Middle School Student Behavior

reply to post by bevigilant


If you are talking while a teacher is trying to teach, you are being disrespectful. There's no two ways about it. It doesn't matter if you were smarter than some of your teachers, you were still being rude. I just opted out of class, or talked back when the material was obviously fallacious. If I was in class and the material seemed to be doing some good for some of the students, there was no way in hell my conscience would allow me to be so disrespectful as to talk while a teacher was doing her thing.

reply to post by unityemissions


>needs to read my post again

reply to post by bevigilant


I did. You were acting antisocial and being totally rude.

reply to post by unityemissions


>antisocial - nope

>rude - maybe... but i was like 13, and since you don't know the circumstances, you arent one to judge.

I went to middle school in the late-70's and I can remember my classmates terrorizing a nearly retired teacher until he locked himself in his office while everything from pencils & erasers to ninja stars were being thrown at him. I felt bad for him, but I understood he no longer had the respect of his students due to his prior dealings with them. That was the last day of his career as he left & retired a few weeks earlier than planned.

I can also remember hearing stories about places like Compton CA. There, kids were stabbed for shoes or leather jackets and girls couldn't use the school restrooms for fear of being raped.

Somehow, I can imagine that our classrooms were never all like "Little House on the Prairie" or "Leave it to Beaver".

Perhaps the only difference now is instead of being hidden on the back pages of some MSM rag if they decided to publish it, we can all see it & discuss it if we choose.

There is nothing biologically different in kids today than then. We still ate McDonald's Hamburgers & drank Coca Cola. In fact I remember if you went to school early enough you could buy maple bars (or jelly filled donuts) at the cafeteria for breakfast along with whole milk if you wanted.

Yeah, I can remember some stupid rules back then, but I know we'd never be suspended for drawing a picture of a gun, a miniature replica gun on a key ring or even using a fake gun prop while acting out in a school play. Now days everything is so politically correct they probably have to rewrite nearly every play scene they try to produce just to fit in with all the ridicules police state rules.

As some other posters have mentioned how can anyone expect kids to respect them once they learn that you lie to them all the time because you don't trust them with the truth? Ask any Native Americans about how much truth is in American History books.

Perhaps not much different than many of the folks who have decided to become career politicians these days who believe the best policies are to lie to their peoples for as long as they can get away with it.

The only difference I see is that the kids have access to more information more quickly these days, and many schools & or teachers have responded by banning electronic devices instead of embarrassing them. Those teachers who are allowing students to text their answers for quiz's on the fly have both their students attention & respect while those who spend their time banning such devices and thus disciplining students for having them out are quite frankly inept at dealing with the speed of technology & thus probably shouldn't be teaching anyway if they can't keep up enough to keep today's kids engaged and hungry to learn.

Originally posted by bevigilant
when i was in middle school i was one of a few 'so called ''class terrors''
its called being a kid. I had a problem with authority, especially authority (which in my mind) either abused their authority, did not know how to sensibly excersise it or i just found that a teacher/sup[ply teacher was not worthy to teach. Thing is, i have always been extremely logical. I never (apart from a few times) directly went out of my way to cause disruption (talking doesnt count, that excuse is, in my opinion totalitarianistic, controllive and plain opressive) (unless the talking is DURING the teacher talking, or an exam)

conformity to the state starts in school, and i was pretty lucky that a lot of my class were non-conformists.

PROTIP: disobedience (not disrespect) to authority is a good thing, deal with it.

====
EDIT
====

basically the way it used to go, is i would talk, the teacher would demand that i be quiet, then i would present a flawless logical argument as to why there is no problem with me talking. I never once raise my voice, but eventually the teacher collapses into a raving rant, as their opressive control is taken away from them through truth of words.

the smart teachers understood and recognised me for the type of person i am, and treated me respectfull and i in turn treated them respectfully. I had nio problems in those classes

....

but boy oh boy, you should've been in classes with me when the overly religious, support teacher was in. She was like an old-school, shink she knows it all, religion spouter, opressing nitwit. She would call people ''blasphemers'' for making any referances such as ''bloody hell'' or ''christ'' (work related)

simply, i caused her to have a mental breakdown, just by sitting and logically talking with her, she started running around screaming and flipping tables, while i sat there, coolly.

edit on 16-1-2011 by bevigilant because: added text

Ha,ha,ha I just can't help, but laugh at your post. I remember my fifth grade teacher had a wooden paddle that she used freely. She was an old-school marm with white hair. My younger sister's class took the paddle away from her and broke it. They also retired three other teachers...whew! They were 'the tough bunch', but they were still good kids. They weren't into drugs or trouble outside school. They just had a mind of their own.

