over kill chemtrails (pics)

Contrails my ass!

I live in an area with no immediate flight path (western NSW Australia) and I photograph this crap on a daily basis, on top of that my son and I have uncontrollable sneeze attacks whenever we walk outside on days the spraying is going on, and end up with respiratory problems.

Some people will never accept it's a boot up their ass till a surgeon needs to be called in to remove it!

reply to post by Coming-soon

I live in an area with no immediate flight path (western NSW Australia)...

Oh, really?

You don't have airlines in Australia?

Flying all over the country, between your cities??

I admit I'm not intimately familar with the geography down there...only been to Sydney, Melbourne and Brisbane (Cairns too, but just for a turn-around...didn't stay overnight).

SO...NSW is the state with Sydney as its capital, right? (I'm familiarising myself, with a Google map).

AND, you're in western NSW, so you're inland, away from the sea?

Gee....do ya think maybe there are flights from, say Sydney to Adelaide? They might pass over your head, and make contrails. OR, what about Melbourne to Darwin?? OR...(pick a city pair...could take a look at the Qantas website, for their route maps...or, what is it...Virgin Blue? Them, too...)

I tried to find images for you, like I can here in the States, of aeronautical charts...not easy to see any that are freely available, online. Plenty of sites that will SELL them, though...by snail mail.

Here's the best I found: www.airservicesaustralia.com.au...

It is just one example --- a list of "waypoints", giving their Lat/Long co-ordinates. You can plot them on a map, if you wish.

Waypoints like those are ONE sort of navigational reference used by airplanes in flight.

All waypoints with five letters are also referred to as "intersections" (a term that is steeped in their original history...before the advent of GPS).

Not all of those waypoints will be utilized as "High" altitude points...I would need the appropriate navigational charts to determine that, but alas, as I said, don't have online access to them ... yet.

Oh....and to see an example, since it's found online and easy to access, of Charts from the States, go to www.skyvector.com... and browse, and learn.

