Revelation; The Beast- 666

reply to post by Anthony2

P.S.
...but of course there would still have to be some visible sign of loyalty, so that authorities could recognise the absence of it.
Elsewhere I've used the analogy of the swastika and Nazi salute under the Nazi regime.

The first thing to appreciate when trying to identify the Beast 666, is that the Book of Revelation deals only with prophecies of "The End Times" which, by the Bible's own definition, did not start until 1948, when the current State of Israel was created by United Nation Resolution 181 in November 1947.

Therefore, to speculate on Bonaparte, or anyone else living before 1948 as being the Beast 666, is completely off track.

Secondly, Revelation does not say the beast is a man. It says the beast has the number of a man ie. a number allocated by a man.

Consider this possibility: During the war with Iraq, when it invaded Kuwait in 1990, the United Nations placed a complete embargo on trade with both Iraq and Kuwait by Resolution 661. However, thousands of civilians, including children, were dying of starvation. The United Nation relented and allowed trade where there were valid "humanitarian considerations".

The number of the Resolution was 666. It was absolutely true, therefore, that no man could buy or sell, in Iraq or Kuwait, unless his transaction carried the number (or mark) of "The Beast". The mark would have to have been on the trading papers and would have been either at the top, or on the right hand side of the documents. Hence the mark 666 would have been on the "right hand" (side) or the forehead (top) of the trading papers, rather than the trader himself, as the prophecy suggests

Obviously John would not have had a word to desribe a United Nation's Resolution, or if he did, the word was subsequently lost in translation and became "The Beast"

You can read a detailed analysis of the revelation of the Beast 666 and the other "Beast", with seven heads, in a recent book, available on Amazon, entitled "Bible Prophecies Fulfilled by 2012"

This and many other revelations can be seen to have been fulfilled since 1948

reply to post by alpete95

a) It seems that you did not read much beyond the first line. As you would have seen on reading the rest of the OP, the reference to Bonaparte was nothing more than a mildly humorous way of introducing the subject.

b) The date 1948 is NOT specified in the Bible.
The Jehovah's Witnesses used to say "within a generation of 1914", but this theory is now wearing a little thin.
Similarly, while it is currentlyfashionable to propose "soon after 1948", I think that line will also be wearing rather thin before too many years have passed.

c) The number "666" can be found in millions of different places.
Therefore it is not enough just to find a match for the number. You need to find a match for what actually happens in Revelation ch13.
In Revelation ch13, the Beast is dominating the whole world; the mark is applied all over the world as a badge of loyalty to the Beast; the punishment for refusing to accept this badge of loyalty is first a boycott ("not allowed to buy or sell"), and finally death.
What you say about "resolution 666" doesn't match any of that. It's purely local in operation, and nothing to do with proclaiming loyalty to an avowed enemy of the Biblical God.

d) This book you mention, here and in all the other posts you made today. I hope that's not your own book you're plugging.

e) "95", eh? Is that your date of birth? And it's now 2012...

reply to post by DISRAELI


You say I didn't read your article beyond the first line, but that is not true. I read it all, several times but I didn't realise that you were making a joke about 666 being Napoleon Bonaparte. If I missed the joke then I apologise.

In general, people’s names are put forward as 666 because it is possible to allocate numbers to letters and make many names come to 666. But please tell me one name which not only satisfies the 666 rule but also fits the qualification that “no man can buy or sell without the number 666”

You say Resolution 666 does not fit the bill but it:

1) Has the required number 666 and
2) It satisfies the rather strange condition that without it, (the number) no one can buy or sell.

How much more do you want and what else can you suggest which fits both these criteria?

You say that the whole world is being terrorised by the Beast but it’s not the Beast 666! and it's not the whole world. If you read chapter 13 carefully, there is another Beast (with seven heads) which is causing a lot of trouble. They are not the same Beasts!

Then there are two more completely different beasts, one with “two horns like a lamb but which speaks as a dragon” and the “Image of the Beast” which is yet another “Resolution” but this time from the other side in the war, The United Arab League. The people who were killed, were those who would not worship the “image of the beast” not those who refused to worship “the Beast 666.”

We could get into a discussion of why people who would not worship the “Image of the Beast” were killed but we will need a fresh post to deal with this. I am happy to supply this if anyone is interested.

I agree the Bible does not mention 1948. What it does state, is that the End Times will not commence until Israel is living in its own country. 1948 was the first time they did so since they were taken into captivity in Babylon hundreds of years previously.

