BREAKING NEWS! Over 10,000 occupying Wall Street.

The saddest part--or most ironically comical part of this whole thing-- is that in ten years, some of these protesters will be on the very balconies they now walk under. Drinking champagne and laughing about youthful indiscretions back in the day.

The faces are all the same. The bored, well off and white run it while the bored, well off and white bitch because they aren't on those balconies themselves.

This isn't a revolution, it's breaking boredom.

Originally posted by Phantom28804
reply to post by Cuervo

 

Those aren't protests? There isn't even clear direction in that list...

1. They have taken our houses through an illegal foreclosure process, despite not having the original mortgage. Pay your bills and this doesn't happen? Aside from that what change do they want free housing?

2. They have taken bailouts from taxpayers with impunity, and continue to give CEO’s exorbitant bonuses.They don't give CEO's bonuses?????? CEO's are paid by the companies they work for not the government.. Though I do agree with the bailout part.

3. They have perpetuated gender inequality and discrimination in the workplace. Again "They" have nothing to do with this? If you do not take the time to claim these discriminations that is on no one but you, the ones perpetuating them are the companies not "They"

4. They have poisoned the food supply, and undermined the farming system through monopolization. Ok this one I am just not even sure on. Sure the FDA is part of the government, and needs to have some work done, but not sure what you are referring to about the poisoning. I would assume you mean additives that were created by the companies and approved by the FDA which would bring merit to the claim so in closing I'll give you this one.

5. They have continuously sought to end the rights of workers to negotiate their pay and make complaints about the safety of their workplace. Ok this one is all wrong once again "They" do not run the business and if youa re protesting a company then protest the business not the government or Wall Street

6. They have held students hostage with tens of thousands of dollars of debt on education, which is itself a human right. Not sure on this one if you are insisting that education be free at even college level not sure how that will go over. They don't even have free college in the socialized parts of the world.

7. They have consistently outsourced labor and used that outsourcing as leverage to cut workers’ healthcare and pay. This again is on the companies, but the government does have no legislation preventing this from happening so there is a duality of guilt here.

8. They have influenced the courts to achieve the same rights as people, with none of the culpability or responsibility.This one I don't agree with as there are many government officials who have been thrown in jail or arrested and charged with things just like we are.Case in Point John Edwards, and there is even a congressman in SC being charged with Tax Fraud right now.

9. They have spent millions of dollars on legal teams that look for ways to get them out of contracts in regards to health insurance. On this one I am not even sure who "They" is referring too. The government has no control over health insurance other then dictating the law that health insurance follows. They dont' have contracts with them so I am assuming you are once again referring to a business level.

I think the above demands just further emphasize what I and others were referring to when we stated they have no clear message or goal.

edit on 10/1/2011 by Phantom28804 because: (no reason given)

Dude, really?

The foreclosures they are talking about are illegal. Words mean things.
The CEO bonuses were paid by us because it came from our bailouts we gave them!
The rest of saying that "they" is not Wall Street is just false. Follow the money. You will find that nearly every decision that has squashed the viability of small businesses and workers have come from Wall Street private interests and career lobbyists.

reply to post by illuminatislave


So then the point of the protest is for the government to impose more legislations on the business world to ensure they do not outsource and to ensure they have more jobs for Americans? This would effectively destroy the whole point of owning a business and being succesful. So I guess the end all result is that everyone is equal and no one is above anyone else.

You should read this books by Terry Goodkind called the Sword of Truth, but specifically the Faith of the Fallen. Gives you a good idea how things will be.

Say what you will about them, but this is a peaceful nonviolent protest. They mean well.

Without bull horns or microphones the protesters are going to need runners. Echoing is a terrific idea for many reasons. The first that comes to mind is it re-enforces ones resolve. Soon telephones and access to the internet is likely to be interrupted. Cell phones were shut down in San Franciso. Yahoo has already done it, the others will follow. Runners, a very ancient form of communication, can't be interrupted. It's about as low tech as it can get, but New Yorkers know how it's done. MSM will distort the info because it is what that media does.

Having, just this moment, channeled the 60's..POWER TO THE PEOPLE because WE (are) THE PEOPLE.

reply to post by Cuervo


Ok so there is merit to the Illegal Foreclosure thing. I honestly don't know enough about it to say and I don't have the time to research it.

