Nikola Aleksic: Stop Chemtrails or...

Originally posted by sally123
Our government has used, lied to, manipulated, stolen from, spied upon, intimidated, raped, and murdered its own people.

None of which shows that chemtrails exist.

Now, you can argue all the fine details about that while airport security does its spying and our leaders do their lying. I am accepting it and attempting to communicate with other people who have accepted it and do care about our children's future. I did not come on here to talk to you.

Did you come on here to provide some actual evidence??

Originally posted by sally123
Our government has used, lied to, manipulated, stolen from, spied upon, intimidated, raped, and murdered its own people. Now, you can argue all the fine details about that while airport security does its spying and our leaders do their lying. I am accepting it and attempting to communicate with other people who have accepted it and do care about our children's future. I did not come on here to talk to you.

What else do you accept without evidence. I am completely aware that the government is guilty of various crimes and these things should be discussed and confronted. However, I will not promote an easily debunked myth based on ignorance and bad science. Misguided anger will get you nowhere. What exactly was it that made you accept the hoax that is chemtrails? I think the real conspiracy is to distract people from real crimes that are occurring. If anyone is a so called paid disinfo agent it is the people who promote chemtrails and have zero evidence to back it up. Hell, we can even trace the start of the hoax and who has benefited from it.

So please tell me what was the clincher? What convinced you beyond a shadow of a doubt that they are spraying our skies?

reply to post by sally123

If you haven't noticed, the (prolific, tireless, ever present) chemtrail deniers seem to believe that if they repeat the lie often enough, people will believe the lie.
It is their job. Or, they seriously have NO life. Actually, either way, they have no life.
Pick one.
Rude? Perhaps. But true.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


Sure go ahead and pick and choose what you reply to.

Why not answer my question?

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Again, why was my credibility questioned if this is soo well known?

Originally posted by tsurfer2000h
reply to post by FreeSpeaker

 

Your not really serious about this video are you? Man have you ever been out in a boat, because all it is showing are boat wakes nothing more. Please pay a bit of attention before posting things like this video and trying to say they are spraying chemicals.

I didn't post that. Take a look again at the context of the post.

Originally posted by SirClem
reply to post by sally123

 

If you haven't noticed, the (prolific, tireless, ever present) chemtrail deniers seem to believe that if they repeat the lie often enough, people will believe the lie.
It is their job. Or, they seriously have NO life. Actually, either way, they have no life.
Pick one.
Rude? Perhaps. But true.

It is funny that you say deniers have no life when it is the chemmies who display their ignorance and believe in an easily debunked myth. Yet they still repeat the same old garbage that has been shown to be false. I can understand about getting wrapped up in the intrigue of a conspiracy but allowing it to overcome your sense of reason displays nothing but stupidity.

So here is your chance to show exactly where the lie is that we keep repeating. What EXACTLY have we said that is demonstrably false? Please I eagerly await your response. If we have repeated it so often it should be easy to find.

I came on here to see whether any of the people who are beating their heads against brick walls would like to stop that right now and do something more life-affirming. So far, no takers, so I will be moving on to more fertile fields and just checking back occasionally. Debating is for college. This is real life. The awakened people need to stop asking your permission to ACT on what they already know. That is self-empowerment, choosing either strawberry or chocolate ice cream, without convincing Daddy that your choice is the right one. I do not need you to believe in chemtrails or that 9/11 was a total con job or that our government lies constantly about everything or that the current events in the Middle East are very dangerous or that another financial raping and major freedom restriction is underfoot. I do not need you, whoever you are, to believe anything. I need people who already know these things. September will be UGLY. Lead, follow, or get out of the way.

reply to post by megabytz

The lie is insisting that what I see being sprayed are normal contrails.
Simple enough?
The group I was referring to will be here long after I go, they were here long before I came.
Like I said, no life.
Edit: And, that is where your stars come from, the chemtrail lurkers.

