Satan and Science, His Creation to Mislead

Exactly if anything, science has enriched your life, sure its enabled us to kill eachother faster, but how is that the fault of science?

Humans are just messed up we enjoy subjugating others, even if we just had sticks and stones we'd still go to war.

In to play comes the human ego...



Kinglizard; cmon you know technology doesn't make us evil, human have been twisted since the beginning of time.

or to use the bible, Cain and Abel where was the evil technodemons there?

[edit on 5-9-2010 by Lysergic]

Satan created everything you disapprove of.
God created everything you approve of.

Shame that you can not provide a single nano-sized piece of evidence for either.

I suppose all of those cures and successful treatments that are of a DIRECT result of science are also the work of the horned red guy from deep down?

In fact, is it not the case that disease is naturally occurring? Whose work is that then?

Until we all start to take responsibility for our own actions and stop relying on (or blaming) fictional supernatural figures then we will continue to act like the idiot species we seem to be.

Originally posted by Pentothal
Satan created everything you disapprove of.
Shame that you can not provide a single nano-sized piece of evidence for either.

True, this is a faith based conversation....from my side anyways. No way for me to prove anything to anyone.

reply to post by kinglizard


So...you're a socialist.

Don't worry, because I'm getting hardcore liberal like that. I do believe in economic democracy.
However, I ask you
"If we are unjust, we shall gain and get off unpunished as well, by persuading God with prayers when we transgress and make mistakes?"

Injustice against man seems not to matter, as we are in favor God.
I find that to be a load of it, to be honest. God is in everyone of us, and in everything. Heaven is for everyone, and a transgression against anyone is a transgression against God imo. Everything is way more connected than you can imagine, my young friend. Its beautiful...

reply to post by kinglizard


I find it quite hypocritical on your part to include only your Abrahamic view of religion in this thread. Have you considered that other religions can and do live in harmony with science? You seem to think that science is promoting evil into your religion. If that is the case, perhaps you should find a religion that is less demanding on your conscience.

Science is neutral. The way in which man uses science is what promotes "good" or "evil". I put those two words in quotes because I do not believe that good or evil exist. Reality is shades of gray. It is not black and white.

Originally posted by bogomil
Anybody interested, read acts and epistles for yourself. You may come to my conclusion, that Paulinism is the greatest hoax ever.

I'm not going to defend Paul. But I don't agree with your claim. What I know and certain is:

In the New Testament, thirteen epistles have been attributed to Paul; of these at least five, and possibly seven, were actually written by St Paul.

Ephesians has the worst credentials for authenticity, in critical circles, among all of Paul’s epistles.

And Paul confesses to having “violently persecuted” the “church of God” prior to his conversion

So either Paul handbook or collections of letters is ( note that I say HANDBOOK )

a) extension works by other authors OR
b) His writing is influenced by his emotions ( anger ) or past experience before his conversion therefore his motive is under question.

Again I have to stress, I'm not trying to defend Paul but I think you have overstep your judgement too much already. Could you kindly be more objective?


[edit on 5-9-2010 by EasternShadow]

Probably the most brainwashed and retarded thing i've ever read. OP; i pitty you.

Re: Kinglizard

It has already been pointed out, that you have the options of:

1/ Stop using devilish devices

2/ Go and live with the Amish (or similar)

Amongst us heathens, there exists something called consequence and honesty to ideals (though we as heathens ofcourse are unable to make the RIGHT sort of consequence, and our ideals are hedonistic, not like the noble motives of 'christians').

Why don't you live up to your own words and bugger off out into the scientifically unpoluted wilderness?

Or are you here just to deliever religious graffiti, which you have no intention of using in your own life?

Originally posted by bogomil
Re: EasternShadow

You wrote:

"Then you should know it would never work because you can't embrace faith by force. A 'force' religion only lead to rebellion and hatred instead of understanding, willingness and love. As I said no one can force you to believe. If you don't want to be a believer then you can never be one unless your heart/soul will for it."

Then what happened at the inquisition and Jesuit god-bothered South-america?

My contry had compulsory statechurch-going duty until a century or two ago, and indigenous and competing christian sects were forbidden.