Bonuses paid to CEO's from bailouts and you have proof of this other then reading it on sites like this?

The rest you didn't even bother to argue at all so that tells me you don't know either

After thinking about it a bit. I had to add this part. Your "Dude Word's Mean Stuff" That whole comment just gives me a whole new perspective on your age, maturity, and level of experience in the world. I cannot even articulate the impact that statement had on your whole argument.

Originally posted by Phantom28804
So then the point of the protest is for the government to impose more legislations on the business world to ensure they do not outsource and to ensure they have more jobs for Americans? This would effectively destroy the whole point of owning a business and being succesful. So I guess the end all result is that everyone is equal and no one is above anyone else.

Exactly. We want the end of the master and slave dynamic. We want a world of equality where we work for each other. That is the demise of successful business and the start of our automated utopia. This is what we, the majority, want. We are powerless to get this from our masters. We must leave the plantain and start from scratch. Our old masters will not be able to maintain their game without us.

reply to post by gentledissident


So you want a world where basically everyone is equal and everyone makes the same amount of money, eats the same amount of food, has the same amount of responsibility etc. Which as the food runs lower and lower there will be no one to make me more because we are all equal and therefore if you were to have more by growing your own food then you are no longer equal to me and that wouldn't be fair.

Good Lord remind me to relocate if that world comes to be.

Originally posted by Phantom28804
reply to post by gentledissident

 

So you want a world where basically everyone is equal and everyone makes the same amount of money, eats the same amount of food, has the same amount of responsibility etc. Which as the food runs lower and lower there will be no one to make me more because we are all equal and therefore if you were to have more by growing your own food then you are no longer equal to me and that wouldn't be fair.

No. A world where the amount of money you have cannot influence laws and screw with the lives of human beings that do not have as much as you do.

Originally posted by Phantom28804
reply to post by Cuervo

 

Ok so there is merit to the Illegal Foreclosure thing. I honestly don't know enough about it to say and I don't have the time to research it.

Bonuses paid to CEO's from bailouts and you have proof of this other then reading it on sites like this?

The rest you didn't even bother to argue at all so that tells me you don't know either

No, it's simple. They were going to be bankrupt. Meaning those CEOs would have been unemployed. They used our taxes to bail them out. Then they get massive bonuses. What does that tell you? Doesn't that look like you and I are paying their bonuses?

Originally posted by Phantom28804
After thinking about it a bit. I had to add this part. Your "Dude Word's Mean Stuff" That whole comment just gives me a whole new perspective on your age, maturity, and level of experience in the world. I cannot even articulate the impact that statement had on your whole argument.

edit on 10/1/2011 by Phantom28804 because: (no reason given)

Dude...

Seriously, if contemporary terms of endearment make you blind to the substance of the conversation, we are more doomed than I thought. Dude.

Originally posted by Phantom28804
reply to post by gentledissident

 

So you want a world where basically everyone is equal and everyone makes the same amount of money, eats the same amount of food, has the same amount of responsibility etc. Which as the food runs lower and lower there will be no one to make me more because we are all equal and therefore if you were to have more by growing your own food then you are no longer equal to me and that wouldn't be fair.

Good Lord remind me to relocate if that world comes to be.

Well, you generalized, fear mongered, and used some faulty logic, but I think you know what I'm saying.

Too bad you won't stay for some beans and rice.

Which is your favorite part of "the system", being the slave or being the master?

I am reading these threads on ATS about American citizens occupying Wall Street, trying to do something to change everyone's life and I cannot believe my eyes seeing that there are people mocking them and making sick jokes about those guys.

I come from a country where we had a REAL revolution; our "beloved leader" decided to speak to the people one day and there were 100,000 people booing him, throwing things on him, trying to get him despite of the police, army and secret services protecting him like he was the one of the world's marvels.
Then they started shooting the people, killing them; the people retaliated... with their bare hands. The whole country was rising and fighting with bare hands. They were using bricks, bottles, bats, anything that could be thrown or hit with against ARMORED VEHICLES and AKs. The whole mess took one week. Many people died. One day, the Army decided to switch sides, and that was the beginning of the end. The "Beloved Leader" was caught along with his wife and they were both put to trial, sentenced to death and executed by a platoon of soldiers. I swear, there wasn't a single man, woman or child who wasn't ready to put a bullet in their heads.
There is, however, something else I want to emphasize: nobody dared to mock the ones in the streets, nobody dared to make sick jokes about them; people died: men, women and children were shot by snipers or by the tanks' machine guns.
We are free now; our freedom, apart from so many countries around the world, wasn't bring by US Marines' boots. We earned it, by our own blood, by sacrificing ourselves, our parents, our brothers, our children.

