Are manners a thing of the past?

I know this thread isn't supose to be about sagging pants but i've been thinking about it. Now i'm on the fence and not sure what is the truth. You have both made a lot of good points but still no official story. Do they let inmates sag there pants? I wouldn't think so... I know they don't in Pittsburghs co. Jail. Maybe they do in state pens.

Let me preface this by saying that i do not personally sag my pants.

I'm 18, so i'm still in high school (graduating next month woop woop!) so i can safely say i know a thing or two about the general social climate of the modern day high school. One thing i don't understand when people complain about sagging pants is that they always bring up the fact that they "see the kids ass cheeks hanging out".

Now, i'm sure there's always exceptions, but i can say that i personally have never seen such a thing, and there are hundreds of kids in my school that sag their pants. Usually when people sag, they have tall Tees that hang down below their waist, so you cant see anything. ALSO, even if they're wearing a normal shirt, 90% of the time they're wearing gym shorts underneath. Now i never see people complain when someone walks around in gym shorts, but throw some pants over them and *oh god!*, it's an gag inducing sight! ;P

**Above comments based on my own personal experiences, i do not claim them to be absolute truth for everyone everywhere.**

reply to post by Stop-loss!


Well...you know what they say...you come out slightly different then when you joined the army.

Originally posted by dude69
reply to post by Stop-loss!

 

Well...you know what they say...you come out slightly different then when you joined the army.

So very true. I swear a lot more then before and sometimes get angry for little reasons. Since I left things have been going smoothly and am a better person now then before.

Originally posted by LostMyPassword
And baggy pants did not start in prisons. That's a myth.

edit on 21-4-2011 by LostMyPassword because: (no reason given)

Lost, I've been told that the old school street look came from young people emulating the people in the neighborhood recently released from prison. Supposedly some ex-convicts have to be given street clothes when they are about to re-enter society. They have to take what they can get, the clothes rarely fit, the pants sag. The unlaced boots, ex-cons also. Even for short stays many jails remove anything they feel may be used for suicide or as a weapon: belts, shoe laces, the drawstring from your gym pants.

I have no clue first-hand, I live in the boonies where only some young white males still think this fad is fresh. Then again, The Beatles 'White Album' still sells pretty good around here too.

Originally posted by WeRpeons
reply to post by LostMyPassword

 

I answered your questions. You just don't want to accept the idea of social norms. I would think you would feel right at home in a lawless and rude society.

(You haven't proven anything to the fact that sagging pants got its roots from kids not wearing fitted clothes! You want to ignore the fact that it's been stated numerous times in numerous links that it did originate in prisons. Granted, you and I will not see eye to eye on this).

If I said I went to a friends birthday party last Saturday and it was f'n awesome.

How about this, "I went to a friends birthday party last Saturday and it was awesome!" Why do you need to put the "F" word in there? The "word" doesn't describe how awesome the party is. It's definitely not an adjective. Simply put, it's a word that has been associated before you or I were born as being profane. Am I saying the "F" word should never be uttered? Absolutely not! All I'm saying is there's a time and place for its use. Just sticking it in a sentence when you're around strangers shows blatant disregard for people who may consider it to be crude and lacks a sense of manners and decorum. You're looking at the "F" word from the perspective of the younger generation. We're sharing this planet with all age groups. Everyone needs to be aware of different cultures, races, and older generations. If you're going to offend anyone in public by saying it, why would you do it? It's just disrespectful, plain and simple. If you're with friends and you all talk that way, than that's your business.

Tbh I'm getting a bit tired of you twisting what I'm saying. Since my first post in this thread I've made it abundantly clear that I'm aware of social norms and do adhere to them, despite the fact I view most as silly. Why? Because of illogical people like yourself who would hold me in contempt for failing to comply with your irrational world view.

Furthermore, I don't appreciate your insults. That's twice you've insinuated I'm some sort of scourge of society. The irony of suggesting that I'm rude! Swearing makes one rude, but directly insulting someone is socially acceptable in your mind. That makes perfect sense.

And just hypothetically; I'd put the F there as emphasis, because it IS an adjective - whether you like it or not. There's plenty of reputable Dictionaries that disagree with your views on this. And the idea that someone should refrain from swearing because it's not necessary is outright laughable. It's not necessary to engage in this debate, but you are doing.

