Is ATS Supporting Ignorance Concerning Chemtrails? I think so.

reply to post by krimletch




Difficult, this thread. It is going so far afield....

Unless crop dusting has to take place 40,000 feet in the air...

CLOUD SEEDING is NOT done at "40,000 feet in the air"!

Nor, at 30,000 feet.

Nor, at 20,000 feet.

It is done low, in the troposphere (LOOK IT UP, please!) where weather forms! Weather doesn't form at 40,000 feet. It doesn't make rain at 40,000 feet. Look up the tropopause, too. Research. Learn something useful.

Weather will rarely climb above the tropopause, and that's only in the cases of towering cumulus clouds, and major thunderstorm activity.

As to "cloud seeding"? IT is done where the air is above freezing! And, look more at meteorology, to see just where the "freezing level" can begin. Varies by season, latitude, and local geography/topography....and varies by atmospheric conditions, that are in constant flux.

Keep this in mind....the "standard" temperature at Sea Level is Internationally agreed upon as 59 degrees F/15 degrees C. Air tends to decrease in temperature by an average of 2 degrees Celsius, every 1,000 feet of rise. (When IN the troposphere).

15 divided by 2? Equals 7.5, right? SO, you can expect, quite often, that above 7,500 feet, will be below freezing. There is NO POINT in trying to "seed clouds" to make rain, when it's too cold for liquid water to exist!!!!

I've got some news for you guys. Virgin Galactic have now joined the chemtrails program.




The article says they were spraying water. Do they really think we are this stupid??

Link to source

A thread about chemtrails hmmm, a highly speculative topic. This belongs in Skunk Works imo.

reply to post by krimletch



I know you was refering to me. that is alright.

If you would click on my profile and go to posts that I have made, you can clearly see that I have took an enormous amount of time to research this topic. You will have to scroll way down to find my posts on chemtrails because it has been a little bit of time since I have taken interest in this subject. I have done my research on cloud seeding. Probably more research than half of the people making these chemtrail claims. Let me take a minute to post some of the results and some of the threads.

Lavenlaar came up with some pictures of planes and an actual company that does weather modification. I have to disagree with your altitude assumptions on cloud seeding. If you take the time to read the whole two pages you will see that I looked up what altitude cumulus clouds can reach. And guess what they seed cumulus clouds.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

This thread I was interested in relative humidity and altitude affecting contrails.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

This is just a few because I do not want to take up any more space on the op's thread.

Please for everybody assuming things without researching it on your own, get the facts people.(not necessarily aimed at you krim). This is why I am the way I am. I took some time to look up some info. I did a little more than to spend five minutes on the google machine. I find that the people making these claims often do not realize what they are talking about.

You can call me a troll or debunker or whatever you want. I see myself wanting the facts. If someone shows me the facts then I will give them their props. Until then all we will see is more false evidence and more speculation on top of that. As far as the attacking, the op was very rude and disrespectful. I believe that I did not attack anyone on this thread, and if I did please correct me.

As far as the op begging for the chemtrail to be moved somewhere else, why?

Thank you for taking the time to read my opinion. Continue with the attacking everyone.(not you krim)

Originally posted by weedwhacker
reply to post by krimletch

 

Difficult, this thread. It is going so far afield....

Unless crop dusting has to take place 40,000 feet in the air...

CLOUD SEEDING is NOT done at "40,000 feet in the air"!

Nor, at 30,000 feet.

Nor, at 20,000 feet.

It is done low, in the troposphere (LOOK IT UP, please!) where weather forms! Weather doesn't form at 40,000 feet. It doesn't make rain at 40,000 feet. Look up the tropopause, too. Research. Learn something useful.

Weather will rarely climb above the tropopause, and that's only in the cases of towering cumulus clouds, and major thunderstorm activity.

As to "cloud seeding"? IT is done where the air is above freezing! And, look more at meteorology, to see just where the "freezing level" can begin. Varies by season, latitude, and local geography/topography....and varies by atmospheric conditions, that are in constant flux.

Keep this in mind....the "standard" temperature at Sea Level is Internationally agreed upon as 59 degrees F/15 degrees C. Air tends to decrease in temperature by an average of 2 degrees Celsius, every 1,000 feet of rise. (When IN the troposphere).

15 divided by 2? Equals 7.5, right? SO, you can expect, quite often, that above 7,500 feet, will be below freezing. There is NO POINT in trying to "seed clouds" to make rain, when it's too cold for liquid water to exist!!!!

