Reports: Israeli ships attack aid flotilla

Yitro, you copying and pasting to every thread the same exact thing?

B/c I saw that same post on another thread that's been closed.

The footage that changed my attitude towards Israel was when I saw Israeli forces mowing down an ancient olive grove in Gaza, trees 1000 years old - and one of the only intrinsic food supplies the people imprisoned in Gaza have.

that just did it for me. Before that I could have been about as happy watching both sides just destroy each other without looking any deeper, but that one act...That struck me as being beyond despicable.

reply to post by curioustype


You're correct

And not only are night goggles, vests and gas masks legal --- they were also well justified

considering that israel, according to news reports, DID use gas on their victims

DID use bullets

and DID monster and threaten the flotilla in the night


Hope my post didn't confuse you. The fact that israel was rummaging through the aid ships at the same time they'd imprisoned the survivors and at the same time as their dead victims were still lying in the morgue, makes me sick with fury

Originally posted by Dock9

Originally posted by DangerDeath
reply to post by contemplate777

 

Computer generated text...

Second wave...

These bots are pasting same texts on every thread.

I know

they're an online laughing stock


Really reflect well on israel, don't they

Actually, I think these are bots, in best case amateurs.
Perhaps this is what Israeli children get to do as their homework to help survival of their criminal state?

Originally posted by Yitro
Israel was within it's rights per international law.

According to the San Remo Manual that governs international humanitarian law, it is permissible under rule 67(a) to attack neutral vessels on the high seas when the vessels “are believed on reasonable grounds to be carrying contraband or breaching a blockade, and after prior warning they ... intentionally and clearly refuse to stop, or ...intentionally and clearly resist visit, search or capture.”

San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea 1994

Prepared by International Lawyers and Naval Experts. Convened by the International Institute of Humanitarian Law. Adopted in June 1994.

www.icrc.org...

FAIL

The blockade has not been deemed legal under international law.

And even according to Oslo.

Gaza-Jerico of 1994, Agreement annex 1, Sec 1.b paragraph 4

As part of Israel's responsibilities for safety and security within the three Maritime Activity Zones, Israel Navy vessels may sail throughout these zones, as necessary and without limitations, and may take any measures necessary against vessels ...suspected of being used for terrorist activities or for smuggling arms, ammunition, drugs, goods, or for any other illegal activity. The Palestinian Police will be notified of such actions, and the ensuing procedures will be coordinated through the Maritime Coordination and Cooperation Center.

www.mfa.gov.il...

So, there you have it. One by international law, the other per Israel and PA agreement. Israel was and is within it's right.

FAIL

The flotilla was attacked well within international waters. The above agreement only governs Israeli / Palestinian controlled sea lanes.

[edit on 6/1/2010 by clay2 baraka]

reply to post by DangerDeath


Oh, we can't be sure they're backwards children, despite their appearing so

They consider themselves an 'online army' apparently

They're very serious about their 'work' for the 'cause'

They do nasty online things to those who call them out

I've had death threats before

Their lives are a flurry of emails passing back and forth at the speed of light.

They'll target an individual in a forum and gang up, giggling like monkeys

cowardly, pimply little losers, most of them, based on personal experience

I think it's genetic, sob. I send little prayers for them

Israel to free Gaza flotilla detainees: sources

Israel decided on Tuesday to free hundreds of foreign activists detained aboard a Turkish-backed aid flotilla to Gaza, including some it had threatened to put on trial, two political sources said.

The sources said cabinet ministers decided amid rising world protests against Israel's raid of the flotilla on Monday in which nine people died, that some 680 activists seized on the boats would be released.

www.reuters.com...

WHAT? They are going to release all those hundreds of jihadists? Unbelievable!

"rising world protests" "nine people died" tsk tsk tsk

reply to post by contemplate777


I think everyone here sees through this kind of spin?

The current crisis and it's background have been long followed and analyzed here on ATS, under other threads, and we have all been watching as Israel's hard-right government have serially undermined and rebutted efforts from all over the world, including the recent embarrassing Head of State meetings (?) with the USA, and scenes from the UN as Isreal stormed out of the UN Nuclear Proliferation Treaty meetings like a spoiled toddler who had been told they could no longer bully the other children at Kindergarden...and chooses to ignore serially UN resolutions, and including official acknowledgment and inspection of their own, well disclosed now, nuclear facilities and weapons...

