Corporatism the most insidious and malignant ism of all

Originally posted by sdcigarpig
reply to post by wayouttheredude

 

And what you are not grasping is that we the people created this situation. The modern day problems, take a good look at them, they did not come about overnight, they grew up from small problems, that has existed for a long, very long time. Any problem or issue that you can mention, if you go back in history, you will see the origins were there. And if you look, it is in response to a problem that needed to be addressed. I say it is we the people that caused this problem, especially when you have politicians who have been in office for years and years. Ironic that they morn the passing of some congressmen, who have spend the majority of their lives in office. You are just suggesting anarchy and the tearing down of society with your arguments and have yet to come up with a solution. Like all those in America who bemoan about the state of things, yet when asked did you vote, they say no. Well guess what, that is part of the problem too, the sheer apathy of the general population to the entire process and the civic duty that they have. You complain of human right and fewer rights for the citizens, yet you do not answer the original question on what you would say to the families of the people who are the victims of some of the airplanes that were brought down by criminal activities, or what do you think the outcry would have been if the underwear bomber had been successful in his attempt to bring down a plane over a populated city? Do you not care for the planet? Are you so heartless as to not care for the safety of the children who have done nothing at all? Do you really hate your country and are unpatriotic? Are you really willing to throw more people out onto the streets for a lack of a job? If you are none of the above, then surely you can see that your arguments all state that.

Why do you fear anarchy so much? Does the people managing thier own lives bother you?

How can the state manage our lives better than we can? We're not animals or children.

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by SpectreDC

 

Too bad every time business and government work together, it seems to do the things you are afraid the free market does.

Not at all, when government and business work together, they manage to do some remarkable things. Government and business working together was Clinton's idea, called "Third Way Economics", and it worked great in the nineties. Free Market Economics killed what was a very functional market system.

Government working with business has done some remarkable things, from public works projects, to clothing sizes that allow people to buy clothes that fit off of the shelf.

Hopefully some day, large corporations become a thing of the past. Their existence is due to the need for huge amounts of capital for mass production during the dawn of the industrial era. With modern technology, mass production can be done on a much smaller scale, and we might be seeing the beginning of the end of these giant corporate entities.

edit on 13-11-2010 by poet1b because: correct grammar mistake.

When goverment and Big Business work together they create fascism and/or corporatism.

reply to post by wayouttheredude


I wasted some time looking for the links where Ron Paul supported selling public assets to corporations'

It seems that there has been considerable effort to eliminate past links that reveal the candidates true intentions. What I find are a lot of muddied paragraphs that say nothing, as they were intended. Here is a nice example.

www.dailypaul.com...

I've noticed a disturbing leftist anti-corporation bent among several users here, going to so far as not wanting to allow corporations to exist and to wanting to allow government to control the press if the press is a corporation. And being upset that a corporation has more capital than them so that it's difficult to compete, as if they want government to socialistically force a level playing field. I find this all odd coming from supposed Ron Paul supporters.

Quoting Murray Rothbard (who Paul has a picture of on his office wall):

"It should be clear...that corporations are not at all monopolistic privileges; they are free associations of individuals pooling their capital.

If you think Mises and Paul support free market politics, and at the same time oppose corporations, then you are not engaging your brain. Regulations prevent corporations from usurping our life liberty, and pursuit of happiness. They are the laws that keep corporations in check. Eliminate those laws and corporations will turn us into slaves.

Here is a nice link that points out RPs true associations.

www.opednews.com...

Paul is a part of the group who with people like Grover Norquist whose

goal is to cut government in half in twenty-five years, to get it down to the size where we can drown it in the bathtub.

www.brainyquote.com...

When they finish drowning democracy who will then be in charge?

Corporations, that is who.

This claim by RP and ilk to be against corporations is simply more smoke and mirrors, designed to keep people supporting the very policies that are stripping them not only of any wealth they might own, but their liberties as well.

reply to post by poet1b

If you are looking for dirt on someone, you should look elsewhere, and not at Ron Paul. You simply will not find him in the pocket of any particular corporations. You see, that is exactly what he rails against, crony capitalism, or government that is in bed with corporations to further said corporations interests.
You can go to Opensecrets.org and check out Ron Paul. While you are there, check out some of the others in Congress, where there money comes from. Go ahead, check out Paul, where his money comes from.
There is a huge difference between allowing corporations to do business, and trying to further the interests of a donor corporation.
Paul believes in constitutional government, so if he ever said anything about dismantling a government agency, it was probably created unconstitutionally, and is in affect a business competing with the private sector. I would imagine he may have spoke of selling the assets on the open market as part of eliminating this bureaucracy. Nothing wrong with that if you believe in limited, constitutional government.
But, you are misrepresenting him, whether intentional or not.

Here is a couple of threads that would be helpful in this:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by Stewie


I don't dig dirt on people, I either agree with people's ideas, or I disagree, and I completely disagree with Ron Paul and the Mises Institute, and their foolish free market concepts. I was looking for Ron Paul's stance of selling off public assets, policies put forth that one could find on the internet, but have now been scrubbed clean.

The U.S. is twelve trillion in debt trying to make the free market ideology work, and the only thing that resulted from the effort is concentration of wealth and power into the hands of the few, and the elimination of our civil liberties, as well as the erosion of our standard of living, and of course, the massive debt created by the scam of the Free Market.

How many times does our economy have to be destroyed before you people wake up to the reality that free market economics does not work.

reply to post by hawkiye


Wow, that second thread of yours,

The Root of the Problem and A New Renaissance 2.0

Is one excellent thread. Thanks.

The giving legal status that makes corporate entities a living entity give them an extremely unfair advantage in the courts, not just because of their money and all the power that brings but also because they are not living.
this allows them to become immortal something witch no real personage enjoys yet they have little to no culpability for the things they do.