40,000 was an example I used which someone said on the thread. I don't know the heights, I'm just pointing out things other don't realize to see because they decide to keep their view on one particular thing about the topic.

Originally posted by weedwhacker
reply to post by krimletch

 

Difficult, this thread. It is going so far afield....

Unless crop dusting has to take place 40,000 feet in the air...

CLOUD SEEDING is NOT done at "40,000 feet in the air"!

Nor, at 30,000 feet.

Nor, at 20,000 feet.

It is done low, in the troposphere (LOOK IT UP, please!) where weather forms! Weather doesn't form at 40,000 feet. It doesn't make rain at 40,000 feet. Look up the tropopause, too. Research. Learn something useful.

Weather will rarely climb above the tropopause, and that's only in the cases of towering cumulus clouds, and major thunderstorm activity.

As to "cloud seeding"? IT is done where the air is above freezing! And, look more at meteorology, to see just where the "freezing level" can begin. Varies by season, latitude, and local geography/topography....and varies by atmospheric conditions, that are in constant flux.

Keep this in mind....the "standard" temperature at Sea Level is Internationally agreed upon as 59 degrees F/15 degrees C. Air tends to decrease in temperature by an average of 2 degrees Celsius, every 1,000 feet of rise. (When IN the troposphere).

15 divided by 2? Equals 7.5, right? SO, you can expect, quite often, that above 7,500 feet, will be below freezing. There is NO POINT in trying to "seed clouds" to make rain, when it's too cold for liquid water to exist!!!!

Actually a bit of a correction..

Thunderstorm cloud seeding, when done as "top seeding" is actually done up around 20,000 ft. Base seeding is done under storm bases, looking for updrafts to carry the particles up to the freezing levels.

But top seeding, is when the seeding is done right at the area of where the storm is developing, with updrafts, supercooled liquid water, and temps of -5 to -10. In the summer, thats easily up around 18-22,000

Now as for the winter, seeding is done at that same temperature range, but that may be around 9-12000 ft.

But for the chemmies who claim seeding is done in blue skies or into cirrus, have no idea what they are talking about. If you dont have supercooled water, then you can not do anything

reply to post by Caji316

I'm sorry but life in the Unites States is getting shorter now...We ARE being poisoned... Life Expectancy Declines in the United States Life expectancy may be on the decline in the United States, especially in some counties. Every year, we can expect to hear how the overall life expectancy has increased in the United States, but this is not true for all places; some counties have experienced slow or negative changes in life expectancy..

Do you really believe that the reason life expectancy is dropping in the USA is because citizens are being sprayed by unknown chemicals from unidentified non-commercial planes?


Now I'm no expert, but maybe the reason that life expectancy is falling is because of this:

Obesity is defined as a body mass index (BMI) of 30 or greater. BMI is calculated from a person's weight and height and provides a reasonable indicator of body fatness and weight categories that may lead to health problems. Obesity is a major risk factor for cardiovascular disease, certain types of cancer, and type 2 diabetes. During the past 20 years there has been a dramatic increase in obesity in the United States. In 2009, only Colorado and the District of Columbia had a prevalence of obesity less than 20%.

source

So what's more likely?....... mysterious planes spraying mysterious chemicals....................or too many burgers?

Originally posted by KILL_DOGG
reply to post by dplum517

 

Chemtrails rank right up there with HAARP conspiracies and alien abductions. I read the threads, have a good laugh, and move on to something else. There's just no realistic evidence of chemtrails. Cloud seeding is different and has been experimented with since the 40's. But what's more probable: government planes spraying chemicals in broad daylight or dense contrails that take a good while to disperse? Again, I've had a good laugh and now I'm moving on.

WOo HOOO! Before you go...........

Here's something from a source considered fairly credible that may shorten that chuckle a bit:

U.N. urged to freeze climate geo-engineering projects

"It's absolutely inappropriate for a handful of governments in industrialized countries to make a decision to try geo-engineering without the approval of all the world's support," Pat Mooney, from Canada-headquartered advocacy organization ETC Group, told Reuters on the sidelines of the October 18-29 meeting. "They shouldn't proceed with real-life, in-the-environment experimentation or the deployment of any geo-engineering until there is a consensus in the United Nations that this is okay." Some conservation groups say geo-engineering is a way for some governments and companies to get out of taking steps to slash planet-warming emissions. The U.N. climate panel says a review of geo-engineering will be part of its next major report in 2013."


