UFOs or Space Junk Near the Surface of the Moon?

Originally posted by zorgon
Phage says;

Originally posted by Phage
sort of a mirage effect.

Kandinsky says;

Originally posted by Kandinsky
I'm stumped for any lunar-based explanations and they aren't TLPs (transient lunar phenomena).

And missing are the hoard of debunkers

As an experienced photographer, I can tell you the first thing I'd do when I see something like this, is clean the lens, and if it's a reflector telescope both the primary and secondary mirrors.

I give 2 to 1 odds the cause is droplets of water on the lens, or if taken through a window, drops on the window. There are several indications of this.

They look like other photos of water droplets on the lens.

The droplets have an effect of capturing the dark sky and light moon inside the water droplet when the droplet is on either side of the edge of the moon, and this is exactly what we see in the video.

Also, once they are too far from the edge of the moon where they can no longer refract the black sky, we lose track of them, which would be another characteristic of water droplets.

Look at the droplet in this photograph near the horizon which has so much contrast in it (top arrow):

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/2746ce8d44ba.jpg[/atsimg]

The droplet way below it in the road almost fades out because there's no contrast that far from the edge (horizon) (bottom arrow). I suspect this is why these "objects" fade out as they move away from the edge of the moon, it's the same effect.

By the way it doesn't necessarily have to be water, there are other kinds of contamination on the lens or optical system that can have a similar effect. But water will do it. Where I live we sometimes get water droplets like this falling from the sky that don't even make the ground wet. If you don't have sensitive skin, you may not even feel them.

reply to post by Arbitrageur


Interesting theory,but when the"objects" appear on the horizon against the backdrop of space,
then continue across the surface of the moon, appearing to change color,or contrast,at such a distance,
would a water droplet have the same effect?
Just wondering.

I personally think they are exactly what they appear to be, objects of some kind which are "flying" above the surface of the Moon.

Not surprising either considering the history of astronomers seeing all kinds of strangeness while observing.

Also nice to see the "debunkers" all hiding under rocks on this one.

I'm not sure if anyone else noticed this, but right before the 3rd set of arrows, I notice another "orb" flying near the surface. I circled it in the image below. Watch the video and you will notice it right before the 3rd set of arrows are shown. You need to watch it in 720, and full screen to see it properly. Right before the "2" in the upper right changes to 3 for clarification.

Edit : I noticed it was the 2nd object that was pointed out. But if you follow it, you see it comes out from the shadows, illuminates, then back behind the moon.

Originally posted by kdog1982
Interesting theory,but when the"objects" appear on the horizon against the backdrop of space,
then continue across the surface of the moon, appearing to change color,or contrast,at such a distance,
would a water droplet have the same effect?
Just wondering.

Yes, my 2 to 1 odds means I'm 67% confident it's water droplets or something like that.

If he's got the camera on a tripod, the camera is not moving, but the moon is (actually the Earth is rotating which makes the moon appear to be moving). So actually the water droplets, the camera and the lens would be stationary, and only the moon is moving. You can see the moon moving in the left hand frame. And that's exactly how it would look after using software to stabilize the position of the moon in the right frame. The drop would appear contrasty above the surface of the moon just like the drop in the photo I posted looks contrasty above the horizon.

Originally posted by expat2368
I personally think they are exactly what they appear to be, objects of some kind which are "flying" above the surface of the Moon.

Not surprising either considering the history of astronomers seeing all kinds of strangeness while observing.

Also nice to see the "debunkers" all hiding under rocks on this one.

Who says the two different pseudonyms claiming to have observed this are astronomers? Or even are two different people?

I asked earlier about checking with real lunar observers at ALPO -- that seems worth a try.

Here is the video I took on June 16. You should watch it in full screen and look at the upper left side of the moon.
Around 10 seconds in. I'm trying to get it uploaded in HD. I'll come back and change it when I do.

Originally posted by Arbitrageur
I give 2 to 1 odds the cause is droplets of water on the lens, or if taken through a window, drops on the window. There are several indications of this.

if they are water drops... why do they appear and disappear?

reply to post by virraszto


You set it for private

Sorry about that. I just fixed it. I hope it works ok now.

