They Are Coming - Are You Ready For Disclosure?

Originally posted by Mr Mask
The OP has plainly stated he is bored with people looking for proof as if a wiser man would accept the "zero proof" we have now as hard evidence of factual alien visitors...
Sorry...it doesn't work that way.

Oh but it DOES work that way..

Look at religion for the past 2000 years..
Look at where Sitchin has taken us...

I can accept the alien believer saying "I personally believe, but admit there are NO facts proving my theories as of yet".

Eye witnesses don't count?

reply to post by torsion


I don't want to get stuck in the peptual 'why now' and not before routine, but what I will say is that there is alot more in the public domain and indeed in the media than there ever has and since the D notice removal of reporting UFO'S, ET e.t.c in a serious light on 1st January 2009. It seems that we are all indeed waking up to more serious sourced journalism on this subject that is starting to sway event the minds of the scientists (Royal Academy) this year. If we all join the dots we can create a tangible outline of what is occurring, however, the decision to look at it for what it is, is not an easy task.

When I talk about disclosure, I am not talking about peaceful intergration of ET and human I am talking about is war and future events that may jeopardise our residence on this planet.

We are oblivious to what is going on and this is what concerns me most.

Fran, I would give you are star and flag...but this was quite a baseless rant when you get down to it. Not trying to sound like an a-hole, as I believe our "gods" (i.e. Aliens) will be returning, probably around 2012 for one reason or another...but as I'm saying, we need to show people the truth, not proclaim it with no proof. I do believe the public media is showing a hell of a lot more to do with Aliens and disclosure these days, you have to be blind not to see, and their attitude towards the subject has shifted vastly in the last year or so, they treat the subject much more seriously at present. Let me run this by you though...I'm thinking of making a thread which connects Aliens to our ancient past, I'm thinking I need to cover these things:

Ancient Structures
Ancient Devices
Ancient Texts
Ancient Maps
Ancient Art

Can you think of anything else I should cover?

reply to post by zorgon


Precisely - we can send a man to his death on the testimony of two or more witnesses without so much as a flicker of doubt from the people who require 'proof' that he committed the crime.

So when we have hundreds, if not thousands of highly credible witnesses (pilots, government officials, research and design scientists, senior military figures, radar operators and persons trained in avionics recognition etc), why do people still say there is no proof that we are:

a) being visited/ observed by alien races, or
b) our own governments (or shadow governments) are conducting highly successful experiments in areas of tech that would benefit mankind if generally released

If one or both of the above is/are agreeably the case, then why are the general public not pressing daily for disclosure? Do they not realise the importance of discovering the truth? Have they been conditioned to stay blinkered? Have they been conditioned to ridicule anything outside the career / mortgage / marriage / two kids / soccer practice / evening meal & wine with friends on a Saturday evening?

So very frustrating that the questions aren't being asked. One way or another the truth will out.

Anyone ever read 'Nightfall' by Isaac Asimov / Robert Silverberg? The behaviour of the journalist character Theremon seems perfectly similar to the attitude of MSM across the world today. Ridicule, until people daren't take it seriously. Then disaster.

I think Asimov got it wrong though - the journalist in his story acted alone; I can't see that being entirely the truth of the matter in our case.

LOL - there's even a rogue planet on a many thousand years elliptical orbit in that story...

Originally posted by franspeakfree

how many times have you thought about a particular theme only to find that its being discussed on a radio program that you just so happened to switch on?

None at all.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but that very long post seems to be comprised of pure speculation.
Am I wrong to want cold, hard provable facts?

Originally posted by franspeakfree
The LHC is capabale of creating wormholes can we all agree on this?

Nope. If it can thats news to me.

Originally posted by zorgon
Oh but it DOES work that way..

Zorgon, as a fan of your work on ATS, I take no pleasure in saying- "no...it does not".

Look at religion for the past 2000 years..

Religion doesn't work with facts...heck, most of it is deadly afraid of such things as facts or proof.

Look at where Sitchin has taken us...

Another fraud and snake oil's salesman...He is as allergic to facts as overly religious types are.

Eye witnesses don't count?

Of course they do...but not as factual proof of anything.

I have tried to be very polite here since I am enjoying the conversation, so please do not take this as a hostile attack.

I am laying down the most obvious fact we should all admit to.

Nobody here has any proof of aliens visiting earth. Even if you saw a strange glowing craft land in your yard and then take off again, you still have no factual proof the craft was alien.

