I spent 3 hours in the ER on the 15th. I just got my $11,000.00 bill in the mail.

So much for Deny Ignorance...

It's rather amusing to read all of the American bashing and denigration of healthcare coverage in this thread... The OP could have avoided the bill at the hospital if he had only applied for AHCCCS which is Arizona's Medicaid program. There would be no charge for an ER visit... None... Zero... Zilch... No bill to stick anywhere, no worries, nothing to bitch moan or complain about... There is one caveat... You have to be responsible enough to apply for AHCCCS in order to receive it... But I'm thinking if you are unemployed and only have $50.00 a month to your name you should be able to find time to fill out an application (and the OP's internet connection is not in question).

There's a time to grow up and act like an adult and this may be it... This may be some tough love, but to read five pages of ignorance and drivel that is devoid of reality begs a response... A reasoned and well grounded response.

Of coarse if you actually engage in the aforementioned mature conduct and properly guard your personal well being, you may not have much success with threads detailing personal experiences...

Sounds like a fair trade to me.

reply to post by randomname


Why wish something bad upon someone for saying something like that? Hate creates a viscous cycle like this. Instead of attacking people on forums put your time to better use sir.

Just say you're Mexican the next time you go to the ER. Act like you dont understand English. Give a fake address and phone #.


Works every time.

Originally posted by Frankenchrist

Just say you're Mexican the next time you go to the ER. Act like you dont understand English. Give a fake address and phone #.

Works every time.

Identity fraud

Brilliant

reply to post by Mirthful Me

There's a time to grow up and act like an adult and this may be it... This may be some tough love, but to read five pages of ignorance and drivel that is devoid of reality begs a response... A reasoned and well grounded response

Are you cooking your own meth at home again ?


pages of ignorance ? or pages of people who understand why the system sucks ? People use the word so freely now. Ignorant this ignorant that . Healthcare is the minimum that anybody could ask for who pays into the system. Life gives alot of lemons at times , the last thing u need to worry about is a giant health care bill. Most people i know living off credit cards and massive amounts of debt . Let alone having a couple grand on the side to pay for silly over priced medical bills .

Everyone deserves healthcare at the very minimum of being human beings . Even our enemys deserve it . The governments steal trillions from tax payers a little healthcare really is to much to ask for ? Alotta sick people just asking for a bone they won't even give that

This is a sad story. I personally believe that we need a better system in place here in the US. There are plenty of succcessful examples out there in the world; surely some combo of these successful programs can be workable here. My bottom line is that I am disgusted that the health and well being of an individual is viewed in a profit/loss type of lense as opposed to what is just and right. What floors me even more is that anyone that calls themselves a christian would support the current system we have in place; Jesus would not like how we treat the least among us.

reply to post by seedofchucky


None of which addresses the reality that if the OP had applied for AHCCCS he wouldn't have a bill... Period. I realize that doesn't fit into your agenda... But reality and agendas are typically disparate. You can foam at the mouth because it suits you, but personally I would play the adult card and make sure I didn't get a hospital bill and get on with my life.

On another note, here is his hospital's financial assistance page.

Looks like they currently offer assistance to households with annual incomes of $125,000.00 or less... If my 'rithmatic is correct, $50.00 a month is just under that threshold.

But why let facts get in the way of an opportunity to pontificate using sheer ignorance.

reply to post by Mirthful Me


I dont know about AZ but in Florida I have applied for medicaid and medicare many times and I am denied! It is highly frustrating when you can't pay simple bills and go to the doctor when needed because of the HUGE bill you will get in a months time.

I will have insurance next month because it is required I have it for the program I am in in school. Funny how I have to take out a loan to afford insurance but I will tell you this I will use every bit of that insurance every chance I get.

I have looked into insurance for just me and it runs about $200-300 bucks a month. The premium per month for my insurance for school is $225 a month and well I can't afford that so I had to take out a school loan just for the insurance I HAVE to have..

You would think with it being considered a hazardous environment they would OFFER insurance but no we have to get it on our own and if you don't have it you can't be in the program..

Some terrible stories on here!
Ripping off the sick and most vulnerable in society... don't think you can go much lower than that.

For those who actually qualify for insurance, is it expensive to have?

I'm almost surprised people haven't revolted in streets!! The gov doesn't seem to mind helping out the greedy corporates but not it's needy citizens.

Hospitals grossly overcharge because they have so many street people and bums come in who never pay diddly squat.

That, and they are running extra tests to avoid lawsuits.

So if you can only pay a dollar month, pay a dollar a month. As long as you're paying, that's it.

But for God's sake, don't get yourself worked up, blow a capillary and vapor lock.

You do what you can do, and that's all you can do!

This is a disgusting situation.