Later on in the text there was mention of one form of geoengineering that was alleged to be taking place regarding salted "Solar Reflectors"

The REASON for this? (from Reuters)

Some conservation groups say geo-engineering is a way for some governments and companies to get out of taking steps to slash planet-warming emissions.

The particular "Solar Reflector method" that caught my eye was this:

-- Spray seawater into the atmosphere to increase the reflectivity and condensation of clouds so they bounce more sunlight back into space.

(see website below for complete article:

www.reuters.com...

What is truly PERSONALLY verifiable is that I was sitting out on the deck with a neighbor, sipping a glass of wine (my first, btw...lol) and I remarked to her that I was seeing little sparkly things in the air, and pointed them out to her.
All around me I was seeing zillions of tiny lights, like water sparkling in the sun.
I was amazed. That was a FIRST! I wondered at the time what could possibly be causing the air to "sparkle"!! (no rain was expected anytime soon )

(Pardon me for posting twice on this subject, but I just ran into this article about geoengineering and geoengineering with solar reflectors and instantly remembered seeing this "sparkling air"experience. Are there any others out there who have had this experience but maybe couldn't link it to the subject at hand??)

edit on 24-2-2011 by UsualSuspect427 because: sorry. don't quite have a handle on the formatting on this site. I may just abandon attempts...

reply to post by dplum517



OP thanks for raising this issue. I wish you good luck with this one.

I agree that there is a bias against chemtrails on ATS. Attempts have been made to discuss this with the site owner and a senior mod, a little while back. I asked them if they would explain the reason they considered chemtrails to be 'highly speculative'. The response was evasive and unfriendly, the question was sidestepped and the thread immediately closed.

There is mountain of credible evidence from all over the globe to support the claim that chemical spraying is happening, including whistleblower testimony. I agree with others, that chemtrails are as credible as UFO's, and the evidence for the existence of the one is on a par with the evidence for the existence of the other.

Not only that, but chemtrails are of major concern for our health, our planet and our wildlife. The issue is even starting to appear in the MSM.

Go figure why, currently, there is a thread in the 'General Conspiracies' forum on 'Judgement Day, May 21 2011.Go figure why this is considered less highly speculative than Chemtrails.
Go figure, anybody? I can't.

reply to post by Blaine91555

Please provide verifiable data from the tests of the air samples from Chemtrails, taken by a qualified unbiased third party. Thanks so much. Otherwise it's highly speculative and in fact you for some reason are lumping into the mixture Crop Dusting and Cloud Seeding which nobody is hiding from anyone.

Anyone could post substance analysis all day, it still wouldn't convince you. You are dead-set Chemtrails...period...proven by your posts.

Your call for "unbiased third party" is ridiculous. If someone posts correctly collected, and analyzed material, it shouldn't matter who it's from. You have set yourself an "out", by being able to claim that the evidence is "biased" no matter who or where it comes from. You will just claim they are biased.

If I understand the Chemtrail myth, they, whoever they are, are trying to poison us all for some reason and thousands of Pilots and Crews are in on it and don't give a damn about their own families and loved ones and likely tens of thousands of people are keeping it secret and don't give a damn about their own families or loved ones.

The only myth is the one you are trying to perpetuate, to make Chemtrail researchers look like foolish dragon-chasers.

They are the US government, and possibly other governments. This isn't an ambiguous point, you are just trying to cultivate an atmosphere of conspiracy by using the phrase "they, whoever they are".

They may or may not be "trying to poison us" on purpose. Again, you are trying to go for the most extreme interpretation to make Chemtrail researchers look ridiculous.

Chemtrail activity for the most part is confined to government/military craft, in my own experience I've only seen KC-135's leaving Chemtrails. That would hardly take thousands of pilots and crews, and blah blah blah you are inventing. Once more, you go for ludicrous hyperbole, to make our stance look tenuous and farcical.

Do you have anything real to say about your opposition to Chemtrails? Or is it confined to Jr. High level defamation?

Strangely enough, we keep living longer and longer lives each generation and we are healthier when we die, despite the Chemtrails. Any explanation?

Yup, easy. Chemtrail have only been around since the early-mid 1990's. 15 years give or take. The negative effects haven't had time to fully saturate into the population. Like corn-sugar and diabetes, or cigarettes and cancer.

reply to post by wcitizen


That was about what I was going to say, although probably a lot less rude than I would have said it. Thanks.

