Clarification on Time and What Creates it

Where do we measure time?
Here and now.
We measure all things from where we are, and we are always here and now.
Here and now are eternal, ever present.

When you see the moon you could say that it is a long distance away, but really you see it instantly.
You can say no, i know how far away it is and it takes X amount of time for the light from the moon to reach my eye. But this is knowledge given to you that has been accepted as true. But in your experience, without prior knowledge it is seen intimately and instantly here and now.
All 'things' are experienced within you, and then the mind makes stories about it.
Listen to the radio, where is the sound heard, we may look at the speaker and know it is coming from there, but where is it heard?
Look at any 'thing' 'out there', what we usually do is go 'out there' a bring an object to us. But try not to see what is in front of you, you will see that it is impossible. We are recieving all the time, 'things' appear to us, in us. There really is no time or distance because it all happens here and now.

Originally posted by PhysicsAdept
My main purpose for posting this is merely to have other people brainstorm their thoughts about this, maybe help refine my ideas. What is time? Can it be truely calculated? Is it really about what happens through prediction, or is it what happens through chance that makes the difference in time? I did write this, it is not from anyone else but me. If i got anythin you believe to be wrong... PLEASE point it out.

I'll just share my own thoughts, since who knows who's right or wrong.

An Intro to Time

When something happens, the occurrance begins, exists, and then it ceases to exist. Each occurrence has its own unique span of physical manifestation, and as we all know, larger occurrences contain lesser occurrences. This means that occurrences are scalable in nature. This also means that within even the briefest perceivable occurrence, there are even smaller, briefer occurrences. At some point, the events themselves become indivisible. I refer to these indivisible "building blocks" as Change Units, and the uniform span of existential manifestation that each possesses is the Unit Rate of Change (URC). If you get enough of these units gathered as an event trajectory, you can perceive that trajectory. A ball rolling across a floor is a good example of a linear event trajectory, where as a mpon orbiting around a planet is a passable example of a redundant event trajectory. All that we view as matter is made up of both linear and redundant event trajectories that are tightly layered into what I call Martrixed Event Trajectories. We (you and me) are impessive examples of matrixed event trajectories. At least we are while we're in corporeal form.

Time is the measurement of gathered Change Units, and all that exists as matrixed event trajectories share the same URC. This causes reality to appear solid and stab;e and material to our corporeal perspective. It also causes us to perceive a before, now and after. The definition of the Unit Rate of Change, in this case, would have to be the word now.

The Variables That Can Explain What Happens in Time:

Chance and Randomness

If there was no such thing as Information, then chance and randomness would be pure and 100% authentic. The truth is that Information does exist, and that it sets "channels" of change potential and plausibility, as a result of historical precedence and situational factors that can include a withering list of attributes dependiing on the impending change. A ball, falling off a table, is only allowed a specific suite of options once its progressive tragectory is interrupted by the surface that awaits its impact. Obviousy, this is neither true chance or randomness, since the ball is not allowed to vaporize, to explode, to curve off into hyper-speed flight, or any of a broad range of trajectory responses.

The reason for this is that each contextual environment (reality) is gradually developed by change and the resulting facts of each change recording the ramifications of that change on emerging structure and the relative yes/no that logic uses to establish order (redundancy, expediency, and other staples of progressive development). We know this is true by the fact that organization, progressive development and redundancy exist in overwhelming manifestation around us and within us. I realize that it's popular on this forum to deny the presence of physical regimentation and dependable consistency of order, but it's an undeniable fact that this is what enables us to even contemplate its existence at all.

So, chance and randomness are words we use to describe the minute range of available options that an event trajectory is allowed to take, and the range of possible linear event trajectories that are available to intersect and change the course of that initial event trajectory.

Luck

Again, we're dealing with trajectory potentials, only this time we're looking back on the impact of either intersecting trajectories or the lack there of, and assigning predestination (even if only a split-second's worth of predestination) to what did or did not intersect that initial linear event trajectory. Luck and destiny are assigned in retrospect in all instances. Each can be imagined as being in play during the arc of a specific trajectory's course of progression, or even anticipated as being part of the intersecting suite of event trajectories that will affect such an arc, but the assignment of luck and/or destiny is always done after the trajectorys arc has completed. It's always a 20/20 hindsight revelation.

In essence, luck and destiny are human inventions, and they mitigate both the bad results that we achieve and the good results that others achieve. They're coping mechanisms.

Spontaneity

Again, trajectory potentials. Within a mature contextual environment, spontaneity is extremely unlikely, and if accomplished, the range of possible avenues of manifestation are even more rigidly confined. As creative as I might decide to be, I can't turn my atoms into quarks and spread my corporeal body into a mist that's finer than air on a whim. I can't be spontaneous to the degree that I can imagine spontaneity. Impending trajectory intersections can't be absolutely spontaneous either. The linear progression of the event trajectory that is my own corporeal development can't suddenly be impacted by a linear event trajectory that reconstitutes my corporeal matrix whole into that of a flag pole. In my imagination it can, but in reality, this will never happen to me.

