Out of Place Artifacts and other things: Update and Review 2010!

reply to post by GallopingFish


You may have missed it, but nothing you listed produces electricity. You also may have missed that the water canals were only 4-6 feet deep, and no more water than the average Olympic swimming pool or something.

Also, there's a crystal cave under it. Surprising you forgot that. But nope, they don't produce electricity.

Maybe if you are so faithful, you could build a scale of this?

Also, how could it be an insulator when the top and bottom did not have it? The base touched the earth and the top was touching gold. WHY do you insulate the non metal parts but forget to insulate the top parts?


Yes, you are kicking a dead horse. The dead horse of your logic.

For all intensive purposes, the pyramid is a big pile of rocks. Because that's what tombs are made for. For all intensive purposes, the engineering of the Colosseum, Great Wall, Hagia Sophia, and so much more all outweigh the pyramid. The engineering required for the pyramids do not even compare to the most primitive Greek temples. They don't even compare to the far more impressive temple complexes of Egypt.

Take a look. Such more engineering involved. Vast scaling of the human body to create perfections in ratio and construction.

Know why the Egyptians stopped building pyramids? after just 200 years of building them? The same reason Americans stopped building Victorian nonsense. The same reason the Muslims stopped building simple mosques:

IT WAS TOO PRIMITIVE AND SIMPLE


So come and take a look at the real glory of the Egyptian nation. Their true glorious constructions and engineering projects. Things that rival even that of the Romans and the Greeks.


LOL, take a look. Even the Egyptians realized how primitive and inefficient pyramids were. Look here. The original design called for a pyramid, but instead they just chose a mountain that looked like one







And look at these marvels.












See, you are being simple. Even the Egyptians in their day would agree. There is no reason to marvel over the most primitive creations of an advanced culture. There is no reason to marvel at the bi-plane when there is an f16 to marvel at. You can be respectful, but understand how silly it looks to a more educated person when people like yourself take a rock and treat is like a battery.


Now I understand how much like an elitist I sound like right now. But honestly, you are being ignorant right now.

[edit on 12-6-2010 by Gorman91]

[edit on 12-6-2010 by Gorman91]

A crane not being able to lift things does not mean they can't be moved. Entire buildings, weighing tens of millions of pounds, have been moved.

For future reference, if you really want a good debate on any one of these objects, post about one at a time. Otherwise any discussion is going to be completely scattershot.

reply to post by coredrill


Okay, you got my interest with the 4 craddles, turning the stone into a cylinder!

Can if be shown/proven they did this activity or is it a concept of modern man to explain how it was done?

How would they kepe the roller/craddles on?

Also, it may make it easier to move but I don't think the illistration does the thinking mind justice by showing just two guys pulling it.

Im intrigued. Star

reply to post by anon72


LoL. You'd have to ask me.

It's actually an interesting mystery of the ancient world.

Most any ancient culture have a good number of similarities. One thing is that many of them, very early on, invented a module to construct things with. Weather this be a module to build with, or a module to make tools to build with, does not matter. The fact is that mostly all of them had some form of module or another.

I'll get some more of the cradle. In addition, some other ones by other cultures too.

Egyptian construction module (your cradle, lol)

The builders of the great pyramids used a variety of tools, knotted cords for measuring, sleds and rocker devices for moving large stone blocks. (Figures 1.141 – 1.145) In order to quarry the Tura limestone they cut channels into the rock using balls of dolerite, an extremely hard igneous rock that they pounded into the limestone with large wooden mallets. Then they used levers to loosen the stone from its base. The workers had no pulleys or wheels to move the stone. Yet the blocks weighed up to 70 tons each. It is likely that they moved these stones by pushing and pulling them along on sleds over wood rollers. (Figure 1.146) This was labor intensive work but time and manpower were no problem. During the annual flooding period, labor was plentiful because the fields were flooded and could not be farmed. Also, the flooding was an advantage in transporting the stone blocks. Most of the limestone for building the great pyramids was quarried on the west side of the Nile in the immediate vicinity of the pyramids. The casing stones, however, were of a higher quality limestone, known as Tura limestone, which was plentiful on the east side of the Nile. This stone could be given a high polish with dolerite and abrasive powder so that its whiteness showed brilliantly in the sunlight. When quarried, the Tura limestone was loaded on barges to be ferried to the construction site on the other side. When the river flooded, it was closer to both the quarrying and construction sites and floating the stones on the river on barges was a much easier way to move the stone blocks than pulling and pushing them on rollers. Stone loses one third of its weight to buoyancy. Most of this Tura limestone casing on the great pyramids was stripped beginning in the 10th century AD to provide stone for the most important mosques in Cairo.

