I spent 3 hours in the ER on the 15th. I just got my $11,000.00 bill in the mail.

reply to post by groingrinder


Sorry to hear that mate iv'e read alot about the American system doesnt sound good. Dont want to push the wrong buttons or anything maybe should move to Canada, I'd also recomend Australia but i like the relative quite so dont bring to many friends. Hope your doing ok and things get sorted for you.

Originally posted by NWOnoworldorder
reply to post by groingrinder

 

might i suggest immigrating to the uk?...wether you work or not u will get FREE HEALTHCARE....if i was to have all that treatment it would have cost me....nothing....free!!

How is it free? The government gets its money from taxing the workers and businesses. That means it is NOT free. It may be free to you or to the person who is not working, but some other poor sap is out there working to pay for it.

Good thing everyone fought against public health care.. Big business always wins, by convincing the dumb to go along with what is best for the companies, not the people.. Always amazes how easily people can be convinced to # themselves.

IMO part of the problem here in the US is that insurance has largely been employer-based, and still usually is. It isn't often a separate commodity that is purchased individually, as is car, life or home insurance. It isn't, as some would suggest, that we have insurance, after all, those here in the US who have job-based insurance have their employer skim off the premium from each paycheck much as the governments do in countries that have gov't run insurance. Those of us who don't get insurance thru our employers (or are self-employed like I am) end up paying even more and there really isn't a level playing field.

I really can't fault those who champion such a system (though I want no part of it, not ever, for reasons I will soon explain) simply because it is all they know. If you were born and raised living in a tree, you and all your friends, neighbors and your whole culture, then you would likely think it odd and perhaps rather bizarre that other people live in houses on the ground. It is a cultural difference, not unlike the way people in England and British colonies drive on the "wrong" side of the road. It's wrong to the rest of us, but not to you; because it's what you know.

But, such a system isn't set up in the US, never has been, and probably never will. It isn't what we are used to and it isn't part of our culture. This piece of smegma that the last congress passed and Obama signed is nothing like what countries with state-run healthcare have. It isn't even a tax; just an unconstitutional regulation (at least the most onerous part of it) forcing people to purchase a service from a private company, totally unconnected from any other action (such as owing a vehicle) other than simply being alive.

Back to why I wouldn't want any part of a state-run health plan....A few years ago I switched from one insurance company to another (I had to as I moved, again this is part of the problem, competition between providers is severely limited by not being able to be sold across state lines), and this new company just up and decided that I had a pre-existing condition (which is often very ridiculous, as people can be denied for very simple, easy to manage and non life threatening issues) and that they would not cover anything that had to do with what they considered part of that "condition". So I bided my time, waited a year or so, and filed another appeal to get them to overturn that exclusion (I had appealed the exclusion as soon as I purchased the policy, and was denied right of the bat). Again, another denial - so, what I did was to contact my state's insurance commission. And guess what - the insurance company instantly reversed their decision and gave me full coverage for everything that was listed in the plan I purchased. This is why I would never want to have the gov't have anything to do with running or administering insurance coverage, simply because the buck stops there. You can't go any higher - you get denied treatment because you are too old, too bad! Then all you can do is hope you can fund the needed treatment yourself, which, depending on the rules of your country, might include leaving said country for the care you need.

As said, there are very real problems here in the US (like the OP's incident), but few ever want to find real answers. If it was up to me, I'd cut out a huge amount of gross gov't waste spending, like funding studies on why pigs stink and other inane ways that the gov't flushes tax dollars down the can. Then I'd extend the income limit so that the working poor could get medicaid (which sucks but is better than no care at all, that could be addressed at some later time) and if necessary, fund that with additional taxes that aren't regressive, like more "sin" taxes on cigarettes and alcohol. Then I'd open up the whole country so medical insurers would have more competition like auto insurers and people could buy policies from companies based anywhere in the US. People who make too much for medicaid would just have to buy their own insurance or just deal with the bills if uninsured, but they would have a much easier time because the rates might actually go down, and not skyrocket as they have done in the last year or so after "Obamacare".

The gov't exists to regulate businesses only when said businesses step out of line, like the health dept making sure that your local Chinese take out isn't infested with rats and roaches. But otherwise, the gov't needs to butt out of healthcare - period.

One other thing - this to the OP - if you ever need medications that are very expensive you might want to look into getting drugs that aren't available in generic directly from the drug maker. I have insurance but no drug coverage and that can really help keep your medical costs down - you can apply directly to the drug company and if you qualify they will give you the meds for free.

