UFO's, Free Energy and Disclosure

Originally posted by MarrsAttax
reply to post by Maybe...maybe not

 

By the way is it just the people you have a problem with or the science or both?

MarrsAttax.....

Regarding Science:

I don't believe there is any science behind this material.

Regarding People:

I believe Greer just collects people to propel his own nefarious agenda.

Kind regards
Maybe...maybe not

reply to post by Welsh_Mulder


They'd have to be very efficient solar panels You may be able to answer this but wouldn't it be unlikely they would be able to draw enough power from our sun 'in-flight'. That would be no good either for interstellar travel, assuming they're from a different solar system. They may have very efficient batteries and a dyson sphere at home.

Do you have an opinion on anti-matter? Doesn't a matter/anti-matter collision produce 100% energy with the mass being anihillated? That may be more reasonable than extracting energy from the vacuum and wouldn't violate any laws of thermodynamics as far as I know. There is a LOT of energy locked up in matter.

reply to post by Maybe...maybe not


Food for thought.

Zero Point Energy (ZPE), or vacuum fluctuation energy are terms used to describe the random electromagnetic oscillations that are left in a vacuum after all other energy has been removed. If you remove all the energy from a space, take out all the matter, all the heat, all the light... everything -- you will find that there is still some energy left. One way to explain this is from the uncertainty principle from quantum physics that implies that it is impossible to have an absolutely zero energy condition.
For light waves in space, the same condition holds. For every possible color of light, that includes the ones we can’t see, there is a non-zero amount of that light. Add up the energy for all those different frequencies of light and the amount of energy in a given space is enormous, even mind boggling, ranging from 10^36 to 10^70 Joules/m3.

In simplistic terms it has been said that there is enough energy in the volume the size of a coffee cup to boil away Earth’s oceans. - that’s one strong cup of coffee! For a while a lot of physics thought that concept was too hard to swallow. This vacuum energy is more widely accepted today.

What evidence shows that it exists?

First predicted in 1948, the vacuum energy has been linked to a number of experimental observations. Examples include the Casimir effect, Van der Waal forces, the Lamb-Retherford Shift, explanations of the Planck blackbody radiation spectrum, the stability of the ground state of the hydrogen atom from radiative collapse, and the effect of cavities to inhibit or enhance the spontaneous emission from excited atoms.

www.nasa.gov...

reply to post by Rigel Kent


check out george green on you tube he seems to "know" alot on the why and why nots of disclosure

reply to post by Welsh_Mulder


I thought that was a puzzling post, I mean do you believe ETs are visiting us ? And if so how do you propose they manage that......using your principles of Physics ?

I find it hilarious that we call ourselves smart because we have gained the power of the "Atom".......When all we do with that power is use it to drive a "Steam Engine"

Surely, If you entertain the notion that ETs are visiting us, then you have to entertain the notion that ETs are using a power far beyond our comprehension..........NO. Whether its "Free energy" or an energy that is within our current understanding of Physics, can only be speculation..........Hence why i can't understand such "Matter of Fact" posts such as yours.


Also with regards to others posts as to whether this "Tech" would be withheld, answer this.....

Would Bill Gates announce a better O/S than his ?

Would GM announce a car better than theirs ?

We live in a "Greedy Capitalist" world, where things like Hemp with all its uses and benefits is made Illegal to favour less viable techniques, Or where Uranium is used instead of Thorium, despite ALL the advantages of doing so.?

Now ask yourself the question again.........Would Technology be withheld..............Absobloodylutely.

Originally posted by MarrsAttax
reply to post by Welsh_Mulder

 

They'd have to be very efficient solar panels

You may be able to answer this but wouldn't it be unlikely they would be able to draw enough power from our sun 'in-flight'. That would be no good either for interstellar travel, assuming they're from a different solar system. They may have very efficient batteries and a dyson sphere at home.

Do you have an opinion on anti-matter? Doesn't a matter/anti-matter collision produce 100% energy with the mass being anihillated? That may be more reasonable than extracting energy from the vacuum and wouldn't violate any laws of thermodynamics as far as I know. There is a LOT of energy locked up in matter.