There are people now who are trying to start fighting against a sick and corrupted system. And you, some of you, dare to mock the ones who are beginning to fight for everyone's good.
For more than 50 years, America was our light in the dark: we hoped America will intervene to get rid of the Red Russians - they PROMISED that! - we also hoped that America will help us to get rid of the Communists - after all, US of A was the citadel of democracy! - and for years we watched people trying to fulfill the American Dream.
And you, some of you, are mocking those people out in the street.

What is happening to you, America??? What is happening to the country I loved from distance for more than 40 years? What is happening to the people I was so proud of, like they were my own people, the free Americans, the proud Americans, the daring Americans?
Oh...I think that people doesn't exist anymore. It was sucked into a life full of commodities, with their huge TVs, their cheap cars, their fancy offices, their neat houses... but guess what??? All of these were LOANED to the people! And now it's time for the people to pay their debts, with a huge interest!
Now, America is facing the real world's challenges. And they are mocking each other.
TPTB is all over the people, infiltrated them, hoarding them, spreading rumors and dividing the ones who have big enough ones to fight against the system.

This isn't America I loved, not anymore.
I want "my" America back. I want to know again that there is a country I can look upon like to a beacon in the dark, teach my children about it as a positive example to the rest of the world.
I want my America back.

I know I got carried away a bit. But I really do regret that there aren't 200,000 people in the streets...

Originally posted by 8ILlBILl8
WOW this is grate. I just saw a women yelling and the people repeating what she yelled. You can hear it echo at least 5 times to spread the word. That means their is a hell of allot of people their. I really hopes this grows and they do not give up. If 1/4 of new york protested for one week the economy would fall and the bankers might have no choice to but start war or give in to demands.

And where will most people be if the economy falls? I recognize that there are people out of work, but most of us still have too much to lose. A house, a job, a family to raise. Yes, we are worried about the economy. Yes, we are worried about the people that have lost homes and jobs. We want to help them regain them while not losing what we have. And, despite the poor performance of our economy, there are still more of us than of them. And we do not want the economy to fall. Asking for a massive economic failure does nothing but ensure that the majority will support the status quo. And that is probably what this protest REALLY aims to achieve.

Originally posted by illuminatislave
No. A world where the amount of money you have cannot influence laws and screw with the lives of human beings that do not have as much as you do.

How do you stop influence?

There's nothing wrong with collecting stuff. We the people, however, should be the designers and manufactures. We should own the means of production and share the product. The only disparity should be the amount of junk accumulated.

We have the technology for the" life of leisure", the "world of tomorrow". It has always been the carrot on the stick. We have had the carrot all along.

reply to post by gentledissident


Oh my favorite part of the system is the part that gives you the freedom to say what you want and me the freedom to say what I want

Aside from that the whole ideal of Socialism is flawed.

Do I want to live a miserable existance of rice beans leanto's and minimal housing just so we are all equal? Absolutely not.

I mean my logic has no fear mongering in it. It is absolute truth. If you are not getting paid for your work then why would you want to take the time to build better houses or roofing? You wouldn't why should that guy have a better house or roof then you? Why should you have to work more then someone else when you are all equal. Read the book I implore you.

As for the rest I am no longer going to reply as I feel at this point I am basically trolling as its obvious the majority on here are idealists of the same age range and do not approve or agree with my sentiments so have a nice day, and enjoy your rallies.

When you are ready for real change let me know and I'll be standing by your side till then sorry not for me I spent my time in service to our country and our freedom and I don't feel like throwing those years away to embrace the same principals we fought against over the last century.

It's about time people! We, as Americans have the right to stand up for what we believe in. This is something that should have happened years ago. When we stand together as one voice we have the power to change things for the better. If this is what it takes for the Americans to be heard by the corrupt U.S. Government so be it!

Throughout history it has always took a revolution to bring change to this great nation. It now appears that a new revolution is at hand. I can’t wait to see what the next move from the government will be. Because, if the government comes to the decision that the only way to end this is with force against its own people, the results of that action will not be pretty.