I think the most popular teachers were the ones that took an interest in the students and allowed some expression, but teachers now are faced with a lot of pressure. They only have so much time to teach the material, because there is a quota or agenda to fill. The stakes have risen in standardized test scores and those test scores reflect on teacher's performance.

I think they should do away with tenure. (I'm sorry!) I get so boiling mad when I see my son's test scores in Spanish. This is a teacher that rarely teaches and doesn't care, if the students pass or fail. She doesn't even teach all the material on tests she gives. When an extremely bright student and most of the classroom fails her tests, you know it's the teacher. Last month the kids had to write an essay in English on "The Living Dead'. What does that have to do with Spanish? After doing some research, only two teachers with tenure have ever been fired and it involved money-embezzling, nothing to do with teaching.

Most teachers do care and I do sympathize with them. They have their hands full with more students than they can handle and the pressure of teaching a set curriculum that they can't afford to deviate from. I ended my sentence with a preposition. It sounds right! Rules, rules, and more rules!

Originally posted by aero56
reply to post by Anttyk47

 

edit on 16-1-2011 by aero56 because: sorry, this post was meant for WhizPhiz

? =|

The only teachers I ever got along with were the ones that acted like teachers. This one teacher would come in, give us 2 or 3 sheets of notes, spend the class reading them to us, and then give us a test at the end of the week. I got so bored with these teachers trying to relate with students, it just seemed like they were trying too hard.

You have to learn to respect authority, I may not like my supervisors on certain days, but I respect them, not because they are higher up than me, but because they worked hard to get where they are.

Originally posted by gougitousakusha
reply to post by aero56

 

this is the result of bad parenting. you really should be able to go to the house an give one of them a smack on the head. go into the parents place of work and act like their brat child, then ask what kind of mood it left them in.

its not bad parenting, its an education system that is a joke. they arent taught to learn anymore, just to regurgitate info like a good little robot to maintain the status quo.

Originally posted by Anttyk47

Originally posted by WeRpeons
reply to post by Anttyk47

 

Don't compare College and Middle school.
What kind of 18-20ish year old in college is compared to a 12-14 year old middle schooler?
Don't say that these aged kids SHOULD understand that people become stressed and that not everyones gonna be nice everyday.
What kind of 13 year old is going to understand STRESS FROM WORK?
Do teachers learn to teach AND learn to deal with young teenagers? Surely preschoolers have some nursing degree of some sort.
My opinion. No.

I never said I was comparing college kids to middle school kids! I was referring to my own high school days.

As for middle school kids, don't sell them short as being so innocent and naive. They know perfectly well the difference between right and wrong. There are kids in our district who are currently in juvenile detention for doing adult crimes!! Do you really expect teachers to coddle kids so when they graduate from high school they find out the hard way that the world isn't always a friendly fuzzy place? Teachers are not doing kids any kind of benefit by treating them any differently than how the real world operates.


I gather I'm a lot older than you, and I've experience a lot more of this dog-eat-dog world has to offer. I'm a CAD instructor, and have worked with many large corporations and small locally owned businesses. I've had to hire and fire people who were incompetent or had terrible work ethics. I teach my kids practical experience that they need to become successful in the work force. Talk to anyone who's in business and they will tell you the biggest problem they are having with new employees is poor work ethics. Students need to know how to follow rules, directions, be on time for class, clean-up after themselves, be honest and be responsible for their actions. The majority of my students can't do this without myself reminding them every single day!! They know I grade them on this simple daily practice and they still just don't care. Kids today have been spoon fed since they started school. Students don't know how to analyze or problem solve things on their own. Employers expect this of their employees. If they don't have the ability to do this, they won't last long in the work place especially in this economy.