Also, read the rest of this, or any other "chemtrail" thread here on ATS.

~~~~~

Also, for your convenience, an inter-active Route Map for Qantas:

www.qantas.com.au...

And, one for Virgin Blue:

www.virginblue.com.au...






[edit on 3 August 2010 by weedwhacker]

Originally posted by Coming-soon
Contrails my ass!

Whoa, screw the science community, a genius is coming through folks!

Originally posted by Coming-soonI live in an area with no immediate flight path (western NSW Australia) and I photograph this crap on a daily basis, on top of that my son and I have uncontrollable sneeze attacks whenever we walk outside on days the spraying is going on, and end up with respiratory problems.

Firstly, are you a pilot? Do you have an extensive map of Australian flight paths? Secondly, if you live in East Jesus Nowhere, why would they be spraying? They would spray a random part of the desert? Or maybe you know too much and they are trying to kill you!

As for sneezing its called Hayfever. Get some anti-histamines and man up.

Originally posted by Coming-soonSome people will never accept it's a boot up their ass till a surgeon needs to be called in to remove it!

Your attitude is plain (or should that be plane?) ignorant here. You believe some fringe psuedo-science bull#, and therefore you can make a sweeping statement like this? You are one of the lucky few who actually 'get' it. You are so wrong it hurts man. Chemtrails have no basis in hard fact or science. There is no actual evidence for them.

"Chemtrails have no basis in hard fact or science". ... Classic DISINFO. It depends on the energy, persistance, and current attention of those who would dispute you, and their numbers. No broken links in my mind after your words. Clever-sounding nonsense remains nonsense. And a cheerful Good-day to the contrailer relics upon the board.

Originally posted by Northwarden
"Chemtrails have no basis in hard fact or science". ... Classic DISINFO. It depends on the energy, persistance, and current attention of those who would dispute you, and their numbers. No broken links in my mind after your words. Clever-sounding nonsense remains nonsense. And a cheerful Good-day to the contrailer relics upon the board.

Ha "Clever sounding nonsense" - That is just chemmie code for "Do not confuse me with the facts or science, I have my mind already made up"

Classic Disinfo? When why is it that us supposed disinfo agents have to keep correcting the chemmies and the rest of the Insane Cloud Posse on continually making false assertions.

It seems every time a member of the ICP tries to post something about aviation and meteorology, its always wrong. So who are the real disinfo agents?

I'm pretty firmly on the whistleblower side of the fence Firepilot; I don't expect you to have to read back to verify that, so I'll assert it instead. As for the truth of this one, we can't trust your official statistics, so people had to start fresh. The difference between you Con(trail) Artists, and those of us who realize chemicals are spewing from the trails of planes isn't a matter of sanity. It's like jaywalking. Who is going to regulate chemtrails except the odd zeolot with the means. While we all look forward to a lab readout for you someday, THERE ARE NORMAL CONTRAILS ALSO, and some of us are not ignorant to the fact that the majourity of them are "normal", by your own definitions. Please don't continue to insult our intelligence over the existance of geoengineering chemical spray programs which are part of a global UN agenda to "combat global warming". I don't care if you're a pilot sinch age four and can assemble or disassemble every nut and bolt in a hundred varieties of aircraft. It means squat while we are speaking about a media-suppressed, details-classified international government program that You aren't involved with.

reply to post by Northwarden


SHOW THE PROOF.

All you have is a "gut" feeling, and allegations...most likely from reading on the Web...

...instead of actually contemplating for yourself, and applying some real thought. Far easier to lap up the "conspiracy" without question, isn't it?

No sense in letting physics, science, math and the utter and total lack of evidence get in the way of these "gut" feelings, and the "I'm better than everyone else because I believe, and am in the know, so therefore I am superior" mindset that "chemmies" exhibit.


Not "you", of course...but it IS the general attitude displayed...that feeling of wanting to BE the "whistleblower", the person who belongs to an elite "club" of just a few who aren't considered "sheeple"....it is a psychologically fascinating phenomenon.

I wonder if there are any doctoral dissertations yet written about it? I think I'll go check....

~~~~~

I don't have more time, atm...but a quick search, and this popped up. Not sure how relevant, but I thought the name was intriguing!!

Apropos to ATS, maybe... since the name "Springer" was in it!!!

www.springerlink.com...


[edit on 3 August 2010 by weedwhacker]

You sound ridiculous, if you're levelling that at me. I've been in thread after thread, and others have been in thread after thread, outlining the scope of the situation, the planes proposed for chemspraying and their payload capacities (recall your embarrassment on that thread Weedwacker)? Why in the past we've covered toxins, politics, nwo connectivity and plan furtherances, the scope of the delusion ptb would portray through mass media, the prevalance of paid disinfo to cover up what would be alarming to the masses. They hide behind the fact that there are normal contrails, plain and simple folks. It's not that the science is hard to understand - it's only moderately hard to understand, and takes some time investment, to be an armchair expert on this subject. ANYONE can learn as much as some of these "experts" in a matter of short weeks. What we are dealing with is their misplaced blame for pollutants, and an issue with a very deep underbelly, that the governments of the world prefer not to answer to. The disinfo here thinks, that so long as they deny the root existance of the subject, all talk of geoengineering and the UN, government soft-kill programs in general, are external to this topic. In other words "don't discuss this one little stitch until you show us the proof in the form we demand". Yet by the measure of Our yardstick-which seeks for truth-we Have figured it out. It's in past threads, look it up. So far as your ego-laden comments about solving a controversy for the sake of heroics, or calling peeps sheeps to what ... make myself feel superior? ... it's about time you realized that most of us here are over such babycrap and are linked to the superego drive to do what is right, to speak of what is true whereby the definitions are drawn from your mists, and to outline the importances of higher-minded particulars which are overdue for discussion about the matter at hand. Proofs are already here. Read past threads. They'd be cleaner compositions if it weren't for those agents paid to disseminate the matter on the worlds largest conspiracy site.

