Illuminati and Freemasons in cahoots....

reply to post by AugustusMasonicus

I proved to you the seal is masonic, what more do you want ? The notion predates the seal, and it's no eye of providence, that is made up with the seal in the 17th century. Prior to that term there is no eye of providence.
It is a masonic icon, it proves the rosicrucian masonic foundation and where it originated from.
Plus the other 3 points I made.

It says nothing of the sort. It refers to the personification of Honor.

Well yes, Honor, I explained that factor a while a go.

Saturn does not have a personification of greed, glory or power in Roman mythology. Stop inventing things.

The roman empire was built on that notion, further more saturnalia was a very important roman holiday.
Saturn represented in roman culture is the same thing, as romans got it from the greeks, it's the same god khronos, same deity, stop deluding your self.

Triple Tau found in the Royal Arch Degree is an icon of masonry, yet more exposure.

The Tau or Tav means “cross,” and is the final letter of the Hebrew alphabet. It is numbered 300 in the Greek and 400 in the Hebrew numerical alphabet. The tau corresponds astrologically with the planet Saturn and the concept of finality

But let's go even further.
Now for the father time(saturn) and the virgin (lady of liberty) from a masonic source.
www.phoenixmasonry.org...

I bet you can't coment on this, let's see justice now. Looks like you are totaly exposed to the truth.
This just shows the afiliation to the roman empire, and the connection to the statue of liberty to Saturn.
I know you are going to tell me it's Christian. The seal is masonic as I told you.
You don't like justice when it's not on your side , do you ?

As I was saying

Ultima Cumaei venit iam carminis aetas;
magnus ab integro saeclorum nascitur ordo.
iam redit et Virgo, redeunt Saturnia regna,
iam nova progenies caelo demittitur alto.

Saturn and the lady of liberty, the return of the saturnial law.
Where the notion of the seal inscription comes from.

Don't forget.

Masons built it, masons found the project to put it where it is, it was installed with a masonic ceremony.

Problem is you can't have justice without feelings, without mercy, without tolerance.

Says who?

You are making my point.

Did you just use Star Wars as a source? And you did not even use the best movie, at least your are consistent.

Movies from hollywood have a high amount of occult meaning in them, it's a very good source.

As I told you, I find masonry highly satanic. I find masonry part of the control freak institutions.

Holy maniacal obsession batman.

Originally posted by pepsi78
I proved to you the seal is masonic, what more do you want ?

You proved nothing and admitted as much in your previous post where you said it was your opinion. Your short-term memory loss can not be that bad.

The notion predates the seal, and it's no eye of providence...

I gave you a book published 200 hundred years earlier where it is dipicted and refered to as such.

...that is made up with the seal in the 17th century.

Did you mean the 18th century?

Prior to that term there is no eye of providence.

How do you explain the book?

Well yes, Honor, I explained that factor a while a go.

You are delusional. You explained nothing and insisted that the line in the poem refered to Saturn himself and not a personification of one of his aspects.

The roman empire was built on that notion, further more saturnalia was a very important roman holiday.

So what? The Saturnalia did not represent power, glory or greed. It was a time of revelry and where there were no societal boundries or strata; e.g. the slave ate with the master at the same table.

Triple Tau found in the Royal Arch Degree is an icon of masonry, yet more exposure.

The Tau or Tav means “cross,” and is the final letter of the Hebrew alphabet. It is numbered 300 in the Greek and 400 in the Hebrew numerical alphabet. The tau corresponds astrologically with the planet Saturn and the concept of finality

Irrelevant. There is no triple tau on the Great Seal.

But let's go even further.
Now for the father time(saturn) and the virgin (lady of liberty) from a masonic source.
www.phoenixmasonry.org...

I bet you can't coment on this, let's see justice now.

You would loose that bet.

It is an image of Time unfolding and counting the ringlets of a weeping virgin's hair. It was part of the monument erected over Hiram Abiff's tomb and is also ornamented with other symbols from that allegory-the broken column, the open book, the sprig of acacia and the urn.

Looks like you are totaly exposed to the truth.
This just shows the afiliation to the roman empire, and the connection to the statue of liberty to Saturn.

No. This just shows that you jambed you foot in your mouth again because you do not READ BEFORE YOU POST. Nice try though.

I know you are going to tell me it's Christian.

Not to my knowledge.

The seal is masonic as I told you.

You can tell everyone what ever you want. Evidence proves otherwise.

You don't like justice when it's not on your side , do you ?