Really, like many, I tend towards impartiality, but doesn't Israel really seem to need to seek help in terms of how to win and keep friends, if she is to find a meaningful place amongst the rest of humanity?

Originally posted by Dock9
reply to post by DangerDeath

 

Oh, we can't be sure they're backwards children, despite their appearing so

They consider themselves an 'online army' apparently

They're very serious about their 'work' for the 'cause'

They do nasty online things to those who call them out

I've had death threats before

Their lives are a flurry of emails passing back and forth at the speed of light.

They'll target an individual in a forum and gang up, giggling like monkeys

cowardly, pimply little losers, most of them, based on personal experience

I think it's genetic, sob. I send little prayers for them

This is not genetic. This is social conditioning.

Feeling of duty - slave mentality (conditioning).

reply to post by DangerDeath


Too little, too late

The deeds are done

And they are added to Cast Lead and all the other atrocities


They shot at people waving white flags of surrender to illegal butchers who believe it their right to kill on a whim and then lie about it

Nine dead. At least

And hundreds of children in Gaza are permanently maimed, crippled, orphaned, traumatised, suffering PTSD and they're under age five

Hundreds more children lie buried under the ruins of Gaza, their bodies blackened like coal from illegal, inhumane israeli weapons

while in pride of place is a poster showing a weeping Israeli soldier weeping and swooning in the arms of others like him because he got a splinter


Too damn little, too damn late, israel

Originally posted by Yitro
Israel was within it's rights per international law.

According to the San Remo Manual that governs international humanitarian law, it is permissible under rule 67(a) to attack neutral vessels on the high seas when the vessels “are believed on reasonable grounds to be carrying contraband or breaching a blockade, and after prior warning they ... intentionally and clearly refuse to stop, or ...intentionally and clearly resist visit, search or capture.”

San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea 1994

Prepared by International Lawyers and Naval Experts. Convened by the International Institute of Humanitarian Law. Adopted in June 1994.

www.icrc.org...


And even according to Oslo.

Gaza-Jerico of 1994, Agreement annex 1, Sec 1.b paragraph 4

As part of Israel's responsibilities for safety and security within the three Maritime Activity Zones, Israel Navy vessels may sail throughout these zones, as necessary and without limitations, and may take any measures necessary against vessels ...suspected of being used for terrorist activities or for smuggling arms, ammunition, drugs, goods, or for any other illegal activity. The Palestinian Police will be notified of such actions, and the ensuing procedures will be coordinated through the Maritime Coordination and Cooperation Center.

www.mfa.gov.il...

So, there you have it. One by international law, the other per Israel and PA agreement. Israel was and is within it's right.

Wrong, Israel was in violation of International Law as it claims not to be occupying Gaza.

To Blockade a nation legally you must declare yourself an occupying force of said nation, and Isreal refuses to acknowledge it is occupying Gaza.

So Israel is in violation on that front.

Further Hamas is not the Palestinian Authority, the agreement signed by the Palestinian Authority has already been violated dozens of times over by Israel, so since the current government of Hamas is not party to the agreement and Israel has never itself honored the agreement, the agreement itself is unenforcable by law.

Further the only 'contraband' on the manifest is cement, which has many applications and uses besides building bunkers.

It is building bunkers that Israel will not allow cement to be imported into Gaza though obviously cement is also used to rebuilt smashed infrastructure of Israel's many illegal military incursions and atttacks on Gaza.

The Law is not a selective thing, it works through precise mechanisms, and while Israel likes to selectively use things to it's advantage, breaking and enforcing laws as it suits Israel, the truth is that this was a brazen act of Piracy on the High Seas, that violated every law you have quoted for the reasons listed above.

Maybe if some of the Israeli Internet Defense Forces would actually read the threads they come to armed with the latest propaganda release they would know what they are trying to post has already been debunked.

WOW, I don't know this dudes name on the Dylan Ratigan show, but they have Elliot Spitzer running the show today. He just had 2 different people spouting how Israeli was in the right, since it's a legitimate blockade and all. The guy who came on to criticize Israel was "perfect" in his response. He called Elliot Spitzer out when Elliot tried to interrupt him. The guest was all "You just had people spouting Pro-Israeli propaganda for ten minutes and I intend to have my say".

The bit that really pisses me off is they are asking this "Ruth" lady about International Law and shes claiming that lawfully they had that right....She even tried to say that the blockade is recognized around the the world. That line right there REALLY pissed me off as we know Israel has NOT owned up to being the "occupying force" in Gaza. They also keep talking about Egypt blockading Gaza but didn't I just read that Egypt recently lifted the closing of that land-border?

