory goes something like this; the soul existed in a state of complete knowledge before reluctantly accepting a body; symbolism is used throughout the teachings. It was at this time a new book came to be, through a source I knew to be a sign for me. The book was The Golden Dawn: The Original Account of the Teachings, Rites & Ceremonies of the Hermetic Order

By using my knowledge of the Kabbala, coupled with the High Magicks of Ancient Times, I began to work on a Ritual. I had decided to meet, in person, my higher Self, my Holy Guardian Angel. I spent two weeks learning the Ritual verbatim, and the vibrations of the words to achieve success.
(This knowledge is not usually found on public websites)

I spent seven day preceding the Full Moon in preparation, eating light, mostly bread and water, and cereal, and washed in a ritualistic way every morning and night. On the last day, I covered my body in sacred symbols, for protection and energy, and began the ritual. I had been chanting for about an hour. Then it happened.

A most beautiful sight I beheld, twin beings of Light, male and female, but decidedly exact twins. Each had wings. I thought to my self, this is where they got that Angels have wings. They smiled at me, and I felt the most intense feeling of Pure Love I had ever felt. I was encompassed in it, and it lifted me right off the floor. I reached out for them, but suddenly I realized we were in another dimension. I don't know if there are any of you who are dimensional shifters, if so, you only will know what I am talking about. The twins pointed to their right, and I followed their gaze....

I am getting off topic, so I will leave that where it is.

Wicca is the only "religion" that ever really fit me. I think of religion, and wish everyone else would, like this. It is like unto a coat, a favorite jacket one has worn for many years. It feels comfortable, and keeps me warm and safe.
But is is only my jacket. It is not your jacket, in fact, it wouldn't fit anyone else at all, only me. I could not wear yours either.

We all need to stop this fighting over religion, which is but a humanistic thing, and has nothing to do with Spirit, and here is where we are now.

You ask a person, "who are you?" you get many different responses. Ever hear this one? "I Am Spirit." I am not "Mechanic," even though I loved doing that, I am not "White, Black, Yellow, or any other Race, I am so mixed I cannot see a difference, especially if we are all Spirit. Spirit lives in Tribes. there are 12 Tribes of Spirits. When you get there, you will know yours, and they will know you.
In the World of Spirit, the 4th Dimension, everything happens with cause and effect. Whatever you think into existence becomes reality instantly. Think of a Coke, one will appear in your hand, ready to drink. There is no punishment here, only your family, and friends, and best of all, your pets. Enough for now, Blessed Be.

reply to post by blah yada


You do realize thats a myth rigjt?

Originally posted by WarminIndy

Originally posted by wyrdwolf77
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

Not all Wiccans believe in that God.
It varies upon the person. And what say you about the rest of my post? Your god is not too much better.

So modern Wicca is merely a new religion? Then how can they say it is old and hold to little of the old religion?

Earth based religion is very old. Wicca is just one of many earth based religions. There are many Christian religions much younger than others but they're still christian religions.

Originally posted by EarthChilde
reply to post by avatar22

 

In fact, the meaning, as perceived by most people I have entered into conversation with regarding this very statement, is further to include yourself in the group of 'no one'. So do what you will, lest you harm no one, means not only will you do no harm to your fellow human, you will do nothing to harm yourself either. Sounds like a pretty decent way to live to me.

Very good Alot of Wiccans don't even pic up on that but it's true. Alot of covens point it out but some don't. The first person you need to treat right is yourself. If you can't treat yourself right you won't have the energy to treat others right.

Originally posted by WarminIndy

Originally posted by avatar22

When you have a plethora of religions that say "Do what thou wilt.." which means "It's your thing, do what you want to do.." that leaves it wide open for you to do just exactly what you want, even if it means you are permitted to lust and commit adultery, that permission given by that entity.

reply to post by WarminIndy

 

But that is not what is said at all.
"Do what thou will, lest ye harm none" is the phrase.
Meaning you are free to do anything so long as no one is hurt by your actions.
It is EXACTLY the same meaning as
"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you"

"lest you do harm" can be a relative term, as you say mine can be. Wicca does endorse revenge and love casting spells. I said in my very first post that my brother practices Wicca and we have many conversations about the subject. It is not like I know nothing about it.

