Wisconsin shows rest of country the real union thuggery going on in this country

Originally posted by HoldTheBeans
Clinton had a surplus on paper too.

You're absolutely right and if I'm not mistaken, they called that paper "money, dollars, greenbacks, cash, moola, denero, take your pick. It was a surplus by the same standard used to establish the existence of a deficit.

reply to post by YouSir


well that's not to good is it? the unemployed are unemployed for a reason. assuming that the best get the jobs, then get fired because they have no voice in their workplace, that leaves lower quality workers getting trampled by the state....yeah..mhm...that's a great idea?

Originally posted by universaltruth
reply to post by HoldTheBeans

 

no, this is ridiculous. teachers have an average salary of 46k. this cut is taking 5k off of that, and taking some benefits. benefits make up for the little pay, but decreasing pay AND benefits? some just can't live off that. the poster doesn't seem to realize that these teachers are trying to raise families, and a 5k gap in a personal budget? not easy to make up for. even though 46k is the average, 25k is the starting. drop that to 20k and whos going to want to be a teacher? definitely not the smartest out there. they can get better paying jobs with a bachelors degree

On top of that, in the state of wisconsin it is illegal for teachers to strike. what's ridiculous is he's trying to eliminate the union to, giving them no bargaining power. if a state worker calls in sick for three days in a row he can fire all of them declare state of emergency and rehire into those jobs. which will be happily filled by scabs in this economy.

People need to realize this is going to effect the already suffering education rates, in a time where we need education more than anything. dropping teachers salaries wonb't improve education quality. this wackjob in office has no college degree, and has no hope of returning to office. What's happening is ridiculous, he's forcing state workers to a lower salary

my emphasis is on education, where this blow will be felt the most. as a student in wisconsin, i'd like to say i know what's going on. Absolutey Ridiculous

As a student you know whats going on?? LOL. Nobody is eleminating the union that is the new battle cry. Read the governors proposal and get back to me. It's illegal for truckers to strike too. What's your point? They have been striking in case you havn't noticed by the way but you know what's going on right.

Originally posted by Flatfish

Originally posted by HoldTheBeans
Clinton had a surplus on paper too.

You're absolutely right and if I'm not mistaken, they called that paper "money, dollars, greenbacks, cash, moola, denero, take your pick. It was a surplus by the same standard used to establish the existence of a deficit.

Paper comes from trees that those evil corporation cut down. lol

Kudos to the Governor of Wisconsin!

I'm the daughter of a retired first grade school teacher from NY (30 years). She now enjoys a $72,000 a year pension plus paid heath care.

She was an awesome teacher but that is absolutely INSANE.

I cried in my car today listening to the Randy Rhodes show on radio am 1150 here Los Angeles when Fireman Bob called in and talked about what a fireman does and how it shortens their lifespan. He called in just after another radio personality on another call sign called firemen in the United States "pigs".

Yes, firemen have a union in the United States.

Here in California, our fireman dig dead babies out of dumpsters, handle anthrax calls, fly to the Middle East to handle bio toxins, put out fires, answer the calls in my neighborhood when someone has a heart attack and bring the dead bodies of teenagers in gangs to the morgue. At Christmas time we take all manner toys to our local stations and they drive them to the inner city for Fireman Santa to hand out to the children.

Just saying...

Originally posted by angelwrangler
I cried in my car today listening to the Randy Rhodes show on radio am 1150 here Los Angeles when Fireman Bob called in and talked about what a fireman does and how it shortens their lifespan. He called in just after another radio personality on another call sign called firemen in the United States "pigs".

Yes, firemen have a union in the United States.

Here in California, our fireman dig dead babies out of dumpsters, handle anthrax calls, fly to the Middle East to handle bio toxins, put out fires, answer the calls in my neighborhood when someone has a heart attack and bring the dead bodies of teenagers in gangs to the morgue. At Christmas time we take all manner toys to our local stations and they drive them to the inner city for Fireman Santa to hand out to the children.

Just saying...

Ummm thats their job.

reply to post by angelwrangler


Firemen and police officers accepted the inherent responsibilities/risks of those occupations when they CHOSE those occupations. It was their choice. There are plenty of other occupations that they could have pursued.

reply to post by Erasurehead


"union thug".

name callings a bit immature for a 42 year old
your arguement would've looked more valid and respectable without that
that kind of argueing is the reason debates go into mindless childish nothings.

don't cite yourself if you won't prove it. i could say "i'm barack obama. i don't care if you believe me, because i know i am." no one's going to believe me, and it makes me look stupid. except instead of me, it's you

Originally posted by universaltruth
reply to post by YouSir

 

well that's not to good is it? the unemployed are unemployed for a reason. assuming that the best get the jobs, then get fired because they have no voice in their workplace, that leaves lower quality workers getting trampled by the state....yeah..mhm...that's a great idea?

Not exactly how the government works for jobs. The best get fired because they are too much of a threat to those how have position of authority over them leaving the rest of the heard much easier to manage.

reply to post by universaltruth

as a student in wisconsin, i'd like to say i know what's going on.

