Colombian shaman arrested in TX, charged with Ayahuasca possession

Originally posted by SevenThunders

Originally posted by Miraj
reply to post by SevenThunders

 

I see you don't like freedom, Seven Thunders.

Just noting that.

I'll skip over the mindless ranting about liberals

Jesus said,
"He who sins is a slave to sin, but he whom the Son sets free is free indeed." So you see what you've been programmed to view as a form of freedom (the unfettered consumption of mind altering drugs) , Jesus calls slavery. Drugs are a good metaphor for this principle since they often lead to physical and/or psychological addiction.

The consumer can not easily disengage from the harmful behavior. The lure of sin or wrongdoing in general has a similar hold. There are hordes of demons behind such activities, spurring souls on, in a headlong plunge to their destruction. So actually I support freedom, freedom from the temptations that destroy the soul. So please don't confuse political freedom with license and the libertine pursuits of personal pleasure.

Nowhere in the bible does it state that doing drugs is a sin? Can you show me that passage? There are many forms of slavery and a traditional method of healing is not slavery. Worst things are Financial slavery, sexual slavery, traditional slavery and religious slavery. Remember the difference between willing service and forced slavery! Methinks you are an extremist. It does say something about drinking too much in the bible (I think)however nowhere does it state that it is a sin to smoke a joint or so. In fact look at Genesis

Genesis 1 (New King James Version)

Genesis 1
The History of Creation

29 And God said, “See, I have given you every herb that yields seed which is on
the face of all the earth, and every tree whose fruit yields seed; to you it shall be
for food. 30 Also, to every beast of the earth, to every bird of the air, and to everything
that creeps on the earth, in which there is life, I have given every green herb for food”;
and it was so. 31 Then God saw everything that He had made, and indeed it was very
good. So the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

www.biblegateway.com...

It seems to me that you are interpreting the bible in an extreme way to suit
others needs. If I remember correctly, Marijuana does have seeds and can
be classified as a herb not a weed. it also has healing properties. Just my opinion.

reply to post by SevenThunders


I call Christianity Slavery.

But that's not the point of this discussion.

Are you saying that you support the government stepping into peoples lives and telling them what they can and cannot do under the guise that they are protecting them from themselves.

Please note Jesus also said that what a man puts into his mouth does not make him evil, it is what comes out of his mouth that is evil.

reply to post by Mr. D


The word for sorcery in the new testament is pharmakeia. Drug use to obtain altered states of consciousness has been a mainstay of occultists for thousands of years. The New Testament explicitly forbids it.

"Sorcery," intriguingly, is pharmakeia in Greek, from which we derive our words "pharmacy" and "pharmaceutical." Diviners, enchanters, witches, and sorcerers employed drugs and other potions to put them or their clients "in the spirit" so their "magic" would work. The drugs, then, came to stand for sorcery of all kinds. For the same reason, drug use is part of the celebration among the more serious Halloween devotees today.

Read more: www.bibletools.org...

In the link you can find the relevant scriptures.
www.bibletools.org...

reply to post by SevenThunders


What relevance does the bible have to the US law, and rights of religious practice exactly? I really don't see the connection at all....

reply to post by TKDRL


Most of the founding fathers were christian and our laws and constitution were inspired by the Bible and christian institutions. That has now been perverted thanks to a largely successful campaign to deconstruct US history, along the lines of cultural Marxism. I'd have to congratulate the diabolical schemers on their successful perversion of western civilization.

The laws against mind altering drugs are a hold over from that christian worldview, that views such substances as occultic, dangerous and not conducive to American society. No doubt you will succeed in eventually removing such barriers. This kind of libertine self pleasuring moral-less society is self limiting however. Throughout history libertine movements have only succeeded in destroying themselves. It's just a shame you have to take the rest of us down with you I suppose.

reply to post by SevenThunders

I was a psychotronic and spiritual warfare victim for ten years of the powers that be I've met the wizards and warlocks of your faith up the deep end pal our only hope is people like this shaman who has the skills and powers to fight in the astral realm against the adepts of your faith.

reply to post by SevenThunders


Are you on drugs? I won't even get into the whole the united states was founded on christianity, anyone who knows basic history knows that is wrong.... I would say it is fair that a good deal don't know about drug laws, so here is some info. The first drug laws came almost 100 years after the founding of the US, and those were only against opium dens. The real drug laws that are like what we see today didn't pop up until 1914.

Edit: Damn it, sorry, I let myself get goaded, and further contributed to the straying of the relevant issues. Took the troll bait, my bad.

reply to post by SevenThunders

doubleposted

I would agree with a previous poster than ANY south american person would be aware of the dangers of the yankee border controls. That he was bold enough to take it rings alarm bells.

IMHO this is another reason to not live in the states, or go there even, but it's their country, they get to make the laws, right? He broke them, it's that simple. I do feel however, that this is a diplomatic incident, since his home country would have no problem with the same crime. So, deport him home, now. Him now spending 20 years in a foreign prison is stupid. Really stupid.