You know as well as I do that there are people in Wicca who take that concept and forget about the "lest you harm none" because that is human nature to do that.

Please point out where revenge is endorsed?

Love spells are done in the form of helping a person find happiness in love it's not done on some unwilling victim.

And the so called wiccans who do spells for revenge get into wiccan magick with the wrong idea. They statr self teaching and then call themselves wiccan when in fact they're just people dabbling and if they stay at it long enough they learn the hard way that negativity comes back.



The Wiccan Rede
(Full Version)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bide within the Law you must, in perfect Love and perfect Trust.
Live you must and let to live, fairly take and fairly give.

For tread the Circle thrice about to keep unwelcome spirits out.
To bind the spell well every time, let the spell be said in rhyme.

Light of eye and soft of touch, speak you little, listen much.
Honor the Old Ones in deed and name,
let love and light be our guides again.

Deosil go by the waxing moon, chanting out the joyful tune.
Widdershins go when the moon doth wane,
and the werewolf howls by the dread wolfsbane.

When the Lady's moon is new, kiss the hand to Her times two.
When the moon rides at Her peak then your heart's desire seek.

Heed the North winds mighty gale, lock the door and trim the sail.
When the Wind blows from the East, expect the new and set the feast.

When the wind comes from the South, love will kiss you on the mouth.
When the wind whispers from the West, all hearts will find peace and rest.

Nine woods in the Cauldron go, burn them fast and burn them slow.
Birch in the fire goes to represent what the Lady knows.

Oak in the forest towers with might, in the fire it brings the God's
insight. Rowan is a tree of power causing life and magick to flower.

Willows at the waterside stand ready to help us to the Summerland.
Hawthorn is burned to purify and to draw faerie to your eye.

Hazel-the tree of wisdom and learning adds its strength to the bright fire burning.
White are the flowers of Apple tree that brings us fruits of fertility.

Grapes grow upon the vine giving us both joy and wine.
Fir does mark the evergreen to represent immortality seen.

Elder is the Lady's tree burn it not or cursed you'll be.
Four times the Major Sabbats mark in the light and in the dark.

As the old year starts to wane the new begins, it's now Samhain.
When the time for Imbolc shows watch for flowers through the snows.

When the wheel begins to turn soon the Beltane fires will burn.
As the wheel turns to Lamas night power is brought to magick rite.

Four times the Minor Sabbats fall use the Sun to mark them all.
When the wheel has turned to Yule light the log the Horned One rules.

In the spring, when night equals day time for Ostara to come our way.
When the Sun has reached it's height time for Oak and Holly to fight.

Harvesting comes to one and all when the Autumn Equinox does fall.
Heed the flower, bush, and tree by the Lady blessed you'll be.

Where the rippling waters go cast a stone, the truth you'll know.
When you have and hold a need, harken not to others greed.

With a fool no season spend or be counted as his friend.
Merry Meet and Merry Part bright the cheeks and warm the heart.

Mind the Three-fold Laws you should three times bad and three times good.
When misfortune is enow wear the star upon your brow.

Be true in love this you must do unless your love is false to you.

These Eight words the Rede fulfill:

"An Ye Harm None, Do What Ye Will"

Originally posted by wyrdwolf77
Okay.
Seeing a thread like this really upset me.
I don't care what religion you are. It gives you no right to bash upon others for what they believe in. Honestly. You should be ashamed of yourself.

Wiccans DO NOT believe in Satan. That is a point in itself.
I don't understand how not wanting to grovel before a selfish god's feet makes me subject to worshiping something that was created by the church to scare people into their religion.

Wiccans believe that what you do comes back to you times 3.

Do not compare several other religions together. Each religion has its own belief systems. And should be viewed separably, not comparability.

Wicca actually DOES predate Christianity. I actually got a source to further back up my point:www.newageinfo.com...

According to this source, Wicca predates Christianity by about 28,000 years. Further evidence that has been discovered further backs up this given fact.
Wicca is modern, but it is based upon the old belief systems. Bringing back the old. To better ourselves and those around us. What is so evil about that?