Originally posted by sally123
I came on here to see whether any of the people who are beating their heads against brick walls would like to stop that right now and do something more life-affirming. So far, no takers, so I will be moving on to more fertile fields and just checking back occasionally. Debating is for college. This is real life. The awakened people need to stop asking your permission to ACT on what they already know. That is self-empowerment, choosing either strawberry or chocolate ice cream, without convincing Daddy that your choice is the right one. I do not need you to believe in chemtrails or that 9/11 was a total con job or that our government lies constantly about everything or that the current events in the Middle East are very dangerous or that another financial raping and major freedom restriction is underfoot. I do not need you, whoever you are, to believe anything. I need people who already know these things. September will be UGLY. Lead, follow, or get out of the way.

No debating is not just for college. Argumentation has been used for thousands of years by philosophers, scientist, and great men of all stripes as a way to get to the truth of matters. Our founders used argumentation extensively to shape our country as did the founders of various other civilizations. Argumentation has been used to find the truth of matters to prevent people from acting on falsehoods. It is an effective and precious tool, if only people would learn its methods and rules. The fact that you deride it as something that is 'for college' as if you are now above it shows how little you know about rational discussion and the pursuit of truth.

Originally posted by SirClem
reply to post by megabytz

 

The lie is insisting that what I see being sprayed are normal contrails.
Simple enough?
The group I was referring to will be here long after I go, they were here long before I came.
Like I said, no life.
Edit: And, that is where your stars come from, the chemtrail lurkers.

edit on 18-8-2011 by SirClem because: Chemtrail lurkers and schmucks

Okay well tell me how they are not simple contrails.

What about them makes you think they aren't contrails?

Originally posted by sally123
That is self-empowerment, choosing either strawberry or chocolate ice cream, without convincing Daddy that your choice is the right one.

I don't think that beliefs are things that you pick arbitrarily, like a flavor of ice-cream. They are realizations that you arrive at based on the available evidence. Realizations that can and should change if new evidence comes to light.

Once you've arrive at a belief, you also don't want to simply stop looking at any evidence that seems to contradict your belief.

Perhaps I am wrong? Perhaps you are wrong? What does the evidence indicate?

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

 

Sure go ahead and pick and choose what you reply to.

Why not answer my question?

Originally posted by FreeSpeaker

Again, why was my credibility questioned if this is soo well known?

I didn't answer it because it is irrelevant - I had asked where debunkers said the 1950's/60s experiments didn't happen - look at your original claim

- www.abovetopsecret.com...

Many debubkers like to claim there has never been any proof that chemicals have ever been secretly sprayed over populations. LAC & Dew2 debunk that claim.

so in fact your claim wasn't just that "many debunkers" had said that a/c were never used - you said "many debunkers like to claim" nothing had ever been sprayed at all!

And you were and are clearly wrong - so it seems you are trying to change the nature of our discussion to avoid having to admit you are wrong.

Sorry - but that isn't going to work.

However I will answer this question you have asked because it is relatively simple - as far as I can see the credibility issue in the thread you linked to appears to have been in regard to whether or not the aerial sprays at the time would have looked like contrails or not. Sorry you couldn't figure that out and had to go blow it all up by mistake.

Originally posted by SirClem
reply to post by megabytz

 

The lie is insisting that what I see being sprayed are normal contrails.
Simple enough?

Sure - it's easy to write.

so why isnt' it easy to provide some evidence to back it up?

Calling debunkers liars is strong language so I'd expect you to be able to back it up with credible evidence.........go on - be the first....

The group I was referring to will be here long after I go, they were here long before I came.

ah - can't be me then - you joined here 8 months before I did

edit on 18-8-2011 by SirClem because: Chemtrail lurkers and schmucks

Intersting reason to edit!!

reply to post by megabytz

What?
Like an anonymous member of ATS is going to ask me why I "think" these aren't normal?
You are kidding, right?
If YOU think it is normal, you are the one with perception problems. I have read these threads extensively, and I have seen the tactics played out. I have no desire to engage such a worthless and fruitless pursuit.
And yes, I know how the responses will play out.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

Before I go,
I have chickens. They are pretty brainless creatures, but entertaining. Your avatar is fitting.
You cannot disprove chemtrails, clearly.
The world is catching on Gaul. Real people, not dancing chickens.