[edit on 6/1/10 by ElijahWan]

reply to post by DangerDeath


Slave conditioning Programming Duty ?

Then how come we don't behave as they do ?

We're the victims in this game. So how come we know how to behave like human beings ?

How come we can tell right from wrong, justice from injustice ?

How come the people on the aid flotilla were prepared to risk their lives to take aid to cripples and the starving ?

How come the online troops didn't do that for the people their heroes had victimised and systematically tried to destroy ?

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Damn right


You tell them

They won't llisten when I tell them

Give it to them with a man's voice and they might be more receptive than they have been towards me


Or maybe they're not here to listen, but to propagandise and run ?

Originally posted by Dock9
reply to post by DangerDeath

 

Slave conditioning Programming Duty ?

Then how come we don't behave as they do ?

We're the victims in this game. So how come we know how to behave like human beings ?

How come we can tell right from wrong, justice from injustice ?

How come the people on the aid flotilla were prepared to risk their lives to take aid to cripples and the starving ?

How come the online troops didn't do that for the people their heroes had victimised and systematically tried to destroy ?

You are not a slave. People from flotilla not slaves. That's why they were killed.

Conditioning of slaves is to live at all cost - they'll do anything to survive.
That's the philosophy behind Israel. It is total slavery conditioning. Just like Nazism. Zionists are perfect Aryans, don't you see?

They are practicing "krypteia". Here's the link: en.wikipedia.org...

Young Spartan men who had completed their training at the agoge with such success that they were marked out as potential future leaders would be given the opportunity to test their skills and prove themselves worthy of the Spartan military tradition through participation in the krypteia.

Every autumn, according to Plutarch (Life of Lycurgus, 28, 3–7), the Spartan ephors (classical Greek Ἔφοροι) would pro forma declare war on the helot population so that any Spartan citizen could kill a helot without fear of blood guilt. Unarmed, the kryptes were sent out into the countryside with the instructions to kill any helot they encountered at night and to take any food they needed. This could be used to remove any helots considered troublesome and provide the young men with a manhood test and experience of their first kill. Such brutal oppression of the helots permitted the Spartans to control the agrarian population and devote themselves to military practice. It may also have contributed to the Spartans' reputation for stealth.

The whole thing with conditioning goes back thousands of years. But, they don't teach that in schools, so people normally don't know what is really going on. They sense there is a "conspiracy" but don't know where to point their finger.

Here's the first hand testimony:

Norman Paech, a former member of Germany's Left Party, was aboard the Mavi Marmara, the largest of the six ships in the convoy.

Speaking at a news conference in Berlin, he said the ship was surrounded by small Israeli assault boats on Monday morning at about 0430 local time.

"Moments later, we heard detonations and then soldiers from helicopters above us dropped down on board.

"The soldiers were all masked, carrying big guns and were extremely brutal."

Mr Paech said he only saw three activists resisting.

"They had no knives, no axes, only sticks that they used to defend themselves," he told reporters.

But he said he could "not rule out" that others used weapons somewhere else on the boat.

First shooting, then boarding, then brutality...

news.bbc.co.uk...

More (same)

Turkish activist Nilufer Cetin told reporters she hid with her baby in the bathroom of her cabin aboard the Mavi Marmara.

"When the Mavi Marmara continued on its course, the harassment [from Israeli ships] turned into an attack," she said.

"They used smoke bombs followed by gas canisters. They started to descend onto the ship with helicopters.

"It [the violence] was extremely bad and brutal. The ship turned into a lake of blood.

news.bbc.co.uk...

It doesn't matter if the flotilla had weapons or not, Isreal has no jurisdiction in international waters and has no right to attack them untill they reach their territorial waters. By international maritime law this was an act of piracy. A military attack on civilians, especially in international waters, is absolutely unacceptable. Turkey has every right to escort aid ships up untill they reach the limit of Israel's territorial water boundary.

[edit on 1-6-2010 by bobnpn]

reply to post by DangerDeath


Yes, there is first hand testimony , but there is no

First shooting then boarding

He does not say that Israelis started to shoot before they boarded. You do.

ok so they are unloading the aid form the ships and sending it to gaza... they are releasing all the so called jihadists... wtf did they attack and kill 19 people again?