Again though we're back to you purposely twisting my words, views and arguments. I haven't once said or implied I go around swearing in public. What I asked is, and Jesus Christ I have to clarify again; What is wrong with the F word? In itself, and for the sake of this tiresome argument, speeched between 2 friends in the privacy of their apartment.

Originally posted by LargeFries

Originally posted by LostMyPassword
And baggy pants did not start in prisons. That's a myth.

edit on 21-4-2011 by LostMyPassword because: (no reason given)

Lost, I've been told that the old school street look came from young people emulating the people in the neighborhood recently released from prison. Supposedly some ex-convicts have to be given street clothes when they are about to re-enter society. They have to take what they can get, the clothes rarely fit, the pants sag. The unlaced boots, ex-cons also. Even for short stays many jails remove anything they feel may be used for suicide or as a weapon: belts, shoe laces, the drawstring from your gym pants.

I have no clue first-hand, I live in the boonies where only some young white males still think this fad is fresh. Then again, The Beatles 'White Album' still sells pretty good around here too.

I'm sure that does happen. But poor people have always had clothes that sagged, long before the American prison system. I've heard the claim thousands of times, and so far I've never been presented with any actual evidence for the claim. It's nothing more than conjecture in my opinion. Actually ask these social historians to provide evidence for their theory and they cannot. It's just an endless trail of people pointing you to sources, and sources to sources, none of which seem to have any evidence to back them up.

This association being made just serves to create and emphasise negative stereotypes of the decent working class population. We idolise criminals or are criminals. Again it wouldn't surprise me if this is carefully constructed elitist propaganda. It wouldn't be the first time.

Hello! Manners in the South are very important, with out manners your name is mudd.
Education, working hard, and manners are three ways to success. People with manners are showing respect for others. No one wants to spend time with people who lack manners. There are good books on Amazon.com
about manners for those who wish to learn manners.

Manners also exhibit how well breed you are, because you usually learn them from your parents. History of manners... it just makes the whole world a nicer place to live in, if every one had manners no one would have built or needed nuclear weapons. Evil has no manners. Manners are a sign of Goodness, or God.

Originally posted by frugal
Hello! Manners in the South are very important, with out manners your name is mudd.
Education, working hard, and manners are three ways to success. People with manners are showing respect for others. No one wants to spend time with people who lack manners. There are good books on Amazon.com
about manners for those who wish to learn manners.

Manners also exhibit how well breed you are, because you usually learn them from your parents. History of manners... it just makes the whole world a nicer place to live in, if every one had manners no one would have built or needed nuclear weapons. Evil has no manners. Manners are a sign of Goodness, or God.

edit on 24-4-2011 by frugal because: (no reason given)

Would this be the same South that's world famous for Racism, Sexism, General bigotry, War mongering and Capitalism?

The South is a great example of manners having no real reflection of an individual or his worth. People in the South are some of the most courteous and kind you'll meet, and somehow on the other side of the coin they're a hateful and rather ignorant group.

And I apologise as I genuinely don't mean to attack you personally. But imo the South of America is a great example of the utter pointlessness and the charade that is to be well mannered. It shows no real judge of character. It's merely a mask.

OOoo this is a hot button topic for Mua. Some 'manners' need to be consigned to the TRASH BIN of the past. And STAY there. Here is what I mean. I am a pedestrian. I do not own a vehicle. I have to walk wherever I go. This county does not even have bus services, considering all the impoverished, disabled, and elderly around here. I am no longer as thin as I used to be, (Aaaahem, ah hee) and far so, less, athletic. So when I'm standing on the curb with my swinging full plastic grocery bags, you people sit there in your big SUVs and wave for me to cross. HOWEVER, YOU want me to SPRINT, cuz you are in a hellatious RUSH, and God help me, if I don't hurry up. So, I take my sweet time, and not too much on purpose. Then you pull up close like you are going to run me over, if I don't hurry up. F*** Y**, that is not manners. NORE is standing there, holding a store door open for me, when I am 10 feet away. I am NOT going to SPRINT for you, when you do that. DON'T make me feel like I have to hurry up for you. Is that really polite??? Really??? Then how about you people who ask "How are you?" And sit there and wait for an answer. It makes me want to say, "I am laying in a hospital bed, dying of Ebola. What does it look like?"