Are you trying to taunt me after you just made a fool out of yourself (again)?

As I was saying

Oh no. You are going to try the Latin thing again.

Ultima Cumaei venit iam carminis aetas;
magnus ab integro saeclorum nascitur ordo.
iam redit et Virgo, redeunt Saturnia regna,
iam nova progenies caelo demittitur alto.

Saturn and the lady of liberty, the return of the saturnial law.
Where the notion of the seal inscription comes from.

So everyone should listen to a person who does not even understand Latin and take their word for it? Do you not get the irony?

You are making my point.

Justice comes first. Tolerence and mercy are decided by ones peers.

Movies from hollywood have a high amount of occult meaning in them, it's a very good source.

Wrong. Movies are make-believe and only used as sources by the delusional.

As I told you, I find masonry highly satanic. I find masonry part of the control freak institutions.

Good for you. Since I do not believe in your bogeyman Satan then I really have nothing to worry about.

Did you mean the 18th century?

Prior to that term there is no eye of providence.

Let me explain to you, the eye of providence was called the eye of providece by the makers of the seal, before that it existed into cabalah, rosicrucian and masonry.
Stop inventing things.

As I was saying
resources.metapress.com...

How do you explain the book?

Please provide information from the book you speak of with a passage.

You are delusional. You explained nothing and insisted that the line in the poem refered to Saturn himself and not a personification of one of his aspects.

Yes the return of saturnial law, Virgo the virgin and Saturn.

So what? The Saturnalia did not represent power, glory or greed. It was a time of revelry and where there were no societal boundries or strata; e.g. the slave ate with the master at the same table.

It's the same god from greek mythlogy, and how does this help you, it does not.
It's the same personification. Here is a nice image, the god of agriculture.

It is a representation of the dark side in kabalah, it is the dark side.

Irrelevant. There is no triple tau on the Great Seal.

It's not irelevant it shows it's part of masonic dogma, it shows the truth and the connection to masonry and to the seal of the united states.

It is an image of Time unfolding and counting the ringlets of a weeping virgin's hair. It was part of the monument erected over Hiram Abiff's tomb and is also ornamented with other symbols from that allegory-the broken column, the open book, the sprig of acacia and the urn.

Who cares, it's Saturn and the virgin(lady of liberty), as for hiram abiff that is a highly fabricated story without any evidence to sustain it.

The sculpture consists of a weeping virgin, holding in one hand a sprig of acacia and in the other an urn; before her is a broken column, on which rests a copy of the Book of Constitutions, while Father Time behind her is attempting to disentangle the ringlets of her hair.

No. This just shows that you jambed you foot in your mouth again because you do not READ BEFORE YOU POST. Nice try though.

I don't see how, when saturn and the virgin(lady of liberty are depicted in a masonic art)
And here she is with him

You can tell everyone what ever you want. Evidence proves otherwise.

Well the evidence speaks for it's self, you can deny it but who really cares what you invent as long as people see it.

Are you trying to taunt me after you just made a fool out of yourself (again)?

I can't see how I made a fool out of my self.

So everyone should listen to a person who does not even understand Latin and take their word for it? Do you not get the irony?

Virgo the virgin and lord saturn, you got the idea.
iam redit et Virgo, redeunt Saturnia regna,

From wikipedia.

en.wikipedia.org...
The Virgin and the Days of Old return

Virgo as the virgin, Saturn as the old. Now stop spilling lies. Saturn is represented by the old man with a sicle and it is a refrence to saturn, there for the name saturnia.

IT even states.

Astræa's departure from the earth at the end of Saturn's reign was memorialized by Ovid in the Metamorphoses,

Originally posted by pepsi78
Don't forget.

Masons built it, masons found the project to put it where it is, it was installed with a masonic ceremony.

here is a history of the Satue of Liberty. In reading all about this, I have learned that:

Laboulaye and his fellow Freemason, sculptor Bartholdi referred to her as "Libertas"

So they were masons, and they did construct the monument. But in reading the history I find that there was a tremendous problem funding this project. There was much opposition to the US even paying for the platform the statue was going to rest on. It seems that either masonry is very much less powerful that most believe, or they didn't want much to do with the Statue of Liberty.

I think you should explain why you feel the Statue of Liberty is evil, and just how exactly it can be considered masonic. At least anymore than a cash register can be considered masonic.

reply to post by network dude


They design it they found it, there was a masonic ceremony. What is important is that they constructed it.
You masons just can't be honest.

reply to post by pepsi78


OK, did they do so on behalf of masonry, or did they do it because they were artists who happened to be masons?
There is a monumental difference as far as you are trying to prove.