I've mentioned a few times in some of these UFO threads what my mother and another witness saw in the early 60s, and also have heard the detailed stories of many folks in my town who also saw unexplainable things in the sky around those handful of years...I have no doubt in my mind they saw something...my mother even saw it close up (a guessed distance of 150 feet away)...but a logical mind MUST admit that even that story (even if it was filmed!) still proves nothing.

At best...it would prove someone saw something...

And to the OP-

I'm sorry if you think I cherry picked your post for something to slam...I did not. I was making reference to what I assume the bare bones of your post was.

"you speculating and saying a theory of your own is a fact".

I'm sorry...you can't do that and not be called out on it.

Like how you say Stargate is based on some UFO facts being hidden from us. Did you know the writers of that show are self admitted "huge fans" of conspiracy and UFO stories? Are you aware there has been countless Stargate-ish stories in written fiction dating as back to the early 50s?

People need to stop seeing reused stories/plots as something more "serious" then what it actually is- "marketing".

Am I saying that there is no chance of it being a show based on secrets the writers and producers know by talking to insiders of secret government agencies? No...I can't say I know "anything like that" for a fact either way.

I am very careful with what I say is fact or not. It is the reason you won't see me creating threads where I tell 6.8 billion humans on earth that "aliens are coming 100% factually for real".

I think ATS would benefit from more people understanding the difference between "guessing and imagining" verses "real proof or fact".

FACT is-

"you do not know anything about aliens or visitors to earth".

Nor do any of you have real factual proof or insight to the real truth behind the phenomena of UFOs.

Heck, even calling UFOs anything but "unidentified" is making a foolish jump in logic.

The second you call a UFO an alien craft, you have set your "good word" adrift in a sea of speculation and guess work.

I support those of you looking for REAL TRUTH...and heck, I TRUST my mother's word on what she saw...but we should all be more careful with what we tell our peers is fact or not...that is just good practice and respectful to the mission of denying ignorance together.

Just my thoughts.

reply to post by Mr Mask

Eye witnesses don't count?



Of course they do...but not as factual proof of anything.

Well thats a new one...Hope the courts don't hear that witnesses mean nothing....

Originally posted by CynicalM
reply to post by Mr Mask

 

Eye witnesses don't count?



Of course they do...but not as factual proof of anything.

Well thats a new one...Hope the courts don't hear that witnesses mean nothing....

We see here in a few simple words what is the problem. It is called "consensus reality." The methodology has been getting the mass of humanity up to speed. All of those "drive by showings" by the UFOs have not been in vain.

We are being worked up the ladder to acceptance without undo thought on the matter. The finding of Earth-like planets around other stars will be the tipping point. The real shock will be with Mars and it is starting. Recently, new assumptions by some scientists have started to question the (reportedly) negative results of the old Viking landers search for life experiments. More revelations about Phobos will come. Disclosure is right in front of our faces--given a few years.

Originally posted by CynicalM
reply to post by Mr Mask

 

Eye witnesses don't count?



Of course they do...but not as factual proof of anything.

Well thats a new one...Hope the courts don't hear that witnesses mean nothing....

You are confusing "beyond reasonable doubt" with "proven fact".

You are also comparing someone saying "I saw that man murder that man" when the authorities have found factual evidence of the crime- with saying "I saw aliens fly over my head".

Point being...I have no doubt in my mind that strange craft fly in our skies and that many folks have seen them.

BUT NOBODY can prove those craft are real...nor can they produce any evidence to show they are aliens from space.

They can be millions of things (literally) that our limited minds can not grasp.

God, time travelers, demons, dimensional visitors, echos of unknown realities, someone's secret technology, a hoax, fish people from under the sea, squid people from above the clouds...you name it.

Now, if you want to guess what is more probable...that is fine...but since you mentioned "court of law", I think we should be considering the difference between "evidence" and "factual events".

If you want to say you know something that all the human race can not figure out...fine...be that guy. I refuse to lie to people or trick myself in to thinking "guess work" equals "fact".

Hi Frank,

I support your theory about a wormhole. I think that the LHC is capable of producing that.

I also think that wormholes do excist in space and that they could actualy be a some kind of stargate in the universe.

I support the theory of Stepthen Hawkings wo say's that if you could travel through a black hole then you are actualy travelin through a wormhole. At the end of that wormhole you exit it through a 'whitehole' The theory is that by doing this you are now in another universe or dimension. I think that the universe actualy looks like this, there could well be around 10 dimensions.

One last post to clear something up-

I am not someone who thinks aliens are impossible or that all UFOs are stories created by hoaxers or crazies.