Then you go on to not only insult my personal spiritual choice, but attack another.
The next attack was on Satanism.
I am not a Satanist, and I do not follow this religion. However, I am openminded enough to not bash on it and actually have an understanding of what it is.
You may want to read this: www.newageinfo.com...

Maybe it will help you understand that religion does not define WHO you are.

You then say yourself, that Christianity is intolerent of all faiths. But doesnt that go againt your own Bible?
You have created a contradiction. And several at that.

You also go on to talk about "Pan". Not all Wiccans worship Pan. And I strongly doubt that all Satanists do. But I will not speak out too too much upon their behalf, because I do not want to give false information.
In either way, Pan is not the "pervert" you made him out to be.

There are quite a few explicit things in the bible, and Im sure that you can name a few. We are talking back thousands of years. The times have changed. You need to remember that.

And now, I am going to open your eyes a bit. I am not going to bash upon your religion, but I feel that you should know their ARE faults in it. Since you so closemindedly said otherwise.

- Jesus has not returned.
I would think by now this "Rapture" would happen.

-The God that you so wholeheartedly follow has done nothing For you. Only TO you.
He has lied.
Cheated.
And been selfish.
Murdered.
Everything.

For we are "in the image of him", so he must be very sinful.
But your retaliation will be "Satan".
why would a loving God have created Satan in the first place? He is all knowing, so why make it happen?
"To create free will"
If we are in the image of God, wouldnt we already HAVE freewill?

He gives no choices.
Choose him or Die.
A little closeminded.
If you dont want to praise him forever in heaven, you have to burn in hell forever.
That is a bit dramatic.

But, I will not insult your religion if you can restrain from doing so to others.
Clean out your own house before you attack my own.

On that note I'd like to point out that Jesus "knew" Mary. 2000 years ago to "know" a person was to be "getting it on" with a person. As was pointed out in the book Holy blood holy grail Jesus and Mary would have been getting it on out off wedlock because they "knew each other" so it's a sure bet that Mary was the Holy grail because as a result of "knowing" Jesus she carried his blood( Jesus was going to be a dad). Kind of brings into question the bit about being married in the eyes of the church.

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by Akragon
You might notice that Jesus answered any question that anyone asked him... even hard questions like what will happen at the end of the world...

What Jesus?

There is not one shred of actual fact/evidence that "mythical biblical Jesus" ever existed.

Actually apparently there is. I was watching a documentary and in it they found his tomb in Israel ( which the Israelis banned access to and closed it off after they become aware of what it was as a result of the documentary researches) but he had a mother and real father and brothers and was just a normal but nice bloke with a following. Also Holy Blood holy grail is a bit of an eye opener. But it turns out that the names were so common for the time that if you went into a market place and yelled "I'm looking for Jesus son of Joseph and Mary" that you'd get more than a few blokes walking up to you.

Originally posted by steveknows

Originally posted by WarminIndy

Originally posted by wyrdwolf77
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

Earth based religion is very old. Wicca is just one of many earth based religions. There are many Christian religions much younger than others but they're still christian religions.

The question I had asked last night was taken from the source I posted. I will reiterate my question to get an understanding on Wicca/Paganism.

I understand from the site I used as a source, the author of the site is Wiccan and offered a lot of information on the subject. The expert of Wicca said that Wiccans and Pagans can serve any way, path or deity they choose. I think most of the Wiccans on here agree with this statement.

Wiccans and Pagans themselves are so varied but they agree that one Wiccan can serve Loki while another can serve Pan and so forth. The problem though arises here, which I would like to discuss civilly. If a Wiccan or Pagan is allowed to serve any deity, within the defined definition and prescribed way to worship said deity, and that Wiccan or Pagan chooses to serve Satan as he is defined by Christians, then is that Wiccan or Pagan not then a Satan worshiper.

I know that Wiccans say they don't believe in particular entities, some they accept and some they do not and Wiccans say there is no ultimate good or evil, those are relative terms within the definitions. But going back to the question, a Wiccan that is permitted to follow whatever path they choose in the defined modes of worship through specific rites and rituals to that particular deity, entity, force, or spirit and they choose to worship Satan, while saying they are Wiccan, they are permitted to do so, and by definition have become a Satan worshiper?

