over kill chemtrails (pics)

reply to post by NichirasuKenshin


If you want evidence previous threads and a little institution that i heard about a while back , Youtube i think they call it , has loads of so called evidence . Some for , some against but there is plenty there for you to peruse at your leisure , i was presumptious enough to think that you would go find said "evidence" without me holding your hand .
I wasnt trying to be compelling , i'm not an author . I was merely stating a factual observation i have made over a period of time . In 1986 i wasnt yet aware i was going to have to take photographs of what i was seeing as a teenager and to keep them for nearly 25 years to prove to you how compelling i should/could be .
Like me you have stayed next an international airport . You claim to have seen no changes and in the same paragraph mention an increase in air traffic . So their has been a change . If that change was insignificant in your mind over that 15 - 20yr period , would it then be fair to say their could be other things that you havnt noticed , regarding "contrail/chemtrails" ?

Its not a significant change that you would notice , not in the way you would notice if all the clouds suddenly turned green or something crazy like that , but its a change that i have noticed.

My tongue can lie but my eyes cant

reply to post by steve_oZ

Anyone who looks at this photo and doesn't see something wrong with it;

Do tell...

YOU tell us. But, I'll start ---

Only thing "wrong" with that picture would be the fact that the camera is pointed toward the Sun. BUT, actually, it gives it a bit of an "artsy" feel...some "creativeness" at work, there....

Also, some creative use of filters, too...again, for that particular "look".

Guess you aren't much into photography, huh??

reply to post by weedwhacker


Misunderstandings and Misconceptions

You got that right .When i told you i prefer to see something before i'm prepared to believe it i have a valid point . You can tell me all day that you have a black cat , but until i see that cat i would tend to believe that the odds of that cats existence are at best 50/50
I am the only person who knows what i can remember and the validity of these memories . Your "selective memory " response is , im guessing , an attempt at dry humour or something like that . "implanted suggestions" is another beauty , where did you dig that from . I'm the least suggestible person you could ever have the misfortune to meet .
Your misguided suggestion of seeking someone with knowledge of psychological matters is laughable . Try getting someone with that kind of experience to explain "projection" to you .

"you are mistaken" , "nothing to be ashamed of" , its not embarassing" all sounds like classic projection .

Originally posted by weedwhacker
reply to post by steve_oZ

 

Anyone who looks at this photo and doesn't see something wrong with it;

Do tell...

YOU tell us. But, I'll start ---

Only thing "wrong" with that picture would be the fact that the camera is pointed toward the Sun. BUT, actually, it gives it a bit of an "artsy" feel...some "creativeness" at work, there....

Also, some creative use of filters, too...again, for that particular "look".

Guess you aren't much into photography, huh??

ah well thank you, i do pride myself as taken quite beautiful pictures!

no filters in this pic! uploaded directly from my CELLULAR PHONE

Originally posted by steve_oZ

Anyone who looks at this photo and doesn't see something wrong with it; their eyes are firmly closed.

seriously look at that photo, its not a flight path so what is it!

Don't forget, there are no dedicated flight paths anymore according to the aviation "experts" here.

They spend a hell of alot of effort to tell us these things are normal and nothing to even talk about.

It bothers them to no end that people look into the sky and see something unnatural, that they try to make us believe is...

You guys are trying to deflect these trails so much it is now getting ridiculous, telling us in general terms that this is really just water vapor and nothing more.

I have a question, do you or do you not think these trails should be in our skies, are they cool...

and why are tests done from people i know living in the middle of nowhere that lately have these trails suddenly appearing and are being found full of poisons never before comprehended , including anthrax.

Originally posted by GrinchNoMore
Don't forget, there are no dedicated flight paths anymore according to the aviation "experts" here.

They spend a hell of alot of effort to tell us these things are normal and nothing to even talk about.

It bothers them to no end that people look into the sky and see something unnatural, that they try to make us believe is...

You guys are trying to deflect these trails so much it is now getting ridiculous, telling us in general terms that this is really just water vapor and nothing more.

I have a question, do you or do you not think these trails should be in our skies, are they cool...

and why are tests done from people i know living in the middle of nowhere that lately have these trails suddenly appearing and are being found full of poisons never before comprehended , including anthrax.

You will, of course, provide links to support this statement. Anthrax? You realize that anthrax is naturally occurring, and tends to be found exactly in the middle of nowhere.

Originally posted by fallinstar

Originally posted by steve_oZ

Anyone who looks at this photo and doesn't see something wrong with it; their eyes are firmly closed.

seriously look at that photo, its not a flight path so what is it!

Seven airplanes passing overhead in the same direction at various times? Sounds like the definition of a "flight path."

Seven airplanes passing overhead in the same direction at various times? Sounds like the definition of a "flight path."

oh well then i should be posting pics of this every day since you seem to shrug this off as a regular occurrence.

Originally posted by fallinstar

Originally posted by steve_oZ

Anyone who looks at this photo and doesn't see something wrong with it; their eyes are firmly closed.

seriously look at that photo, its not a flight path so what is it!