I am just not one of the sky-zealots who throws away the scientific method when dealing with the phenomena.

If you begin speculating, I begin poking...plain and simply. I'm not stupid or slow and can tell "speculation" from proof. I just think more people in this forum need to be clear where they are "speculating" and where they are "resting on facts".

Its all I ask, really...

reply to post by Mr Mask


I get it...

Its like I think no one has proven gravity, but we accept it and teach it in schools...

Its even set at 9.8..

Hmmm, actually that goes against your theory.....

Gravity has NEVER been proven but we accept it as fact, wierd huh ?

reply to post by Mr Mask


Hello Mr Mask,

I will post this video from Dr. deGrasse Tyson again as I believe this falls in line as to what you speak of regarding real proof.
Sightings are nice, but not real PROOF. This is not a court of law, not reasonable doubt. If that were the case aliens would have been here, not provable, but reasonably.

This video should be required viewing prior to any thread posting regarding alien visitation or abductions.
Please take 10 minutes to view. It is well worth it:

mcooki.es...

Thanks and 73's,
Tom (KC5ILU)

Originally posted by CynicalM
reply to post by Mr Mask

 

I get it...

Its like I think no one has proven gravity, but we accept it and teach it in schools...

Its even set at 9.8..

Hmmm, actually that goes against your theory.....

Gravity has NEVER been proven but we accept it as fact, wierd huh ?

See? this is where you get in trouble...acting like you know stuff and then proving you are guessing or talking from the hip.

Gravity exists, that is fact...How it actually works and why is theory.

The difference there is this-

We have gravity "laws" (meaning we can predict the movement of things trapped within the effects of gravity), and those laws can be tested time and time again, flawlessly and accurately in controlled experiments, giving us the basic "fundamental laws of gravity" as taught in grade schools across the globe.

But how it works, why it works, just why the universe produces gravity as it does, is all unknown. It baffles science to this day...making it a theory.

Looking for loop holes to evade my original statement- "those who say aliens are coming 100% are speculating and have no proof or facts to back them"- is silly...its true...none of us can prove UFOs or aliens either way.

Not me...not you...not Phage nor Zorgon...nobody has come forward with enough factual evidence of anything.

Speculation is NOT a bad thing...speculation is the beginning of all things that eventually become fact. I just think people need to stop pushing speculation as facts and be more honest with the audience here on ATS when they start "connecting the dots" on their own... especially when the only info they have gathered is second hand or from highly questionable sources.

I'm being fair here...I do not see why you are trying to knock that.

reply to post by tomdham


Thank you for the vid...I'm watching it now.

I will say to you this-

I have seen MUCH evidence that convinces me of UFOs in our skies. I simply do not rush off and tell people they are aliens.

PS- thus far your video is totally saying what I am trying to say in my own limited way. So I am guessing you understand what I'm trying to lay down here. Thanks for that!

reply to post by Mr Mask


You've got me wrong...

I wouldn't dream of saying aliens exist 100% or are heading here...

I'm saying, IMO, we have enough reliable witness accounts and evidence to say UFO's exist...

Thats all...Not that they are alien or on their way....

reply to post by Mr Mask

See? this is where you get in trouble...acting like you know stuff and then proving you are guessing or talking from the hip.

Gravity exists, that is fact...How it actually works and why is theory.

\
Thats pretty silly saying "acting like you know stuff and then proving you are guessing or talking from the hip."

Then going on yourself to say gravity is just a theory..So really no one knows right??

Some have said it is electrical/magnatism etc....

Originally posted by CynicalM
reply to post by Mr Mask

 

You've got me wrong...

I wouldn't dream of saying aliens exist 100% or are heading here...

I'm saying, IMO, we have enough reliable witness accounts and evidence to say UFO's exist...

Thats all...Not that they are alien or on their way....

Then me and you are on the same page...you made it clear that you are sharing an opinion based on eye witnesses, and keeping your mind clear in seeing that these UFOs may not be aliens at all.

I have no problem with your opinion...

Its when people go flippantly acting "more informed" by saying "aliens are fact" with not a single shred of proof that I get uppity.

reply to post by CynicalM


Hello CynicalM,

Please take a look at the video on my post above....eyewitness, nice...ashtray, better!!

Take care,
Tom

reply to post by Mr Mask


MM, I have an open mind, some say clever, but I look at each piece of information and form an opinion/theory until absolute proof...

The one thing I find interesting is the ancient sightings and ancient technology, but again, this could be advanced humans if true..

Do I think there's life other than here on Earth? Sure, probability tells me there should be..

Thats as far as I think..