Originally posted by epitaph.one
reply to post by blupblup

 

no worries, just wait until one of their family members gets cancer.
im sure they will be happy as a pig in ____ when they have to pay $367,000 + funeral fees.

wouldnt it be nice if everyone chipped in $0.37 from their paycheque so no one would have to deal with that? oh...wait... thats...thats SOCIALISM! HEAD FOR THE HILLS!

nice, very nice clever answer man !! you understand it - some hope is permitted !!
up in the hills you neo-cons !! get out of our sight !!!
human feelings are killing your deceiving plans !!!

Originally posted by aceto
Good thing everyone fought against public health care.. Big business always wins, by convincing the dumb to go along with what is best for the companies, not the people.. Always amazes how easily people can be convinced to # themselves.

Well put. Short, and to the point. Right on!

Originally posted by thisguyrighthere
A clear indicator of a scheme being afoot is the ease with which an $11,000 gets dropped to $3,000.

What are the factors present in that drastic difference in cost?

Something tells me that even that $3,000 is still a substantial markup as with any good or service.

How many of us with insurance are blindly and dumbly paying the pre-corrected $11,000 amounts? Since nobody really shops around because medical consumers are one of two people, insured and complacent or uninsured and blind with rage, I'm willing to bet we're all paying outrageous prices for things that are essentially buffered from the real marketplace by virtue of insurance and politics.

So I want to know why it was so easy for a hospital to just write off $8,000.

 

Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

 

This whole system is bs. I had acute appendicitis 2 years ago (that means it was about to burst and I could have died) I had no insurance.

The bill for the surgery, a CAT scan, and 2 days in recovery was $21,000. Talk about crappy. Basically they are saying pay us 21,000 or die. I chose life, and thus.. debt.

reply to post by Whitbit


20,000 is close to two years of pay for me, now, if I had any chronic conditions, which I do, that I needed care often for, well, I could easily rack up enough medical bills to spend more on just medical care than I earn. This is unsustainable. One could just be adding way more debt to their name than they could ever be able to pay back, and well....
who are we kidding here... most of us are gonna end up with some kind of condition that will need prolonged, regular care in our lifetimes, and so, most of us are gonna die leaving a bunch of unpaid debt.
the healthcare system, as it is today is unsustainable.

i was under the impression that "emergency recovery" was free , simple terms , you need medic, "they" provide medic

and that under the hippo code everyone is equal ,

you guys are just being conned

11 years ago I was on a Sailboat vacation, spent 10 days on the Hudson Sailing around, my wife and baby were to join us for the last 4 days we met at a riverside Restaurant where I had some seafood and got food poisoned. I was rushed to a hospital in Albany NY, Spent 3 days there. Got a bill for $39,000. I had no insurance but plenty of money, I of course felt the bill was off, since I had nothing special done and saw a Doctor 2 times. I had them give me an itemized bill. over 30,000 was for services and procedures I never received. They adjusted the bill. I paid the bill and that's the story.

The reason they do this is because most uninsured people have no way to pay the bill, the hospital inflates the bill to write off fraudulent amounts of money. I was youngish and made a bet that I could not have insurance, and come out ahead in my youth for a few years, I was right. After this experience I got insured.

They charge the most outrageous prices for health services here. My insurance is good but not "Premium". I pay a $20 dollar deductible when I visit the doctor, and my prescriptions total is about $40 dollars a month. I spend 5 minutes a month with the doctor. He gets $100 for the 5 minutes. A breathing exam where you blow into the equivalent of a Breathalyzer is another $100, an ekg is another $200. A blood test lab will charge $200 to $500 for a normal blood test.

The problem is in the system. Medical supply companies charge outrageous amounts for anything they provide. The entire system is out of control. I'm not on medicaid, or medicare, but I can only imagine the fraud that goes on there. Hospitals just pad their bills with impunity. There needs to be some way to hold them accountable.

You people with single payer systems seem to be much better off than what we get for the money in the US.

Originally posted by MessOnTheFED!
reply to post by endtimer

 

I guess your one of the folks who dont really give a rats ass about anyone but yourself? If you dont see the total scheme going on all around you, you must be. Health care should be free PERIOD.

MOTF!

Nothing is free. Everything in this world has capital and opportunity costs. So, if you go get "free" health care somebody some where else is paying for the actual cost.

My income isn't great and I pay out about $175 a month to various doctors for my wife's pregnancy and my kids early health care so far. I don't complain, I pay it. I don't believe anybody should be forced to pay for somebody else's health care.

Originally posted by Blaine91555

Originally posted by NWOnoworldorder
reply to post by groingrinder

 

might i suggest immigrating to the uk?...wether you work or not u will get FREE HEALTHCARE....if i was to have all that treatment it would have cost me....nothing....free!!

Not picking on you here so please take it as intended.