If some ideology is hammered into you all life, and there's no alternative, it's called brainwashing. But surely 'christianity' would NEVER lower itself to such, and there are NO christian soldiers left. Except a few here on this forum, maybe.

Sorry I must have miss this. Ah..... I see.

So is that influence your thinking? It seem you do not have the choice there. You are being forced. I am sorry for you. I can understand where this anger come from. You have just demonstrate exactly what I have say. Force religion lead to rebellion, anger and hatred. I feel very sorry for you. This is really bad. All I can do is to assure you this is not right. This is not Jesus teaching. This is not Moses teaching. Be patience. Everything has it's retribution. Have faith in this even though you have no faith in God. You shall have God's Mercy in the end.

[edit on 5-9-2010 by EasternShadow]

LOL This is just amusing.Please will a mod delete this thread.Deny ignarance, this is very much promoting it ,to the extreme I must add.I feel ignorant just taking the time to respond to it.Thanks OP you just made my I.Q drop for taking the time to read this.

god created satan. satan created science. sounds like its all gods fault.

[edit on 5-9-2010 by violence=answer]

reply to post by violence=answer


LOL amen to that.Of course god did turn off his all knowing powers when he created satan and didnt know he would turn on him.Even better when he turned on him instead of doing away with him he cast him down on us that he loves so much.Kinda like if your dog goes mad instead of putting him down you lock him up in the room with your children.

Kinglizard,

I have some ideas for you that may expand your perspective.

First of all - don't freak out now - but I am a mechanical engineer. Something you touched today - I had a hand in the design of, somewhere along the line. Me, the 'scientist' is touching you via something. If you own a car - you have absolutely encountered me.

There is an old joke - civil engineers build targets, mechanical engineers build weapons.
But I myself would never be involved in anything destructive. I will tell you too - most of the businesses I have worked for/with - are ethical and not out to do harm intentionally. Do not fear too much. Sure there are some rotten and greedy people out there, but most are not.

Now. For my ideas. Perhaps you might try to learn more about "technology" and "science" and see how it can be used to help people.

I am also qualified as an Environmental Engineer and I would like to tell you, and others, about this because Environmental Science is a very great thing and something we can all learn about and use to help ourselves and others.

It is sometimes hard to talk of these things as some people think that it means "tree huggers" and "nut jobs". Not at all! It encompasses everything you can think of and is mostly "in your backyard" type of things. There are many fascinating angles to read and learn about.

Now - I noticed you spoke of 'starving children' so I wanted to point out a very good book I have recently read. Here is a link to a synopsis of this book -
"W aste" by Tristram Stuart

This book discusses global food waste and it is very shocking how much waste of food there is, all along the supply line. It is theorized that in the US - 50% of all food is wasted!

Here is another book I have read recently, which is about the coal industry and pollution -
NYTimes book review of "Big Coal" by Jeff Goodell

This is a very good book also about the energy industry and pollution.

You can read about many environmental subjects and use this knowledge to help
others! You can learn things and begin to make a difference in your community and elsewhere right away.

I hope you can perhaps open your mind to some of science and learn about the ways it can really help us all. It is nothing to be afraid of.

Greed and misuse of technology are bad things, using science to help people is a good thing!

I am not really religious myself, been through the Jewish Temple and Christian Churches (my parents really wanted to pile it on, eh? ) and I think there are many good things about religion too.

Religion and science do not have to be mutually exclusive.

Oh and be sure to think of me if you pop open a beer or soda or juice - I very likely designed the tooling that produced their caps.
(Don't stand there with the fridge open either )

~ Peace

Based on scientific cosmology and inductive reasoning, I have arrived at the conclusion, that gnostic cosmogony and cosmology is the best of the religious models.

Not being a religionist, I will express this in rational terms.

There is an irregularity in cosmic creation, and one aspect of this irregularity manifests as hierarchies of predation. This is experienced as 'suffering' by mankind.

In OT/Pauline cosmology this irregularity (experienced as 'suffering') is a result of human misbehaviour (original sin). In my cosmology the irregularity started long time before mankind existed, so we are hardly responsible for it. Responsibilty is in creation itself.

OT/Paulinism actively support and join predatory hierarchies (resulting in 'suffering'); postulating that mankind has to accept it, as we are responsible for it ourselves, and that the only answer/solution is obedience to OT/Pauline doctrines.