Well weedwhacker, it appears you are in love with contrails, similar to someone who loves racing cars likes to burn rubber.

How is it that these pathetic trails are being allowed to completely decimate our skies , where is the research and development side that would avoid having a single ahem "contrail" blot out the sun and cause changes in air temperatures, wind directions etc.

Even if i believed you for a second that these were all just condensation vapor trails mixed with exhaust... now listen to this sir....

Get this ridiculous devastation of the skies figured out then , and find a goddam fix for it,, the way Chadwickus talks these engines apparently are better and cleaner ??

WELL, if everything is better than before WHY IN BLAZES cant someone find a way not to destroy the skies...why are these BETTER engines causing contrails that somehow keep finding ice particles to attach to for up to SIX HOURS !! HOW IN THE BLOODY HELL DOES 4 planes flying across the sky , in -40 or so blot out the entire sky !!! Those particles would have cooled INSTANTLY.

But oh no this is NORMAL , LIVE WITH IT you say.

I am starting to get angry with this crap...in my opinion your time would be MUCH better served trying to LESSEN "CONTRAILS" than tell me its just going to continously get more of them....

Originally posted by DimensionalDetective
Agree to the Nth degree OP.

Want to know how to spot THE biggest and most highly guarded conspiracies of all?

Watch the amount of debunking and ridiculing which takes place upon the subject matter.

When a subject and anyone discussing it are fervantly attacked each and every time, and anyone discussing its possibilities are referred to as "nut-jobs", "delusional", "paranoid", etc., you know you are onto something. Read the C.I.A. protocol for dealing with stifling discussion about highly sensitive material and subjects. There are methodologies right here on this very site being employed by certain members that will actually make you laugh out loud when you read the protocol outlined by spook agencies. It's straight out of disinfo 101.

3 hugest examples here on ATS---9 / 11, Aliens & UFOs, and THIS SUBJECT. Take a peek at virtually ALL the threads, and who the most prolific posters and ridiculers are on them, then draw your own conclusions.

Keep fighting the good fight people.

The irony of your own post is obviously lost on you isn't it

reply to post by weedwhacker


hoax

reply to post by liejunkie01


From what I've seen on ATS of the chemtrail phenomenon, it isn't about a direct plot to kill or harm people. It's more about controlling the environment in ways that favour corporate food production over and above the smaller producers. Why would they do this? He that controls the food supply controls the world.

I saw a wonderful little video of a kids school project where they were testing the air quality in their local area. The kids discovered unusually high Barium and Aluminium levels in the samples they were taking. Barium and Aluminium salts are some of the proposed contents of the chemtrail sprays. Will try to find it... Might be interesting to purchase a really good camera with binoculars-quality zoom, and to try and design some experiments to test the atmosphere myself. I'd enjoy the project if nothing else.

ATS user Slayer69 composed an excellent thread on the death of honeybees, and the production of genetically modified seeds by Bayer-Monsanto that are highly resistant to - guess what - Barium and Aluminium.


************* *************** *************


As to the means by which so many pilots are convinced not to disclose? Well in actuality they wouldn't need as many people as are suspected. Remember the theory about how a well-organised and tightly coordinated group of around 50 people (from runners on the ground, up to senior political sharks) would have been able to pull off 9-11? Well on a slightly larger scale that's true here as well.

Inserting concentrated levels of certain chemicals over a long period of time would be akin to 'doping' the atmosphere, and thus the soil, in target regions. Properly concentrated spraying (utilising dispersion techniques reliant on prevalent winds and weather systems) could probably affect the soil in target regions to levels of contamination significant enough to impair crop growth - within around ten-fifteen years of spraying. How many pilots would be needed? Well in the UK, a close-knit team of approximately twenty pilots, aligning their operations with weather patterns, using ten (or fewer) planes, could certainly achieve the 'little-by-little' doping of the entire British Isles. It would effectively amount to cloud-seeding, ensuring that the resultant rain-clouds chucked the chemicals down with the rain. There may well be multiple experimental methods in operation, testing manipulation of the ionosphere in tandem with HAARP-style technology is just one other possibility. As a method for achieving experimental things with various chemicals and particulates (in the atmosphere and on the ground), chemtrailing would offer an excellent delivery system. And - here's my point - it could relatively easily be achieved in secrecy, and would be quite cost-effective too.


