Global Warming is not only NOT a hoax, but it is about 10,000 times worst than your worst nightmare.

Originally posted by Eurisko2012
reply to post by MrXYZ

 

The cloud formation was so bizarre that they posted it on YouTube.

It looks artificial to me.

That's because you too probably don't have a clue about thermodynamics

reply to post by C0bzz
OH...really...what is your credible source of info that they are not...comic books..You sound like a true debunker...

I would just like to set the record straight. The earth warms and cools cyclically. Since 2000 it has NOT been the hottest recorded temps on earth. Planets other then Earth ARE also showing similar trends in climate change as best we can tell.

"Study Confirms Hima-Lyin’ About Climate Change

Hoaxes: New research shows that the world's greatest snow-capped peaks have lost no ice in the last decade and that polar ice is melting at a much lower rate than warm-mongers say.

The new study was conducted by scientists at the University of Colorado, Boulder, published in the journal Nature and based on satellite observations from the Gravity Recovery and Climate Experiment satellite."

news.investors.com...

Another non-reputable link to an unknown op-ed. The climate is changing because our magnetic field/poles/geography is changing. So if you move the Himalaya's suddenly to warmer climate of course the glaciers will melt. Was the purpose of this thread to scare people or blame people for it?

India - Record snowfall revives 2,000 glaciers
17 Feb 11 - Already more snowfall this month than
1998 record for the entire month. Think you'll see
this in the mainstream media?
See India - Record snowfall revives 2,000 glaciers


NORWAY
Ålfotbreen Glacier
Briksdalsbreen Glacier
Nigardsbreen Glacier
Hardangerjøkulen Glacier
Hansebreen Glacier
Jostefonn Glacier
Engabreen glacier (The Engabreen glacier
is the second largest glacier in Norway. It is a
part (a glacial tongue) of the Svartisen glacier,
which has steadily increased in mass since the
1960s when heavier winter precipitation set in.)

Norway's glaciers growing at record pace. The face of the Briksdal glacier,
an off-shoot of the largest glacier in Norway and mainland Europe, is growing by an
average 7.2 inches (18 cm) per day. (From the Norwegian daily Bergens Tidende.)


Click here to see mass balance of Norwegian glaciers:
www.nve.no...

Choose "English" (at top of the page), choose "Water,"
then "Hydrology," then "Glaciers and Snow" from the menu.
You'll see a list of all significant glaciers in Norway.
(Thanks to Leif-K. Hansen for this info.)
CANADA
Helm Glacier
Place Glacier

Glaciers growing on Canada’s tallest mountain
17 Nov 08 – The ice-covered peak of Yukon's soaring Mount Logan
may be due for an official re-measurement after readings that suggest
this country's superlative summit has experienced a growth spurt.
See Glaciers growing on Canada’s tallest mountain
FRANCE
Mt. Blanc - See Mont Blanc Glacier almost doubles in size
ECUADOR
Antizana 15 Alpha Glacier

Italy
Winter snows did not all melt on Italy’s Presena Glacier this summer
10 Nov 09 - 'Their massive base depth last season meant it didn’t all melt
over the summer so they have nearly a metre and a half of snow on the glacier
ski area already." (The second story of this kind in two years.)
See Winter snows did not all melt on Italy’s Presena Glacier this summer


Glaciers growing in Italy
8 Feb 11 - Glaciers are growing on two different mountains in Italy - Mount Canin and Mount Montasio. Will you see this in the main-stream media?
Glaciers growing in Italy
SWITZERLAND
Silvretta Glacier
KIRGHIZTAN
Abramov
RUSSIA
Maali Glacier (This glacier is surging. See below)

GREENLAND See Greenland Icecap Growing Thicker
Greenland glacier advancing 7.2 miles per year! The BBC recently ran
a documentary, The Big Chill, saying that we could be on the verge of an ice
age. Britain could be heading towards an Alaskan-type climate within a decade,
say scientists, because the Gulf Stream is being gradually cut off. The Gulf
Stream keeps temperatures unusually high for such a northerly latitude.
One of Greenland’s largest glaciers has already doubled its rate of advance,
moving forward at the rate of 12 kilometers (7.2 miles) per year. To see a
transcript of the documentary,
go to www.bbc.co.uk...


Greenland Ice Sheet Growing Thicker
4 Nov 05 - After gathering data for more than ten years, a team of
Norwegian-led scientists has found that the Greenland Ice Sheet is
actually growing thicker at its interior.
See Greenland Ice Sheet Growing Thicker


Rebellious Greenland Glacier Keeps Growing
26 July 10 - Berlingske Glacier has steadily grown for the past
100 years. And yet, it's not counted in the glacier inventory. Why
haven't we heard about this growing glacier?
See Rebellious Greenland Glacier Keeps Growing
.
.