Free Health Care is myth and a lie. It does not now, nor has it ever existed.

First, your health care is paid for. It's paid for by your government. Governments except in nations ruled by Dictators have no money themselves. They take it from people who produce wealth by taxing them. Every penny used to pay for your Health Care was taken away from somebody else who earned it. That is how all Entitlements work. Entitlement is a fancy word for Welfare. In this case the people they take the money from by force have no say in the matter. That is the TRUTH.

Look around you at Greece for instance. That is what happens when a government becomes your Mommy, Daddy and Uncle Bob. The citizens start to believe that money just magically appears out of thin air and then they Riot (throw infantile temper tantrums) demanding more candy when the candy is all gone and there is no more money to be stolen from the producers to give to the users. Then the producers move on to get away from the thieves and bums taking all their earnings from their education and hard work. They leave or just quit producing and the Progressive Government fails. The more Progressive the faster it fails.

To the Canadians. We are not all naive enough to believe you have Free health care. We know about the strangling taxes. It not a secret. It's only free to bums who don't work or produce. Just say thank you to those who earned the money your Government took to pay your way.

Second, because of our free market system in the US, we pay for most of the development of procedures, equipment and pharmaceuticals used. We are charged more than you for the same medications and procedures because we are stuck with the cost of developing for instance drugs that are sold in other countries like Canada and Mexico far cheaper. Why is it cheaper there? Because the citizens of another country paid for the research and development of those drugs. More Welfare, only this time from people who don't even live in your countries.
__________________________________________
On topic to the OP.

If you are telling the truth and only earn $50 a month, you are eligible for aid in many forms. First though you have to cooperate with the Hospitals requests to you to apply for the available monies. It is your responsibility to do that. You should not be misleading people and lying to them to make them think no Health Care is available to you. The only way it would not be is if nothing is wrong with you, or if you are unwilling to take the steps necessary to get your needs taken care of. That is a fact in the US and it's getting really irritating how many are willing to lie, when in fact they just go to the Hospital and then don't follow through on getting the financial aid they need.

While my Wife was having surgery last year, I ended up in a very detailed conversation with one of the Administrators. He told me that any necessary procedure could be paid for under one program or another if only the Patients would cooperate and apply. He told me most of the Hospitals losses were due to Patients who come in through the Emergency Room, get treatment and then they never hear from them again and they refuse to apply for the assistance that is available. They even have a person who will fill out the papers for them and all they need to do is provide proof of income and sign the damn papers.

I paid for my Wife's surgery myself. I met with the Surgeon and the Hospital beforehand and made advance payments. The Surgeon knocked 50% off the bill. The Hospital contacted us after we paid off a third of their bill and said that since we kept our word, the bill was now paid in full. All because we were honest with them.

I got quite a lesson from that Administrator as he ran me through a list of all the available resources for the poor to get the health care they need. He told me that they could get 100% of it paid for if they would just do as asked. These are the exact same people who run around lying and doing all the whining. To lazy to fill out and sign papers or they are lying and just don't want to pay.

I, myself was homeless for a bit about 30 years ago. Not only was I able to get having my Appendix removed and the costs from it paid for in full, I found out I could get anything else I needed. It was a real education for me. In the city I was in I could get five, yes five hot meals a day for free. I could get new clothing for free. I got a place to live and they allowed me to work for room and board while I went to school to get another Degree. I worked four hours a day as a volunteer and they fed and housed me. Of course most of this came from Christians and not the Government which I preferred.

Don't throw your hands in the air and whine to strangers. You take the initiative and you will find out you can get the care you need and get it paid for unless you sit back and expect the government or other people to do it for you.

To those in the so called free health care countries. You need to get at least a basic education on where the money comes from that pays for your care. It is NOT FREE. That is a LIE. They took the money away from somebody who earned it and then they give it to people who did not earn it. That is the TRUTH.

edit on 12/29/2010 by Blaine91555 because: (no reason given)

I wish I could give you a million stars for this post.

As for Groingrinder...on page two you said:

"My mind is racing trying to think of ways to come up with $3,000.00 before Jan 08,2011. "

Yet on page 13, I think it is you admitted that you filled out paperwork for charity care and more than likely this amount will never be owed by you at all.

So then why is your mind racing to come up with the $3,000 before January 8? Why January 8 anyway? I'm pretty sure that even if you have to pay the $3,000 because the hospital decided your $50 a month is exceeds the allowable amount you are allowed to earn in order to qualify, you would not be forced to pay that money so quickly. When I read that post I felt like maybe you were hoping some of these people would feel so sorry for you that they would U2U you and ask how they can get money to you to help you survive this horrible injustice.