And mr christian, don't support the stupid policies that will be used against you, please?

This is a non-issue. The guy was coming to a country with a substance that was illegal in said country, and he is facing the consequences.

Instead of serving time in *our* prisons, he should just be deported and not allowed in for whatever the sentence was.

If this guy was Muslim, he wouldn't have gotten half the replies that he did now.

Nobody would be calling him a psychopath, or asking him if he's on drugs. Not out of fear, but because you all seem to respect the Muslim religion.

It makes me think this site is filled with children, angry at their mommy and daddy and their religion because some Communist rock song told them to be. If the economy and WW3 don't destroy this country, generation y will. I must be positive though, at least generation y is saving me some money. If I want to see a horror flick, I don't need to go to blockbuster or the theaters... Nope, I just head down to the local mall, or fast food joint.

reply to post by SevenThunders


The only reason the church are so against medicines such as this is because they are fully aware of its power and potential.

They fear people gaining understanding and insight as the church want to control this. Fact is spirituality is so so much more than about what "Christians" believe and are told.

Now the demons envoked as you mention are in fact the patients inner demons if you like. The kind of scars left on the patient from lifes many traps and temptations, maybe even including the church etc.

Typical patients include alcohol and drug addicts, profoundly depressed people and people who have gone through traumatic events in there lives leaving them scarred or unable to move on etc.

Ayahuasca allows the patient to regress if you like by breaking down the mental blockages that are at the root of the problems so that they can be worked through with your new insight and healers guidance.

It is so effective that the most severe depression can be overcome in a single session without any side affects which is so obviously better than psychiatric drugs for years and still never dealing with the issue.
One session can also completely turn a heroin addict or alcoholics life around.

Its effectiveness is so recognised now that there are ongoing studies/tests etc into it being used in mainstream medicine although thats probably a way of yet.

As for the church, well they wouldn't want you to see how insignificant they really are in the bigger picture and so demonise issues dangerous to there control over the flock.

Oh and the christian faith is full of adopted paganist practices and beliefs, done by the romans to encourage the pagan populace of invaded lands to convert

www.ayahuasca.com...

reply to post by SevenThunders

If it's from a third world culture that is hostile to christianity then you are told it's goooood.

Excuse me but wasn't it you Christians who systematically wiped out entire cultures in South America to spread your disgusting religious doctrines? Wasn't it you who told entire cultures, after killing countless of them, to convert or be killed?

Your memory seems to be short and your reading material seems to be christian only, so of course you're going to come across more ignorant and dense than a rock. Which is okay, we understand that you're ignorant.

And wage of sin is paid in death your avatar says? You really are ignorant, even to your own words, your own books, your own thoughts.

Either deny ignorance and embrace it and go back to church. Sheesh

reply to post by sliceNodice


If a muslim was making wild claims about things that can easily be looked up, like history, then I would probably take a stab and ask if they were on drugs. If that is what you are meaning to ask that is. My parents were catholic sure, but they were also rational, and honest about it. They stated it as their personal belief, not as the one and only truth, believe or you will burn in hell sort of way.

reply to post by RestingInPieces


That sounds like a pretty rational solution. But I doubt the moneyhungry prison system would feel the same unfortunately. Got to keep feeding that beast to make all that money afterall :/

reply to post by harryhaller

since his home country would have no problem with the same crime.

You don't think most countries have laws about bringing controlled substances into their countries?

reply to post by cropmuncher


I work in the healing arts myself, and I don't have to use drugs to get results.

I don't see much difference between the Stories of Jesus casting out demons to heal a person, or a shaman.

books.google.com... FNebb49jsWE&hl=en&ei=dGXNTP7jDMeDngeP7-HfDw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=5&ved=0CCYQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q&f=false

Please correct me if I am wrong, but is it not legal for Native Americans to possess Ayahuasca for religious purposes? How is this any different, the only exception being he was a foreign religious person?

Oh and does anyone else get the distinct feeling of "Westboro Baptist Church" when they read SevenThunder's posts?

reply to post by Kryties


There are all kinds of laws regarding what you bring into a county, it is not just about controlled substances, for instance,

www.travel.state.gov...

If you violate Albania’s laws, even unknowingly, you may be expelled, arrested or imprisoned. Penalties for possession, use, or trafficking in illegal drugs in Albania are severe, and convicted offenders can expect long jail sentences and heavy fines. Engaging in sexual conduct with children or using or disseminating child pornography in a foreign country is a crime prosecutable in the United States.

reply to post by Stormdancer777


Fair enough, I get that but there should be some leeway in determining if someone is bringing this into the US to deal out to other people, or actually for use in a religious ceremony. Surely and judge would look at the evidence, maybe wrap the shaman across the knuckles for not reading the laws of entry properly then send him on his way.

Either way, I'm sticking by my Westboro Baptist comment