I think a good punishment for most of those misfits would be to require the parent to attend with their child during class. The kids would instantly behave because of the extreme embarrassment of having their parents tag along with them every where.

reply to post by queenofsheba


I totally agree with your assessment. Our district eliminated tech ed classes, art, music and home economics to spend more time learning how to pass state tests. If politicians would let teachers do their jobs instead of worrying about test scores maybe students would enjoy learning more. Students need a break between academics and those courses did just that. Those courses gave students hands-on-leaning skills and helped them learn everyday life skills.

I do agree their should be some kind of basic testing before kids advance after 3 grade levels. Let's make sure they can read at a 3rd grade level and pass basic 3rd grade math before advancing to 4th grade and so on.

Originally posted by WeRpeons

Originally posted by Anttyk47

Originally posted by WeRpeons
reply to post by Anttyk47

 

Don't compare College and Middle school.
What kind of 18-20ish year old in college is compared to a 12-14 year old middle schooler?
Don't say that these aged kids SHOULD understand that people become stressed and that not everyones gonna be nice everyday.
What kind of 13 year old is going to understand STRESS FROM WORK?
Do teachers learn to teach AND learn to deal with young teenagers? Surely preschoolers have some nursing degree of some sort.
My opinion. No.

I never said I was comparing college kids to middle school kids! I was referring to my own high school days.

As for middle school kids, don't sell them short as being so innocent and naive. They know perfectly well the difference between right and wrong. There are kids in our district who are currently in juvenile detention for doing adult crimes!! Do you really expect teachers to coddle kids so when they graduate from high school they find out the hard way that the world isn't always a friendly fuzzy place? Teachers are not doing kids any kind of benefit by treating them any differently than how the real world operates.


I gather I'm a lot older than you, and I've experience a lot more of this dog-eat-dog world has to offer. I'm a CAD instructor, and have worked with many large corporations and small locally owned businesses. I've had to hire and fire people who were incompetent or had terrible work ethics. I teach my kids practical experience that they need to become successful in the work force. Talk to anyone who's in business and they will tell you the biggest problem they are having with new employees is poor work ethics. Students need to know how to follow rules, directions, be on time for class, clean-up after themselves, be honest and be responsible for their actions. The majority of my students can't do this without myself reminding them every single day!! They know I grade them on this simple daily practice and they still just don't care. Kids today have been spoon fed since they started school. Students don't know how to analyze or problem solve things on their own. Employers expect this of their employees. If they don't have the ability to do this, they won't last long in the work place especially in this economy.

You know at first this started out as an argument, but i want to get on some sort of same level basis here.
You probably have had x2 or x3 my life expierence, as i'm only 17. But it doesn't mean i don't know about the things you talk about.
I just want to point out here,

FIRST OF ALL.
You're teaching these kids based on your own life expierence, pushing them to learn from your mistakes.
You remind them constantly about these sort of things quote "every single day!!"
Kids today are being spoon fed since they started school. They don't know how to analyze or problem solve.
SURELY THERE MUST BE A REASON FOR ALL THIS?
You know i learned something very small when i was younger. It had to do with electronic devices. Don't update something that works perfectly fine. Not unless you need the upgrade. If somethings not working, update it/upgrade it.

Obviously there's something wrong with the Education system. But whats with the blame game? Why can't there be COMPROMISE?
You can get a breif understanding of how my schooling went with the very first thread i posted on ATS.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

The American Education System DID NOT WORK FOR ME. I came to realize, it is not supposed to work for everyone. There's like 100 million people on facebook, yet only 200 thousand people on ATS. Hey facebook works for the majority, so ATS shouldn't be bothered right? I didn't fit into the education system simply because i was a puzzle piece that did not fit. Perhaps if we try to work for a better education system we wouldn't have teachers afraid of their students. I've been to 8 schools in 11 years. 7 of which were public schools and 1 of which was an alternative highschool. (The alternative HS had an awesome program which i enjoyed well.. anyways) Student comitte's or students that work with staff have little say in how schools are run. Because what really runs the school is the School Board. I see the school board being FAT BANKERS COMPARED TO THE USA. They don't see eye to eye. They force the teachers to deal with the students and try to get as little problems as they can. Teacher retires? Thats because they were not fit for the job, so instead they hire an Ex-Marines guy that has PTSD which whip the students into shape and leave the school board with no problems.

You want the kids of today to not be so STUPID/ARROGANT/IGNORANT/DISRESPECTFUL?
How about.
Compromise.