Spontaneity is a word that we use to describe plausible linear event trajectory change potentials. They are extremely limited, regardless of what the double-slit experiment says to a handful of quantum theorists who've gotten their books published and are hoping for further book sales.

Instinct

Instinct is our word for the DNA information directives as translated and implemented by the corporeal brains of what I consider to be the epitome expressions of multi-layered, matrixed event trajectories. In fact, this DNA matrix management scheme is the default for all such systems, and only the human version of this high-end level of event manifestation is capable of overriding such management directives with the data configurations that emerge as a result of the brain's interpretation of those directives. 99% of those configurations involve sub-system management details, but that 1% that contains awareness of self makes all the difference between what is human and what isn't human.

That 1% reaches back and actively sifts through all that is presented to the short term memory as cognitive information, and picks and chooses what will and won't be allowed in. In this way, it fine tunes its own relative Identity over the course of the corporeal matrix' linear progressive trajectory. In the end, when the corpse has dropped, this 1% will emerge as the fully developed human being. Basically, that 1% uses the rest of that 99% to create itself, and this is what's unique about the human being.

Instinct is always there and affecting the human mind, but the human has the additional influence of Intellect to mitigate the impact of Instinct.


So, I thought we were discussing Time?

reply to post by PhysicsAdept


I agree with you, time is just a perception of the present. When we are gone there is no time.
I can compare this to a night, when going to sleep if there is no dreams nothing at all you wake up as if you just gone to bed, everything seems like 5 minutes from the moment you fall asleep to the moment you wake up.

Originally posted by pepsi78
reply to post by PhysicsAdept

 

I agree with you, time is just a perception of the present. When we are gone there is no time.
I can compare this to a night, when going to sleep if there is no dreams nothing at all you wake up as if you just gone to bed, everything seems like 5 minutes from the moment you fall asleep to the moment you wake up.

edit on 15-7-2011 by pepsi78 because: (no reason given)

And yet, everything else carries on and time moves forward while you sleep. You can isolate your senses completely, and reality will still be there all around you. It'll still be there inside you. You'll still age, even as you pretend that you've mastered time by eliminating all perception of it. Time is bigger and more impactful than your opinion of it. Everything that collects to become you is time-centric, and that's just the truth of it all. Only in your imagination is time flexible in any sense of what that word means. Outside of your own thoughts of it, time rules each contextual environment without challenge.

And yet, everything else carries on and time moves forward while you sleep. You can isolate your senses completely, and reality will still be there all around you. It'll still be there inside you. You'll still age, even as you pretend that you've mastered time by eliminating all perception of it. Time is bigger and more impactful than your opinion of it. Everything that collects to become you is time-centric, and that's just the truth of it all. Only in your imagination is time flexible in any sense of what that word means. Outside of your own thoughts of it, time rules each contextual environment without challenge.

That is very interesting what you say there, everything moves forward, I know, it's just how fast does it move ?

I don't think time is a stable unit, people invented the clock and added a version of how time is defining it by a clock.
But that''s how they calculated it, other meajurments can be made. So when we calculate time it's really how we see it, maybe it's not time that is moving things, just our perception.

Originally posted by pepsi78
I don't think time is a stable unit, people invented the clock and added a version of how time is defining it by a clock.
But that''s how they calculated it, other meajurments can be made. So when we calculate time it's really how we see it, maybe it's not time that is moving things, just our perception.

Our perceptions are fooled when it comes to time. Time is never in fluctuation. The indivisible event unit is the building block of all that emerges as physical existence, and the simplicity of how change is stepped from event unit to event unit, building into chains of events and whole event trajectories is what establishes the stability of it all. This is how progressive development is possible. This is how redundancy is possible.

The idea that time is flexible suggests that the sub-structure of reality is much more complex than it could ever be (and still survive to any degree whatsoever). Think simple and extremely primitive when you're dealing with existential staples, like Time. Time is as primordial as it gets. We humans over-complicate the entire premise, and fail to understand it as a result.

Something happens, and when it does, it emerges as a chain of lesser events that are strung together. The span of that occurrence's existence is a definable collection of indivisible event units. Those event units "set a common clock" for everything that occurs within a full contextual environment (in other words, a defined reality). That extremely simple sub-structure bases the entire concept of what the word REALITY represents.

Humans create time. Humans create every 'thing'.
I create time by saying tomorrow or yesterday. I have not really created anything, just a belief, the illusion of time.
When i say tomorrow or yesterday it is always now. I can not say anything in the past or future, because they are not real and never were and will never be. Whatever happens will only ever happen now presently.
The whole of 'time' appears now. If i speak about the past it is a story arising presently, if i speak about the future it is a story arising presently.
I am the creator and destroyer of all worlds.

reply to post by Itisnowagain


Ha yeah I suppose one could take that route. What about stargazing, looking INTO the past?

reply to post by PhysicsAdept


When one looks at the tiny dots of light in the darkness of the sky, specks of white are seen.
The mind has information that has been downloaded that tells us that they are stars! The view that is seen has information added to it (mind stuff), like these stars are millions of miles away and the light that i see takes X amount of time to travel from there to my eye. But really how long do you have to stand there to see it?
The dot of light is seen instantly, now.
All time and distance is measured from where you are standing. It is all relative to the observer. You are the observer and if you notice, you are always here and now.