If they did it on behalf of masonry, why was there not an outpouring of monetary support from the masonic community?

edit to add:
a lot of buildings have masonic ceremonies to lay the cornerstone. It's a community involvement thing. We have quite a few buildings in my town that have masonic cornerstones. Most of them are not masonic at all.

Originally posted by pepsi78
Let me explain to you, the eye of providence was called the eye of providece by the makers of the seal, before that it existed into cabalah, rosicrucian and masonry.
Stop inventing things.

You either do not read or do not want to read. Since you can not figure out anyting without great assistance I will repost what I explained earlier.

The 1614 published frontispiece of The History of the World by Walter Raleigh (not a Mason) depicts an eye in a cloud with the name "Providentia" overlooking a globe. How much more proof that it was called that do you need?

If you need further clarification the word 'providentia' means 'providence' in Latin. Notice when this was published and do some simple math to arrive at the number of years prior to the Great Seal that this image was referenced in that manner.

Please provide information from the book you speak of with a passage.

It is not a passage but an acutal image. The Eye of Providence refered to as such by a prominent author of the 17th Century.

Yes the return of saturnial law, Virgo the virgin and Saturn.

This was after I explained what it meant to you. Stop trying to backtrack. You insisted it refered to Saturn himself because you do not understand Latin.

It's the same god from greek mythlogy, and how does this help you, it does not.
It's the same personification. Here is a nice image, the god of agriculture.

It is a representation of the dark side in kabalah, it is the dark side.

That is the Grim Reaper. It is obvious that not only do you have a history impairment but you can not even keep your mythological creatures straight either.

It's not irelevant it shows it's part of masonic dogma.

Irrelevant. It has nothing to do with your original assertion. That Masons created the Great Seal.

Who cares, it's Saturn and the virgin(lady of liberty), as for hiram abiff that is a highly fabricated story without any evidence to sustain it.

You care, obviously. You care so much that it is Saturn that you took the time to link writings that show it is Time. Thank you for verifying what I explained earlier.

The sculpture consists of a weeping virgin, holding in one hand a sprig of acacia and in the other an urn; before her is a broken column, on which rests a copy of the Book of Constitutions, while Father Time behind her is attempting to disentangle the ringlets of her hair.

I don't see how, when saturn and the virgin(lady of liberty are depicted in a masonic art)
And here she is with him

You mean Time like it says above in the link you provided, right? Good job.

Well the evidence speaks for it's self, you can deny it but who really cares what you invent as long as people see it.

Yes, people will see the link you put above and know that you can not keep anything straight because you keep adding more and more bullcrap to the mix. You should have given up when it was proven that Jefferson did not use the Eye of Providence or the pyrmaid, instead you broke out your shovel, hell you used an excavator, and dug the biggest of holes.

I can't see how I made a fool out of my self.

By insisting it was Saturn when the link shows it is a depiction of Time.

Virgo the virgin and lord saturn, you got the idea.
iam redit et Virgo, redeunt Saturnia regna

You mean Time and Liberty or the Grim Reaper and Justice or a Weeping Virgin , or, or, or? Any other mythologival figures you want to throw into your mix? You left out Kali and Odin, they called and said they felt slighted.

From wikipedia.

en.wikipedia.org...
The Virgin and the Days of Old return

I always like how you try to explain something to me (Virgo and Libra) that I exlained to you, FOUR POSTS AGO.

Virgo as the virgin, Saturn as the old.

No, Honor of Old. Before you try to educate people in what Latin means maybe you should actually learn Latin. Just a thought. Quo usque tandem abutere patentia meridianus?

Where is the source for this.

If you need further clarification the word 'providentia' means 'providence' in Latin. Notice when this was published and do some simple math to arrive at the number of years prior to the Great Seal that this image was referenced in that manner.

The 1614 published frontispiece of The History of the World by Walter Raleigh (not a Mason) depicts an eye in a cloud with the name "Providentia" overlooking a globe. How much more proof that it was called that do you need?

The eye of providence was called they eye of providence by the designers of the seal.
Now give the source, where is the source ?

A globe, we are not talking about globes here.

Second this guy he founded a secret society called "The School of Night" that was closely related to the Rosicrucian. What are you giving me here ?
Interesting is that why you hide your links ?