I totally reject such a slave-ideology, and strongly suggest that OT/Pauline doctrines only have two functions: To keep mankind in ignorance and to protect the power-position of an OT/Pauline elite in a predatory hierarchy.

Using the religious terminology of OP I state: Those promoting OT/Pauline ideology are the REAL devil-supporters (black satanists, if you like).

This is on a forum of conspiracy? OT/Pauline religion IS such a conspiracy. I have scientific considerations in my conclusions, so I'm not off-topic either.

I can back up this hypothesis quite well logically, but naturally expecting the response, that logic is 'satanic' and bible and/or faith are ultimate truths in the excellent tradition of circular argumentation. But from now on, I'm in the same privileged position as fundamentalist 'christians'; I can also call my opponents for satanists. I'm looking forward to such a simplified discussion, suited to 'christian' level.


[edit on 5-9-2010 by bogomil]

Originally posted by bogomil
Re: adjensen

you wrote:

"Paul taught that we are not saved by our own works, which was the Jewish belief, but by our faith in Christ,....."

But that's what I said. Are you trying to disprove me, by agreeing with me?

Let's actually use my quote, which you conveniently cut short:

On the contrary, Paul implored his churches to be faithful, to be moral, to care for and love one another. No church believes that forgiveness and salvation are complete without repentance. Go look up what that word means, because it is key to Christian faith, and it is the easiest argument against your ignorant claim.

So I'm clearly disproving your claim that Paul said people could do whatever they wanted, so long as they have faith.

"To claim that you "live up to our own ideals of ethics" means nothing, because you can just mould your "ideals of ethics" to be the things that you want to do."

Isn't that what 'christians' are doing all the time by reading the bible as it suits them?

A Christian who reads Christ's two commandments and thinks that it's morally okay to steal, murder or abuse others is not a Christian. You, on the other hand, are only held to what you personally think is right, so it's no surprise that you consider yourself to be "living up to your own ideals of ethics."

From James:
...
Paulus: Romans
...
Does this sound as two people agreeing?

I already refered to that, go back and read what I wrote

You have an extremely unpleasant habit of giving my words just a little twist, giving them a new meaning, and then from there leading the subject out into demagogic ramblings, either as divertive action or to tire or confuse everyone. If you want to relate to my posts, at least avoid deforming my words.

No, your words are what demonstrate your failures, not me. Paul did not teach that one can or should live their lives in conflict with Christ's teaching, which is what you claimed. That's an absolute untruth, so one can come away with the realization that your "ideals of ethics" includes flat out lying, when it serves your purposes.

edit: post removed.

edit2:This thread is a joke right?



[edit on 5/9/2010 by C0bzz]

organized religion and doing things in "the name of god" has killed entirely more people than science.

The end.

Actually it was more money that did those things and not science. And just because something causes an unexpected or bad result, it's satans fault? ha..

If "satan" didn't convince eve to eat the forbidden fruit, you probably wouldn't be here. That's if there was a satan and the bible is true which is unlikely...

[edit on 5/9/2010 by nightrun]

reply to post by kinglizard


After many years of deliberating the purpose of the devil in God's infallible creation, the Universe, and his desire for peace I have come to this conclusion. The Devil was created by God to give man an adversary so as not to allow his mind to atrophy to the many pleasures of a Heavenly existence. Man is to earn his way to GODLINESS, as evdienced by the example Jesus Christ served and pointed out when he stated that mankind was all God's children and we all could do as he if we had the faith of a mustard seed, and God has a plan. There is a disbalance to be rooted out by the open provocation the Devil presents to imperfect beings and is the best way to sift out the bad from the good. The devil has his purpose and God allows this to put man to the test because only the best of the best can continue on this journey of which result is unknown for the moment but before and during the end times many things shall be revealed. So keep an open mind to every perspective out there all the while holding on to your faith because once lost is next to impossible to reclaim. 1

reply to post by kinglizard


Ok, for me science is a tool, like a knife. A knife could be used to cut food so you can ration it with your family OR it can be used to stab them all to death. Science works the same way, IMHO. It's about who's wielding it and with what purpose. The only "Evil" I see here is the one that lives within Us.