Originally posted by Aliensun
reply to post by K-PAX-PROT

 

More than likely, these are stars that are being occulted by the Moon. That means that from our viewpoint, perspectively, they are being passed by the Moon. You will note that in the full Moon images, the Moon is moving across the field of the 'scope as it does when the 'scope if fixed, not automated to follow the motion of the Moon. In the closeup, the Moon appears stationary and the objects seem to move. That is exactly opposite of what is actually happening--the Moon is the only thing moving.

I would consider that...except that the "objects" become black dots once they move in front of the white moon background before they fade...possibly overwhelmed by the moon's glare. Seriously, I think even Phage's weak "debunk" of saying it's some sort of mirage effect is stronger than the "occultation" theory.

reply to post by virraszto


At the 11th second of your video, as you jerk the camera the anomaly copies the movement so I'm going to say it's something on the end of your telescope or whatever it is you're using to zoom in and film through.

This is the first post in the Aliens and UFO's forum I've felt compelled to read this year. Star and Flag!

IMO, what we're seeing is either:

a. Lunar-based ships ferrying "people" and/or cargo from one location to another location. Since the ships seem to disappear, they're probably entering an opening that takes them into underground facilities.

b. Computer Generated tiny blobs. Wouldn't a CGI hoax of little blobs be far easier to create than the many CGI hoaxes of terrestrial U.F.O.'s that have been posted here from time to time?

-CareWeMust

Originally posted by zorgon

Originally posted by Arbitrageur
I give 2 to 1 odds the cause is droplets of water on the lens, or if taken through a window, drops on the window. There are several indications of this.

if they are water drops... why do they appear and disappear?

They appear first of all because of the rotation of the Earth causing the apparent motion of the moon.

Once you have relative motion of the moon and the water droplets, they appear and disappear due to refraction.

When they first appear, they are against the black sky, and when the edge of the moon gets close enough, the droplets start to refract the bright surface of the moon inside the drop, that makes them appear lighter, that's why they first appear while they are still against the black background of space.

As they cross the surface of the moon, they then refract both the darkness of space and the brightness of the moon into a concentrated area as in the example photo I posted. As they move across the surface of the moon, it remains visible for a time as it continues to refract the blackness of space inside the droplet.

Eventually, it gets so far from the edge of the moon, it can no longer refract the blackness of space, and it appears to vanish. It probably doesn't actually vanish, it's still there but since everything it's refracting is the same color, it just doesn't show up, like the droplet in my earlier example which has the road as a background.

Each droplet acts like a panoramic or wide angle lens. Here's an example:

en.wikipedia.org...

An image of the Golden Gate Bridge is refracted and bent by many differing three dimensional drops of water.

Note how you can see the dark color of the land/sea in each water droplet even though the drops are all on the light background of the sky. This is exactly why the "objects" in the OP video remain visible over the moon for a while, except the dark part they refract is the darkness of space, instead of the dark land/sea in this example. The dark land/sea isn't even in the photo yet it shows up in the droplets.

reply to post by Arbitrageur

I was thinking in terms of refractive thermal effects of a warm lens and cool air.
Refractive effects of water droplets is a better explanation, being more localized.

reply to post by Phage


Hahaha, one of your less convincing comments

This is great, but to be expected. The truth is coming soon, at an outlet near you.

You people never fail to amaze me. They follow the camera movement, they are attached to the camera or the telescope! ATS should change their motto to deny intelligence.

First of all are those objects near the Moon or could they be here on earth high up and just happen to be in the field of view the other thing people making comments about seeing things on the Moon with video cameras etc a little fact for you.......

The Hubble in Earth orbit with NO problems regarding atmospheric shimmer etc can resolve objects about 300ft across yes with its 2.4mtr mirror it can just make out an object around 300ft across........

So you wont see much with your videos cameras and your 6,8,10" scopes sorry.....its a FACT!

Just because these objects look close to the Moon doesn't mean they are it could be simply high flying birds yes something that simple.

reply to post by TheAnnouncementMovement


but theres no "anomaly" at from 9-12 seconds so how does it follow the camera jerk?

Also everybody here needs to pay attention to the object after about 40 seconds where you can see it travel in front of the moon and turn dark. thats where your best bet at debunking this is but for the time being none of these explanations really seem likely to me. S+F a jolly good ufo vid my friend

I don't think anyone is capable to come to a definite conclusion as to what they are, because they are simply too small in size.