Originally posted by Phantom28804
reply to post by gentledissident

 

So you want a world where basically everyone is equal and everyone makes the same amount of money, eats the same amount of food, has the same amount of responsibility etc. Which as the food runs lower and lower there will be no one to make me more because we are all equal and therefore if you were to have more by growing your own food then you are no longer equal to me and that wouldn't be fair.

Good Lord remind me to relocate if that world comes to be.

Why do you need more than someone else? What it is that makes you feel the need to have so?

If you don't starve, have everything you need, have a secure job, and good health.... why does someone else have to starve so you can have a little more?

Having more doesn't make you a better person or someone to respect, intact I would respect you less for wanting more. And remember, since you are already passed the point where you have what you need... what is the rest for?

I don't understand people like you.... is your life so empty that you need to compensate with material goods?

Anonymous has called for the occupation in other major city's. I live in Michigan and on OCT 15th the protest/occupation in lasing MI stat capitol. It starts on the capitol buildings stairs..

i have a full time job... but man i want to go.. but I'm not sure I'm willing to loses my job over this. maybe ill just donate water/food on the weekend/paydays instead of going myself ill just help supply.

I posted this on another thread, I really want to hear what YOU think...

I don't know what to make of this whole thing yet, I'm still on the fence. I know that we were being bombarded the by media with images and HOPE for the Middle Eastern Countries that took to the streets. Protest has been the theme this year. I suppose we are to believe that the uprisings have affected change for the better in the countries they transpired in, but I hardly believe it is any better than status quo for the little people. Libya is another enigma altogether; I do not know what to believe about how the people were treated in that in country as there are opposing sides of information.

That being said, I can't help but get the feeling we are being set-up. It was the same feeling I got during the election of 2008, and some may agree with me when I say it seems that was case. I went and looked at the web-site for the occupy movement...wow, so far... so fast.

The idea of protest seems short of the mark. Many of us agree the entire system needs an overhauling. I could start with economic problems, but there's political, education, and social problems that seem just as glaring to me, and need just as much attention. If I were to list what's obviously corrupted in these systems where most of would agree about those shortcomings, that list would go on ad infinitum.

I think the greatest danger we face is the idea of protest, leading to rebellion in this country. Ghandi said,
“FIRST THEY IGNORE YOU, THEN THEY LAUGH AT YOU, THEN THEY FIGHT YOU…THEN YOU WIN” ~
But at what cost? And what is it that you win???

It seems a reckless waste of time to begin to dismantle one system, without a reasonable assumption of a starting point for something new. These people on the streets have no idea what that might be, or if you were to ask them, it would be hard to find two people to agree. I consider the idea of a "reset" using the current system, and all I see is a repeat. The thing is, a revolution needs a leader and a great new idea, and when I hear the word "REVOLUTION" I think about a particular candidate for 2012, and I look at the calendar, and I think, and I think, and I think...(talk about a revolution LOL)...

In any case, I'll leave you to figure out what I'm hinting at, and your thoughts, and ask you, what do you think about that...?

Originally posted by flice

Originally posted by Phantom28804
reply to post by gentledissident

 

So you want a world where basically everyone is equal and everyone makes the same amount of money, eats the same amount of food, has the same amount of responsibility etc. Which as the food runs lower and lower there will be no one to make me more because we are all equal and therefore if you were to have more by growing your own food then you are no longer equal to me and that wouldn't be fair.

Good Lord remind me to relocate if that world comes to be.

Why do you need more than someone else? What it is that makes you feel the need to have so?

If you don't starve, have everything you need, have a secure job, and good health.... why does someone else have to starve so you can have a little more?

Having more doesn't make you a better person or someone to respect, intact I would respect you less for wanting more. And remember, since you are already passed the point where you have what you need... what is the rest for?

I don't understand people like you.... is your life so empty that you need to compensate with material goods?

Ok yea I was done with this thread, but I honestly have to reply to this cause that is the funniest $^#$ I have heard in a long time. You don't know me or how I live. I am living paycheck to paycheck and I am hanging on by the skin of my teeth. Does this mean I want to have less then I do because that would be fair? No. Does that mean that I think I should have more then you because I worked harder and saved up my money? Yes because why should I not be able to save my money and get something nice? What right do you have to say that I can't?

Furthermore how did you get that from anything that I said in that post that you quoted?