Freemason Knights Templar meeting here in Italy 2 days ago, changed my life...

reply to post by samhouston1886


I also remeber Deep Throat, who was in fact a high ranking agent of the FBI who helped two Washington Post Reporters bring down Nixon.

He made them promise to keep his identidy secret the rest of his natural life. It was not revealed who he was in fact until he died a natural death.

When you consider he was that frightened as a high ranking FBI agent for his safety and that of his family, it says a lot.

Now additionally Deep Throat did not reveal much to Woodward and Burnstein, instead he told them where to look, when they were hot, when they were cold.

That should tell you something too.

Bringing down a local political or Mafia boss is dangerous. Bringing down a national political or corporate boss is more dangerous. Bringing down a President of the United States, no one ever forgets these things, and that is far more dangerous still. Bringing down the Shadow Government that rules the world...

No offense but if Vincent wanted to get things out there he would be putting it out a piece at a time, secretly to someone like Woodward and Burnstein who are highly visible and highly protected and let them be the heavies. They also have the budget and knowhow to debunk and find credible facts, in real world, real time, real significant ways.

How would you pursue what Vinny might reveal? Through Google?

So in essence you asking him to put it all out there, and jeapordize himself for people, who a. are not inclined to believe him in the first place b. have a vested interest in dismissing it and proving it false to themselves using poor methodology and limited resources, and c. telling it to people in an environment that can't do one thing to help him or protect him, in d. an environment where people are also present who will leave no stone unturned to discredit him, and e. no one has the power to help or protect him.

Think about what you are really asking, just a little harder, please!

Vincent is more a guy, who has had a traumatic real life event change his perspective on the world and reality. He is working through that right now, trying to internalize it all, trying to figure out what it means to him and Vincent, and just bouncing some things off of us, for the sake of his own sanity as he adjusts to his new reality.

I think we ought to respect that Vincent knows what's best for Vincent at this point, and just let Vincent share what he feels comfortable in sharing.

Maybe Vincent is wrong about some of the things he may have witnessed, or maybe he is dead on the money.

Maybe, though highly unlikely its an elaborate hoax, though its missing the classic hoax ellements at this point.

I can tell you this though, if Vincent has discovered something that is truly reality altering for him, the person who most wants it to be wrong at this stage is Vincent himself.

Vincent would likely prefer to just wake up prior to last weekend and have not found out any of these things, if they are that earth shaking.

Post traumatic stress syndrome is real, so are some conspiracies, and so is the internalizing process of adjusting to a new reality and perspectives.

Another thing to point out, is Vincent sure has not been milking this situation for attention!

Lets be nice to Vincent and maybe, just maybe Vincent will be nice to us!

Thanks my friend.



[edit on 24/4/10 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]

reply to post by Dock9


Freemasonry has been free about their members for awhile now, as well as what degrees they've worked and where.
Any person I've spoken to has been proud tell me honestly, same as I'd be proud to talk about what rank I've achieved in karate.

What is a secret, are the modes of recognition, and he ritual itself.
A Freemason cannot personally disclose it, but they can recommend you check the books published on them, like Duncan's.

Personally, despite not being a Mason myself, I've enjoyed reading recommended books from Masonic libraries.
Some of it's pretty interesting.

Best way I can explain the "truth", I would think, is that the philosophical truth they are referring to is like when you look through a kaleidoscope, or one of those art structures that you have to stand in just the right place to really get wat's trying to be conveyed.

Masonry offers itself as one path towards this truth, there are many., and each person has their own.

[edit on 24-4-2010 by RuneSpider]

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


You did not answer my question. How would it affect your opinion of him if he were lying about his Masonic affiliation?

reply to post by Fitzgibbon

That speaks to your threshold of concern.

My oh my Fitzgibbon! You've done it again. I will remember that one! So there is a threshold by which you can remain silent no longer and feel that it is necessary to grill a person on his claims of being a Mason? I see.

Wouldn't it have been better to offer help by letting Vinny describe what it was that actually had him so upset and then see if anything he is claiming lines up with what you know about? By jumping the gun and demanding proof you are doing no one here any justice.

Originally posted by VinnyboyXI
Ok guys im back in the states... Augustus I definitely was not scared off by you or you're cronies.

No one here is trying to scare anyone off, so cut the melodrama.

Stop asking to tell you everything that went on because that is not gonna happen.

Why am I not surprised.

I would just settle for you answering Saurus's questions.

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

You did not answer my question. How would it affect your opinion of him if he were lying about his Masonic affiliation?

Yes I did, this was my answer.

Wonderful gifts have sometimes been known to come in ugly wrappers.

Worthless and harmful gifts have been known to sometimes come in beautiful wrappers.

The Trojan horse comes to mind as an example.

Yet Spies of agencies like the CIA routinely lie to establish covers.

Agents of agencies like the FBI routinely lie to establish covers.

