Freemason Knights Templar meeting here in Italy 2 days ago, changed my life...

reply to post by Diplomat


I hear you! We all have our own thoughts about Freemasonary........but for some guy to come in and say, I know stuff you don't but I'm not going to tell you what it is is quite frankly stupid.

If you CAN'T tell us what you know...........then don't post this tidbit! Thumbs down to the OP.

nice post-Thank you very much for the information. The information is actually avaible out there if you just use common sense and use history books as facts,its very tough information and hard to understand though,you need alot of time to understand the whole plot\idea.

For your part i fully understand and respect that you had to write this. And as you probably understand and experience through the replies on this post,The importance of other people having belief in this couldnt be less important.

The normal\standard man ,shall never and will never get a chance of getting info as you did. Cause the normal\standard man\human have no chance of even grasping at this.

So concider yourself special.

I will also write you a mail with a name, a person\name wich i belive will make you get goosebumbs

Lets just hope he was there.

Originally posted by TheOracle
but don't put everyone in the same basket.

Don't tell me not to put them all in the same basket.

My friend stole something when we were teens, and I went to jail too. Cuz I gave him a ride see. I did not know it but, I was an accomplice in his crime.

Anyways, I did not invent the basket. I did not tell them all to jump in that basket.

They all jumped in it on purpose. It was their choice.

So sue me for being aware of it. lol.

Look I swear I was innocent I did not know that Sammy had stole something, but YET I WENT TO JAIL ANYWAY.

It's called Crime by association. And they are culpable for protecting their "brothers" from prosecution. This is a well known practice. I've seen it with my own eyes.

Hell the kid that got off the hook in my personal experience wasn't even mason himself. His dad was the head mason so therefore he got to escape criminal prosecution for manslaughter and negligence.

That is the kind of crap I want stopped.

reply to post by RealityisanIllusion

First let me say I haven't signed in to ATS for over a year, but your response, to this post Is so rude and so poorly argued I couldn't help myself. As far as grammer and spelling... So what? A couple of the most materialistically and financially set people I know Cant even read!!!!!! That's right they are illiterate!!!!

Now in relation to the OP!!!

Just because you are an entry level initiate of anything doesn't mean you know everything about what you hear at meetings.

I was initiated into one of the Greek Fraternities at Univesity, like I'm sure a lot of ATS members may as well have. Before that Inwent to high school just like most people, but I wrote my senior project on the Free and Accepted Order of Masons. Back then there was no ATS ('94) and I had to find the few books I could at the time on the topic. There weren't many mostly had to go to antique book stores. The Builders, by Newton and so on. Even then it was simple to find the connection from Templars to Masons it's everywhere. So to my point on you bashing poor Vinny from Chi Town...
When i was initiated into my fraternity we didn't have a house so the international heads of our chapter used a place they were more familiar with... A Masonic Temple... To my shock!!! You never truely know what you're a part of till you fully become it. For you to say spelling and grammer ( spelling just for you ) has anything to due with what he says he saw is absurd!!!
If ya really want something to flak over try this... My fraternal god is Apollo the god of light... Lucifer the Angel of light is one and the same as Apollo, or Set or Saturn, or any of his other names. Yup had my college fraternity initiation in a Masonic Temple but had no idea that my lil Greek fraternity would be so tied into such an old, ancient, order, but go figure they are! Does that mean Masons are Satanic? NO! So who are you and what background do you have besides grammer to argue your disagreement with his thread. I believe if he saw and heard what he did and is horrified to talk about it! He gave you enough info you can research it yourself! Here's one for ya to look into "the global conclave" every year all degrees of Masonry meet in one place. ( not all of them, but several hundred of them) Quite a few years back ( maybe 10 ) it was in Yemen. At this event you have anyone from butchers and barbers to fortune 500 CEO's and world leaders ( some of who's nations maybe at war, but they meet nonetheless under one name and love Freemasons. Yes there are Templars still out there! Do your homework before you tear on people like Vinny. To him it must have been a shock to see and hear the truth. For me it's just a well.... Fact. Good luck to all of you in the up coming years- peace out

reply to post by network dude


I think ND nailed it here. Vinny is probably in the initial stages of joining/petitioning and has had a meeting or two where he lives.

He probably got very excited about the information he was receiving and just had to post about it. He made up the trip to distance himself from where he was getting his initial information but just had to post a tidbit of what he was hearing.

He probably feels guilty right about now but maybe he can absolve himself and find a way to gracefully come clean without ruining his reputation with ATS or the fraternity.

Above is all just my opinion.