CHILE
Pio XI, the largest glacier in South America, grows
50 meters in height, length and density every day.
See Pio XI - Largest glacier in Chile - Growing every day

NEW ZEALAND
All 48 glaciers in the Southern Alps have grown during the past year.
The growth is at the head of the glaciers, high in the mountains, where they
gained more ice than they lost. Noticeable growth should be seen at the
foot of the Fox and Franz Josef glaciers within two to three years.(27 May 2003)
See New Zealand Glaciers Growing

Fox, Franz Josef glaciers defy trend - New Zealand's
two best-known glaciers are still on the march
31 Jan 07 - See Franz Josef Glacier still on the march

New Zealand Glaciers Growing

See also: Contrarian New Zealand Glaciers Keep Growing

ARGENTINA
Argentina's Perito Moreno Glacier, the largest glacier in Patagonia,
is advancing at the rate of 7 feet per day. The 250 km² ice formation,
30 km long, is one of 48 glaciers fed by the Southern Patagonian Ice

Just thought I'd chime in with an unsubstantiated website of my own to take as 100% fact.

reply to post by libertytoall


Fear is a powerful tool.

Deception also works well when you add fear.

I know a hoax when i see one.

Originally posted by Eurisko2012

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse

Originally posted by CB328
Heat islands prove that humans are heating the environment.
They found that the city of Houston at night is a full 10 degrees warmer than the surrounding area- completely due to human activity and environmental change (concrete).

edit on 6-2-2012 by CB328 because: (no reason given)

That is just a local heating... It does not affect the global climate in the least... This fact is corroborated when you get out of cities the temperatures immediately decrease...

This is the problem with the AGW proponents...every one of them is ignorant of everything that has to do with Climate Change, and CO2...

Who needs the truth when you have a religion called Global Warming?

AL Gore has created a cult of the weak minded.

It reminds me of a movie starring Kate Winslet. -- Holy Smoke! --

I saw that movie - Holy Smoke! --

Brainwashing is real.

Well Libby, it's 2 years now since your original post and as promised I'm back to say how wrong you are (you said we'd be frying to death by now or have you conveniently forgotton that). I'm alive, my fields are very wet and cold and I've just stocked up on wood and heating oil for the winter.

In case you are interested, read this also:
(Excerpts) - On Sunday, scientists from NASA’s Jet Propulsion Laboratory and the British Antarctic Survey announced in Nature Geoscience that the sea ice surrounding Antarctica is witnessing record growth.

To hear global warming alarmists, melting Arctic ice allegedly vindicates their claims. Unfortunately for them, the Antarctic ice cover reached a record 7.5 million square mile expanse this year, with some regions showing a doubling in size since 1992.

cfif.org...

reply to post by Mez353


Really, thats funny because according to the latest research, it appears that the West Antarctic Ice Sheet is warming twice as fast as previously thought, and three times faster than the global average.

thinkprogress.org... table-ice-sheet/

What else is happening....

Well, let's see we had the historic "summer in March"

www.businessweek.com...

The unprecedented melt in Greenland

"For several days this month, Greenland's surface ice cover melted over a larger area than at any time in more than 30 years of satellite observations."

www.sciencedaily.com...

The sixth largest drought in recorded history

www.wunderground.com...

The hottest year on record

www.cbsnews.com...

The lowest Arctic Ice extent and volume every measured BY FAR, smashing the previous record set in 2007

www.iup.uni-bremen.de:8084...

And don't forget hurricane Sandy, which was not only unprecedented in size and scope, but the path it took was as a direct result of the now wobbly jet stream.

The jet stream, it turns out, is THE big story because it is the thing that will probably do us in, though most don't realize it....yet.

I am going to be writing a sequal to my "Global Warming is Not Only Not a Hoax..." post at some point next week where I will go into detail about the latest science and why we are so beyond screwed it isn't even funny.

To give you a preview, basically the polar jet stream is what drives weather events and it gets its speed from the differential between the temps in the tropics and the temps in the Arctic. Well the Arctic is warming several times faster than the global average, which means that the differential between the temperature at the equator and the temperature in the Arctic is much less than it used to be and with the record melt that we had this year, it is getting hotter and hotter up there.

So this causes the jet stream to meander with deep troughs that tend to get stuck in a blocking pattern. See this short video to understand.

www.youtube.com...

This is what caused the drought (that we are still experiencing by the way), the crazy path of superstorm Sandy, summer in March, etc. etc.

And it is never going back to the way it used to be....it's only going to get worst.