In order to understand Corporatism I think this is very useful.

Originally posted by hawkiye in this thread
www.abovetopsecret.com...


This is only the first part but if interested you may continue on to the other parts of course...shocking and very illuminating. Allows us to see why this is not the Republic we think it is. We are citizens of Wallstreet and the Banksters. But you knew that.

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by hawkiye

 

Wow, that second thread of yours,

The Root of the Problem and A New Renaissance 2.0

Is one excellent thread. Thanks.

Thanks for turning me on to the thread.
And thanks to hawkiye!!!!

I had to re post the video. Was very helpful. Clear and straightforward and makes perfect sense. This is what we see happening around us today. We are not even close to a "free market" system.

Now how to stop it.....?

reply to post by rusethorcain


Thanks for putting this into the thread. It is a good seat of lessons in the basics of the establishment of this globalist corporatist cabal. It is such a threat to us I can not believe that people have such a hard time understanding and then fighting against this abuse of power from the highest levels for generations.

reply to post by John_Rodger_Cornman

When goverment and Big Business work together they create fascism and/or corporatism.

Working together is find, it is when one gains too much influence of the other that things go awry.

Foolish attempts at creating a free market have lead to corporations having too much control in the U.S., and it is lead to a fascist environment, that is now being called corporatism.

It is too bad that the people who preach free market ideology don't take off their blinders and see that attempts to create a free market are creating this corporatist controlled environment that they are now finally starting to recognize.

reply to post by wayouttheredude


A Star and flag for you my friend. I am really getting sick of listening to the socialist calling the present US system "Capitalism" and bashing it or the Right calling it "socialism" and bashing it. Although it is more "socialist" errr Fascism than anything else.

It is obvious that there are numerous differences between socialism and fascism, the most obvious of which concerns their view of private property. Socialism abolishes the institution entirely; fascism does not.... I hope by now that it should be obvious that the philosophical difference between the fascists and the socialists was minor, if existent at all. www.lawrence.edu...

Corporatism is actually an attribute of the right. If your Mom and Pop store evolves it too will become a corporation. Such is the American dream. I really need people to start using appropriate terminology. How else can we honestly solve the problems that we face in a non-partisan way??

reply to post by tiger5

Corporatism is actually an attribute of the right. If your Mom and Pop store evolves it too will become a corporation. Such is the American dream. I really need people to start using appropriate terminology. How else can we honestly solve the problems that we face in a non-partisan way??

Corporatism is a form of socialism.

"The first stage of fascism should more appropriately be called Corporatism because it is a merger of State and corporate power" --Benito Mussolini (1883-1945), Fascist Dictator of Italy

The basic idea of corporatism is that the society and economy of a country should be organized into major interest groups (sometimes called corporations) and representatives of those interest groups settle any problems through negotiation and joint agreement. In contrast to a market economy which operates through competition a corporate economic works through collective bargaining. The American president Lyndon Johnson had a favorite phrase that reflected the spirit of corporatism. He would gather the parties to some dispute and say, "Let us reason together." www.sjsu.edu...

Sure doesn't sound like capitalism to me!

Capitalism is a social system based on the recognition of individual rights

What is capitalism?

Capitalism is a social system based on the recognition of individual rights, including property rights, in which all property is privately owned. Under capitalism the state is separated from economics (production and trade), just like the state is separated from religion.... www.capitalism.org...

reply to post by crimvelvet


you actually livein a capitalist society. Not a socialist one. You cannot have your (new word) corporatism without capitalism. I f mussolini is your thought leadre then you are in problems.

here is a better example

en.wikipedia.org...

We do NOT have capitalism.
How can we have capitalism when we ourselves are considered the property of the state?
We live in a deceptive and fraudulent political and economic system for the benefit of the wealthy few. The political and economic structure has been slowly altered and amended to accomplish this ultimate goal. Private property doesn't exist, unless you are one of these few elites and effectively "above the laws" and not subject to them.
Whenever this topic comes up, some will explain how the system works in theory, the deception. In practice, we have a corporatocracy, rule by organized crime, La Cosa Nostra de Los Estados No Unidos.

reply to post by Stewie


You actually have capitlaist institutions where capital is traded. Said institutions trade in 90% of the country's wealth. Even the Fed is controlled by 24 private organisations. Private ownership is the norm. The rule of profit is adhered to.

Pray tell me how this is not capitalism as a socioeconomic definition. Why invent or endorse a new word for the sake of it

Actaully capital is traded in the Stock Exchange.

If it looks like a duck quacks like a duck.....

reply to post by wayouttheredude


Research this topic and inform yourselves. Corporatism




i personally do not see how the professed, 'love-thy-neighbor' Christians can abide with Corporatism
which equates to Statism & Fascism in all the models i've seen...

but it all falls in place with the Beast system & the Beast individual...
ergo most of these self proclaimed do-gooders are full of their own delusional fluff,

the corporations, by edict of the SCOTUS, are allowed unlimited funding (buying) of Legislature votes,
promotion of what benefits the Corporations' , AKA Demi-Gods,
Communism was 'Godless' in structure only...Corporatism seeks to become the entity of 'God'
~but what the hey, we keep spending money for our IP Addresses...we keep reloading our cell phone/IM/web search accounts...we keep ingesting the franken-food and processed foodsuffs on the FDA approved list.~


Oh Yeah, myself included...but i never claimed otherwise, what about yourself

What we are supposed to have is a Market based economy regulated by a representative government, but under the con job of the free market, we have morphed into a corrupted market system, where corporations have gained far too much influence over government.

What we need is a method of putting corporate powers into check.