Originally posted by network dude
LBJ was an Entered apprentice. he never went any further in his degrees. I don't know why, but that is what I have read. Ford was the last president to be a mason. Clinton was in the DeMolay (a masonic organization for kids) but apparently did not chose to become a mason. Neither Bush JR, or Sr were masons. they were Skull and Bones. (nothing to do with masonry)
And Obama is not a mason as far as any reports have been given. Hell he might not even be american.

Thx ND,
This has helped me straighten out in my mind such a twisty road (a bit).

reply to post by Kellter


I totaly agree with what you said!!! He just to new at what he is... If I met a talking two month old I would be shocked!!! Point made good job!

reply to post by Young minded old soul


I didn't know any of that stuff about college fraternities.

Do they all have a "fraternal god"?

And how can you say it is not satanic if your "fraternal god" is Apollo (aka Lucifer)???

Sounds like the exact definition of Satanic to me. (You know, considering Satan your god or whatever).

I just don't get it. How can you exalt Lucifer yet not be Satanic?

I think we need to just go over the definitions of words for awhile.

Originally posted by muzzleflash


Look I swear I was innocent I did not know that Sammy had stole something, but YET I WENT TO JAIL ANYWAY.

Hell the kid that got off the hook in my personal experience wasn't even mason himself. His dad was the head mason so therefore he got to escape criminal prosecution for manslaughter and negligence.

That is the kind of crap I want stopped.

now I am confused. Other than the kid who ran to Mexico's dad being a mason, how did masonry affect you being put in jail? You drove the getaway car for a heist. Did Sammy go to jail as well? Do you know that mexico has extradition laws with the US? Did Sammy kill someone? Did you? Please explain this story.

reply to post by ForAiur


The Saxons/Normans/Danish are most definately decendants of Ephraim & Manasseh, sons of Joseph (or the House of Yosef), however it is known when they were exiled by the Assyrians from the land of Yisrael, people among the tribes of Benjamin and Judah went with them too and they travelled North West. The real Israelites are in fact the decendants of Ephraim who inherited the House of Israel from Jacob (Israel). Modern day Israelis are not Israelites, they are Israelis (know the difference); the Israelis today mostly decend from the House of Judah of which King David decends from.

The Hebrews are those who decend from Avraham to Issac to Jacob; this does not mean only the Jewish people. The decendants of all Jacob's children are scattered worldwide and are not "lost" tribes as persue. It's the Rabbis of today that refuse to acknowledge them and will do whatever it takes to disqualify them to ensure only the Moshiah decends from Judah however unbeknown to them this is only partually true. His lineage must cross between Judah and Ephraim and he WILL come from the North and not from modern day Israel. Only such a man with both lineages can bring peace to Israel and the world; his paternal lineage will decend from Judah. There will be two great (infamous) men, before the real Moshiah comes who will make claim to the "throne", one will come from the East and the other will come from inside Israel, both will cause a Holocaust of his people. The third will be the real deal and I believe he will come from one of the Commonwealth of Nations (one of three of the nations I won't mention).

It is total arogance of the Jewish people to ignore this fact, and it is ignorance of the Saxons/Normans/Danish to ignore this fact. However I can confidently tell you that among those who DO know are the British and Danish Royal Families - as well as those like myself who are in full knowledge of this fact.

The next King of Israel will be as wise as that of a Levite (protector of the great temple/priests); a great warrior like Judah and a great nation builder as that of Ephraim's tribe.

What does this have to do with the Freemasons? More than many of you could ever realise!

reply to post by YourPopRock

The OP said he had been to a meeting "2 days ago" based on the fact he was typing it all at 3 am (per his claim), the meeting would have been on a Sunday. Not likely. If my math is off, it would have placed the meeting on monday with him having just flown in through a volcanic eruption that had GROUNDED ALL AIR TRAVEL IN EUROPE.

First off the OP didn’t say anything. He did though STATE some things, as saying things requires audible enunciation, where stating things can be done typing.

Above is an example of the kind of hair splitting that is resorted too on some of these Mason related threads.

Second the OP did not state, that he flew to Italy the same day as the Mason Meeting he was invited too.

For all we know, he might have been attending various trade shows and conventions around Europe for a month now taking Eurail and passenger ferries from point to point.

The OP didn’t state when he got to Italy, or how long he has been in Italy. Since he is an Italian speaker, he either loves Italy or has ties to Italy, so there is every normal reason to surmise he may have well decided to go days before the trade show, he claims to have gone to, to sightsee, visit relatives and have some personal time there.

Yes he stated the meeting was 2 days before his post, but it is a disingenuous assumption, since his primary business in Italy had nothing to do with the Mason’s meeting, that he flew in the day of it.

So where you get he had just flown through an ash cloud is a question an intelligent person would put to you.

Please show me in any of Vincent’s posts where he states how he got into Italy and what day he arrived.

