What did the war bring to us?

I have never served in the armed forces, but I want to give a big thumbs down to Jakomo and anyone else who has bagged on crmanager. Boy you sure look foolish ripping someone in our armed forces who have fought for our freedom. Are we supposed to be impressed that you think the war is unjust.

crmanager, I persoanlly want to thank you for the freedoms that I have, nevermind about these armchair quaterbacks that know nothing about wha our freedoms really are about.

It is so easy to be negative behind your keyboard. Why don't you guys stand up for something you believe in. Not just quoting links and such about how the war in Iraq in unjust boohoo. Jakomo your comments were so wrong, I can't even put it into words. It is not murder, look up the definition.

Back to the subject at hand....

What do illusionists/pickpockets/magicians do? They keep you distracted while they perform a trick/rob you.

The war is a distraction.

Who ever the person that said how do we know that the Iraqi people weren't better off under saddams rule have you seen the vids and pics of the torture chambers and the videos of mothers and fathers showing up to mass grave sites holding pics of their sons and daughters who vanished and were killed remember that

Have you seen the pictures of the inocent causalties of US invation, I forgot, liberation.

Of course every war has civis dying you cant avoid it but we don't kill hundreds of thousands of Iraqis for speaking ill of us and in long run the Iraqis will be better off then they were with saddam.

Originally posted by marg6043
Have you seen the pictures of the inocent causalties of US invation, I forgot, liberation.

Some of those civilians weren't quite innocent themselves. When I was in Fallujah, we were scowering the city for weapon caches. We were walking down the street when we heard sniper shots from down the street. An Iraqi women crossing the street fell to her knees. Shortly after her husband ran to her aid and he was also shot. We quickly retreated and were fired upon serveral times before removing all my guys from the street. Iraqis killing Iraqis.

Another time, in Kabul, we were doing the same excerise. Find weapons, transport them to Baghdad. Fun. An iraqi women peers out her window and starts screaming at us in arabic, we turn to her, she goes inside and momentarily comes back to the window with an AK.. I'll give you a $1 if she wasn't marked down as a civilian death.

So the "all the civilian deaths!" idealogy is sorta bunk. Granted some civilians were and will be caught between fire fights. Or at the wrong place at the wrong time. But the notion that all civilian deaths are indeed civilian deaths (and not civilians SHOOTING AT US) is quite vague and untrue.

Just remember that Iraq as now is the result of the poorly prepared government (our government he did not plan for post war invasion of Iraq) to deal with these results and US troop are as much casualties of the stupidity of this president as the Iraqis killing Iraqis casualties.

I will never blame our troops of what is going on in Iraq. Our troops are fighters not politicians or law enforcers.

I honestly agree with you fully. The GOP (I wont put blame completely on the President) expected a warm hug from the Iraqi's. In all actuality, we got just that. The Iraqi people thanked us all the time. The ones that could speak mild english actually held us to quite high standards.

What the GOP did not plan on though, is the influence of Shiite and Sunni militants. Added with the surge of several terrorist organizations that flooded down from Syria during and after the war. These organizations view a democracy as a threat.

Imagine if the USA was run by an evil dictator. This dictator cattered to militant groups and gave them what they wanted. This dictator slammed the American public around and regularly killed us. One day a country comes and saves us from this evil dictator. You can bet the militant groups are going to fight for him. This is whats going on in Iraq. All the groups that were cattered to under Saddam are fighting to the last man to get things back to normal. The Iraqi civilians are thrilled we're there. But unfortunatly, our wonderful News coverage does not and will not show this.

I agree with you there the media will not show any good that is happening in Iraq like school being built or they wont show the lines of Iraqis singing up to be police or soldier to defend their country they wont show Us soldiers treeing Iraqi civilians in hospitals for every day injuries for every bad thing that happens in Iraq there are more good things happening but of course the media will only report what brings rating up who wants to see good things they only want to show bad things so they can get the mothers fathers brothers and sister of the soldiers glued to the TV

That's only Bush's purpose and wishes maybe,but yours.Soldiers fight for the country and Bush for the throne but haven't any long time.

One thing the war has not brought, if this thread is any guide: Wisdom.

The very title of this thread is constructed to presuppose an answer. It is remiscent of the question "When did you stop beating your wife?"

Look past the garbage incessantly crammed into your heads, and you will have taken your first step into a larger world. It never ceases to amaze me how otherwise thoughtful people let others think for them. So many talking points, so little thought.

I would say more, but the squawking of the parrots is deafening.

Let the shoe that is this message fit those who would wear it. For those it does not fit, I recommend walking on.

Originally posted by marg6043
Just remember that Iraq as now is the result of the poorly prepared government (our government he did not plan for post war invasion of Iraq) to deal with these results and US troop are as much casualties of the stupidity of this president as the Iraqis killing Iraqis casualties.

I've read some of your posts before, and I don't recall agreeing with you very much, but I do here about Bush. The post-war situation was poorly planned, if it was planned at all. Bush and his compadres were WAAAAAAY to ideological in their assessment of Iraq. From what Bush says, he seems to believe that authoritarianism is the root of hostility toward the West in the moslem world, and to democratize the region would end the hatred. That's ignorant. You may, and so may others, disagree with me here. I believe the root is the intense reactionary and hardcore imperialist arab/moslem nationalistic sentiments they have. The moslem world must secularize or be secularized. Without that the problem will not end.
There's nothing wrong with being proud of your culture, but it should never extend to irrational hatred and violence toward others.

With all that being said, I believe Iraq was the wrong target. Iran should have been the target all along.

Every country in this world is different because of its culture,politics and the like.All countries should have their differences.Like China or USA or others,they have some good aspect or bad,but we should try to accept other ideas and views, not to agree but to respect.

Originally posted by EastCoastKid
The war in Iraq has brought us massive debt, unparalleled insecurity, the disdain of the world community and profound ill repute.

We have spent billions bringing "freedom" to a country that doesn't know or care how to deal with it. They now have terrorist attacks where there were none before. Before long they will probably be in the midst of a civil war. We have lost almost 900 American lives. Hostage kidnappings are the order of the day. Our status in the world has been diminished. Our allies are now questioning our motives. Oh Gee ! What did we gain? Nada...zip...zilch. NOTHING worthy of the loss of 1 American life!!

The number of soldiers being killed in Iraq is arised to 891 when I saw my daily newspaper in my home in Beijing.I never know your feeling about that.Maybe that is the cost?

Originally posted by NavyDog
- 872 dead soldiers
- 11,000 wounded
- countless civilians dead and maimed
- more debt for US
- ruined foreign policy and buildup of past relationships
- abu gharib scandal
- beheadings
- increase in terrorism
- it didn't get us Osama - that is for sure
- it didn't stop increase of jihad and hatred for US
- precendents for MORE pre-emptive strikes based on false info

Do we need more??What do our politicans not get?? WHAT ARE we gaining from occupying Iraq????

I really believe that nothing said will change anyones mind.

The discussion is interesting but fruitless.

My two cents...

Soldiers die in war. We lost over 2000 in the SEVEN YEAR occupation of Germany and everyone claimed we were losing the peace.
Soldiers wear green to hide because people want to kill them.

Iraq is and will be better off. If you say otherwise then you really are clueless. Unless you like rape rooms and acid baths.

Iran now has over 200,000 American soldiers surrounding it. They are sweating and we haven't fired a shot at them.

Look. there are no bad people in this thread. But people if you actually think war is NEVER the answer then tell the SIX MILLION JEWS that died that they are just part of the peace process.

This is what it brought us:

www.abovetopsecret.com...