Originally posted by Northwarden
I'm pretty firmly on the whistleblower side of the fence Firepilot; I don't expect you to have to read back to verify that, so I'll assert it instead. As for the truth of this one, we can't trust your official statistics, so people had to start fresh. The difference between you Con(trail) Artists, and those of us who realize chemicals are spewing from the trails of planes isn't a matter of sanity. It's like jaywalking. Who is going to regulate chemtrails except the odd zeolot with the means. While we all look forward to a lab readout for you someday, THERE ARE NORMAL CONTRAILS ALSO, and some of us are not ignorant to the fact that the majourity of them are "normal", by your own definitions. Please don't continue to insult our intelligence over the existance of geoengineering chemical spray programs which are part of a global UN agenda to "combat global warming". I don't care if you're a pilot sinch age four and can assemble or disassemble every nut and bolt in a hundred varieties of aircraft. It means squat while we are speaking about a media-suppressed, details-classified international government program that You aren't involved with.

Fanastic post!

Star for you sir.

Originally posted by weedwhacker"I'm better than everyone else because I believe, and am in the know, so therefore I am superior" mindset that "chemmies" exhibit.

Think you could fit any more derogatory jargon into that sentence?

I don't think any "chemmie" thinks they are better than anyone else. What a ridiculous accusation to make.

It is the fevered self-assuredness people like you display which is saddening.

I mean if the situation itself was much harder to identify people might not be so eager to point it out. But the reality is; go outside early enough in the morning and tilt your head up.

Contrails disperse behind the plane. Chemtrails stay around for hours, spread out and soon enough clouds form and the sky is overcast. I mean, isn't that just a simple observation?

How can you watch this and think it is all normal..?

Originally posted by steve_oZ


Contrails disperse behind the plane. Chemtrails stay around for hours, spread out and soon enough clouds form and the sky is overcast. I mean, isn't that just a simple observation?

Yes, it is a simple observation. But contrails do exactly that and have been doing it ever since they were first seen early in the age of flight. But here is an article written in 1970:

The spreading out of jet contrails into extensive cirrus sheets is a familiar sight. Often, when persistent conditions exist from 25,000 to 40,000ft, several long contrails increase in number and gradually merge into an almost solid interlaced sheet.

journals.ametsoc.org...

[edit on 8/3/2010 by Phage]

reply to post by steve_oZ


Do you see?

How can you watch this and think it is all normal..?

To me, with a lifetime of experience in aviation, there's nothing in that video that's out of the ordinary!

Do you see why it's frustrating to those of us who know better, when these oulandish claims are made, based on nothing? Zilch? These claims are a simple matter of ignorance, of meteorology and aviation, and other sciences.

It has turned into a frenzied ado about nothing...AND, like many "conspiracy" projects, it is a cash-cow business, in the finest entrepreneurial spirit imaginable.

But, WE who understand this, can type/speak until blue in the face...so, let's get t ospecifics, in THAT video.

WHAT did you see that is so "wrong"? Point by point, so we I can address them...

reply to post by Northwarden


Sorry....not to seem churlish, but your posting style is difficult to read and encompass, lacking in paragraph breaks.

But, let's ask about this, because you seem to be sorely mistaken...or you merely didn't understand something, and must have gotten the wrong impression:

...the planes proposed for chemspraying and their payload capacities (recall your embarrassment on that thread Weedwacker)?

Why not "refresh" my memory, hmmm??