People who are grabbing money money money and power power power can't see what is right in front of them - greed is the root of all evil - not only that, but it will cause our downfall, including theirs (most spectacularly, theirs).

Health care should be a right, not a privilege. But it is not.

Education should be a right, not a privilege. But it is not.

Adequate nourishment should be a right, not a privilege. But it is not.

A roof over you head should be a right, not a privilege. But it is not.

But it is true that the love of money is the root of all evil (for once I agree with the bible).

Those of you that say healthcare should be free need to state your reasons why puhlease.

There is no such thing as free healthcare.

There is however taxation, which is another word for robbery in my book.

If I have money taken from me through the threat of violence or actual use of violence and given to the government so they can allow its use by someone else is that not called robbery?Especially in regards to funding abortion, abuse of social welfare,fighting foreign wars for gain. Why am I beholden to provide for a system that encourages its citizens to not be productive?It is not the governments job to tell me what I can and can not spend my earned income upon.I am more than willing to give to those in need any extra resources I can afford...as a matter of fact I do.I have my own family to take care of. I should not be held responsible to provide for anothers.

I went off on a tangent once to see exactly how much of my income goes to taxes here in the USofA.
40% of my income is taken by taxation when you add in all the hidden taxes.Those that do not believe this I challenge you to add up all the taxes you pay in a year.It's to the point now to where they even tax you when you're dead!Here is a list to aid you on your way.


TAXES:
Accounts Receivable Tax
Building Permit Tax
Capital Gains Tax
CDL license Tax
Cigarette Tax
Corporate Income Tax
Court Fines (indirect taxes)
Dog License Tax
Federal Income Tax
Federal Unemployment Tax (FUTA)
Fishing License Tax
Food License Tax
Fuel permit tax
Gasoline Tax (42 cents per gallon)
Hunting License Tax
Inheritance Tax Interest expense (tax on the money)
Inventory tax IRS Interest Charges (tax on top of tax)
IRS Penalties (tax on top of tax)
Liquor Tax
Local Income Tax
Luxury Taxes
Marriage License Tax
Medicare Tax
Property Tax
Real Estate Tax
Septic Permit Tax
Service Charge Taxes
Social Security Tax
Road Usage Taxes (Truckers)
Sales Taxes
Recreational Vehicle Tax
Road Toll Booth Taxes
School Tax
State Income Tax
State Unemployment Tax (SUTA)
Telephone federal excise tax
Telephone federal universal service fee tax
Telephone federal, state and
local surcharge taxes
Telephone minimum usage surcharge tax
Telephone recurring and non-recurring charges tax
Telephone state and local tax
Telephone usage charge tax
Toll Bridge Taxes
Toll Tunnel Taxes
Traffic Fines (indirect taxation)
Trailer Registration Tax
Utility Taxes
Vehicle License Registration Tax
Vehicle Sales Tax
Watercraft Registration Tax
Well Permit Tax

Workers Compensation Tax

Not one of these taxes existed 100 years ago and our nation was the most prosperous in the world, had absolutely no national debt, had the largest middle class in the world and only one parent had to work to support the family.

What happened?

Since the creation of managed care in this country by our beloved government in the 60s the health care industry has outpaced inflation in terms of costs by 30% year over year.

The health care industry has seen so much inflation that the end result is what can only be described as HYPERINFLATION.

Originally posted by catwhoknowsplusone
This is a disgusting situation.

People who are grabbing money money money and power power power can't see what is right in front of them - greed is the root of all evil - not only that, but it will cause our downfall, including theirs (most spectacularly, theirs).

Health care should be a right, not a privilege. But it is not.

Education should be a right, not a privilege. But it is not.

Adequate nourishment should be a right, not a privilege. But it is not.

A roof over you head should be a right, not a privilege. But it is not.

But it is true that the love of money is the root of all evil (for once I agree with the bible).

So are you out there working your fingers to the bone to provide all of this "freely" from your labors for your fellow man?

Or do you just feel ENTITLED to it?

reply to post by TexasChem


People pay taxes.

Taxes pay for people's rights, or should.

As a taxpayer, yes, I do feel entitled.

Originally posted by FarArcher
Hospitals grossly overcharge because they have so many street people and bums come in who never pay diddly squat.

I have seen this a number of times in this posting and it is simply not true. Medical care prices are artificially inflated due to the way insurance and medical providers handle charges. I explained this in page three of this posting but will quote it again

"I see many of you do not understand how the U.S health insurance / Medical Service scam works in relation to cash paying and insured customers.

If the OP had insurance, the insurance company would pay around $800-$1000 of that $11,000 bill. The hospital would consider that payment in full as is required by the contract with the insurance company.

That explains why they were able to easily knock off $8000.00 because with insurance they would probably receive much less than that.

Do you really think the insurance company actually pays $300.00 for a Tylenol PM?..Of course not, but if you were a cash paying customer they do expect it.