************* *************** ***************

How would you go about setting up a decades-long chemtrailing projects? It would be implemented by an international corporate/shadow government cabal, needing only a handful from within the cabal to be directly involved in setting up/supervising the operaions. These fatcats would arrange for the project to be sanctioned by the most senior government/ black government people in each nation state participating - as 'part of a global project to alter the atmosphere as a means of [insert good excuse here]'.

The sorts of excuses I'm thinking of could spiderweb from the simplest - 'cloud seeding' - to 'an endeavour to prevent global warming', to 'improving crop yields nationally', all the way out to 'doping the soil in order to maximise profitability of genetically manipulated seed, as a step on the ladder towards global governance by controlling the supply and distribution of food - hail Satan'.

Obviously the excuse used would depend on the mark's position, status, likelihood to question, likelihood to raise awareness of the issue to others, and essentially it could extend to: "What is needed in order to buy their silence?" or: "What threats can we issue to keep them silent once their usefulness to the cause is spent...?" (etc).

The management of the pilots could be handled by five men/ women. The admin teams supporting the project would be tiny, perhaps two or three persons. Maintenance and fuelling / prepping the chemical payloads would be maximum forty persons on a rotational shift pattern. Commercial radar operators and air traffic control would likely be the biggest source of potential leaks; as a result, all traffic would probably go through military bases, where 'need to know' is par for the course (and there are plenty of secrets already, so what is 'one more' going to do?) Not many would actually 'need to know' either...!

In the UK:

- The ten senior 'fatcats' who possibly govern the international effort. Having influence in UK but not based here.

- Five senior national level controllers
- Five 'on-the-ground' management staff
- Twenty pilots
- Up to forty maintenance & fuelling/doping staff
- Three administrative support staff
- One person with need to know on each applicable military base; say thirty bases nationally are used routinely for stop off and ordinary refuelling once payloads are spent (etc) makes 30 'in the know' military commanders nationwide.

Possibly, the following:

- One air traffic controller/ airport manager in each of the twenty-three major UK airports, with general clearance to ensure disinfo is perpetrated through the air traffic control staff throughout the UK (a simple disinfo line of 'military test flights' or 'private commerce' would suffice to 99% of people that would ask).

Only major airports need be dosed with disinfo. Minor airports wouldn't be involved in the operation except in emergencies, and would be unlikely to question the situation if they thought it was a military operation of some sort. They'd likely be glad of a change to an otherwise humdrum routine...


************** **************** **************

Note - the last group (commercial airport staff in major airports) may not be necessary and would probably put strain on the need for secrecy. Instead, how about a couple of union representatives, or reps from the professional institute of air traffic control/ airport management - that would possibly suffice to get some simple disinfo rolled out in 'training sessions' for the relevant managers; it would then filter down to the grass roots staff by simple workplace chit-chat:

"Man this cafeteria food is goddamn awful..."

"Yeah... Hey, I meant to ask - what was that unmarked 737 all about, the one that stopped off this morning? Someone said it might be a military contractor?"

"Nah - John said it was some private firm delivering Scottish oysters to posh restaurants in Paris. Charge a year's wages for a plateful apparently."

* shakes head *
"Some people have more money than sense... S*** - gotta go and clock in. See you later, down the pub?"


************** **************** **************


So in total - how many people would be needed to run a secret operation to dope the soil in the UK with Barium/Aluminium (and whatever else they're up to) over a period of fifteen years?

One hundred and three. Say it with me... 103. How many? A HUNDRED AND THREE.

103 people, in a country with a population of 61,200,000 people.

It's not hard to ensure compartmentalisation / adherence to secrecy contracts, in a group of a hundred and three. Particularly if the job pays well, and suitable disinfo has been planted in training to mislead them from the reality of their actions. If you weren't confident in the idea of misleading the pilots/ maintenance staff (those closest to the action and thus very likely to be asked to do ethically questionable things) you could simply recruit sociopathic loners with a professional commitment to military excellence and obeying orders. Hell, they'd probably just recruit them all into the secret black lodges behind the whole shebang and make them feel like kings.

Ten fatcats controlling the global endeavour would control the monitoring of the participants via relevant secret service agencies. Simple monitoring of communications and daily activities when not on-the-job, for a probationary period. People would be recruited based on prior records of adhering to secrecy. Once sufficiently 'proven' loyal, then basic communications and internet activity monitoring, status, the feeling of being 'in on something super-secretive', general elitist perks (playboy bunnies?) and stackloads of money would be adequate to maintain their allegiance...