It is not a passage but an acutal image. The Eye of Providence refered to as such by a prominent author of the 17th Century.

Yes this go's well with this.
resources.metapress.com...

This was after I explained what it meant to you. Stop trying to backtrack. You insisted it refered to Saturn himself because you do not understand Latin.

Stop beating around the bush it's what it means.

That is the Grim Reaper. It is obvious that not only do you have a history impairment but you can not even keep your mythological creatures straight either.

That is saturn with the sicle and the virgin.

Irrelevant. It has nothing to do with your original assertion. That Masons created the Great Seal.

Yes it does, I don't see how it does not.

You care, obviously. You care so much that it is Saturn that you took the time to link writings that show it is Time. Thank you for verifying what I explained earlier.

I don't see how this will dismiss the facts.

Yes, people will see the link you put above and know that you can not keep anything straight because you keep adding more and more bullcrap to the mix. You should have given up when it was proven that Jefferson did not use the Eye of Providence or the pyrmaid, instead you broke out your shovel, hell you used an excavator, and dug the biggest of holes.

Yes they will see you are a highly ignorant person and what the connections imply

By insisting it was Saturn when the link shows it is a depiction of Time.

What depiction of time are you refering to, The father of time is saturn he is even shown with the virgin and the sicle.

You mean Time and Liberty or the Grim Reaper and Justice or a Weeping Virgin , or, or, or? Any other mythologival figures you want to throw into your mix? You left out Kali and Odin, they called and said they felt slighted.

It's saturn and the virgin, now stop making things up.

www.astrologycom.com...
Astrologically the planetary Lord of Aquarius and Capricorn, Saturn, a harvest god, is known as the grim reaper

I always like how you try to explain something to me (Virgo and Libra) that I exlained to you, FOUR POSTS AGO.

What Lybra , were talking about Virgo the virgin.

No, Honor of Old. Before you try to educate people in what Latin means maybe you should actually learn Latin. Just a thought. Quo usque tandem abutere patentia meridianus?

Stop jerking around.

Originally posted by pepsi78
Where is the source for this.

The 1614 published frontispiece of The History of the World by Walter Raleigh (not a Mason) depicts an eye in a cloud with the name "Providentia" overlooking a globe. How much more proof that it was called that do you need?

The eye of providence was called they eye of providence by the designers of the seal.
Now give the source, where is the source ?

Is there something wrong with you? The source is the book iteslf. The frontspiece. How much more clear does someone need to be?

A globe, we are not talking about globes here.

Then concentrate on the Eye which is what the link was refering to. An eye refered to as 'providence'.

Stop beating around the bush it's what it means.

I know, because I told you. You never did thank me for the free Latin lesson(s).

That is saturn with the sicle and the virgin.

Tell you what. Make a post with only that picture in it and ask everyone, "Is this Saturn?" And then I will do the same thing except the question will be, "Is this the Grim Reaper (Death)", and we can let the informed masses decide.

I don't see how this will dismiss the facts

Because the link you provided says it is Time. Only you call it Saturn. (maybe we can do the same thing with this image too, unless of course you are afraid of everyone's opinions.)

Yes they will see you are a highly ignorant person and what the connections imply

I know. Like when I used a real fake pyramid as evidence or said that Jefferon's son-in-law influenced him prior to actually meeting him. I am such an ignoramus.

What depiction of time are you refering to, The father of time is saturn he is even shown with the virgin and the sicle.

The one in Hiram Abiff's memorial. You know, where it says 'Time'.

It's saturn and the virgin, now stop making things up.

I am not the one who has an invention problem.

What Lybra , were talking about Virgo the virgin.

Genius, Libra and Virgo are the same, one is her and the other her Scales. If you would have been paying attention earlier you would have caught that. STOP TALKING AND READ.

Stop jerking around.

You did not answer me, I asked you a question.

Originally posted by pepsi78
Where is the source for this.

The 1614 published frontispiece of The History of the World by Walter Raleigh (not a Mason) depicts an eye in a cloud with the name "Providentia" overlooking a globe. How much more proof that it was called that do you need?

www.lib.unc.edu...

Is there something wrong with you? The source is the book iteslf. The frontspiece. How much more clear does someone need to be?

Where is the source for this ? Post the source as for the rest I explained, from where this stuff comes anyway.

Then concentrate on the Eye which is what the link was refering to. An eye refered to as 'providence'.

Were not talking about globes, and what you posted is highly doubtfull since it comes from a person afliated to such movments.