Pretending a person stated something, simply to discredit them, is just that, pretending a person said something.

If a person isn’t observant enough to actually comprehend and retain what a person stated, maybe you should be asking questions, instead of MAKING UP statements to try to discredit the Original Poster.



[edit on 22/4/10 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]

reply to post by Young minded old soul


Fascinating post. My thought has always been that the Atlanteans, could travel to other planets, and Saturn has some special purpose. I'm convinced that people live on Saturn, and Saturners live on Earth.

Long story, so I'll leave it at that. Thanks for sharing the info.

Originally posted by network dude

now I am confused. Other than the kid who ran to Mexico's dad being a mason, how did masonry affect you being put in jail? You drove the getaway car for a heist. Did Sammy go to jail as well? Do you know that mexico has extradition laws with the US? Did Sammy kill someone? Did you? Please explain this story.

LOL ok. It's two totally separate stories.

#1 ) was the Heist story where I went to jail. I wasn't aware of the heist (of a freaking skate board) , until it was too late. I honestly thought it was Sammy's skateboard.

Point of this story is to show that although I am innocent, I was tossed into jail (YET NEVER CHARGED WITH ANY CRIMES). It basically shows that the legal system considers guilt by association as legit.

#2) The story about the kid who fled to Mexico over manslaughter charges. His father ran the town I was in, mayor. Top level Scottish Rite mason. He is worth over 100million $.

His Family runs the city council (most of it) , examples, his brothers are on the city council with him.

They run everything in town, they own 85% of all the land, they own the Water company etc etc. City of over 250,000 population.

But his teenage idiot kid, was selling Extasy to his buddies. Well they were partying one night and his home boy overdosed and Died.

They rushed the Kid to their family Doctor, who has huge connections to the Mayor/ top level mason. The Doctor realized he could not save the kid, and it was too late.

So instead of REPORTING the death to the authorities, the Kid drug the dead body out to the local golf course until it was discovered the next day.

The local media largely ignored it, although they did report on it to some extent. And the media CONFIRMS THESE FACTS.

Then when it was obvious that the kid was going to be prosecuted for manslaughter and face prison, his father flew him to Cancun Mexico THAT NIGHT.

That kid has NEVER stepped foot back into the US since, because he is Wanted by authorities for crimes.

But this guy, the mayor, he didn't get in any trouble over this clearly illegal act of paying the flight for a criminal to escape custody.

Just because it was his son does not mean it's ok to use your position of power and influence to get them off the hook when they REALLY SCREW UP BIG TIME.

Since that event was so blatant and obvious, I am of the belief that Institutions of Power, for example Masonry, is misused by almost everyone for personal gain. It is used to secretly create plans to avoid legal restraints that would prohibit such activities.

I saw it happen once, and it was a pretty mundane event actually. So I am sure even worse things have happened. It is inevitable.

[edit on 22-4-2010 by muzzleflash]

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler

Second the OP did not state, that he flew to Italy the same day as the Mason Meeting he was invited too.

For all we know, he might have been attending various trade shows and convention around Europe for a month now taking Eurail and passenger ferries from point to point.

People who've been in "Europe for a month" don't typically complain about jet lag.

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
If a person isn’t observant enough to actually retain and comprehend what a person said, maybe you should be asking questions, instead of MAKING UP statements to try to discredit the Original Poster.

Oh that was only one mistake he made. It'll be enlightening to hear him explain how it was that someone who at best might be an Entered Apprentice would be allowed into a ceremony for a side rite that requires you to be at lest a Master Mason.

But I guess you'd prefer to just dismiss the low-hanging-fruit of his mistakes.

Originally posted by Fitzgibbon

Oh that was only one mistake he made. It'll be enlightening to hear him explain how it was that someone who at best might be an Entered Apprentice would be allowed into a ceremony for a side rite that requires you to be at lest a Master Mason.

But I guess you'd prefer to just dismiss the low-hanging-fruit of his mistakes.

So you are saying there is for sure a legit masonic related Knights Templar group *not rogues*.

And you admit that this guy posting, has no way to have gotten there into this meeting.

Well, You just admitted a lot there.

Ok so the Knights Templar still exists, and only master masons are allowed in the meetings?

Thanks for revealing so much!

I'll write that down on a stick-it note.

Found it!!!

Finally, I found something that might shed some light on the matter:

The international Order of Gnostic Templars held their congress in the Marche region of Italy starting on 17 April, 2010, exactly where the OP claims to have been.

Here is the link to the congress:

International Order of Gnostic Templars Congress, Italy 2010

Anybody who can shed some light on this matter, please do so.

I know nothing about them, and I do not know whether of not they are linked to Freemasonry in any way.

reply to post by Saurus


From your link (BTW Good find).