Some similar tools in their creative writings.







GREEK MODULES

The Greeks also used modules in their things.

Earliest examples: "modern" architecture in ancient Minoan society. This is older than Greece and Rome. Just about the age of the pyramids.

See why I said we're only 100-200 years ahead of them in most things?







Ancient temples: just like legos!


























Chinese Module Construction

Older than dirt, but still mighty cool!

The Tou-Kung bracket. It was essentially a lego system of support. You just connect the modules as needed for support. This structure enabled the world's earliest skyscrapers: pagodas. All from 200 BC!




















INDEED. It is a mystery of the ancient world. But because it is universal, it is simply human. Not anything special, other than BEING human. Module construction is efficient, fast, and easy.

The pyramids did not have this type of construction much. Other than being a brick itself. Egyptians had it to build stuff with, and later on, built into their temples.

[edit on 12-6-2010 by Gorman91]

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by Byrd

 

Humans as they are today are actually 50,000 years old. The human form, as it is today, is 200,000 years old. Confused?

Not really, but the more recent discoveries are really pushing the boundaries. It was only a decade or so ago that they thought h. sapiens was no more than 50,000 years old. Just read a Science article that says around 190,000 years: www.sciencedaily.com...

The human brain and behavior, as it is today, evolved 50,000 years ago. Body came before brain.

I'd suggest it was the other way around, but have no hard data to support that... and a busy night of work planned so I'm not going to look it up (lazy me!!!)

As I said, I was dumb. A shoe is likely to have been made when those first humans left Africa 50,000 years ago. Though who knows if they will ever find them. All I know is it would have been hard to travel the world without shoes.

It would be. I did look up the "out of Africa" theory because 50,000 years seemed to recent... it says 70,000 years but surely that's for h. sapiens sapiens.
en.wikipedia.org...

It does kind of "mess" with some recent (not well confirmed) North American sites. We need more data, frankly.

I hope you'll excuse this 'hit and run' post. Next week is a really stressful work week and I'll probably be too tired to hop on here, but I'm interested in timelines of hominids and some of the odd findings like the Topper site. I'm familiar (in a general way) with all the hominid timelines but can't say I'm any great expert at them.

reply to post by Byrd


Not a problem.

But it is actually new science.

The human species is 50,000 years old. It's called "behavior modernity"

Basically, behavior modernity is the earliest common ancestor that acted like a human. This person is from 50,000 years ago.

There are theories that state that human left 100,000 years ago, and then behavior modernity evolved separately globally, but this is not likely due to the fact that the ice age was happening.

Behavior modernity occurred 50,000 years ago. These humans either bred out the others or killed them off, or simply out competed them.

en.wikipedia.org...

reply to post by Gorman91


It appears you are/were the one to ask.

Thank you for that info and everything else you posted.

My mind is, simply, Blown Away from what I learned from you and others. You won't get this info on the History Channel!!!

And Byrd also. See, you old schoolers were piviotal in getting info out and/or sharing about stuff many of havne't heard of before or it was limited info etc. Thank you for jumping in the discussions-I know it may be a repeat for many but.... we are all here to learn. Thank you.

I have to agree. I've looked into these ancient megalithic structures as well and found no solid proof linking such technologies to such culture. Even the Great Pyramid of Egypt cannot accurately be linked to the Pharaoh Khufu. The Egyptians have no record of the construction. Egyptologists and archaeologists attribute these monuments to the 4th dynasty of Egypt due to the recordings of Heroditus. The pyramids were long since built prior to his encounters with Egyptians, thus his story could be thought to be as accurate as that of Plato's "Timeaus and Critias" (Atlantis). All the other pyramids (supposedly built before and after) were decorated with hieroglyphics claiming in dedication to whom and how they were built. The three pyramids on the Giza plateau are strikingly baron; no hieroglyphics, no decorations, no treasures for the pharaohs to take to the afterlife and no bodily remains. Each of the other pyramids: the Bent Pyramid, Red Pyramid, Step Pyramid, etc. were all built using blocks no bigger then 2 tons. The largest blocks in Giza are over 40 tons and have withstood the test of time. Even the Great Sphinx (Also located within the Giza Necropolis) shows geological evidence predating the structure to at least 5,000 years. We're led to believe that these structures were created using simple pulleys with rope and stone tools. The Japanese (one of the most proud cultures of our time) were once funded to build a replica of the Great Pyramid 1/6 in size. Using only the most skilled masons and master builders they failed.