Tell you what. Make a post with only that picture in it and ask everyone, "Is this Saturn?" And then I will do the same thing except the question will be, "Is this the Grim Reaper (Death)", and we can let the informed masses decide.

It is already explained who is who and what is what.

Because the link you provided says it is Time. Only you call it Saturn. (maybe we can do the same thing with this image too, unless of course you are afraid of everyone's opinions.)

What the man with the sicle and the virgin ? That is saturn and the virgin

The one in Hiram Abiff's memorial. You know, where it says 'Time'.

That is the father of time saturn and the virgin, here he is under the all seeing eye with the virgin, oops more evidence,

Now be a honest boy and admit to it.

Genius, Libra and Virgo are the same, one is her and the other her Scales. If you would have been paying attention earlier you would have caught that. STOP TALKING AND READ.

I do not see how this changes things, what point do you want to make out of this ?

Originally posted by JoshNorton

Originally posted by pepsi78
Where is the source for this.

The 1614 published frontispiece of The History of the World by Walter Raleigh (not a Mason) depicts an eye in a cloud with the name "Providentia" overlooking a globe. How much more proof that it was called that do you need?

www.lib.unc.edu...

He may not be a mason but he is asociated with the rosicrucian, Part of the secret sociaties, this just proves my point.same thing if you ask me, and as stated were not talking about globes here.


He founded the secret society called "The School of Night" which was closely related to the mysterious Rosicrucian movement. As explained it's where the eye of providence with the triangle come from, from secret sociaties.

It proves this:
resources.metapress.com...

Originally posted by pepsi78

Originally posted by JoshNorton

Originally posted by pepsi78
Where is the source for this.

The 1614 published frontispiece of The History of the World by Walter Raleigh (not a Mason) depicts an eye in a cloud with the name "Providentia" overlooking a globe. How much more proof that it was called that do you need?

www.lib.unc.edu...

He may not be a mason but he is asociated with the rosicrucian, Part of the secret sociaties, this just proves my point.same thing if you ask me, and as stated were not talking about globes here.


He founded the secret society called "The School of Night" which was closely related to the mysterious Rosicrucian movement. As explained it's where the eye of providence with the triangle come from, from secret sociaties.

It proves this:
resources.metapress.com...

edit on 14-6-2011 by pepsi78 because: (no reason given)

wait a minute, now all secret societies are the same?

why do they have different names and meet in different buildings? Why do the teach different things?
how is it that you know all this stuff that

nobody

else knows? I think you are making most of this up as you go. That makes me a sad panda.

Originally posted by pepsi78
Where is the source for this ? Post the source as for the rest I explained, from where this stuff comes anyway.

Have fun.

Were not talking about globes, and what you posted is highly doubtfull since it comes from a person afliated to such movments.

The globe is not important. The Eye is labeled 'Provdentia' and disproves your point completely. This is how you counter an arguement. Use REAL evidence, not opinion or phony items (goat-sucker skeletons). And I have no idea what you mean by 'a person afliated(sic) to such movements'.

It is already explained who is who and what is what.

Why not let everyone else give you their opinion? Are you frightened? Post the picture and ask the question.

What the man with the sicle and the virgin ? That is saturn and the virgin

Uh, no. It is the Grim Reaper (Death).

That is the father of time and the virgin, here he is under the all seeing eye with the virgin, oops more evidence,

Now be a honest boy and admit to it.

Admit it? I was the one who told you it was Time and not Saturn. The Hiramic image is Masonic, in it is Time and the Weeping Virgin. Neither one has anything to do with Saturn as explained by the link you provided explaining the symbolism. Are you going insane?

I do not see how this changes things, what point do you want to make out of this ?

That you are wrong again because you never TAKE THE TIME TO RESEARCH ANYTHING.

Listen my Romanian friend, you have completely gone off on several non sequitors and tangents after finding out that Jefferson was not a Mason and did not incorporate the Eye and Pyramid into his desgin on the Seal. You have run everywhere from lost civilizations in Ecuador (which never existed) to trying to teach people Latin (again) to trying to get everyone to think that the Grim Reaper is Saturn (for what reason?). Stop. Take a break and find a topic or thread where you actually know about the points being contended. Or at least one where people will buy your line without fact-checking you on what you assert.

wait a minute, now all secret societies are the same?

why do they have different names and meet in different buildings? Why do the teach different things?
how is it that you know all this stuff that

nobody

else knows? I think you are making most of this up as you go. That makes me a sad panda.