Make sure you truly understood the topic, and we'll see who was "embarrassed".

~~~~~~~

Oh, and since this, you brought up, about the possiblity of lofting enough "stuff", using airplanes, to make any appreciable difference??

Was perusing a recent copy of "Aviation Week & Space Technology" magazine, and they had some interesting satellite photos of the volcanic ash cloud in Iceland, from back in March/April.

It occured to me that it was PERFECT example of what I am talking about, and why the "chemmies" (Like Cliff Carnicorm et al) are completely bonkers.

This is a video that's out on YouTube, from RussiaToday --- pretty much shows a similar image to waht I saw in AW&ST mag.

"Since the beginning of the eruption, we estimate that 250 million cubic metres (8.8 billion cubic feet) of tephra (ash and other fragmental material) has been produced," Icelandic geophysicist Magnus Tumi Gudmundsson told AFP.

Source.

NOW....think about that. Think about that amount of ash...and compare to the area of the Earth that was affected...effectively "covered".

Pretty minor percentage, huh?

I've read later stories, after analyzing the plume, and its effects...you can search, too.

Basically, consensus is that the volcano in Iceland, even as LARGE as it seems, to us --- that amount --- will have little to no lasting effects on our climate.

So, care to calculate how many airplanes would be needed to loft 250 million cubic meters (8.8 billion cubic feet) of material? AND, even that much to have little to no effect?

THIS is why the frenzied hand-wringing over so-called "chemtrails", and some alleged ongoing program, is nonsense.

We are technologically a long, long away from actually having the skills and ability to implement any such large-scale operation.

What the "chemtrail" hoax peddlers count on is, I beleive, known as a form of "confirmation bias".

You can read here about "confirmation bias".










[edit on 3 August 2010 by weedwhacker]

Thank you for the compliment! But as for you Weedwacker, I am presently stuck on a cell phone that allows No paragraph breaks, so please deal with it! The thread will be dug up for you promptly, tomorrow. It got better on the later pages as I recall. I likewise have no cut and paste ability or would deal with your nonsense, effectively, now. In the meantime, one question to occupy your time. What is your Official stance on geoengineering : How much have you studied the matter, what materials have you covered, and what is your assessment of the success of chemtrails as they are proposed? A short synopsis is fine; what are your ideas about the actual idea of creatung artificial cloud cover to combat global warming? Talk to you tomorrow.

[

Contrails disperse behind the plane. Chemtrails stay around for hours, spread out and soon enough clouds form and the sky is overcast. I mean, isn't that just a simple observation?

Says who? A chemtrail website tells you this, so you all just lap it up without question..

I will bite though, tell us why a contrail MUST disperse, and how it can not persist?

Should all clouds disperse right after forming, especially in well below freezing temps?



[edit on 4-8-2010 by firepilot]

reply to post by Northwarden


Savvy on the cellphone/BlackBerry thing. Not into that tech, so sorry, didn't consider that, as not familiar. Guess this means you can't view the videos/links, either? Now it makes sense....

What is your Official stance on geoengineering...

As has been pointed out, repeatedly, by not only me, but many others....the concept of Geoengineering IS a valid field of study. However, it is still in the theoritical and evaluation stages...and if any such activity has been atempted, likely only on a very small scale, as testing of practicality.

Further, there is not YET a consensus (and there will have to be an International agreement) of the neccessity.

...what are your ideas about the actual idea of creatung artificial cloud cover to combat global warming?

I've stated my personal thoughts on the subject.

I think it's far, far too early to "jump-the-gun" on this, and causiton should be the rule of the day.

It seems that MOST in the scientific community agree.

Still, the ongoing research IS logical, to be prepared, and have a fall-back strategy, even if only in theory, in the case fo a dire need to implement it, some day in future.

There are MANY instances, in other fields of study, and disciplines, where similar things occur...for example, I'd wager that deep in the bowels of many Western nations are various "war" plans, or strategies, to respond to just about every imagined international scenario, especially in today's volatile world --- of extant terrorism threats, and extremist ideologies.

But, back to the concept of "geo"-engineering.

There are many many more viable suggestions, from a feasibility standpoint, than lofting material by airplanes ---

---Rockets, which acheive a higher final altitude

---Specially designed ships on the ocean, that suck and pump sea water into the air

---Orbiting devices of some sort, in space (this one seems the least likely, due to costs, to me...)

Certainly, in future, it may come to pass, IF deemed to be neccessary, that many forms will be employed, to work in concert with each other.

BUT, it will certainly be overt, and well-publicized, if and when it begins in earnest....