In South America, there could be found numerous structures that defy logic. In Peru and Bolivia we have Sacsayhuamen, Ollantaytambo and Machu Picchu, Tiahuanaco and Puma Punku; each built in an area of great elevation, using massive stones that were quarried miles away. There would have been no way possible, no matter how great the labor force, to have pulled stones hundreds of miles into the mountains and cut to such precision that not even a piece of paper or dental floss could fit between the cracks. Many of these structures are just said to have been built by the ancestors of the closest tribe. When Spanish conquistadors destroyed all the artifacts the tribes had barely developed a writing system. To build these structures they need careful planning, which could not be done without written language. In Ecuador many artifacts have been found so out of place it should not be attributed to the tribes holding them. The Incas presented a stone tablet to a priest in 1800's, which was decorated with unique patterns and an elephant atop of pyramid. No elephants have been known to exist in South America. The closest relative would be the remains of a wholly mammoth found in Central America dated 20,000 years old. Stone boulders with drawings of maps and islands that don't exist today have also been found.

Underwater structures off the coast of Cuba, Japan and Crete have been found. Some of these could only be dated by going back to a time when the ocean levels were much more shallow. It wouldn't be until 12,000 years ago. It's practically forbidden for archaeologists to predate something before 4,500 BC. Finding stone tools with wooden handles under granite stone that is well over 10,000 years should be proof, but it's been done and many have lost their job for suggesting such a notion. Finding a human footprint as old as dinosaurs' is a career killing, so they must come up with some other explanation whether it's logical or not.

In other areas of the world we find massive structures such as Easter Island and Stonehenge, we use contemporary methods to date these places. Maybe history does need to be edited: we can keep everything before 1000 BC, around the time writing system came about. But our "historians" need to admit what errors they have and the things they don't know. If there was an antidiluvian civilization we should admit what we do know about it and search for answers instead of inaccurate dating.

reply to post by Dubbs


Everything you said about the Egyptian pyramids is wrong. I have no reason to believe anything else you said is true.


The ENTIRE Egyptian civilization was based on the axis of North and South. What on Earth are you talking about no cultural connection? Mostly the entire Egyptian civilization revolves around the golden ratio, and that is found in the pyramids and everything else.

No decorations? Did you miss the golden tip and glowing limestone? Or the mortuary temple? or the Valley temple?

Good God. No wonder you haven't seen any connection. You haven't seen anything!

Gorman91, great posts. This has been a really interesting thread that actually kept my interest through every post. You, Coredrill, Byrd, whatever have all really added some good info and made the thread worth sticking it out through. I just want to please ask you if you could stop...

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by GallopingFish

 

For all intensive purposes,

...that. It is much like enjoying a smooth quiet drive down a lovely avenue only to keep hitting hidden speed bumps. You seem intelligent and well informed which is why it stands out so. Just offering a bit of helpful advice that I am sure is unwanted. Anyway, thanks for all the information.

reply to post by K J Gunderson


Thank you English Teacher.

No I agree. It was what killed me back in school. Always. Bad transition words. lol.

I'll try my best to stop.

Pretty much my info comes from the course I just took that is simply phenomenal. The course is written by the guy who actually went to these places and researched it. Wonderful experience. I looked at these people as nothing before. Now I view them as my equals, seeking the same ends in their art and literature and sciences. That is why I state we are only 100-200 years ahead of them. Because electricity and all its relations that we created for the last century are pretty much the only thing we have on them.

I recall a report I wrote some time ago on Rome and Water. What if they discovered its power. What if they found electricity. Oh what a world we would live in today.

reply to post by Gorman91


Honestly I meant no offense. Just the opposite. If you sounded like a moron, had nothing to offer, just wanted to insist something crazy for no reason, or were pushing bunk then it sure would not have bothered me. I find these topics really interesting and this was the first thread in a long time that really kept me reading and reading without flipping around. You and one other poster were offering up such interesting and verifiable info that I was finding your posts quite valuable. That is the only reason I that kept sticking out. Not as much the first 4 times lol, but you kept up with it.