Apparently, you don't, because what you said here:

teachers have an average salary of 46k. this cut is taking 5k off of that,

is wrong. From Reuters

State workers must increase contributions to their pensions to 5.8 percent of salary, and
double contributions to their health insurance premiums to 12.6 percent.

then this.

the poster doesn't seem to realize that these teachers are trying to raise families, and a 5k gap in a personal budget?

I, too, am trying to raise a family, and this past year, in Wisconsin, my property taxes were $6200.

Do you know what property taxes pay for?
Schools.

Of course, since I opt to send my child to private school, tack on another $8000 in tuition alone.

On top of that, in the state of wisconsin it is illegal for teachers to strike.

Then why were schools shut down across the state yesterday and today?

dropping teachers salaries wonb't improve education quality.

Increasing them hasn't seemed to work, either, now has it?

All you people who are bashing unions don’t realize the debt you owe unions in this country. EVERY benefit you have, from vacations to days off and sick days is because of what unions fought for.

You are ignorant ingrates and deserve a governor like Walker and the fool in New Jersey Christ Christie.

Soon, after they finish with the national union bashing, they will go after you, the ordinary guy, and do all kinds of things to you and your rights.

Right now they are trying to nullify the rights of woman after that will come the environment, social security, health care, and everything else that empowers ordinary people, and what will be left is modern serfdom.

YOUR NEXT!

MIDDLE CLASS PEOPLE GET THEIR POWER FROM THINGS LIKE UNIONS AND COMING TOGETHOR AND FORMING COALITIONS

What you dupes who union bash don’t realize is that once the rich and their lackeys [ Republicans] fool you and deceive you to hate what benefits you . . . that will leave you powerless and barren

You will be at the mercy of the rich and powerful

AND THEN THEY WILL DESTROY YOU!

Yes it's all labor's fault! Its labors fault that American workers will not work for 50 cents an hour so that some well deserving CEO can "earn" a billion in salary. It's labors fault that corporations don't pay taxes. It's labors fault that millionaires and billionaires refuse to pay taxes. It's labors fault that corporations have moved operations to foreign countries. Labor in the US is too expensive who can blame them. Labor is greedy! Not those poor billionaires and millionaires. Labor is a pig at the trough. I saw my son's teacher board her private jet for some conference in Hawaii and I thought "Man those teachers sure have got it made." Wish I was a teacher in a big bad union with Mafia enforcers so I could be a socialist mobster living the high life!

Well I gotta go Rush is on the radio!

reply to post by HoldTheBeans


as i said, focusing on education buddy. so their not eliminating it, apologies for my wording. effectively eliminating it's purpose. teachers can't strike, workers can't leave for three days, which they would use for protest. then they get fired. is that better for you? i'll just spoon feed you my thoughts.
this guy is playing politics. fire and police are exempted, and they made pretty large contributions to his campaign.

reply to post by HoldTheBeans


"Let them die, we can decrease the surplus population" Ring a bell...or no?

"They knew it was their job,..."

They did not know that they were not going to be compensated for it. And furthermore, they did not know they were going to earn money, put in their pension accounts, have it gambled upon or take a 3% reduction in last years salary and then be asked to give up their first amendment rights.

Read my post before last, take into account quantitative easing, their pensions are down around 30% conservatively.

What's your model? Cough it up or shut up.

reply to post by Oaktree



"State workers must increase contributions to their pensions to 5.8 percent of salary, and
double contributions to their health insurance premiums to 12.6 percent"

ok, so roughly 8k? your point? this is averaged. it changes witht the salary

Originally posted by jrod

Originally posted by universaltruth
reply to post by YouSir

 

well that's not to good is it? the unemployed are unemployed for a reason. assuming that the best get the jobs, then get fired because they have no voice in their workplace, that leaves lower quality workers getting trampled by the state....yeah..mhm...that's a great idea?

Not exactly how the government works for jobs. The best get fired because they are too much of a threat to those how have position of authority over them leaving the rest of the heard much easier to manage.

they're using politics...in politics! the masses get played over money and they get their power. everyone's happy...right?

reply to post by universaltruth

ok, so roughly 8k? your point?

I'm sure I made my point.
And some day, when you're old enough to pay taxes, you will see it, too.

reply to post by robyn


A future without police officers and firemen....

Ever called 911 Robyn?

Ever been afraid for a loved one or a neighbor or an OD teen? Ever seen the streets? The real streets?

Ever needed a police officer to be their first because you could not get there on time?

Or are the lives of the peoples on this thread so safe, so insulated, so not in the mainstream of the life on this planet that they can say without conscious, "...they could have chose other occupations."

The cavalier attitude of you all with the lives of police officers, firemen, teachers, city workers, trash haulers, snow plowers and everybody else who keeps the fabric of your universes together is abhorrent.

And guess what self righteous ones, on the other side of the mirror, these workers ( and so obviously not you) face down big government, big business and big banks...and, it is revealed, that you do not? No dirt under your fingernails., Coffee house debaters all.

All bark... no bite

reply to post by angelwrangler



Your reply to my post does not follow logically.

I appreciate the services of the public employees that my tax dollars pay for. And, they are certainly entitled to a fair wage commensurate with the risks and the responsibilities of their jobs. However, the crux of the problem (I believe) lies in the fact that unions themselves have become fairly corrupt business supporting corrupt politicians in exchange for political favor.