So what is it? ill tell yea what it is! its Nato Pilots following orders without remorse! and spreading crap into our atmosphere thats what it is!

reply to post by DCDAVECLARKE


And blocking the sunlight just before it sets!

Those evil, evil little men in their flying machines!

reply to post by Chadwickus


Yea dont need to remind me man but thanks anyway!

i do have to say the arguments on the contrails side is very good and i am leaning more towards them. but the fact that the government does have total control takes me back to the chemtrail point. Its there, we see it, but the evidence says its exhaust. well i guess to truly kno what it is we would need a hot air balloon to go up there and somehow test the air. any takers?

Originally posted by teapotbishop
reply to post by NichirasuKenshin

 

If you want evidence previous threads and a little institution that i heard about a while back , Youtube i think they call it , has loads of so called evidence .

Maybe that's the problem. Your standard of evidence is so low that simple youtube videos showing contrails with a "chemtrail" caption is proof enough for you that chemtrails exist. The first time I saw "chemtrail" pics on the net - about 11 years ago I was baffled and believed it on the spot. Then I started researching and with time came to the conclusion that despite the alarmist captions of youtube and the hyperbole of chemtrails-promoters there is nothing new in the sky. Working and having lived next to an airport made researching fairly easy, I know whom to ask and what to look for. The only thing that has changed in these 11 years is gradually increasing airtraffic, hence gradually increasing sightings of chemtrails.

Some for , some against but there is plenty there for you to peruse at your leisure , i was presumptious enough to think that you would go find said "evidence" without me holding your hand .

This is a discussion board. We're here to discuss things. This thread claims to present evidence of chemtrails. All I see is videos of contrails - I see no other evidence. Since we're on a discussion board I am just as free as you to post my opinion and observations - if you agree with them or like them or not.

I wasnt trying to be compelling , i'm not an author . I was merely stating a factual observation i have made over a period of time . In 1986 i wasnt yet aware i was going to have to take photographs of what i was seeing as a teenager and to keep them for nearly 25 years to prove to you how compelling i should/could be .

You guys can't even get your story straight. One guy says this started in the 60's, one guy says they're spraying the sky, the other guy says their putting stuff into the fuel. Others say it started 10 years ago. No you say 25. If you guys we're all noticing the same thing - the appearance of chemtrails - why is none of you seeing the same thing or presenting the same story?
If you all were noticing an objective change in the sky logic would demand that your stories check out. Yet every chemtrailer I ask has a different narrative. That's not convincing - it goes to strengthen my impression that it's mostly conjecture, not observation.

If the chemtrails story would be true your stories - at least the timelines of first noticing it etc. - would completely check out. Well, they don't.

Like me you have stayed next an international airport . You claim to have seen no changes and in the same paragraph mention an increase in air traffic . So their has been a change . If that change was insignificant in your mind over that 15 - 20yr period , would it then be fair to say their could be other things that you havnt noticed , regarding "contrail/chemtrails" ?

That's disingenious to say. And it's a straw-man. It has been repeatedly established in this thread that skeptics acknowledged that something changed: there was a severe increase in airtraffic ever since aviation began and therefore there has been a severe increase in the formation and hence in the obersvation of contrails. Seems to me that both increases correlate beautyfully, as the Island-Volcano has shown.

Its not a significant change that you would notice , not in the way you would notice if all the clouds suddenly turned green or something crazy like that , but its a change that i have noticed.

You should decide on that, though. Either it is noticeable to all by the naked eye (official chemtrail story) or it isn't. If the latter is the case then you are again deviating from chemtrail dogma - most chemtrailers I met online insist that it is easîly seen by the naked eye. If you say something different now I'd have to repeat my critique: If you guys are talking about the same phenomenon, why don't your stories check out?

My tongue can lie but my eyes cant

That's true. But your eyes can fool you. There's numerous examples. And then of course there's the mind, the trickiest part. If you haven't been consistently and systematically watching the sky for the last 20 years then it is rather strange to suddenly insist that something has changed. How often does a layman look up to the sky?
The people I know who believe in chemtrails share one trait: They never watched the sky beofre they saw a chemtrail video: After that, they saw chemtrails everywhere. I was that way at first. But when I researched the topic and saw pics, vids etc. from contrails back in the beggining of the century I was quite convinced. I was even more convinced when I had an expert explain to me just how much globalization added to airtraffic. The increase in the last 20 years is phenomenal, almost scary. One would expect to see tons of contrails all the time with this kind of air traffic volume.



I feel like I keep repeating myself. I'm not even up for a fight. I wish someone had a real argument that would convice me. As I said, debunkers minds are minds desperate to be convinced. But if "something in the sky has changed, I saw it, I know it" is all you guys got - that won't persuade me.

And I wait since 8 pages for the proof. One chemtrail picture and and one contrail - show me the difference. But you can't, this is why I am still waiting. Anything else is just....nothing.

And this Contrail with a brake in it:
Maybe the pilot just pulled the machine up or down for a second. Then the water condensed different or not while the wing flap had another position.