Bottom line, great thread and thanks for adding some real information to it. Ancient mysterious are great but I do not feel that any reality ever offered diminishes that in anyway. Humans using ingenuity, power, and time to accomplish amazing things is just as interesting to me as the idea of a 50,000 year old spark plug or whatever it was. Sorry for how it sounded but I really meant that your posts were the most interesting and informative ones and I hated that the only person detracting from that was you. Sorry. Thanks for all your posts just the same.

On the electricity thing...I have often thought that too, or at least rather I have wondered if maybe it had not been discovered just not quite understood a few times. I have to believe the a man or two managed to utilize a found fire more than once before the idea of harnessing it came up and even then I find it hard to believe that the first person to do it was so successful that fire was just a given after that. Just me speculating on nothing really but I can easily imagine them maybe getting the right materials together to create and even observe electricity but not really understand how it could be applied. Maybe I just like to think they were thiiiiiiiiiiiiis close a few times before we got it all figured out.

It is nice to imagine what the world would be like today if just a few things like that came up when it almost seems like they actually should have.

[edit on 13-6-2010 by K J Gunderson]

reply to post by coredrill


Thanks! I did some searching online and couldn;t really find anything other than the same source. I just found it interesting and I had never heard of it before. I have been looking at that site and they should really remove some of their articles, esp the ones proven to be a hoax.

Thanks.

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by Byrd

 

Not a problem.

But it is actually new science.

The human species is 50,000 years old. It's called "behavior modernity"

Basically, behavior modernity is the earliest common ancestor that acted like a human. This person is from 50,000 years ago.

en.wikipedia.org...

Many thanks for the link! I haven't kept up with behavioral sciences... there's just so much research being published these days. I really should do some reading in that field.

These are called flesh tunnels/ear tunnels. and are not put in the ears,because they are actually a peircing



I find these thing suspicious. as you can buy almost indentical ones online anywhere.

They are very popular nowdays.

look how similar this modern glass tunnel is to the "Aztec" ones

(the extra ring is rubber, you can remove that, scource: www.bodyjewelleryshop.com...)

and are worn a bit like this:



I would be very interested to know where these aztec, ear plugs were found. and who by. also where are they being kept? I see them on numerous websites, but they never link back to a musuem or anything.

I put something about the Underwater Cities section of the source webpage.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/937065135335.jpg[/atsimg]

Did anyone check it out. Amzaing. Not unbeleiveable, just wow. I was hoping an ATS member may have some person knowledge of these sites and maybe dove to them.

I think that is something I would consider for a vacation trip-diving around ancient ruins.

Anyway, any input-other than what is on those pages in in source link?

[edit on 6/13/2010 by anon72]

reply to post by anon72


Could you be more specific?
Which page of the source page. i am looking all over s8int.com.

Are you talking about the Yonaguni structures ??

[edit on 13/6/10 by coredrill]

[edit on 13/6/10 by coredrill]

The Yonaguni "Monument" (why the hell do they call it a Monument???:puz
is a natural geological feature.

Natural formation
Some of those who have studied the formation, such as geologist Robert Schoch of Boston University, state that it is most likely a natural formation. Schoch observes that the sandstones that make up the Yonaguni formation "contain numerous well-defined, parallel bedding planes along which the layers easily separate. The rocks of this group are also criss-crossed by numerous sets of parallel and vertical (relative to the horizontal bedding planes of the rocks) joints and fractures. Yonaguni lies in an earthquake-prone region; such earthquakes tend to fracture the rocks in a regular manner."[5][15] He also observes that on the northeast coast of Yonaguni there are regular formations similar to those seen at the Monument.[5][16] Schoch also believes that the "drawings" identified by Kimura are natural scratches on the rocks.[15] This is also the view of John Anthony West.[3] Other examples of natural formations with flat faces and sharp straight edges are the basalt columns of the Giant's Causeway and the natural staircase formation on Old Rag Mountain.[17]

Source- Wikipedia.org

Most of the people advocating that the Yonaguni "Monument' is man made also follow other Psuedo stuff like "Pyramids are older than thought" etc etc.
If they object to what Robert Scoch and John Anthony west have stated, the advocates are the worst of the breed...i would come and whack them on their head.
They believe what Scoch says on the Pyramids but disbelieve what Socch says on the Yonaguni "Monument"

eh, I'm not going to say I know for sure. I do know that civilization must be older than Sumeria. These neolithic villages look indifferent to work camps and labor divisions for civilizations.

www.limassollink.com...

reply to post by coredrill


It's on the left hand side, with the other topics.

About the 4 or 5th down