Not forgetting that threats/ 'decisive action' can be taken if they become a nuisance; for example if they join ATS....

reply to post by Blaine91555

So the Chemtrail myth has adapted to include Cloud Seeding which is not a secret or being hidden?

From the start of Chemtrails in the early-mid 1990's Cloud seeding has been proposed along with geo-engineering and population control among other ideas. It's not a new hypothesis that you are trying to fraudulently make it out to be.

How is something that is not hidden in any way part of a conspiracy?

The Kennedy assassination, and 9/11 happened out in the open. Hasn't stopped anyone from claiming they have conspiracy elements.

You obviously don't understand the definition of conspiracy, something that you should rectify if you want to keep participating in a Conspiracy forum.

Seems to me that the myth is adapting to the counter arguments, which mean Chemtrail folks are just making it up as they go along.

The only myth is the one you are inventing here and now, and trying to stereotypically apply to all Chemtrail researchers. Most Chemtrail researchers aren't hopping from one foot to another and have their ideas firmly pinned down. To bad for your "every chemtrail believer believes the exact same thing, so they're all wrong" theory.

reply to post by liejunkie01


Cloud seeding is a CHEMICAL reaction.

So.........

What I find really hard to believe is it seems that anyone who believes in chemtrails cant seem to afford a plane ticket am I wrong because thats how it seems DO you guys ever get up in the wild blue yonder 70,000 flights world wide in any day!

Posted this video before open your eyes and YOUR EARS listen to what is said!!



Did you listen set flight paths etc etc because we have chemtrailers on here who because they live hundreds of miles from an airport think that no planes should pass overhead

It seems that over the last few years science has been dropped from schools if you look at the logic of some people on here.

Originally posted by Byteman
reply to post by liejunkie01

 

Cloud seeding is a CHEMICAL reaction.

So.........

Actually, no its not.

Originally posted by miniatus

Originally posted by Drezden

Originally posted by Blaine91555
Please provide verifiable data from the tests of the air samples from Chemtrails, taken by a qualified unbiased third party. Thanks so much. Otherwise it's highly speculative and in fact you for some reason are lumping into the mixture Crop Dusting and Cloud Seeding which nobody is hiding from anyone.

If I understand the Chemtrail myth, they, whoever they are, are trying to poison us all for some reason and thousands of Pilots and Crews are in on it and don't give a damn about their own families and loved ones and likely tens of thousands of people are keeping it secret and don't give a damn about their own families or loved ones.

Strangely enough, we keep living longer and longer lives each generation and we are healthier when we die, despite the Chemtrails. Any explanation?

Try not to pull "facts" out of your .... ear. Americans are living longer yes, but they are much sicker, the quality of their elderly years has gone down. So many people in nursing homes, I personally would rather die at the age of 70 being able to move around on my own than die at the age of 90 in a nursing home bed where I can't breathe or wipe my own butt or live through the day without heavy medication and treatments.

I don't see where he pulls facts out of his ass.. life expectancy has increased, not decreased.. As for health, there are many factors involved in declining health overall that can be attributed to that .. industrial pollution, benzene in your drinking water ( from plastics ), poor diet, decline in activity as convenience is on the rise.. None of those are chemtrails and all of them have a negative effect on overall health..

Given the context of the thread it's as if you are directly linking those health issues to chemical trails.. and boy is that a leap

Additionally, he raises very valid points in what he said, which you did not address.. What about the pilots who fly these missions? all of the people involved who would be willingly spraying their own friends and family? and to what purpose? why would they want to poison us? .. and to what effect? life expectancy has increased and I see PLENTY of well known things out there that can be blamed for health declines .. seems there's no need to be spraying anything, and if they are.. what a waste of time because it doesn't seem to do that much..

Mind control? well if that's the case why are there still so many who disagree on it? why isn't everyone agreeing on anything for that matter? .. if it's mind control it's not doing a very good job of that either..

It comes down to one scientific mantra .. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence and I've seen none.

edit on 24-2-2011 by miniatus because: (no reason given)

With all the words you've shoved in my mouth I'm not sure how I'm supposed to reply. The ONLY thing I was replying to was the fact that he said "Strangely enough, we keep living longer and longer lives each generation and we are healthier when we die". We are NOT healthier when we die. Forgive me for pointing out incorrect information. I personally don't know if Chemtrails are a real threat or not, how much is true or not. I'm just trying to keep the information honest. I guess that's not important. I apologize.