What you have no interest in, doesn't get registered.
Unless the mind says, 'something exists, nothing exists'.
Mooji.

youtu.be...

Originally posted by Itisnowagain
What you have no interest in, doesn't get registered.
Unless the mind says, 'something exists, nothing exists'.
Mooji.

youtu.be...

This reminds me of a child who makes me disappear by covering his little eyes. It's precious, but inaccurate. All it takes is for reality to reach in and prove that it still exists regardless of whether the child refuses to acknowledge its presence, and the child never tries that little maneuver again.

Philosophy is fun, but it's not reality, and no amount of intellectual influence can reason away what is real. Seriously. Try putting your assertions into practice some day. Like, with cars on the freeway. Lose interest in the entire fact of freeway traffic, and see what comes of it. I'm going to suggest that it'll resist your influence.

reply to post by NorEaster


Yes, and with a bus barreling towards you like that, physics would make sure it exists.

However, imagine this boy you speaks of doesn't just cover his own eyes, but covers the rest of his senses that lead to him knowing your existance... You then do not exist with him at that moment is what I predict. In fact what can then only exist as you is what he placed in his memory, a view of the past. Because the past and future cannot exist (to some people that have replied to this thread ) then you DO NOT exist to that child

reply to post by Nor'Easter


The reality for the child with his eyes covered is darkness with no vision apparent. He can not see you so to him you do not exist (in his experience). If a truck came along and smashed into him this would be his reality. The reality would not say 'truck' or 'smash', it would be a sensation felt. Reality can not creep in. Reality is.
What ever is happening is reality.

If you had never seen a ghost you would say that ghosts are not real, yet some say they have seen them.
If you believe in matter but no scientist has ever seen any matter does it make matter real?
You may live your life worrying about yesterday or tomorrow, if you believe they are real.

Philosophy is fun, however it is also very practical in helping determine what is my problem and what is not. It blows away many strongly held beliefs.

It is your belief that reality is over there and can come from there and jump out at me.
You seem to think reality is separate from your experience.

Did you watch the video?

reply to post by Nor'Easter


The video and the post i posted say; what is conceived is; what is perceived.
You believe that philosophy is fun but useless, it is your perception.

There is nothing 'real' until you have perceived it so.
It is you who decides what is real and what is not. It doesn't matter how many people tell you you are wrong, until you see the truth they will be wrong.

A friend of mine was so excited about the vision he had seen in the night sky, he was convinced he had seen ufos, until someone pointed out that on that particular night chinese lanterns had been released for a memorial, i saw the truth hit home. For him the reality was unidentified flying objects until they were identified flying objects.

It is not about making 'things' disappear by not thinking about them. It is about no 'things' being real until you create it with thought. A thought about tomorrows meeting is given the power to keep me awake at night if i believe the thought. The thought arising is reality but believing in the thought is not necessary, because tomorrow does not exist. Reality is what is happening Now in the moment. Thoughts appearing, sound, vision, smell etc. Reality is not something that will happen or could happen.
We may have heard stories about tomorrow, but has anybody seen tomorrow?
A bar in town has a sign up saying 'Free Beer All Day Tomorrow'.

Nothing "creates" it. If we view it as a dimension, it's like asking what creates length.

Humans are story tellers and magicians.
We tell stories about 'things' that do not exist and never will.
We magic time and space out of nothing.
We are the creators and destroyers of all worlds.

There is no world separate to your existence.
Yet you do not exist and neither does the world.
Only 'this' is.

The mind builds worlds and the mind believes in every one of its creations. It doesn't notice that it sees only one at a time, each one created destroys the last. The world that is present (for you) is the one that has control over you. Is it reality or is it an imagination, a story about some other time or place?
It believes in time and time becomes its master.
If other times are being secured who is here to see this moment.

Time is a lie.
What is the truth?

youtu.be...

Originally posted by Itisnowagain
You seem to think reality is separate from your experience.

You seem to think that your perceptions supersede reality. It'd be interesting to watch during that 1st moment in your life when that notion is finally debunked. I hope you survie it. Some don't. Reality is much more disinterested in you than you are in it. I've already seen just how disinterested reality is in what we think about it. No amount of philosophical gymnastics can affect what is and isn't real. Perception isn't and has never been reality. You'll discover that someday. Everyone does eventually.

Did you watch the video?

No. Does it still exist, or did my disinterest in it cause it to vanish? If not, then there you are. No loss, as far as I'm concerned. Youtube is lousy with those kinds of videos.

reply to post by Nor'Easter


Then, that is your up to your willingness to inquire into the nature of mind. The mind does not know reality, it only thinks it does!
The mind will tell you something is lousy (when it hasn't even allowed you to look) and it is trusted.
Are you going to let your mind decide everything for you?
Who is it that gives the power away to the mind?
Whos mind is it anyway?

If it is your mind, it is time to claim it back and be the owner of it.
It is not wise to allow the mind to be in charge of you.