And this new jet stream will make it impossible to grow crops because it causes massive drought and floods and if you think the drought of 2012 was bad, wait until 2013.

Anyway, you will hear all of this and much more in my sequal post that I will write in the next few days.

So bottom line is not only was I right, but I was optimistic. Things are looking much worse than even I thought.

Looking forward to it Libby. In your opinion, what is the cause or causes of the Jet Stream repositioning much further south than previous years to date and could you explain why last year it seemed to block warm air coming up from Northern Africa / Med to Northern Europe resulting in a summer of constant cloud cover and the year before positioned itself between Russia and Pakistan, causing intense heat in Russia and floods in Pakistan. Basically, why is it on the move so much?

reply to post by Mez353


The thing that drives the jet stream, as I said, is the temperature difference between the warm equatorial region and the cold Arctic region. The more difference in temperature, the faster the polar jet stream moves.

Because temps in the Arctic are warming several times faster than the global average (due to multiple positive feedbacks up there....replacing highly reflective ice with highly absorbent open water, melting permafrost releasing methane, ice on land shrinking exposing dark soil which absorbs sunlight, etc. etc.) that means that the difference in temperature between the equator and the Arctic is less than it has been for millions of years. And because of the positive feedbacks up in the Arctic that essentially feed back on themselves and make the problem worse, the problem is growing exponentially worse by the year (just like Arctic ice did not melt in a linear fashion...it's getting exponentially worse)

Watch this short video...fast forward to 4:00 if you are short on time:

www.youtube.com...

As for that iceagenow nonsense, YES there are many places experiencing record cold this year, but that's because of the jet stream.

As it slows down, the troughs become lower (a trough is a dip in the jet stream) and the ridges become higher (a ridge is a bump northward in the jet stream). The lower troughs are essentially filled with cold Arctic air so all that freezing air that used to stay up in the Arctic is now being transported to much lower latitudes.

And that is another positive feedback because essentially it's like opening the door to your refrigerator. All that cold air in India that iceagenow cites is cold air that SHOULD remain in the Arctic.

I notice that iceagenow does not mention things like Australia is experiencing the warmest temps on record:

www.stuff.co.nz...

" Hobart experiences its hottest day on record, with the island capital hitting 41.3C at 1.53pm (NZT 3.53pm), beating a previous high of 40.8C set in January 1976.

That record had stood since 1899, when the mercury hit 40.1C.

Records have been kept in Tasmania since 1883.

The Bureau of Meteorology says it isn’t sure what the new record will be because the temperature is unlikely to peak before 4pm.

Hobart’s overnight minimum was a January record - 23.4C.

RECORDS TO FALL NATIONALLY

The Hobart record fell at the start of a week-long period when other long-standing temperature records were expected to fall across Australia.

A huge swath of central and south-eastern Australia is poised to swelter with temperatures expected to peak at 41 degrees in Melbourne and 44 in Adelaide. "

Not sure if you are a celcius or farenheight guy, but in case you are the latter, 44 degrees C is 111 degrees F!!!!!

Still working on my new post. Hope to have it posted tomorrow.

I'll save you a job. As many in this thread have consistently said, it's the Sun not AGW. Can't tax the Sun though!

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by Mez353


Well said ,
Glad to see you are still on the ball with this one .

snoopyuk

www.iceagenow.info

NASA – New study shows that CO2 COOLS atmosphere
science.nasa.gov...]

'For the three day period, March 8th through 10th, the thermosphere absorbed 26 billion kWh of energy. Infrared radiation from CO2 and NO, the two most efficient coolants in the thermosphere, re-radiated 95% of that total back into space.'

Ta da!

darn it mez i just went through this whole thread to see if the new NASA data on Co2 leading to cooling was posted yet and there you are on the (now was last post ) LOL
I'll garden hose all the stuff off my slicker later

here is the trend map for sea level from the university of Colorado
sealevel.colorado.edu...

well look its going up in the islands of the pacific
AND DOWN TRENDING ON MANY OTHER PLACES!

but if you go to skeptical science ( now at any rate ) you will get cherry picked again because that singular are is what they us to justify man made global warming.

reply to post by Danbones


This is what I love about the whole global warming "debate":

How can you guys seriously sit there and scoff at being called "deniers" and then post a map like that and say "Look! It's trending down - the alarmists are cherry-picking the data to justify their global warmings."


Anyone with eyes can see that it's trending up, and YOU are the one cherry-picking the data.