Why do you say that two assertions about the End Times are “wearing a bit thin” Either they are possibilities, or they have been completely disproved. Who says they are “wearing a bit thin” and WHY? What does it even mean – “wearing a bit thin”?

Finally, you say that what I am proposing is a “local” matter, rather than a global one, and you imply that it is therefore too unimportant to be included in The Book of Revelation.

Please let me enlighten you. The Book of Revelation was written by a Jew for the Jewish people and is only concerned with events involving Israel and their sworn enemies, the Arab nations surrounding them. The allies of Israel are of necessity included in some of the prophecies, notably the UK and USA, because they often play a major part in the events prophecied.

There are two classes of people mentioned throughout the book and I don’t want to be accused of racism but the facts are there and any racism is on the part of the author, not me. The two races are:

1) Those whose “names are written in the Book of Life” ( The Jewish people) and
2) “Those who dwell on the Earth” The Non-Jewish people or Arabs)

If you read carefully, you will see clearly that these names are used consistently throughout the book and are quite clear to whom they refer. Again, I could write a whole blog on this subject if anyone wants to hear it and show clearly without any shadow of doubt where the two races are first identified .

Finally, on a lighter point, 95 is not my year of birth; I wish it were. It is the number of my house!!

Originally posted by alpete95
But please tell me one name which not only satisfies the 666 rule but also fits the qualification

Why should I need to give an alternate name? As far as I'm concerned, it's perfectly feasible that whoever or whatever fits the number isn't even born yet. In that case, nobody in the present time would be able to identify the name. For that reason alone, the argument "It must be this one, because there aren't any alternatives" doesn't really work

How much more do you want and what else can you suggest which fits both these criteria?

There are many theories which fit together "666" and "control of buying and selling". They bring in credit cards, bar-codes, etc, etc, almost anything that governs modern trade.
Frankly, I think they're missing the point, because the mark is primarily a sign of loyalty, and the boycotting of the un-cooperative is just a by-product of that.
All the same, the fact that these theories exist refutes the idea that yours is the only way of making the connection.

You say that the whole world is being terrorised by the Beast but it’s not the Beast 666! and it's not the whole world. If you read chapter 13 carefully, there is another Beast (with seven heads) which is causing a lot of trouble. They are not the same Beasts!

No, I did not say that, and that's not what happens in ch13. You are the one who is not reading the chapter carefully, which means that your understanding of it is garbled.
I said that the Beast DOMINATES the world. But it dominates the world largely by virtue of the fact that most of the world loves it (vv3-4).
Secondly, I know there are two Beasts, but the two of them go together. They are inseparable.
My own understanding is that one represents the world-state, while the other is the leader of that state.
Anyway, the "mark" connected with "666" is the sign of loyalty which the second beast imposes on the world as a symbol of willingness to worship the first Beast (v12). So it belongs to both of them.

Finally, you say that what I am proposing is a “local” matter, rather than a global one, and you imply that it is therefore too unimportant to be included in The Book of Revelation.

My point was this; in Revelation ch13, the second Beast is imposing upon the whole world the worship of the first Beast. The insistence on the "666" mark is part of that world-wide operation. Those who don't co-operate are punished, first by boycotting, and ultimately by being slain.
What you say about "resolution 666" doesn't match any of this. There's no parallel at all between that trivial feature of recent history and the world-wide event described in Revelation ch13.

That's why I say that it's not enough just to find a match for the number.
You also need to find a match for what actually happens in Revelation ch13.

ALPETE95

2 BEAST IS THE FATHER AND THE SON, WHO IS THE JESUS AND 666.

They say JESUS WILL COME TO JUDGE THE LIVING AND THE DEAD, THIS IS WRONG. LET THE DEAD BURY THE DEAD. WE ARE ALREADY DEAD ,SO HOW CAN JESUS COME AND JUDGE THE LIVING.