There are literally thousands of different deities out there in the Universe, and which ones you choose to honor will often depend significantly upon what pantheon your spiritual path follows. However, many modern Pagans and Wiccans describe themselves as eclectic, which means they may honor a god of one tradition beside a goddess of another. In some cases, we may choose to ask a deity for assistance in a magical working or in problem solving. Regardless, at some point, you're going to have to sit and sort them all out. If you don't have a specific, written tradition, then how do you know which gods to call upon?

paganwiccan.about.com...

If it is allowable and permissible, then even though one says "I am Wiccan, but don't believe in evil" and then follow the path of Satan within the definition of Satan, then that Wiccan is a Satan worshiper.

Would this be a fair assumption that there are then indeed Wiccans and Pagans who are Satan worshipers, because they have covered themselves under the umbrella of the name Wicca or Paganism? I did not say here that all Wiccans or Pagans did that, but I would like to get the understanding that those people are offered the choice to worship evil as they define it within Wicca because it is permissible, according to the expert I sourced.

But while most Wiccans here say that Wicca does not believe in evil, there are those who do. How do you address those who have chosen to follow a way, a path, or a deity that by its own definition is evil?

reply to post by WarminIndy


I can't speak for all Wiccans or Pagans here, but I have to agree with you on this point.
By definition, if a Wiccan worships Satan as one of their deities, then yes I guess you could say that they are Satan worshipers.
As to how these people are addressed...
Well, the same as anyone else is addressed.
Again, I cannot speak for everyone, BUT a big part of nature-based beliefs is that we are free to choose who and how we worship. Faith is a very personal matter and cannot be put into a single box. Though we may not agree with the way some believe, we understand that it is their right to do so, and that the Creator speaks to everyone in different ways. We understand that we are in charge of our own lives, and afterlives. We tend to agree that judgement is not something that we can do to others, or others do to us, we answer to our selves and whomever our higher power is.
Does that help to clarify?
There is of course a lot more to it, but hopefully I helped you with your questions at least somewhat...

reply to post by WarminIndy


So I can understand from that broad definition of Wicca, that people can think Christians could also be Wiccan. That may be why it is easy to believe Jesus was a witch or a sorcerer.

So as a Christian, I think it would help if I should explain why the Christian religion is different than Wicca. We believe that God is the Creator of the universe, and all that is seen and unseen. Jesus was present at creation and took an active part in it. As Christians, we believe that Jesus was not only there, but that He is Lord over all creation, both the seen and the unseen.

We also believe that God is omiscient, omnipotent and omnipresent. We believe God is holy and that He speaks for Himself and revealed Himself throughout history without the aid of man. God is a spirit. But God Himself prescribed the way He should be worshiped and why He should be worshiped in that manner. He was the one who said that we come to Him through Jesus Christ, the Anointed One that is the express image of God. We believe He did this because He wants His creation to honor Him.

We may have various rites or rituals that are different, just as in Wicca. But for the Christian, it is about accepting God as Truth and our lives should reflect that. We, as Christians, have chosen to follow the way of Jesus, because we found Truth in Him.

Originally posted by avatar22
reply to post by WarminIndy

 

I can't speak for all Wiccans or Pagans here, but I have to agree with you on this point.
By definition, if a Wiccan worships Satan as one of their deities, then yes I guess you could say that they are Satan worshipers.
As to how these people are addressed...
Well, the same as anyone else is addressed.
Again, I cannot speak for everyone, BUT a big part of nature-based beliefs is that we are free to choose who and how we worship. Faith is a very personal matter and cannot be put into a single box. Though we may not agree with the way some believe, we understand that it is their right to do so, and that the Creator speaks to everyone in different ways. We understand that we are in charge of our own lives, and afterlives. We tend to agree that judgement is not something that we can do to others, or others do to us, we answer to our selves and whomever our higher power is.
Does that help to clarify?
There is of course a lot more to it, but hopefully I helped you with your questions at least somewhat...

Thank you for that. I know there are Wiccans and Pagans who may disagree with you on that, but at least we can have meaningful discourse on the subject.