Very efficient solar panels would be a smaller leap than free energy I think! lol In a different solar system I there would be another sun. Plus the sun has an effect on all of the planets in our solar system so I assume there would be energy to harvest even in the far reaching corners of the galaxy.

I dont know aanything in depth about anti-matter. It's all about actually having the technology which brings me back to one my original points, if they had this technology the energy companies or TPTB WOULD market it to makes tens of trillions from it. They are greedy and anyway of making more money would be seriously exploited.

Originally posted by ken10
reply to post by Welsh_Mulder

 

I thought that was a puzzling post, I mean do you believe ETs are visiting us ? And if so how do you propose they manage that......using your principles of Physics ?

I find it hilarious that we call ourselves smart because we have gained the power of the "Atom".......When all we do with that power is use it to drive a "Steam Engine"

Surely, If you entertain the notion that ETs are visiting us, then you have to entertain the notion that ETs are using a power far beyond our comprehension..........NO. Whether its "Free energy" or an energy that is within our current understanding of Physics, can only be speculation..........Hence why i can't understand such "Matter of Fact" posts such as yours.

I'm not sure what to believe Ken10, there is so much BS spouted on this subject by those in the 'know' and the people who blindly follow them.

If 'ETs' were visiting us then yes they would be using a level of Physics way above us, there is no argument about that. They may have developed a way of harnessing the energy from the sun for example.

However its still stands that you cannot create energy out of nothing, that is a fact, that will never change, it is a fundamental. There is no doubt we are in our infancy when it comes to understanding all there is to know about the universe. I've yet to see the man who can disprove the first two laws of thermodynamics or 'steam engines'.

The problem is, people want to believe, they want to take things at face value with little or no evidence to back it up. They would rather believe a far-fetched science fiction story by some idoit who's looking to make a fast buck, than the cold hard truth, because it does not fit what they want to believe. Thats why UFOlogy is the laughing stock it is today and why there is little serious research done on the subject.

If this technology were available now you bet someone like Bill Gates would be exploiting it, for all the money they could make. Why sit on it till they were old and grey or passed on and not make any money out of it???

Its like me saying "I have the potential to make millions because I can cure cancer, but hey lets forget about it, I'm already making enough money to live, forget the enourmous amount of money I could make and the millions of lives I could make better. I'll just leave it locked up where it is."

The free energy argument is BS!!

My View/opinion:

Steven Greer is a government disinfo agent who is part of a group suppressing antigravity, free energy and in the end knowledge about physics. He is just one of many including Stan Deyo, Bob Lazar, Billy Meier.. Richard Hoagland, Hal Puhoff, Ingo Swann, Art Bell etc etc..

Now.. what is disinfo? You mix real info with fake info.. thereby discrediting all of it. I think what Greer talks about here involving antigrav and free energy is real.. and they tack on all this alien nonsense to make people think the antigrav and energy is also baloney.

The "aliens" are in fact the Germans.. who began developing this tech during WWII. When our pilots saw the Foo Fighters -- the beginning use of this tech -- over Germany.. they automatically assumed it was alien technology because it was so advanced. This is what gave our oewn military the idea of using this to our advantage to keep this tech secret.

They say you can fool some of the people some of the time but you can't fool all the people all the time. I think we have fiound a unique occurrence when this isn't true. Antigravity is considered so unbelievable.. whether by nature or because of a government propoganda campaign, it has been very easy to make us believe in aliens before we believe in this tech.

But it may have also included an immense investment to keep this all secret. Because this technology would likely kill all the job producing fields in our economy -- energy and cars, construction -- it would completely change our lifestyle. I also think that this technology could be even more dengerous than nukes. I think this tech could give anyone the power to go to home depot and build your own WMD.

When you add all this up it allows the government the excuse to use limitless funds to keep this all secret. I think NASA and our science institutions are huge money pits that are a show to keep this whole facade up... as well as this massive alien disinfo campaign.

reply to post by Welsh_Mulder


Isn't oil free energy? Burning wood? How is zero point energy any different?

reply to post by Welsh_Mulder

However its still stands that you cannot create energy out of nothing, that is a fact, that will never change, it is a fundamental.