If you really are only making $50 a month and your Father's income isn't greater than the poverty level, then you will get the charity care and not have to pay a dime. Plus as your Father's caregiver you are eligible to a monthly check from the state for being his caregiver.

My son, his wife, and our Grandson live with my husband and me, my son was told by welfare to claim he was my caregiver so that he could get an almost $600. a month check from the state. Fortunately my son is honest and told the worker that he is not my caregiver, that his Father is my caregiver. She told him that it really didn't matter and that they don't even bother to check to see if a person is actually a caregiver, they just hand out the checks. However, my husband can't get this check as he makes too much money even when unemployed. All my son wanted was help to get some emergency dental work since he and his wife make about $250 a year too much for medical coupons and no employee benefits and no way to pay for insurance or dental.

Maybe if all the freeloaders who never worked and never will were to stop getting all the free help, then maybe some of the taxpayers could get some help from the services that they have been forced to pay into.

Back to your mind racing...BS.

Forgot a couple of things.

Our son, daughter in law, and Grandson live with us, but are eligible for some food stamps as they keep their food seperate from ours. We have two refridgerators and two freezers so they have a set and so do we. They also have their own cabinets here and area in the pantry for other food. So if you keep your food seperate from your Father's there shouldn't be any problem getting help. Since you are his caregiver, see about getting the caregiver check.

We were without medical back in June and that is when I ended up in the ER. We are paying $25 a month with no interest until it is paid and we could have paid even less per month. We didn't get any discount so you actually got lucky.

Sorry I was a bit harsh in my last post, all the "here's how you can get a free ride in life" posts were making me ill.

Looks like you are trying to get on SSI and not welfare, you should apply for welfare while you wait. Once you get the back SSI the welfare office will take what they've given you from that and you will still have money left over. I was on SSI for awhile many years ago and that's how it was done for me.

reply to post by MikeNice81

Originally posted by MikeNice81
Nothing is free. Everything in this world has capital and opportunity costs. So, if you go get "free" health care somebody some where else is paying for the actual cost.
...

And you can be absolutely sure it's not any of the rich people or corporations paying someone else's bill as they don't have to pay taxes.

Besides paying illegal aliens dirt wages to make $billions in profits, that's why we're in such a mess.

reply to post by ziggystrange

Originally posted by ziggystrange
You people with single payer systems seem to be much better off than what we get for the money in the US.

That's why the lobbyist and the government itself fought tooth and nail to make sure there was no single-payer option.

That's one gravy train that they were not going to let get away.

Originally posted by ziggystrange
The problem is in the system. Medical supply companies charge outrageous amounts for anything they provide. The entire system is out of control. I'm not on medicaid, or medicare, but I can only imagine the fraud that goes on there. Hospitals just pad their bills with impunity. There needs to be some way to hold them accountable..

Dude,

you have my respect. The sheeple here in the US bought the propaganda developed and paid for by the right-wing cabal. So they claim that the basic freedom is to be uninsured and then subsequently bankrupted by the rigged system of ours.

We had a C section and the bill was 30k. Hello, it's a small fortune for a routine operation. I just think that anyone opposing the national healthcare program is a complete moron. You think you are one? Maybe you are.

Tell 'em to shove it.

HEALTH CARE IN AMERICA IS FREE.

The debt statute of limitations is the legal time limit a party has to collect a debt through the court system. []Credit reporting agencies have adopted a universal statute of limitations of seven years, after which a debt is removed from a consumer’s credit report regardless of the state statute.

www.insidearm.com...

You're not going to tell me what BS trumped up bills I have to pay.

Sri Oracle

This is an example of why I say that most americans have put in more than enough money to the health care industry, we should all have the right to affordable healthcare!!

our gov't is growing again!!! ain't that nice, the gov't that is borrowing out of the wazoo, telling us that they have to cut the social security to the bare bones, letting our states proceed into a state where the only possible solution is to declare bankruptcy, which they can't legally do, well, they are starting a whole new agency....
to help the drug companies with their research!!!

www.nytimes.com...

okay, so our tax dollars now will go to the reasearch an testing of drugs, which will then be turned over to the drug companies...ummm...will their be any conditions to this, or will the drug companies be free to slap any outrageous pricetag on those drugs as they see fit to?

try going into a big hospital rated number one in the country getting a shot of adrenaline a regular antihistamine and an ultra sound...bill was 12k.
im not going to pay it why? they didnt even find out what was wrong with me and then to top it off i knew more about it than the drs and just general medicine. i said im allergic to this medicine. dr well its not on your charts so it should be okay...well im not taking it because i can die. dr said well you need to take it it will help.

sigh america were lost...