Stop focusing on the bright shiny (cherry) red spots, which are obvious extremes, and simply look at the bigger picture: The VAST MAJORITY of that map has a yellow-green hue to it. Where does yellow-green fit in the legend?? It's centered right around +3mm/year - which just so happens to be the exact same trend, as reported by the exact same source, that YOU are using here:




This is such a perfect example of how much climate denier brains love to simply filter out any inconvenient data they don't like, and choose to focus instead on visceral mental mapping that supports their pre-conceived beliefs. It's such a farce, and it's obvious to everyone except climate deniers themselves. So they (rightfully) get labeled deniers - which is not a perjorative, it's just a simple FACT, and then they all get mad and indignant about it - even though the PROOF is right there in black and white. Or in this case green and gold:

It's the same thing with the supposed NASA data that apparently proves CO2 has a a cooling effect (in denier-land that is). It's quite obvious the ones parading this info around the internet don't understand a lick about what it is actually saying. So they simply choose to focus on key words like "cooling", and all start to automatically congratulate each other on prematurely discovering the 439692719th "final nail in the coffin" of the AGW hoax.


Meanwhile, if they understood what this data was actually saying, they would understand it in fact only further validates and PROVES Anthropogenic Global Warming. Because what it does is verify what a powerful absorber of infrared radiation CO2 is.

It's saying, yes - CO2 likes to trap IR, and kick it back out to where it came from. The problem is the majority of solar radiation is not IR - it is visible and UV. The CO2 in the atmosphere lets that radiation pass right through. This energy then heats the Earth, and the Earth re-radiates that energy back out into space. But unlike the Sun, the Earth does radiate most of its energy in IR.



CO2 now traps this energy going the other way, and kicks it back down toward the surface instead. This is the friggin' Greenhouse Effect which has been proven, verified, well-understood by over 150 years of science now.


But the denier brain filters these inconvenient little details right out as usual of course. Just focus on this:

'For the three day period, March 8th through 10th, the thermosphere absorbed 26 billion kWh of energy. Infrared radiation from CO2 and NO, the two most efficient coolants in the thermosphere, re-radiated 95% of that total back into space.'

Wow - 26 BILLION kWh you say?? That's 26,000,000,000! What a HUGE number!!


Except let's look at what the Earth is giving off. The Earth's surface radiates at around 390 W/m^2 (Source). The Earth's surface area is over 510,000,000,000,000 m^2.

This times 390 is 199,000,000,000,000,000 Watts, or 199,000,000,000,000 kW.

Over 3 days (72 hours) that's 14,320,000,000,000,000 kWh of energy.

That's over 550,000 times the amount of energy CO2 had available for "cooling" between March 8th through 10th, and instead targets straight for warming, all [3] day[s], every [3] day[s].


But oooops, let's ignore all that annoying and difficult to process math, and just focus on the big, easy to swallow headlines that say Cooling effect blah blah.

Climate deniers are getting so played. By right wing media. By oil companies. By shill scientists. By idiot bloggers who have no idea what the **** they're talking about. But most of all by their own ignorance, intellectual laziness, and desperate desire to see only what it is they want to see.

*** I should in all fairness point out that CO2 does only actually trap a small portion of that outgoing longwave radiation.

The formula for CO2 forcing is given here. Based on current atmospheric concentrations of ~400ppm, that means the increase in CO2 emissions since the industrial revolution has resulted in a heat trapping effect of about 1.9 W/m^2 (thus far, still growing).

Even when you plug this value into the calculations above - you still get a number that's 2700 times greater than this apparently amazing cooling effect CO2 has in the thermosphere.

It's amazing how much deniers are jumping up and down over this data - which they completely accept as scientifically valid and important, but then turn around and claim an effect 2700 times greater than this is "insignificant", and anyone who thinks otherwise is just "arrogant" and clearly blinded by Al Gore's propaganda...

reply to post by Mez353


In other words you don't understand science. The key word in that report was thermosphere, that's at the edge of space. Where are we? The troposphere. Where are the GHG's that we release going to? Nowhere, they stay in the troposphere, trapping heat.

Originally posted by Kali74
reply to post by Mez353

 

In other words you don't understand science. The key word in that report was thermosphere, that's at the edge of space. Where are we? The troposphere. Where are the GHG's that we release going to? Nowhere, they stay in the troposphere, trapping heat.

Actually, it's a very large region from 55 miles from earth up to about 500. This thermosphere region increases in temperature the higher you go up due to absorption of radiation (although it's a near vacuum so you wouldn't feel a real temp increase). What this study says is that CO2 enables a cooling effect within this region by sending back UV radiation which is dominant in this layer. So, MC and others, you are completly making up the twaddle about IR only, just as you normally do. Get the facts about the sky above you, how the sun works, what stops us frying and then get back to me.