Yet in that latter case, the evidence they bring into the court rooms, is generally judged by quantified standards objectively, without being tarnished in part or in whole, by the fact that the person who obtained the truth, did so through a deception, and misrepresentation of himself.

The truth would be the truth, line item, by line item as it checks out.

If the truth on line 2, is false, it does not make the truth of line item 3, or 4, if it is rooted in fact, false by extension of the fallacy of line item 2.

While many are prone to be emotionally manipulated to throw the baby out along with the bathwater, I am not one of them.

There are elements of potential truth in Vincent's story!

Thanks my friend.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

It’s an allegorical answer! It’s a metaphorical answer! It is a quintessential ProtoplasmicTraveler answer!

An answer steeped in wisdom!

An answer made to challenge one to think!

An answer to encourage one to grow!

An answer for the ages!

An answer for all times!

An answer that legends are made of!



Edit to add: I don't judge people Augustus, I judge their actions, as the singular occurences each one is. Judge not, least you be judged!



[edit on 24/4/10 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
It is a quintessential ProtoplasmicTraveler answer!

Agreed, which means it is a typical Proto non-answer.

So be it.

Originally posted by AugustusMasonicus

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
It is a quintessential ProtoplasmicTraveler answer!

Agreed, which means it is a typical Proto non-answer.

So be it.

If a serial killer tells you the Sun comes up at dawn, does the fact that he is a serial killer mean the Sun does not come up at dawn???

If I fib and tell my wife, that those jeans don't make her look fat, when she asks, does it mean that when I volunteer of my own accord that her haircut is fetching that too then is a lie?

I am not here to judge Vincent, and to accept or discount what he says based on my judgement of Vincent.

I am here to hear each and everything Vincent has to say, to judge those things as being relevant and truthful, or non-relevant and truthful, one thing at a time.

Everyone has some redeemable quality!

Originally posted by jackflap
reply to post by Fitzgibbon

 

That speaks to your threshold of concern.

My oh my Fitzgibbon! You've done it again. I will remember that one! So there is a threshold by which you can remain silent no longer and feel that it is necessary to grill a person on his claims of being a Mason? I see.

Do be so kind as not to edit posts and take individual lines out of context. That's certainly conduct unbecoming. The actual line in its orginal context was:

"If you're OK being sold a bill of goods, dandy. That speaks to your threshold of concern. "

To translate, If you're OK with accepting someone lying to you as 'truth', that speaks to your threshold of concern.

Does that help clarify it for you?

Originally posted by jackflap
Wouldn't it have been better to offer help by letting Vinny describe what it was that actually had him so upset and then see if anything he is claiming lines up with what you know about? By jumping the gun and demanding proof you are doing no one here any justice.

Sorry you feel that way. He claims to be a Mason; Saurus posted (and I've re-posted) a very simple way for him to be able to verify the anchor point from which he claims many wild and wooly things thereafter.

Is starting from fact really so shocking?

reply to post by Fitzgibbon

Do be so kind as not to edit posts and take individual lines out of context.

Oh but I was so kind as to not edit what you said. You said that there is a threshold of concern and I enjoyed it thoroughly and will use it in the near future. Many thanks to you for sharing this epiphany!

I believe everyone here and any one who reads this thread will not take his claims as facts until all things can be proven. I don't see any danger in letting someone say that they are a Mason and that they have information that is pertinent to everyone. Let him first share what he believes happened and then dissect. Does this make sense?

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


supreme moral authority of what? what's your spiritual soup du jour, proto? if you don't answer me directly and rather tap dance around the topic, i'll make you my new research project.

reply to post by Rockpuck


paganism has been historically much worse to women, even though they had goddesses to look to for inspiration or what have you. the goddess was the only female afforded any respect. you definitely don't want to keep that in your head as a legit alternative to "patriarchal" society/ i think the historians were deliberately ignoring the fact that pagan cultures were even more patriarchal than christianity (by a long shot). yeshua was the first to advance the concept of equality of the sexes. unfortunately, people were still too solidified in their cultural norms (including apostle paul) concerning women and basically ignored the message entirely.

Originally posted by undo
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

supreme moral authority of what? what's your spiritual soup du jour, proto? if you don't answer me directly and rather tap dance around the topic, i'll make you my new research project.

Why of Rome of course! Originally the title was held by the First Citizen of Rome, and then once the Republic gave way to the Empire, it is one of a half a dozen titles for the Emperor.

For instance the Pope at the Vatican has the Title of Pontificus Maximus, (Rome’s High Priest) which is also one of the Emperor’s titles.

Morals have nothing to do with spirituality, but morality.

Spiritual questions should be addressed to the Pontificus Maximus, morality questions can be addressed to me!

No tap dancing at all, though I am putting on the soft shoe and thinking about a walk on the beach!

Thanks for asking.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


how's alpha centauri? i think you should just enjoy your trip (and the in cabin music: "the girl from ipanema" and the "star trek theme").

so you're the moral authority of what? i'm still trying to figure this part out.