"The last time a conference of this genre and caliber occurred was in Paris in 1785. It was attended by St. Germain, Cagliostro and many other high-ranking Initiatic Society leaders. The goal of that gathering was the same as the upcoming one - to throw off the yoke of patriarchal control in a campaign for spiritual freedom. However, that gathering ended in the violence of the French Revolution. Times have changed, and we can now acknowledge the futility of resorting to violence in a quest for world peace. Instead, we simply want to extend a hand to those persons in the world who are thirsting for the inner peace of gnosis."

Read that stuff.

They sure do hype this meeting up like it is a HUGE DEAL!!!

But really, I have Never heard of Gnostic Templars. It's new to me.

Their message sounds nice and fluffy though.

Also notice, Everyone is invited to this meeting. (Or was, since it happened days ago).

That means that it is no conspiracy that this guy got in. It invites everyone. It doesn't seem to be very exclusionary or secretive at all.

I will see if I can find anything else about them.

Also if you read that groups webpage, it is 100% clear and obvious it is a religious cult.

"Spiritual Warriors - Dedicated to the revival of Gnostic Wisdom + the Goddess tradition of the Original Templars."

This statement is concrete proof it is a religion.

reply to post by Fitzgibbon

People who've been in "Europe for a month" don't typically complain about jet lag.

ok never mind guys, i honestly just wanted to share what happened here with me and a few others a couple days ago. its 3 15 am here and I have serious jet lag.

Jetlag can simply be the adjustment from one time zone to another. Are you used to going to bed at a certain time each night and getting up a certain time each morning? Change the clock by six hours and these habits by six hours and then see how many days it takes you to adjust.

Further Vincent is a Jeweler and not a Doctor. So his ability to diagnose things such as Jetlag is hardly scientific.

Vincent was also under the additional duress of having recently lived through a life perspective altering moment he was still trying to internalize, as well as a hazing and grilling from angry Masons meant specifically to unbalance him emotionally.

Could these things mimic what Vincent considers to be Jetlag, and is what Vincent considers to be Jetlag the same thing you or I consider to be Jetlag, and is it more importantly what a Medical Doctor would consider to be Jetlag?

Regardless getting used to a radically different time zone, and throwing off and then adjusting the body’s internal clock to a new schedule can take several days to even weeks for some people.

Vincent’s statement in regards to Jetlag neither proves when he flew into Italy, or that he was even suffering from Jetlag.

One might wonder though the level of aggression being deployed by some of the Masonic Members of ATS to use this as a scientific indicator, with out any of the necessary scientific controls, to possibly be able to accurately use it as one.

The Mason Forum Gang was out to shut Vincent up and silence him, and appears to have suceeded so now we might never know the FULL answers.

And like Vincent we will all have to suffer the hair splitting, and grasping at straws by a rabid pack of agenda driven posters.

Oh that was only one mistake he made. It'll be enlightening to hear him explain how it was that someone who at best might be an Entered Apprentice would be allowed into a ceremony for a side rite that requires you to be at lest a Master Mason.

But I guess you'd prefer to just dismiss the low-hanging-fruit of his mistakes.

Hard to believe that the Masonic Brotherhood considers the rest of us to be the equivalent on the evolutionary scale as monkeys with these statements!

If his rendition of what he was told is false, then why would he have had to have been a Master Mason to hear such a false ceremony?

Your statement is completely contradictory, either Vincent is incorrect, because there is no such Ceremony, or Vincent is correct perhaps, because there is such a Ceremony, a Ceremony that you are claiming one has to be a Master Mason to partake in.

Now I actually READ the Original Post, and Vincent mentioned being asked to attend a Lodge gathering, as an interpreter for other foreign guests who don’t speak Italian.

He did not say these things revealed to him were revealed through any Ceremony.

So if I wanted to be every bit as assumptive as you (which I don’t) then I would have to assume what Vincent is saying was imparted to you in a Ceremony. That is why you believe a Ceremony took place.

For all we know, what was told to Vincent was a proud Italian Mason, sharing with Vinnie the History of his lodge and Masonry in Italy.

You are the one claiming a Ceremony took place, and a Ceremony that only a Master Mason could attend.

You are as are the other Mason’s through your hastily formed attacks on his post, actually giving his post more Credibility and potentially revealing more Masonic Secrets than Vincent did.

I am guessing what, in Rome’s eyes, we are monkeys and you guys are orangutans?

Thinking can be your friend!

reply to post by muzzleflash


It looks like you had to request an invitation, sent to Sedona, AZ to a guy named Mark Amaru Pinkham, who has a website called
SerpentsofWisdom.com
www.serpentsofwisdom.com...