The thing is with this statement is this....

Forgetting the "Creationist" theory of how the universe was made. Before any kind of matter existed, we (As in the everything) must have came from Nothing.....So the energy to make everything that makes our universe Must have came from nothing...........Does that make sense.

Free energy technology:

Originally posted by 8311-XHT
reply to post by Welsh_Mulder

 

Isn't oil free energy? Burning wood? How is zero point energy any different?

Oil isnt free energy, you need to look up how oil was made and the definition of free enrgy.

Originally posted by ken10
reply to post by Welsh_Mulder

 

However its still stands that you cannot create energy out of nothing, that is a fact, that will never change, it is a fundamental.

The thing is with this statement is this....

Forgetting the "Creationist" theory of how the universe was made. Before any kind of matter existed, we (As in the everything) must have came from Nothing.....So the energy to make everything that makes our universe Must have came from nothing...........Does that make sense.

Now that is deep! Chicken and egg!

reply to post by Welsh_Mulder


My point is that oil is a natural creation.. it is free to us. How is zerio point energy any different?

How about solar energy.. same thing.. solar energy is free energy. So how can you say there is no free energy.

I think it's naive and small minded to think there are no better forms of free energy out there we haven't figured out how to tap into.. well we have, actually, IMO, our government just won't share that info.

We should define 'free energy', 'zero-point energy', and 'perpetual motion'. Otherwise we will go round and round in a lexical argument and not even realize it.

I don't think any of the above are possible, in their literal sense. But if we add the term 'relatively/comparatively' to 'perpetual motion', then they most definitely exist. We already have them. Watermills and windmills. Which evolved to hydroelectric dams and wind power generators, (with some new additions such as geo-thermal and solar and more). What other natural currents can we plug into next?

Consider, is our civilisation older than the snow cover mountains or the wind currents that have helped shape them since the birth of our planet? Of course not! Although, compared to our short life spans they are 'perpetual', or more precisely they are 'relatively/comparatively perpetual'... to us that is. In macroscales, they most definitely are not perpetual. Literally, nothing is absolutely perpetual.

So, in short, when discussing these ideas of 'free energy', 'perpetual motion', etc we should make sure we put it into context of scales. Differentiate between absolute and relative.



BTW, this is not "getting energy from nothing". That's a strawman.

It was because of Greer and The Disclosure Project that led me to ATS almost a year ago (something I put in google search that got me here), and for that I'll be forever thankful to Greer. But, after just a few weeks of reading through his stuff and watching some videos and gaining some insight thanks to members here, I'll have to agree with MMN...

Yes, he did a great job of pulling together a good conference in 2001, but all his extra BS makes him out to be a totally unreliable source. I'll save the name calling for others...

There are more than enough threads already about all of this, just search them out...

reply to post by Toxicsurf


I think the OP intended this thread to be more about UFOs and Free Energy tech than Greer, though.

The 'Free Energy' conspiracy goes all the way back to Tesla and Stubblefield, and maybe even further - well before Greer was even born.

That is why I continue to research it, in spite of all the dumb things Greer says publicly or writes in his books

reply to post by MarrsAttax


Man all the usual cliches about energy companies the government the military trying to keep good old joe public in the dark about how to get free energy.
Does it ever occur to you guys IF aliens visit us and have the technology to travel vast distances they would also have the technology to never be detected in the first place, I mean even we are trying to do that.

maybe its a wee bit off topic... but has Stanton Friedman ever spoken about, or expressed any opinions on Steven Greer / Disclosure???

I would respect Stantons opinion , as i find him to be one of the most level headed and respected in the UFO field.

Anyone know ???

Originally posted by MarrsAttax

Not according to J Allen Hynek and Blue Book. In that study it was found that the more data that was available the more likely the encounter would be unexplained.

I've read "Project Blue Book", it doesn't change what I said.

In fact did you read the part where I said I don't necessarily agree with the governments stand on UFOs?