Another example from personal experience. I have a condition that requires me to have a blood test every six months.
Cash Price: $142.50
Insurance price: $12.00

Check your EOB's from your insurance companies closely sometime, you will see the same thing. What the Hospital charges Vs. what the insurance actually pays and the Hospital considers paid in full. "

In reality the Hospital really only expects to get around $1,000 for that $11,000 bill, however seeing as this patient has no insurance they appeared to try and look helpful by knocking off $8000, but that $8000 was already just over inflation of the bill compared to what they really expect to get for the bill.

As for getting state aide and such, it is more complected than just meeting the income requirement and filling out some forums, generally there are a whole list of other criteria to get on these types of plans.Some states have a set limit on how many can be on the state plan and if you apply you will be put on a waiting list hoping somebody opts out or dies.
As for the Hospital aide, many times you have to be married or have dependent children to qualify for charity plans.
We simply have no idea if the OP would have qualified for any of these types of plans.

The humane thing the hospital could do is reduce the bill to the level they would expect an insurance company to pay and work with the OP from there.

To the OP: Do go and check out the options available to you at your income level from the hospital, some local governments also offer emergency medical bill help if you have dependents. The hospital will be able to fill you in on all these types of plans. Just make an appointment and be honest with them. The hospital wants to be paid by whoever and if they can steer you in the direction to get some help, the more likely they are to get paid.

Originally posted by catwhoknowsplusone
This is a disgusting situation.

Indeed it is.

Health care should be a right, not a privilege. But it is not.

So if you smoke a pack a day and get emphysema it is your right to stick me with the bill for your bad personal choices? Health care isn't a right because your health and your body are YOUR responsibility, not society's.

Education should be a right, not a privilege. But it is not.

We've all but made education a right in this country. Education is entirely up to you, and it is entirely up to you how much or how little education you get. There are many cost effective ways to achieve an education that doesn't require me paying for your music lessons.

Adequate nourishment should be a right, not a privilege. But it is not.

And who decides what adequate is? No one in this country is starving. There is help, privately and publicly, both of which I support. But it is not a right, your nutrition is your responsibility as well, otherwise what is the point of working to provide for your family if government does it all for you?

A roof over you head should be a right, not a privilege. But it is not.

A roof over your head is most certainly not a right. I'm sure there are plenty of freeloaders in the US who would love it if my tax dollars paid their rent...Oh wait, they already benefit in that capacity...

But it is true that the love of money is the root of all evil (for once I agree with the bible).

And government doesn't love money? Have you ever read the Soviet Constitution? Everything you listed has to be paid for, when it couldn't be millions went to gulags, prisons, and death row, others were conscripted into the the military to rob the Soviet satellites of their wealth...Today the US is following the same path, would you really have us make the same mistakes they have?

I guess so.

reply to post by Dreamwatcher


I said something like this a couple of pages back as well.

Not as detailed, and awesome though

And don't forget the three rules, if you go to the ER without your consent:
1) Don't sign anything
2) Make them prove you signed something
3) No debtors prison if you did sign something

And don't forget, every other industry is feeling pain in their wallets due to the current economic state. Well every industry except the medical, that has actually been growing by leaps and bounds during these times.

I refuse medical treatment of this type, the stress of the bills is not worth my life. I would rather die than be strapped with an 11,000 dollar bill. Litterallty

My daughter has Cystic Fibrosis..Its a chronic, progressive, and frequently fatal genetic (inherited) disease of the body's mucus glands..
Some of her meds are very expensive running up to 500 dollars a week some are alot more..sometimes she has to be in the hospital for over a month at a time..It got to the point i was selling everything i could get my hands on in my home to pay the bills..I offred the hospital 50 dollars a month they said no they wanted the payment in full there was no way i could do this ...
So i went to the county and they are picking up the bills for her hospital and dr visits plus her medications the health care system in the USA is horrible i feel for anyone that gets slaped with a hospital bill cuz its going to be more then anyone can afford..
I worked 2 jobs and couldnt keep up with her bills the health system needs to change,,

Many folks in this thread are busy using this story by the OP to make their politically motivated, absurdly emotional points about how much American health care sucks...

Many of them are right. But socializing medicine through the same government that gave us the Iraq War, torture, the Gulf of Tonkin, the TSA, warrantless wiretapping, the housing bubble, the .com bubble, stupid programs like cash for clunkers, and a whole lot of other nonsensical, anti-American crap is just plain stupid.

Everywhere the government is there is either a broke agency or an artificially inflated market, in the case of health care, hyperinflated.

We really need to start looking at the core of these issues rather than taking worn out tired ideas like socialism, which is causing much of the debt woes around the world, as a pill to cure the ill cause by government intervention in the first place.