Why don't you use your brains guys? Last post here, it seems to be lost energy, posting arguments here.

Here you can see how a contrail (moisture) accrues on a f18:



Water steam, that's really all - get it, or ignore it.


[edit on 26-7-2010 by cushycrux]

Originally posted by One Moment
reply to post by Chadwickus

 

How is MY observation and MY opinion disinformation???

Wow! You truly have issues.

Say, why don't you stay off these threads and start your own '"They are merely contrails and you're all delusional to think otherwise' thread????

Pathetic!

For those who are wide awake these non-Contrails have been acknowledge.... somewhat. They (MSM) are calling them chaff, which is an anti-radar concoction which, the military is testing ! Which we know by now are half-baked truths when it becomes 'official'.

Pay no attention to those who stalk threads just to pollute them!

That was a rather stupid comment. Chaff has been around since world war two. Its nothing new. Its made out of glass fibre (or aluminium foil in the earlier systems) and you cant see it unless youre quite close to the aircraft. Its not dangerous, looks nothing like a contrails and has absolutely nothing to do with this argument what so ever.

Just thought I would highlight that particular bit of ignorance.

Originally posted by PsychoX42
reply to post by cushycrux

 

The fact that the "contrails" come from JET FUEL, probably means that there are chemicals in it.

Do you think your car spits out water vapor?

Jesus wept.

Some people sleep harder than others. I suggest another 8 hours for clarity of thought, take two pills...oops, you already did. They must have been the blue ones.

Foolish! IT IS FROM WATER!

Condensation from engine exhaust

The main products of hydrocarbon fuel combustion are carbon dioxide and water vapor. At high altitudes this water vapour emerges into a cold environment, and the local increase in water vapor can push the water content of the air past saturation point. The vapour then condenses into tiny water droplets and/or deposits into ice. These millions of tiny water droplets and/or ice crystals form the vapour trail or contrails. The vapor's need to condense accounts for the contrail forming some way behind the aircraft's engines. At high altitudes, supercooled water vapor requires a trigger to encourage deposition or condensation. The exhaust particles in the aircraft's exhaust act as this trigger, causing the trapped vapor to rapidly turn to ice crystals. Exhaust vapour trails or contrails usually occur above 8000 meters (26,000 feet), where the temperature is below -40°C (-40°F).[3]


en.wikipedia.org...

[edit on 26-7-2010 by cushycrux]

reply to post by fallinstar


This is odd....

You are fallinstar, right? From Tempe/Gilbert in Arizona?

Another member, Steve_oZ, posted a picture, and that's the one I thought we were discussing. It's the one that's been repeated at least three times, scroll up.

It shows normal contrails...highlighted somewhat because of the way the Sun is angled in the photo. As I said, rather artsy looking.

I realize the first pics in the OP were yours...and they are normal contrails, BTW.

OK, back to the "artsy" photo. As has been pointed out ad nauseum, more than one airplne will fly along a particular Jet Airway quite often.

And, catch on to this very carefully: They can all be going in the same direction, and be separated by a mere 1,000 to 2,000 feet! Even directly above/beneath one another --- it occurs.

SO...American 123 is at 29,000 feet. United 321 is at 31,000 feet, and Continental 345 is at 33,000 and Lufthansa 45 is at 35,000 and Southwest 987 is at 37,000 and Delta 21 is at 39,000 feet. (These altitudes are all appropriate for EASTBOUND travel)

ALL on the same Jet Airway at the same approaximate time. It CAN happen. Usually, there is at least a few minutes' gap, because of winds, different airspeeds, etc.

ALSO, on the same Airway, other airplanes can be going in the opposite direction!! Going Westbound, they will be at EVEN altitudes.

Prior to the year 2000, the vertical separation requirement for traffic above FL290 (29,000 feet) was 2,000 feet. This is changed, now, due to the 'RVSM' standards (you can google that). Better, more accurate altimeters and static systems, with computer enhancements allow for closer standards, and THUS, more traffic frequency, and congestion.

ONE MORE THING....each Airway has an imaginary "centerline", of course. If you drew it on a paper map, drawing a lline between fixes (waypoints) then that defines a centerline.

Airplane navigation systems are NOT accurate down to the "inch" (even with GPS) when used for en-route navigation. Variations can exist, between each individual airplane, and where its system "thinks" it is.

THAT is one reason why the lines are parallel, but not exactly lined up, one over the other.

ALSO, routes are referenced to the ground, of course. The air, and winds, don't care about the ground. Contrails formed in the air will drift with the prevailing winds....so those formed at different altitudes, and times, will tend to move across the ground after being made, drifitng with the winds...

"The answer, my friends, is blowin' in the wind...the answer is blowin' in the wind...."

So if i was to go a long with you guys it seems modern Jets are more polluting now than in the past, is that it! well it certainly looks that way! There's two going over my house now spewing out a long horrible spread out chemtrails , an i can see the jets with out binoculars so they'r not that high, makes me sick just the thought of them f£%Kin& up the very air that we all need to survive!