Originally posted by SirClem
reply to post by megabytz

 

What?
Like an anonymous member of ATS is going to ask me why I "think" these aren't normal?
You are kidding, right?

Why would you conceal evidence of something nefarious going on??

Why is the the evidence showing that chemtrails are a crime of some sort something only to be shared among small groups of people who know each other??

If YOU think it is normal, you are the one with perception problems.

There's no problem with someones perception if they can recognise that a contrail looks like a contrail.

There's something wrong with someone's perception if they think they can tell that a white cloud has a particular chemical makeup that involves somethign other than water and exhaust gases from 6+ miles away just by eyeballing it.

I have read these threads extensively, and I have seen the tactics played out. I have no desire to engage such a worthless and fruitless pursuit.
And yes, I know how the responses will play out.

Indeed - as have we all - chemmies such as you will claim contrails are something else, and refuse to provide anything in the way of evidence to supporthe claim.

Debunkers all note that you dont provide any evidence, and will link to the prolific evidence that contrails are contrails.

And therefore "you" will conclude that "your" inability to probvide evidence proves that debunkers are all paid government disinformation agents, liars, blah blah blah.

Originally posted by SirClem
reply to post by megabytz

 

What?
Like an anonymous member of ATS is going to ask me why I "think" these aren't normal?
You are kidding, right?
If YOU think it is normal, you are the one with perception problems.

It's not just him, it's also 100% of all meteorologists, scientists, and meteorology students.

It's also, every single book on meteorology.

It's also all of recorded history, old photos, videos, science papers, newspapers and magazines. They think that's normal contrails.

You'r the odd one out. So surely you have a reason?

Originally posted by SirClem
reply to post by megabytz

 

What?
Like an anonymous member of ATS is going to ask me why I "think" these aren't normal?
You are kidding, right?
If YOU think it is normal, you are the one with perception problems. I have read these threads extensively, and I have seen the tactics played out. I have no desire to engage such a worthless and fruitless pursuit.
And yes, I know how the responses will play out.

No I am serious, I really want to know what has convinced you so that the trails you see in the sky are anything but normal contrails.

Please tell me how you can distinguish between contrails and 'chemtrails'

Originally posted by SirClem
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

 

Before I go,
I have chickens. They are pretty brainless creatures, but entertaining. Your avatar is fitting.

Thank you - I chose it to try to make CT's feel more comfortable - clearly it has done so for you

You cannot disprove chemtrails, clearly.

Ah - the old argument from ignorance - thanks - it's been at least a day or 2 since some CT or other has pulled that one on me.

Being unable to prove that something does not exist does nto mean that it DOES exist.

Have you ever heard of Russell's teapot??

And of course there is also a logical argument evidence of absence - if something should leave evidence, then the absence of that evidence is actually reasonable evidence that the "something" is not there.

chemtrails as they are described should leave some evidence - if they are spraying alluminium or barium or germs then where are those things in the atmosphere?? where is the infrastructure required to support this massive effort? Where are the whistle blowers? Where is the aircraft equipment??

There are none - so it is perfectly reasonable to conclude that chemtrails do not exist.

The world is catching on Gaul. Real people, not dancing chickens.

Yes the real world is catching on - and starting to realise the real harm and waste of resources that stupid conspiracy theories like chemtrails cause.

The politics of paranoia

Originally posted by SirClem
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

 

Before I go,
I have chickens. They are pretty brainless creatures, but entertaining. Your avatar is fitting.
You cannot disprove chemtrails, clearly.
The world is catching on Gaul. Real people, not dancing chickens.

He doesn't have to disprove 'chemtrails'. He is not making the positive claim. The burden of proof lies with the chemmies.