Masonry is highly asociated with the rosicrucian movement, they mixed and it may be very well that masonry comes from there, what is your point ?

reply to post by pepsi78


The point is the book was published 170 years before the point where you said no one refered to it as the Eye of Providence. This proves otherwise. You are wrong AGAIN.

Have fun.

This really does not change anything, coming from people with a backround like this.
It just proves my point that the eye of providence comes from the secret sociaties.

The globe is not important. The Eye is labeled 'Provdentia' and disproves your point completely. This is how you counter an arguement. Use REAL evidence, not opinion or phony items (goat-sucker skeletons). And I have no idea what you mean by 'a person afliated(sic) to such movements'.

It is very important, as the eye of providence with the triangle is first called the eye of providence by the designers of the seal.

Second of all it does not create anything new, since it comes from secret sociaties.

Admit it? I was the one who told you it was Time and not Saturn. The Hiramic image is Masonic, in it is Time and the Weeping Virgin. Neither one has anything to do with Saturn as explained by the link you provided explaining the symbolism. Are you going insane?

Anyone knows it's father of time saturn, It is saturn and the virgin.

Listen my Romanian friend, you have completely gone off on several non sequitors and tangents after finding out that Jefferson was not a Mason and did not incorporate the Eye and Pyramid into his desgin on the Seal. You have run everywhere from lost civilizations in Ecuador (which never existed) to trying to teach people Latin (again) to trying to get everyone to think that the Grim Reaper is Saturn (for what reason?). Stop. Take a break and find a topic or thread where you actually know about the points being contended. Or at least one where people will buy your line without fact-checking you on what you assert.

This does not help you at all, the father of time is saturn

Have fun.

This really does not change anything, coming from people with a backround like this.
It just proves my point that the eye of providence comes from the secret sociaties.

The globe is not important. The Eye is labeled 'Provdentia' and disproves your point completely. This is how you counter an arguement. Use REAL evidence, not opinion or phony items (goat-sucker skeletons). And I have no idea what you mean by 'a person afliated(sic) to such movements'.

It is very important, as the eye of providence with the triangle is first called the eye of providence by the designers of the seal.

Second of all it does not create anything new, since it comes from secret sociaties.

Admit it? I was the one who told you it was Time and not Saturn. The Hiramic image is Masonic, in it is Time and the Weeping Virgin. Neither one has anything to do with Saturn as explained by the link you provided explaining the symbolism. Are you going insane?

Anyone knows it's father of time saturn, It is saturn and the virgin, he even has a sicle in his hand, now tell the truth. He's even the time god.

Listen my Romanian friend, you have completely gone off on several non sequitors and tangents after finding out that Jefferson was not a Mason and did not incorporate the Eye and Pyramid into his desgin on the Seal. You have run everywhere from lost civilizations in Ecuador (which never existed) to trying to teach people Latin (again) to trying to get everyone to think that the Grim Reaper is Saturn (for what reason?). Stop. Take a break and find a topic or thread where you actually know about the points being contended. Or at least one where people will buy your line without fact-checking you on what you assert.

This does not help you at all, the father of time is saturn

As for the rest.

www.astrologycom.com...
trologically the planetary Lord of Aquarius and Capricorn, Saturn, a harvest god, is known as the grim reaper

As for the seal they were told what to draw, it's clear where the seal comes from, from secret sociaties.

Originally posted by pepsi78
This really does not change anything, coming from people with a backround like this.
It just proves my point that the eye of providence comes from the secret sociaties.

Who cares where it comes from as long as it shows you are wrong AGAIN. Eye of Providence, 170 years BEFORE you said it was first used. Published in a book. You know, those things with words in them?

It is very important, as the eye of providence with the triangle is first called the eye of providence by the designers of the seal.

Wrong. An eye with the word 'Provdentia' above it means only one thing.

Second of all it does not create anything new, since it comes from secret sociaties.

Irrelevant denialism. Emotional pleading will not allow you to be right on this. Try something else.

Anyone knows it's father of time saturn, It is saturn and the virgin.

'Father Time Saturn'? Is that like the Easter Bunny-Santa? Or Frosty the Snowman-Rudolph? Oh man, your feeble flailings are fantastically funny.

This does not help you at all, the father of time is saturn

Uh, no. The father of time is Time. Saturn was not even the first Roman Diety created. Nice try though attempting to reinvent mythology to hold up your soggy arguements. Pathetic.