Originally posted by VinnyboyXI
reply to post by Rosha

 

I completely agree with you and that where i see you understood me wrong. What I meant is that what I heard them talk about, is what they believe, not what actually is, They believe that they posses the secrets of the ages through compartmentalization.

I'm not saying I think what they have is the truth.

and Raider of Truth, I have no bond here. I'm nothing more than an initiate. If it matters to you or not, I dont care. I'm sharing an experience I had.


[edit on 21-4-2010 by VinnyboyXI]

Hello Vinney

I it is true that it has been said that through the birth death and ressurection of Jesus Christ many burdens of the human soul and mind were compartmentalised. The Grace ie: the strength and Truth came to us through Jesus, just as Law was handed through Moses, details this process in action. This was prophesied by Isaiah and was a part of what Christ fulfilled in his arrival and depature form this earth.

It is said that the mind of Man was given this gift of Grace and Truth as a relief of burdenand as a means to move on freely, to grow and evolve - a means to let go of the past.
The truth itself, remaining sealed, for us, as an inherritance.

Jesus said : "Behold I am making all things new", and this transformation of Mind and sealing away of the past etc is said to be a part of that. It is written within you and detailed within the pages of the bible however, it is not occulted knowledge, even if those newborns just now coming to realisation of it for the first time might think so.

Belief that those compartmentalised burdens contain 'secrets of the ages' or anything more then the personal record and experience of an individuals own soul, or information stored solely for that individual soul or even for our collective soul to refer to though, is a choice.

Though my comprehension is limited in this area, I do speculate that that is the case that this storehouse of information is within all people, everywhere, and is not an exclusive province of selected people.

The manner in which human DNA records information and stores it, the way cells of our bodies communicate with each other, does suggest that given the right vibration or on divine activiation, it can open doors to intermind communication and quite vivid experiences of information and past experiences that we have until that point been subconsciously acting upon in ignorance.

This to me is the meaning of the biblical passage where it says that the Law and His Word is 'written on the inner most parts of our being'.

However the nature and value of that information to anyone outside of the individual experiencing it is specific, and dependant on the individual themselves, their maturity, spirituality and how they are experiencing it.

As it contains so many different variables, many which are unable to be reconciled outwardly - the least of which is genetic dilution- it is in affect, not so much a detailed cognizant historical archive as it is a cumulated body of comprehensions, impressions and results that is open to any number of interpretations by the 'hearer' or viewer.

There in lies the danger and risk of deciet and the avenues for misinterpretation and manipulation by the evil, ignorant or wilfully uninformed.

As it was written, 'the words of the scroll' or if you will the information collected within our DNA were sealed by God, it was also written that at the end of days, the words of the scroll will be opened...and that ALL will see and ALL will know of Christs return. We will not need secret societies on that day, we will Know the Lord.

Imo, anyone seeking to gain power from or manipulate whatever has been sealed by God or to use it in any nefarious way, needs to go re read their bible and examine the consequences of doing so....Freemasons, Templar or not, included.

reply to post by samhouston1886


I agree Sam, we can all make up fabulous stories and then provide no concrete evidence. This is why I questioned the OP.

[edit on 4/24/2010 by RealityisanIllusion]

reply to post by Rosha


that's an interesting post. what has god sealed that you think the freemasons or templars are opening without permission, so to speak?

reply to post by undo

paganism has been historically much worse to women

I strongly beg to differ.. U2U me if you wish to discuss it, as we digress from the er.. conversation (if that's what this thread is). "Paganism" and it's histories are butchered by the conquering belief systems.. I will gladly show you such evidence.

You look at History through Roman eyes.

reply to post by Rockpuck


Let's do it! Be prepared for an onslaught of reality.

(what's with proto? he makes a thread about the need for religions to agree enough with each other a bit more so that we don't blow up the planet in an attempt to destroy each other, then suggests the formation of a NEW RELIGION that compacts everyone into one homogenous faith (kinda goes hand in glove with new world order don't it? and here he is attacking masons, who are supposedly the real masterminds behind the NWO ?????? what the freak is wrong with this picture? is he some high ranking mason trying his hand at ye olde good cop/bad cop theme? i hate it when people don't just say what they mean and mean what they say. then you have to do some kinda weird word tango with them just to wrench their actual point outta the background noise!)

grr. ruff ruff. meooooow.

Originally posted by undo
reply to post by Rockpuck

 

paganism has been historically much worse to women, even though they had goddesses to look to for inspiration or what have you. the goddess was the only female afforded any respect. you definitely don't want to keep that in your head as a legit alternative to "patriarchal" society/ i think the historians were deliberately ignoring the fact that pagan cultures were even more patriarchal than christianity (by a long shot). yeshua was the first to advance the concept of equality of the sexes. unfortunately, people were still too solidified in their cultural norms (including apostle paul) concerning women and basically ignored the message entirely.

Actually, evidence suggests that the patriarchal religions gained ground after animal husbandry became dominant. Elam, for instance, was a society with a religion predating Christianity which was a matriarchal society.