What we're doing wrong?
We hire counslers to force kids to not learn while they're in school, but instead force them to speak to these people because those kids are "PROBLEMS"
We threaten kids with expulsion suspension detention - like they're 6 year olds getting punished for stealing cookies before dinner.
We say they're young adults, but treat them like toddlers.
We force students to learn in a way that they might not be compforatble learning in, or is not the best way to teach a young adult.
Most importantly, we force them with knowledge we think they need.


And on a side note, we built a institution that simply creates people to not think.
I'm a young adult in a crisis because i dont know how to handle seeing the majority of my age group act so inhuman. We're creating non-humans

That side note woulda led me to a big rant. Anyways hope you enjoy this post WeRpeons - and anyone else interested in this topic.

Originally posted by davespanners
reply to post by NadaCambia

 

Agreed.

I find it quite amusing that we have a bunch of teachers on here complaining that their inability to teach properly is down to the "degeneration of society"

Have any of you ever considered that you just aren't that good at keeping discipline in your classes? Or that your standards are slipping and not the kids?
I guess not, it must be down to children being so much worse then before, before this last year most children just sat quietly in rows awaiting your instruction

edit on 15-1-2011 by davespanners because: (no reason given)

Uh...no that's not entirely it. You are being simplistic. I can only speak for myself, but I know that I can teach and I also know that I can control a class. I wouldn't be a teacher if I didn't love my job. This past year, I have seen so many excellent teachers who care about their students, offer exciting and interesting lessons, and who are skilled at behaviour management throw their hands up in frustration and disbelief at the extent of the bad behaviour of these kids who do not seem to want to learn, do not learn from their mistakes and CANNOT SEEM TO RELATE TO OTHERS AS ONE HUMAN BEING TO ANOTHER.


signature:


Agreed.

I find it quite amusing that we have a bunch of teachers on here complaining that their inability to teach properly is down to the "degeneration of society"

Have any of you ever considered that you just aren't that good at keeping discipline in your classes? Or that your standards are slipping and not the kids?
I guess not, it must be down to children being so much worse then before, before this last year most children just sat quietly in rows awaiting your instruction

Originally posted by XxRagingxPandaxX
reply to post by 5MaveN5

 

Spare the rod spoil the child bull#. I'm 16, i'v been spanked twice my entire life, i'm not unruly, I make good grades, and i'm a good kid. Although I completely agree that your child SHOULD be disciplined, I think beating them is completely uncalled for and child abuse. I'm not saying you do, but thats what your post could be interpreted as! Also it is fair to mention people are different and there is only one of me, everyone is different so everyone calls for a little different parenting style, but i'm against people beating their kids!

There's a fundamental difference between beating a child and applying appropriate physical discipline. 5MaveN5 did not advocate that the child(ren) be beaten. We don't know what she meant by her "spare the rod, spoil the child" reference. There undoubtedly are children to whom that adage holds true.

Sounds like you learned the lesson of your two spankings quickly and moderated your behavior accordingly. Assuming, of course, that the spankings were applied for your benefit rather than as the target upon whom your parents vented their frustrations.

reply to post by Harlan1111


I find it hard to believe so many teachers are on ATS in general :O

Originally posted by Anttyk47
reply to post by Harlan1111

 

I find it hard to believe so many teachers are on ATS in general :O

People can be anything on the internet.

- alien
-Angel
-jesus
-messenger
-etc

Originally posted by AtruthGuy

Originally posted by Anttyk47
reply to post by Harlan1111

 

I find it hard to believe so many teachers are on ATS in general :O

People can be anything on the internet.

- alien
-Angel
-jesus
-messenger
-etc

Just not female. And if you believe they are, you are a fool

Anyways i love this topic, lets not steer it into OT!

reply to post by WhizPhiz


That's why career and technical schools should be the norm across this country. Students graduate from an all academic high school and than find they have no marketable skills to help them earn more than the minimum wage.

Career and Technical schools got a bad rap in the 70's, because parents felt those schools were for dummies who couldn't make it into college. I would beg to differ, I've had students who have gone on to become engineers. They have come back to tell me their 1st year of college was easy, because they already learned how to draw technical drawings and understood the terminology better than students who came from regular academic high schools.

It's makes simple sense...

= 4 year of related terminology with academics helps kids prepare better for their related college degree.