I just spent some time with an old friend who is an art teacher for one of the Pittsburgh public schools. We were talking and she said "I just can't take that school anymore" She told me that 11 years ago when she started, she loved it. I asked her what the problem was, and she told me the kids just get ruder and more disrespectful every year. I asked her what she thinks the problem is. She basically said the school lets a lot of stuff slide because anytime they try to discipline a child they have crazy irate parents at the school screaming and swearing about how there kids can do no wrong. She said the discipline problems are so big that, swearing and being blatantly rude or mean just isn't worth the hassle.

The above post reminded me of how annoying common it is today for people to just walk out into the street, sometimes a group of people, and they walk soooo slow. They try to act like they didn't see you and it's almost like they want you to hit them.

reply to post by MidnightSunshine


Some "manners" are pointless and retarded. Like old teachers that tell you to take off your hat, or not to chew gum. They claim it is rude, yet not a single one can say WHY it is rude. That is just what they were taught when they were young. Stupid meaningless rules really.

reply to post by TKDRL


Yea, that stuff is silly, but she was talking about swearing at each other and the teachers, and nasty name calling. She told me about this program the art dept. has where they bring in some artist and it's really a fun thing for the kids and it costs the school a lot of money. She said this year the lady said she probably won't be back because of how rude, disrespectful, and un appreciative the kids are. I think she said this is 5th grade.

reply to post by MidnightSunshine


Well why is a cuss a cuss? Because someone decided to label it as such. They all have noncuss equivilants that have not been labeled as bad etc. Poop crap #, all the same thing. Yet some people get offended by the last because someone told them it was a bad word. Why?

Also, a lot of it has to do with upbringing, I mean you grow up in the inner city, swearing, insults, and a primate type attitude is typical. That is what they grow up around, and a vast majority emulate it. Rich roots, they may not cuss at you, but they know some obscure 30 letter word to insult you with

A word is a word, nothing more or less, you choose to be offended by the word. I honestly would rather see a majority of the kids out there be rebellious, but also smart, you know? Being a quiet, obedient little slave never got anyone anywhere, other than working a factory job. Being a total idiot, gets most people into gangs and prison though

reply to post by TKDRL


Language was created to communicate our thoughts ideas and feelings. I don’t have to poop on a plate and hand someone a fork because I can just tell them to eat poop. Some words or phrases are offensive by design. Their sole purpose is to offend . Like the “bunt” (-b + c). I can’t think of any use of the word where being offensive isn’t intended. Fortunately some people, myself included, don’t take offence because we feel a word is just a word. I could use that word all day and it wouldn’t bother me a bit. I would feel like a complete donkey though because I know how some people feel about that word, and my manners provide me with enough consideration for my fellow human beings to not want to offend them.

I live in a low class community and I still get called “Mrs. So and so, Or Miss first name. I find it a little corny but I like it. I like it because I know someone in that child’s life is teaching them a way of behaving in the world that is conducive to that child’s success in life.

I agree if a kid doesn’t want to draw a picture or slice up a frog, they shouldn’t. But telling a teacher F U I aint doing it is a different thing all together.

Originally posted by LostMyPassword

Originally posted by frugal
Hello! Manners in the South are very important, with out manners your name is mudd.
Education, working hard, and manners are three ways to success. People with manners are showing respect for others. No one wants to spend time with people who lack manners. There are good books on Amazon.com
about manners for those who wish to learn manners.

Manners also exhibit how well breed you are, because you usually learn them from your parents. History of manners... it just makes the whole world a nicer place to live in, if every one had manners no one would have built or needed nuclear weapons. Evil has no manners. Manners are a sign of Goodness, or God.

edit on 24-4-2011 by frugal because: (no reason given)

Would this be the same South that's world famous for Racism, Sexism, General bigotry, War mongering and Capitalism?

The South is a great example of manners having no real reflection of an individual or his worth. People in the South are some of the most courteous and kind you'll meet, and somehow on the other side of the coin they're a hateful and rather ignorant group.

And I apologise as I genuinely don't mean to attack you personally. But imo the South of America is a great example of the utter pointlessness and the charade that is to be well mannered. It shows no real judge of character. It's merely a mask.

No offense taken I was born in Pittsburgh. The people lacked manners but kept their word and did what they promised, ususally. Still I perfer the illusion of manners. I take no one for their word, until they have proved themselves trustworthy.