PAUL AND THE REVELATION IS 100% AGAINST JESUS. image of the beast, are statues, pictures, ICONS O F JESUS.

you are right in the Revelation are 2 kingdoms, one for the living and one for the dead, LIVING IS FOR THE CHOSEN PEOPLE WHO WROTE THE REVELATION AGAINST JESUS.

who or what is the beast?" the number 666 is a name of man" does this mean to be a man or of man 666 could be the letters of the man, 6 in the first 6 in the middle and 6 in the last name, the closest one, Ronald Wilson Reagan.
Or could it be of something man made? Take COMPUTER, do the math and numbering it does =666

reply to post by bekod


666 IS JESUS , NO ONE ELSE

Originally posted by bekod Take COMPUTER, do the math and numbering it does =666

But as I observed in the OP, that calculation works for so many other words and names as well.
How to choose between them?
This difficulty means that using that method gets us nowhere.

reply to post by DISRAELI
"let a wise man know" , what else dictates what you buy, when you buy, how you buy, but a computer.
Use a card is it not computer read , buy with cash does the receipt not state payed with cash, is not the name computer not of man?
The other clue is "in the hand or forehead" Smart phones,and numbers to remember, is one or both not fit this, yes we are in the end times, it is just a mater of time before we all need smart phones to use to buy your milk via computer for one can not buy with out the mark of the best, smart phone is the last piece of the puzzle, for only you and you a lone can use the next gen. No phone no way to buy, cards and id pin numbers will be the thing of the past. we are already being trained how to use the new system, we think it is just a new toy, one that we must have as soon as the next gen comes out 4g 5g 6g ect ect. do i have one no, will I have no, will i be an out cast yes.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

This can answer the what does 666 mean.

I keep hearing the Nero answer.
Unless everything else written happened back then, its not him.
Mountains falling, sea becomes blood, etc. Kinda think we would have seen that somewhere in the history books.

reply to post by winterkill
yes this is true many things must come to pass before the "return".
The building of the temple, the receiving of the mark, ect ect. the beast is here, it is now getting the mark on or too all free phones web for the poor and free computers are all part of this, the sad thing is no one sees it as this yet and when they do it will be to late.

reply to post by bekod

There is no reason at all why the Mark should be directly connected with money or the control of trade.
If the Hitler Reich had issued a decree saying "Everybody must wear a swastika badge. Nobody without one will be allowed to run a shop, or for that matter buy things in shops", then that badge would have fitted the description. Nobody would have been allowed to "buy or sell" without it. The Mark could be something with the same kind of indirect connection.

I think those who focus on the "control of trade" motif are missing the point.
The Mark is first and foremost a sign of loyalty.
It indicates loyalty to the Beast, which is why he punishes those who won't take it.
At the same time, it is a sign of disloyalty to the Biblical God, the opponent of the Beast, which is why he punishes those who do take it.

Now consider this question very carefully.
In what way is someone using a computer expressing disloyalty to the Bibilcal God, and loyalty to his enemy?
Does anyone explicitly say,when they're selling computers, "by the way, by using this computer you will be demonstrating your willingness to worship the ruler of the world (who doesn't exist yet) instead of the Biblical God?"
No, they don't.
Is it rational to suppose that God would consign ,men to the fire (ch14 v11) because they've been tapping away on a keyboard?
God punishes the Mark because it is consciously chosen disloyalty, Nobody using a computer is making a conscious choice for or against the Biblical God, and therefore it cannot be the Mark.

reply to post by DISRAELI
For the sake of argument, lets say there is no more cash it is all card, pin numbers to bank accounts could be used till you got a card, now is this just a system, or is it the "mark"?.

The computer is the beast or the system, the mark is the of the beast or of the system, now by receiving the card have you now received the mark, and now have you become of the beast or of the system?.

For the beast will trick man to become part of this, it will be the new god of man, all will fine, all will be taken care of, peace will be all around, no more war, no more death, as long as you are willing to bow down to the beast, be part of the system. now how would one not say this is god or god like?

reply to post by bekod

But this does not involve people consciously choosing against God.
And if they are not choosing against God, how are they being disloyal?
And if they are not being disloyal, why should God be so punitive?

reply to post by DISRAELI

My response to the claims made about the year 2012 was that I could see no prophetic significance in the date.
This position seems to have been vindicated.

THE NUMBER OF A MAN = 20 + 8 + 5 + 14 + 21 + 13 + 2 + 5 + 18 + 15 + 6 + 1 + 13 + 1 + 14 = 156 = 3 X 52
SIX = 19 + 9 + 24 = 52

156 = SIX SIX SIX

For WoW Discovieries

reply to post by JethroBlack

"man was created on the sixth day of Creation" is a much simpler way of getting there.
Simpler is better, because it gives people a better chance of understanding what God is getting at.

This series was running ten years ago. People may think it is becoming topical again.